Comments on: Hmm: Enter Sandmen http://www.metsblog.com/2007/10/19/hmm-enter-sandmen/ Latest Mets News, Links, Rumors and Opinion Fri, 04 Feb 2011 21:22:00 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: sellitman http://www.metsblog.com/2007/10/19/hmm-enter-sandmen/#comment-30173 sellitman Sat, 20 Oct 2007 20:14:33 +0000 http://www.metsblog.com/2007/10/19/hmm-the-two-headed-save-montser/#comment-30173 Rivera? Are you nuts? Sign Posada & Rivera then hire Joe as Manager. Make Steinbrenners 3 gag. Rivera? Are you nuts?

Sign Posada & Rivera then hire Joe as Manager.

Make Steinbrenners 3 gag.

]]> By: odouls03 http://www.metsblog.com/2007/10/19/hmm-enter-sandmen/#comment-30137 odouls03 Sat, 20 Oct 2007 15:39:14 +0000 http://www.metsblog.com/2007/10/19/hmm-the-two-headed-save-montser/#comment-30137 Um, Mariano Rivera is the greatest closer of ALL TIME. And he's still the best around by far. Wagner couldn't hold his jock strap. If the Mets get Mo, Billy should carry his water bottle and shine his cleats. Why would we ever want the two of them to split the duties? It's not even a conversation who's better. Wagner blows big saves, Mo does not. Um, Mariano Rivera is the greatest closer of ALL TIME. And he’s still the best around by far. Wagner couldn’t hold his jock strap. If the Mets get Mo, Billy should carry his water bottle and shine his cleats. Why would we ever want the two of them to split the duties? It’s not even a conversation who’s better. Wagner blows big saves, Mo does not.

]]> By: davenappy http://www.metsblog.com/2007/10/19/hmm-enter-sandmen/#comment-30044 davenappy Fri, 19 Oct 2007 22:56:32 +0000 http://www.metsblog.com/2007/10/19/hmm-the-two-headed-save-montser/#comment-30044 If this were a video game in franchise mode, you could have Mariano Rivera and Billy Wagner split the saves fifty/fifty. You know, "Hey Mo, you go M,W,F. "Billy, you pitch T,TH,SAT, and we'll split Sundays". This saves either one from having to pitch back to back days for the most part. But this is real life, or as real as it ever gets, and this won't ever happen. But Rivera to the Phillies is a disturbing thought. If this were a video game in franchise mode, you could have Mariano Rivera and Billy Wagner split the saves fifty/fifty. You know, “Hey Mo, you go M,W,F. “Billy, you pitch T,TH,SAT, and we’ll split Sundays”. This saves either one from having to pitch back to back days for the most part.

But this is real life, or as real as it ever gets, and this won’t ever happen. But Rivera to the Phillies is a disturbing thought.

]]> By: CleonJones http://www.metsblog.com/2007/10/19/hmm-enter-sandmen/#comment-30031 CleonJones Fri, 19 Oct 2007 21:59:52 +0000 http://www.metsblog.com/2007/10/19/hmm-the-two-headed-save-montser/#comment-30031 Forget the Yankees thing for a moment, let's just focus on the players, Rivera and Wagner. Both are old, and the majority of Mets fans here have already come to the consensus that we need to get younger. Personally, I think Rivera would be a great signing, but we will not get our money's worth by the end of his contract (most likely due to injury or declining skill set). Rivera is a warrior, but he is no longer "invincible". As for Wagner, when his contract is up, I would be more than willing to bid him "adieu", provided we have a closer waiting in the wings. And by waiting in the wings, I don't mean we necessarily bring up "one of our own" to inherit the job from Wagner. I don't think we currently have anyone that would easily replace Wagner for us that we could count on. Given the choice of free agents and potential trade prospects available this off season, the best name out there to grab would be Joe Nathan. Nathan is not only nasty, he's a horse as well. If the Twins were given the choice, they would rather re-sign Santana to retain some credibility with their fanbase after letting Torii Hunter walk away (their most popular player since Kirby Puckett). Were the Twins to trade Santana or let him walk would be an invitation for a public relations nightmare at best, or a fan boycott at worst. The Twins are a "zero sum game" team, which means if they sign or extend someone to a fat contract, they're going to lop off contracts from the team in other areas in order to afford the latest big money deal they give out to someone like Santana. The obvious choice for the Twins is to make Joe Nathan available for trade, as they have the young pitchers now who could take over in Nathan's closer role, and then the Twins use Nathan to fill in their perceived weaknesses on their team. The money they save on Nathan is used to help defray the costs of signing Santana. If the Mets are smart, they make a play for Nathan to be their main setup man for 2008, and let Wagner walk after the season and give the closer role to Nathan in 2009... this allows enough time to pass to determine the future roles and the reliabilty (or lack thereof) of the bullpen pitchers we already have that need further evaluation... players like Sanchez, Joe Smith, Padilla, Kunz, Muniz, Collazo, etc. One of those players will have to take over as the main setup man if Mets management determines that Aaron Heilman will be moved to our rotation or traded to another team in a deal that improves our ballclub. Thinking of our future, let's face it, we will have no power or leverage to retain Heilman if he opts to leave via free agency if the Mets continue to relegate him to our bullpen where he does not want to be. Better to get value for Heilman either as our 5th starter in 2008, or to trade him in a package for a player or players that we are all hoping to obtain. What's more, if Heilman is as good as he thinks he is (or as some Mets fans here think he is), then there would be no need to trade for a Joe Blanton, right? lol If push came to shove, I'd have no problems trading Heilman to the Twins to obtain either Santana or Nathan, but I don't see Santana in our immediate future. Nathan is a much more realistic possibility, and gives us the added benefit of making our bullpen stronger for 2008 and beyond. Forget the Yankees thing for a moment, let’s just focus on the players, Rivera and Wagner. Both are old, and the majority of Mets fans here have already come to the consensus that we need to get younger. Personally, I think Rivera would be a great signing, but we will not get our money’s worth by the end of his contract (most likely due to injury or declining skill set). Rivera is a warrior, but he is no longer “invincible”.

As for Wagner, when his contract is up, I would be more than willing to bid him “adieu”, provided we have a closer waiting in the wings. And by waiting in the wings, I don’t mean we necessarily bring up “one of our own” to inherit the job from Wagner. I don’t think we currently have anyone that would easily replace Wagner for us that we could count on.

Given the choice of free agents and potential trade prospects available this off season, the best name out there to grab would be Joe Nathan.

Nathan is not only nasty, he’s a horse as well. If the Twins were given the choice, they would rather re-sign Santana to retain some credibility with their fanbase after letting Torii Hunter walk away (their most popular player since Kirby Puckett). Were the Twins to trade Santana or let him walk would be an invitation for a public relations nightmare at best, or a fan boycott at worst.

The Twins are a “zero sum game” team, which means if they sign or extend someone to a fat contract, they’re going to lop off contracts from the team in other areas in order to afford the latest big money deal they give out to someone like Santana. The obvious choice for the Twins is to make Joe Nathan available for trade, as they have the young pitchers now who could take over in Nathan’s closer role, and then the Twins use Nathan to fill in their perceived weaknesses on their team. The money they save on Nathan is used to help defray the costs of signing Santana.

If the Mets are smart, they make a play for Nathan to be their main setup man for 2008, and let Wagner walk after the season and give the closer role to Nathan in 2009… this allows enough time to pass to determine the future roles and the reliabilty (or lack thereof) of the bullpen pitchers we already have that need further evaluation… players like Sanchez, Joe Smith, Padilla, Kunz, Muniz, Collazo, etc. One of those players will have to take over as the main setup man if Mets management determines that Aaron Heilman will be moved to our rotation or traded to another team in a deal that improves our ballclub.

Thinking of our future, let’s face it, we will have no power or leverage to retain Heilman if he opts to leave via free agency if the Mets continue to relegate him to our bullpen where he does not want to be. Better to get value for Heilman either as our 5th starter in 2008, or to trade him in a package for a player or players that we are all hoping to obtain. What’s more, if Heilman is as good as he thinks he is (or as some Mets fans here think he is), then there would be no need to trade for a Joe Blanton, right? lol

If push came to shove, I’d have no problems trading Heilman to the Twins to obtain either Santana or Nathan, but I don’t see Santana in our immediate future. Nathan is a much more realistic possibility, and gives us the added benefit of making our bullpen stronger for 2008 and beyond.

]]> By: kiteless http://www.metsblog.com/2007/10/19/hmm-enter-sandmen/#comment-30026 kiteless Fri, 19 Oct 2007 20:45:40 +0000 http://www.metsblog.com/2007/10/19/hmm-the-two-headed-save-montser/#comment-30026 Mariano to the phils is a terrifying prospect. I don't see why it couldn't happen. They have the money and they certainly have the need. They can move myers back to the rotation. Sounds like a pretty ideal fit. Just seems weird picturing rivera outside of new york though. Mariano to the phils is a terrifying prospect. I don’t see why it couldn’t happen. They have the money and they certainly have the need. They can move myers back to the rotation. Sounds like a pretty ideal fit. Just seems weird picturing rivera outside of new york though.

]]> By: dap260 http://www.metsblog.com/2007/10/19/hmm-enter-sandmen/#comment-30009 dap260 Fri, 19 Oct 2007 19:24:09 +0000 http://www.metsblog.com/2007/10/19/hmm-the-two-headed-save-montser/#comment-30009 We have our closer - we don't need a $12M set-up man. We have our closer – we don’t need a $12M set-up man.

]]> By: GuruMets http://www.metsblog.com/2007/10/19/hmm-enter-sandmen/#comment-30005 GuruMets Fri, 19 Oct 2007 19:16:12 +0000 http://www.metsblog.com/2007/10/19/hmm-the-two-headed-save-montser/#comment-30005 My comment was aimed at the '07 squad, there is no argument that the '06 model seemed to be a tighter-knit group, then in '07. And they were 1 curve-ball swing away from the WS. This year, from Sanchez's laziness, to Julio's "latin" thing, to LoDuca's comments about fire, to Reyes disrespecting Willie, there was no glue that kept this team tight. And add Rickey, and possibly Castillo to that argument as well. I know it's not a fair comparison, but look at the Rox. They play like "Band of Brothers", and it shows. And they are going (unbeaten) into the WS. Yes, quite a few of them did play in the minors together, but even the guys who didn't seem to honestly "grit-it-out" for the rest of the team. There were only 2 position players, down the stretch, who played like that... Alou and Wright. The rest didn't seem to have their heads into it 100%. If Wags is not in that frame of mind, off to Siberia (or TB) with him! My comment was aimed at the ’07 squad, there is no argument that the ’06 model seemed to be a tighter-knit group, then in ’07. And they were 1 curve-ball swing away from the WS. This year, from Sanchez’s laziness, to Julio’s “latin” thing, to LoDuca’s comments about fire, to Reyes disrespecting Willie, there was no glue that kept this team tight. And add Rickey, and possibly Castillo to that argument as well. I know it’s not a fair comparison, but look at the Rox. They play like “Band of Brothers”, and it shows. And they are going (unbeaten) into the WS. Yes, quite a few of them did play in the minors together, but even the guys who didn’t seem to honestly “grit-it-out” for the rest of the team. There were only 2 position players, down the stretch, who played like that… Alou and Wright. The rest didn’t seem to have their heads into it 100%. If Wags is not in that frame of mind, off to Siberia (or TB) with him!

]]> By: NY Cuban http://www.metsblog.com/2007/10/19/hmm-enter-sandmen/#comment-30000 NY Cuban Fri, 19 Oct 2007 19:07:28 +0000 http://www.metsblog.com/2007/10/19/hmm-the-two-headed-save-montser/#comment-30000 Mo would be a HUGE addition. This is the greatest closer of all-time. He might not be the same as in his prime, but he is still in the top 3 closers of the game. Why not throw some money at him? And contrary to some thoughts, Mariano will not be a Yankee reject...he is upset because he feels spurned by an organization that he gave it all for. They wouldn't negotatiate with him but they can negotiate with A-Rod?!!? That's insulting. Another factor that Omar might want to think about...the rumor is that the Philies are gonna make a huge push for him. So not only will you improve your own bullpen, but you can block the team we are trying to catch (man that was painful to write). Omar, go get Mo! Mo would be a HUGE addition. This is the greatest closer of all-time. He might not be the same as in his prime, but he is still in the top 3 closers of the game. Why not throw some money at him? And contrary to some thoughts, Mariano will not be a Yankee reject…he is upset because he feels spurned by an organization that he gave it all for. They wouldn’t negotatiate with him but they can negotiate with A-Rod?!!? That’s insulting.

Another factor that Omar might want to think about…the rumor is that the Philies are gonna make a huge push for him. So not only will you improve your own bullpen, but you can block the team we are trying to catch (man that was painful to write). Omar, go get Mo!

]]> By: Gilch http://www.metsblog.com/2007/10/19/hmm-enter-sandmen/#comment-29999 Gilch Fri, 19 Oct 2007 19:04:30 +0000 http://www.metsblog.com/2007/10/19/hmm-the-two-headed-save-montser/#comment-29999 and addin MO does nothing to the "cohesiveness" of this team ..... would u consider WAGNER a real "cohesive" player? and addin MO does nothing to the “cohesiveness” of this team ….. would u consider WAGNER a real “cohesive” player?

]]> By: Gilch http://www.metsblog.com/2007/10/19/hmm-enter-sandmen/#comment-29998 Gilch Fri, 19 Oct 2007 19:03:42 +0000 http://www.metsblog.com/2007/10/19/hmm-the-two-headed-save-montser/#comment-29998 There would definatly be takers for Wags seeing how big time closers barely hit the open market anymore.... and most come from within.. the problem would be .. who would trade for Wags while Mariano is still on the market .. WAGS for 10mill or MO for 15ish? no brainer , therefore.. the mets would have to sign MO while WAGS is still on the team, then look to trade him,risking getting not alot for him (which still might not be a bad idea) ....they just cant trade him first then look to knock MO's sox off with an offer and rick going into to 09 with no closer lol ... all that being said, i would like CORDERO myself... set up WAGS till hes gone, then he becomes the closer still at a young age There would definatly be takers for Wags seeing how big time closers barely hit the open market anymore…. and most come from within.. the problem would be .. who would trade for Wags while Mariano is still on the market .. WAGS for 10mill or MO for 15ish? no brainer , therefore.. the mets would have to sign MO while WAGS is still on the team, then look to trade him,risking getting not alot for him (which still might not be a bad idea) ….they just cant trade him first then look to knock MO’s sox off with an offer and rick going into to 09 with no closer lol … all that being said, i would like CORDERO myself… set up WAGS till hes gone, then he becomes the closer still at a young age

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