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…i’m at a loss…it’s game six of 162, and i’m at a total loss…
…on one hand, i know that Willie Randolph cannot switch his 
message to one of ultimate fight, anger and win-now, because if he does that and the team loses just one game then what…he will not only seal his own fate, but he will seal his team’s fate as well…at the same time, his current message of turn the page, stability and long-season level-headedness may actually be having a worse effect, not just on the players, but on the fans as well…
Randolph, talking to reporters after yesterday’s game:
“There is really no correlation, it’s a new season, last season is over. We get to play these guys 18 more times. You’d like to get the first win, obviously, but, you know, if we go out and win the next 10 then it’s a moot point…Any time you play the division you want to play well, and beat the guys you want to beat. You know, we’ll get ‘em tomorrow…but, no, I don’t think there is any connection like that.”
…well, first off, there is a connection…sure, it’s not an in-print connection in the schedule…but there is an emotional connection, and he knows that…i need to remember that what he says in these press conferences is not necessarily what he believes…these press conferences are a show, whether we choose to accept that or not…it’s not reality, unfortunately…at least i hope, because of course there is a connection…and a person would have to be numb not to feel it…
…at any rate, i think my problem with his message isn’t the even-keel approach, because – unlike football, which most fans want to compare baseball to, and shouldn’t – in baseball that style is necessary for success…my problem, instead, is with the What If-approach…
…sure, what if the Mets win the next 10…or, what if they don’t…what if the Mets are in first for five months, then blow a seven game lead in the standings…
…i prefer the Carpe Diem approach, i.e. seize the day, not just in baseball but in life in general…which is not to say that every game is monumental…not every day deserves a speech from General Patton complete with buffet tables getting flipped over…however, from what i can tell, continually kicking the can down What If Avenue seems only to result in tired excuses, which eventually turns in to laziness…again, not just in baseball, but in life as well…
…what’s more, i had hoped to see this team play out of the gate as though they had no choice but to redeem themselves for what happened last year…because, you know what, they have no choice…they need redemption, otherwise a whole lot of people will be looking for new jobs next season…i hoped that the Mets would remember the Collapse, not brush it off, using it is motivation to start hot, emotionally and in the standings, to send a message to us, the Braves, Phillies, etc, that this year will be different…
…so far, that has not happened…
…that said, it is a long season, and that journey can certainly begin right now…
…Carpe Diem, willie…like you enjoy saying, “Get after it.”…
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Amen Matt!
You’re preaching to the choir!
I’d like to see Willie get more fired up…or you know…fired up at all. He’s so complacent, it’s just damn annoying.
Jim Leyland may be out a job soon. Get on that Wilpons!
CARPE DIEM
SEIZE THE DAY
the Mets, of all teams, should know that EVER game counts, no more even keel, let’s get fired up and piss some people off, when we did that, we were winning!!!!
smile, have fun, play with intensity, clap your hands and do handshakes in the dugouts, do some dances, WHATEVER IT TAKES
SEIZE THE DAMN DAY
Forget about Leyland. This should be Backman’s team. It should have been Backman’s team in ‘05, but the Wilpon’s decided to buy into that Mike and Mad Dog mentality that everyone in NY loves that Yankee magic and would embrace Willie immediately.
The Mets will never win a championship with Willie Randolph!
To be fair, neither Mike or the Mad Dog embraced the Willie hiring, initially.
I agree, as long as Willie is at the helm, it will never happen. Ya know, this might sound a little crazy, but more and more lately I keep thinking that the Santana trade might have been a bad move for the Mets. Let me tell you why. At the rate we are going, with Willie as our manager, the Mets will NEVER win a WS. We will be a mediocre team that is ok but not great. Just like the Phillies of years past. The Cubs, Pirates and Rays will win a world series before the Mets. So get used to it people. But about Santana, he is so good and will help us win games, no doubt, but still not so good that we’ll be WS contenders. Therefore it’s sort of a waste to have him. In 7 years, his contract will be up and/or he’ll be no good anymore and then he’ll be gone. And for what? Whereas if we kept the prospects we let go and maybe in about 2 or 3 years, some of them develop AND we get rid of Willie, then maybe we would have stood a chance. But as it stands now, we have Willie and a mediocre team and that just won’t cut it. Oh well, gonna be a long 10 years or so!
I hope Willie gets fired soon so the mets have a chance to get to the World Series. When the Mets win its in spite of Willie not because of him. He can’t manage a pitching staff, hates young players, and just generally does an all around poor job. The worst part is he doesn’t seem to care. “Oh well its just one game.” Irritating, get someone with some fire in there.
also, completely agree w/ your message Matt…completely agree..and i’ve been a willie supporter for a long time..but i’m getting sick of this pathetic play
THAT CHAMPAGNE IS ONLY GOING TO TASTE A LITTLE BIT SWEETER, RIGHT WILLIE?
what a failure…
huh huh huh Willie supporter huh huh huh huh
I have always been a huge Randolph supporter, but it is time for him to go. He is not right for this team and enough is enough.
The connection is that they are playing the same way, doing the same incorrect things, and Willie sounds just like he did last year.
The only advantage is that it is early enough in the season where Willie can change his tune to get a new response from his guys… or he can be replaced. There is plenty of time, at least right now there is.
Re the earlier Feliciano post — obviously, we don’t know why he had to go to Puerto Rico, but if it has anything to do with his daughter who had open-heart surgery last year, and the Mets punish him for something that wasn’t his fault (his flight being canceled), I don’t know where this organization’s priorities are. Besides, they’d just be punishing all of us by having to watch Schoeneweis out there.
Well this is the same organization that fired Art Howe in the press before letting the man know.
I agree…We do not know Feliciano’s story. Also, if his airline carrier was American Airlines, the FAA grounded over 300 flights entering and leaving NYC.
Look, none of us know what Willie says to the players when not in front of the camera. That said, I am concerned that he is losing (has lost?) some of them. There’s an article in Newsday today about him being so criticial of OP yesterday, comparing his outing negatively with the prior one. Schneider responds that, “There wasn’t much difference between the Perez who took the mound in Florida and the one at Shea. He did great. He was flying along there for a while. A couple of times they got some guys on base and he got the key out that got the inning over with.” (Willie really sounded odd to me in the post-game presser, too — I mean, yeah, in the sixth he was OP being OP, and I agreed with the decision to put Smith in there, but the man threw 5+ of 3 hit, 0 run ball. Was he the problem, or was it the BP who Willie is “not concerned about”??)
Meanwhile, it seems clear as day to me that Schoe cannot be successful here. I don’t even necessarily blame him. The man is booed when he is introduced, and as any human was, has developed a “yeah, they hate me complex” and he simply isn’t able to succeed in that atmosphere. I couldn’t either, and Omar should cut his losses.
Feliciano, whatever his personal situation was, was due into Queens at 9:30 a.m. Isn’t this problematic?? Flights are delayed all the time. Shouldn’t he have had to come back Monday night? That just seems absurd to me.
Finally, just a thought on Castillo: has the knee been bothering him all week? And was it “cold” at Shea? Wasn’t cold where I was watching from.
feliciano has serious issues back home in puerto rico so how dare any of us berate the man for wanting to tend to his family… as far as im concerned he can take as much time as he wants to make sure his daughter is ok (if thats the reason for him gonig and coming back late)
Look, if he has a serious issue at home that’s fine! Give him the day or the week or whatever and make it known that he is unavailable and have someone else ready.
My problem is with the plan of having him due into the airport when the players are reporting to Shea. It just doesn’t make sense.
Certainly agree–I think all of us have shown tremendous patience with Willie over the past few years–but the reality is that the Mets are a .500 team since June 07. .500!!! The talent on this team is not .500 talent. I understand the pen can have its days, but if you can’t motivate these guys to come out breathing fire for the home opener—after last september—against the Phils—-after losing 2 straight in Atl—then nothing’s gonna get them fired up. We’ve been very patient as fans, but this is a win-now team, and he’s not the right guy. I don’t know who the right guy is, but if Larry Bowa (cleary insane) was in the dugout, i’d be afraid to give up a run or make an error–that guy would kill me. ENOUGH IS ENOUGH—SAVE 08—WILLIE MUST GO!
3 out of the current 8 starting position players were not on this team last year. Sure the other 5 guys should be fired up but sometimes this hurts more than it helps. How many times did we say last year that the Mets were pressing and just needed to go out and relax and let their talent do the work. When you press everytime up you start trying to hit the 5 run HR and be the one to get the team out of the funk when its not possible. Its like quicksand, the harder you try and press the farther you fall! The team needs to work together and have fun again and just concentrate on getting on base and letting the guy behind you hit you in. Wright looked like he was swinging for the fences in every at bat yesterday instead of looking at hitting gappers and getting on base. Reyes needs to find a way on base so they can start manufacturing runs again!!!
Enough already guys….its game 7 of 162, there 2-4 off to a slow start….ITS STILL EARLY!! and I’m sick and tired of the panicking and whining…..If there 20-30 after 50 games, then you can say we are in trouble but till then, let them play it out, hit a hot streak and who knows what can happen!!!!
It is not just this season, he hasn’t even changed his attitude from last season and what did that get us. I think he is a great guy and will make a fine manager somewhere just not here. Make a change while we are still in it.
He would be fine for the Yankees. Those guys can manage themselves, and his even keeled approach would work fine over there.
So you’re in the clubhouse everyday when Willie addresses the team?
No?
Didn’t think so.
Neither you nor anyone else, including Matt, knows what Willie’s attitude is in the clubhouse with the players, behind closed doors, where it actually counts. He can’t panic in press conferences, and he can’t show serious concern to the media, even if he is feeling it.
It’s not Willie’s fault that the bullpen can’t get anyone out right now.
It’s not Willie’s fault that Reyes and Castillo aren’t getting on base.
It’s not Willie’s fault that the clutch hit is not being delivered.
And it’s not Willie’s fault that the team is playing Little League-looking defense.
The players are not performing. If you want to blame someone, blame them.
But the thing is, you can’t blame them. You blame the manager. That’s how life is. It’s easy to fire a manager. They don’t make a lot of money (in comparison to the players). They can be fired and replaced. With players, you can trade them, but it’s not that cut and dried. You have to worry about salaries, and whether or not teams are interested and what you get in return. If a team is underachieving, the manager is the first person to take the fall. Right or wrong, that’s just how it works.
Mister Koo, all true, but Krumbledkookie is right also. Changing the manager is not going to change their play. Not going to make the BP pitch better. As for motivation, thats bull. Someone above said something of if you cant motivate these guys to come out breathing fire for the home opener- after losing in Sept.- after losing 2 straight in Atl- against the Phils, then nothing is going to fire them up…but this is a win now team and he is not the right guy. Blaming, as does most here, Willie for not firing them up. He kind of answered himself there. After all that happened, do the players really need someone to motivate them to play better? If they’re not self-motivated they dont belong here. Someone also said above that what Willie says in the press is most likely different than what he says in private. We have no idea what Willie says to his players in the clubhouse or his office. Berating the players in the press is a quick ticket to losing a players trust and respect, and no, I dont think the players have lost respect of him. The bullpen asking for more defined roles is not a sign of losing repect, and despite how much they’ve been used so far, they’ve pretty much have had defined roles so far. The only one’s who say he lost respect of some players are the fans in here, who I’m sure those players told. I guess not coming thru in key situations are signs of lost respect for the manager. Bringing in someone who gets in players faces, and yells, and rants, never works out. Why do you think Pinella has bounced around, Bobby V is in Japan, Bowa couldn’t hold a managerial job, as well as others? Willie’s fatal flaw is in his in-game strategies, but I thought thats what Jerry Manuel is there for, to help him with those. Anyway, after all my bull, it’s not all Willie’s fault, he has blame, but it’s the players not being able to put it together thats been the real problem.
When was the last time the Willie led Mets hit a hot streak? We may be waiting till football season for that to happen. The Knicks are playing with more fire over the last week.
“The Knicks are playing with more fire over the last week.”
That could be the biggest insult to the Mets thus far this season.
I want to give Willie a big insult – Isiah Thomas has more wins on his record this week than Willie.
If Willie was a brand new manager on a brand new team (Joe Girardi), I agree with what you say. But this is the same team playing the same way as last year, basically carrying over after a 6 month break. So, yeah, 6 games is enough to criticize and worry that this season is over before it begins.
Reality Check:
This team has not had a 6 game winning streak since Beltran went deep against Izzy in late August 2006. Doesn’t that seem like ages ago? And wasn’t that a Mets team with a completely different mantra?
A winning steak is not possible with an inconsistent team completely lacking identity and focused emotion. And that is the crux of the entire issue…..identity.
I am not pushing the panic button after six games…however, I am in the majority about Willie. He needs to grow some cojones. Have some fire…Make your players want to play for the love of the game. Challenge them…He hasn’t done a thing as of now. If the Mets are sinking come late May into early June, then I say make a move.
Everyone who is a frequent poster on Metsblog knows that I am a Willie supporter. However, at this point it may be best to let him go. I do not think he is a horrible manager, I just don’t think it’s working. Maybe he’s like the picture on the dresser of your girl friend that broke your heart. It’s not that she was a bad gf but she reminds you of everything that was bad with the relationship because you have not put it past you yet. Time to throw out that picture and put a new picture up.
It’s not about fan reaction, no matter who we hire if we lose they will be all over them. However, who at this point is out there that would fit this team?
I thought it would have been best to fire Willie immediately after last season. It would have sent a message to the players and gone a long way to rid the ghosts of the collapse. Bringing him back along with his “last year is over, forget it” and “it’s just one game, no big deal” attitude just seemed to bottle up the problems. Santana helped, but it doesn’t seem like it’s going to be enough.
and they’d still be 2-4 and the ‘ghosts’ would still be here.
Wright makes the ‘last year is over’ comments too.
really, what do you want him to say. “Damn, last year really bugs me. I stay up at night worrying about it. I hope these guys can turn it around.”? That would be disastrous.
I agree, it’s not Willie’s fault. However, sometimes you have to make a change and people get burned.
No, of course not. I didn’t mean it as much as what he says, but how he comes across with the team. Getting rid of his presence alone could have helped. I remember a player being quoted last year as saying “I know Willie cares, but he doesn’t always show it.” And what about his comment: “If we sip the champagne, that’s great, and if not, that’s life”. Just getting someone new in the clubhouse to lead the team could have made a big difference.
I agree. He should’ve gotten the boot last year.
Managers are either tacticians (Valentine) or fire up the guys types (Pinella), great ones are a little bit of both, but few are.
We know Willie is no tactician, and since the “dire the troops up” didn’t work last season, time to move on. I don’t know if it would accomplish anything if it happens now though.
Well, everyone who is a frequent poster on Metsblog knows that I have always been a low-to-marginal Willie supporter for 3 years. But last year…he completely sent me over the edge. You know what?…it wasn’t b/c of the collpase. In hindsight, that collapse now makes total sense. It was the season-long mentality of the team that allowed for a collpase to occur. And Willie’s inability to change that persistent underachieving mentality did it for me.
For nearly a year I’ve been complaining about this team’s lack of identity and chemistry which is highly evidient in their inability to put a winning streak together (season high 5 last year). We all can’t deny that something clicked in the past year+ that has caused this team to underachieve greatly. Maybe it was Sanchez’s late night cab ride (the catalyst to a failed 2006), maybe it was Molina’s HR, I don’t know. But something happened to this team’s blue-collar toughness, and Willie has done next to nothing to alter that path. Maybe he has tried. But if he has, that would add ineffectiveness to his resume as well.
Willie is a very good guy and I respect him as a person. I do not respect him as a manager. Why?….he’s a Yankee. He manages the Mets like Torre managed the Yankees. Ignoring the X’s and O’s and being a ‘player’s manager’. That works with All-Stars with rings who can manage themselves uner a pre-existing canopy of winning team chemistry and strong fundamentals. I’m sorry…but that is no way to ever describe the Mets. Bobby V knew this. But Willie missed this mark completely on his approach to managing this team of youngsters and Veterans w/o rings, and his complacent demenear has just thrown fuel on the fire. And that is evident in the fact that now the Mets are playing with poor fundamentals. When that begins to happen…you know something is seriously wrong.
Yesterday we saw an emotional team with identity and chemistry who knew how to win. On the other side of the lines, we saw a clueless, underachieving, and lacadasical team who was playing not to lose. Unfortunately, Mets fans were rooting for that second team. And I have no confidence in Willies ability to turn us into a winning team. Instead of giving us the usual ho-hum press conference caked with cliche…..He should have had these guys running wind-sprints betwen foul lines after that game. Seriously Willie….where’s the phuking outrage?
Plane and simple…this team, under the leadership of WIllie, is playing like a bunch of losers. How can one deny that overwhelming fact?
Castillo did have to put on the brakes hard as he tried to run down that pop up. He likely aggrivated the knees by jamming them at bit while slowing quickly.
I look forward to Angel Pagan batting second for a couple days, with Easley’s righty bat 7th. It could make for a balanced lineup, and hopefully it sparks Reyes. Wright and Beltran cant get any RBI’s with no one on base, and they are both hot right now. Even Delgado was going well, but the 1-2 spots have killed the offense so far.
Wright is hot?
What Mets team are you watching..?
the one that hit the ball a little bit in Florida, I guess.
Wright is .304/.407/.609 but it is falling
Delgado is .375/.407/.542 and thats better than expected so far.
I fact 3 through 8 in the order are hitting over .300 so its all on the top 1-2 of the lineup as far as the poor offense is concerned. imo
It is early but nothing looks any different from last year. Thinking we should see what Bobby V., is up to in Japan.
With no player /team leader on the team that can motivate his fellow players, we absolutely need a manager who can, Willie is not that guy.
Managing this level of talent over the past 3 years….Bobby V would have a championship by now.
You can’t prove that at all. That’s like saying that I would have been able to get a championshipt too.
no…i obviously can’t.
But I can say with a high level of confidence that the collapse doesn’t occur. Why?….b/c Bobby V, for all his faults and arrogance, always got the best out of his players.
So …to answer you question above. Bobby V would be a a PERFECT fit for this team.
i love bobby v. and want willie gone, BUT for historical accuracy’s sake… bobby v. was no stranger to sept. collapses. 1998 and (almost) 1999 anyone?
Also talk about a manager who lost the respect of his players. You dont think thats not remembered? Why is it with all the jobs that have been opened since, he’s never gotten one? I say he’s right where he should be, managing a team that has to do what he says without question or back talk, be it right or wrong.
or becasue he is in Japan, is aenjoying celebrity status, and happens to be the highest paid manager in professional baseball (including MLB).
Oh geesh! Bobby V alienated players left and right when he was manager. In 2002 he totally lost many of his players. I think he holds the recent record for most losses in a row by a Met team in 2002.
If Willie were fired, I would not want Bobby V back.
typical VCarver fashion. Arguing against other people’s points,,,,and not offering any remedies or suggestions.
Uh, Danny. Think again. YOU are the one who argued against my posts below.
But whatever … here is my suggestion since you are so big on them. If the Mets don’t make the postseason and Delgado and Show and the absence of Pedro and Alou are a big reason why, then fire both Willie and Omar.
The owners need to do a search for someone with better talent evaluation skills and not someone who runs the club like a kitchen cabinet.
Look at assistant GMs in the game and pluck someone like Drayton Moore and give him the job. Maybe even Ricco is a better option, as long as he was not responsible for Schoeneweis. I would avoid anyone within the Mets organization who thought it was a dandy idea to sign that turkey.
We agree!!!!!!!!!!!!
Not sure it is Willie per se as much as a lack of a fiery personality on the team — no Lenny Dykstra / Wally Backman type that will get in your face if the manager doesn’t. Beltran, Wright, Santana, etc. are all great — however, they just go about their business without the visibly fiery and intense personality that could inspire.
Re: Schoe, not sure you could blame him for yesterday’s game, although agreed that he is not being set up for success in NY.
That probably would have been Feliciano’s inning. Or at least when Schoe got in trouble they could have gone to Heilman and then held Feliciano for the 8th.
Wagner could have come in there somewhere too. It was close home game, there was no save to get by the 8th. Why save him if Feliciano isnt there?
I agree it was probably not Schoe’s inning but Willie did the right thing by bringing him in to face the lefty pinch-hitter. Willie then did the wrong thing by not having a righty up and ready so when the philies pinched hit for the pinch hitter with the right handed batter. Schoe is what he is a lefty specialist thats all, he should not be used to try and get righty’s out in a close game.
I think the biggest problem is that the Mets have not had time to get into a grove, they played 3 games in FL, had a scheduled day off than a rain day off, then played 2 games and had another day off so the schedule isn’t helping. Its hard to get into a grove with so many off days early in the season, baseball players have to see the ball well to be able to hit it. I bet that this team will start playing to its potential during the 17 straight days of games they have starting April 15th.
Two things spring to mind . . .
1) If Carlos Delgado doesn’t hit Chase Utley center-of-mass in the back in the seventh, and instead gets the ball to Jose Reyes to start the 3-6-1 DP, it’s likely that Pat Burrell flies out just like he did to end the inning, and the Mets are on top, 2-0. Would we be having a different conversation now? Maybe.
2) I seem to remember a certain NL East team started last year 4-13, and the major sentiment that was sweeping their fans’ blogs was, Can I volunteer to be the one to fire Charlie Manuel? We know how that one turned out.
All correct, except the doubleplay would have ended the inning.
BOTTOM LINE:
Every time they lose to the Phillies, they effectively lose two games in the standings. Those eight straight losses last year represented a 16-game swing.
The Phillies come to town and act like they know this. The Mets see the Phillies coming and echo Randolph: It’s no big deal.
I just don’t get it anymore. I don’t get the in game moves, I don’t get the post-game press conferences, I don’t even get the “Its a long season” message anymore. I mean, how can anyone buy into the message after the collapse from last year. I mean, our only 2 wins are against a team who’s entire payroll is less than your 1 star makes.
I was at the game yesterday, so I didn’t get to vent on here last night….please allow me to do it now:
Pulling Ollie was bad yesterday (3-hit shut-out in the 6th with 2 outs and the 7 hitter up…not Howard, not Utley, but the 7 hitter). He had only thrown 94 pitches. Let him finish the inning. And MAYBE come out for the 7th inning to face 8, 9, and possibly Rollins. You do this especially if you know you are one man short in the ‘pen. You can’t complain that you expect more out of your starters, like Willie did, after your starter had pitched 5 2/3 shut-out ball and you had a quick hook. What more do you want?
And then…why is Endy not bunting? Down one run, Schneider gets on. You already used the double switch, now BUNT! Move the tying run to 2nd with the top of your order coming up. Nooo…let him hit away, Endy into DP, and then Reyes hits the single that would have possibly tied it up. Again…I’m just at a loss.
Well. I agree on Perez. Definitely. No way he should have came out. Onto Endy, that is just bad luck. Should have been a single, hit the mound and slowed it down. Interesting that the other day, down by 2 we had 1st and second no outs. Reyes tried to bunt in the same situation (to get the tying run to second with 1 out) and was absolutely killed for it. I dont get it. I bet phillie fans were complaing just like we were last year at this time.
Come on, I was sitting at home screaming at Willie to take Ollie out. He had completely lost the strike zone at that point. He had walked two in a row and didn’t throw a strike to either one (the “strikes” were swings at bad pitches). When OP gets to the point where he can’t find the plate you just have to get him out of there, for the team’s sake, and for his. But no way should you bring Joe Smith in at that point since he does terribly with inherited runners. He got out of the inning, barely, but then Willie has him back in to start the next inning. Another bad choice. I’ve always been a Willie supporter, but the counter evidenc eis piling up deep at this point. You can’t fire him now though, right? Terrible message to the team and the division, hey, we’re baliing at the first sign of trouble!! But if by mid-season this has been righted, then WIllie should pay with his job.
Yeah, I definitely hear you!
But I have to thinking that whether or not OP made it through six, he simply wasn’t going to go out for the seventh not w/ 100 pitches (which he probably would have pitched at a minimum to get out of the sixth) and this early in the season.
Randolph has to go with the BP. Whereas I still have some fading faith in Heilman, I really see no future for Shoensh&t and Sosa.
I still defend Randolph, but I am going to give him till mid-season. I am desperate to see the Mets and Randolph succeed together. What true fan wouldn’t!
It’s not even the losing that gets to me, it’s the play. I think I heard more cheers in the pre-game festivities than the game itself. I can’t believe I wasted 6 billable hours to take in such a lifeless game. Something has to be done.
Bring back Bobby Valentine…someone with spunk who will create breaks…this team is playing uninspired ball. This team is always waiting for the next shoe to drop…
Bobby V’s team quit on him too because he was the antiWille. There has to be something in the middle.
when did they quit on him? please refesh my memory.
The team’s attitude is a direct reflection of the manager. There is no fire, no spark no urgency to win. And I don’t mean urgency in the sense that time is short, but in the sense that winning is important to them. Does winning look important to this team?
For those that want to say it is early, you have a valid point and I wouldn’t fire Willie tomorrow. However, this has been the team’s persona dating back to last season.
If something doesn’t change soon I think you have to get someone new.
How can you tell if a team wants to win or not. Do they start gritting their teeth? Growing out a beard, putting on war makeup? I just don’t buy the “they don’t want to win” I think it is much more that they are pressing and trying to do too much.
If you re-read my comment, I was refering to the persona of the team and I asked if winning looked important to them. Not if they wanted to win, because as you pointed out, you can’t read minds.
Bodylanguage however, especially in sports, can be just as important. And in my eyes the whole makeup of how they look and play is lifeless.
I don’t see a lifeless team out there, I see a team that can’t get out of it’s own way just like last September. Every move that Willie makes, every decision by the players in the clutch right now goes the wrong way.
Agreed. No one on here has the right to question the team’s desire, because we don’t spend anytime with them. We can question their play and even their hustle (or lack of it), but their desire is not something we know about.
They look like the Knicks out there:)
i never really liked willie, some of my dislike was unjustified some was justified. but the writing is on the walls, this guy has lost this team and its time for him to go.
I tend to be a big Willie supporter, see what happens kind of guy, but this season should be different. OTOT I look at Leland, an inarguably great manager over there in Detroit and have to wonder what’s going on in his house, with that team that was supposed to be so good.
Jimmy Rollins put some sort of spell on this team last year, and you could see the spell was still in full force yesterday (double play ball scores 2 runs, the next inning, a would-be single up the middle nets 2 outs, easley’s ball to the track shortly thereafter). I’m hoping Rollins sprained ankle is a signal that the spell has played itself out, and tonight’s when we come roaring back. As always, I have high hopes, but I’m keeping the expectation factor low, so the disappointment does not sink in too much. Santana’s going to have to be our Bugs Bunny out there this year, maybe he can pitch every 6th day, & take the 8th inning in between?
I’m at a loss here…this team looks set to disappoint again, the bullpen is half-cocked, with no help in sight, our (second?) biggest star has sensed that he’s human. It’s enough that I didn’t buy the whole year of mlb.tv , just got the first month, because I’m not sure I can watch this every game all season. I’ll reevaluate at the end of April, but so far, I’m going to have to keep my distance for my heart’s sake (and my wife’s sake ;)
I agree. I had held off on buying a bunch of tickets, and am now glad I did. It’s all set up for another heartbreaker, and while I don’t think I can take that, I know it as a very familiar feeling as a Mets fan. I thought we had put those dog days of bad baseball behind us and now they’re creeping back.
Hate to say it, but the Phillies are fun to watch. They play the way I wish my team plays. Their players are smart and tough, while I wonder about the mental and intellectual capabilities of Reyes. Not the brightest bulb, but with all the skills anyone could ask for. But I’d rather have brains at this point. Look at Keith Hernandez, with the build of a weekend golfer, did brilliantly on field because he was so samrt and tough. Reyes is neither of those things, and I wish that D Wright would stop with the Hallmark card remarks after each devastating loss.
I am laughing at the suggestion of Leyland at the moment.
I think Met fans are getting a clear vision into reality vs. myth.
If you think anything but coincidence will change the course of the Mets future should Randolph get fired you are kidding yourselves.
I have watched Davey Johnson, a fairly even keeled, let the veterans police the clubhouse approach work until his veterans decayed and some were sent packing.
I watched Bud Harrelson look brilliant and then lifeless.
I watched Jeff Torborg who was considered at the time of his arrival a brilliant rising star manager fall into the abyss and who has he managed since?
I watched the militant Dallas Green get nowhere.
I watched Bobby Valentine get ridiculed endlessly and have his head on the chopping block repeatedly in early 1999 and 2000, only to be canned after a GM made bad move, after bad move, after bad move.
Howe, talk about a fool (not because of his managing) stepping into the wrong place at the absolute wrong time.
Now Randolph. Is he Connie Mack? Nah, but this team is CONSTANTLY put in a position to win and succeed, the bullpen which is hugely critical in the modern game has been a shambles since the departure of Braford and continued absence of Sanchez. I like Rick Peterson and Omar Minaya a lot, but they have to be raked over the coals for what they have helped piece together.
Smith, Sosa and Schoenewiess is 50% of Randolph’s option. He routinely needs 10 outs a night from the bullpen, at least since roughly last June. That is a huge huge problem. I suspect the weight of innings and the toll at which those innings are taken has perhaps caught up to Aaron Heilman.
I am not suggesting it is easy, but Peterson and Minaya shuttled some young arms out of here and the replacements have all backfired, badly. Very badly.
nice post — thanks for the perspective. One of my biggest memories of going to shea as a kid in the late 80s was listening to people skewer Davey Johnson’s moves on the call-in shows. If Willie has no bullpen to go to, it’s silly to question this move or that move. As for pulling Ollie early, I think it was clear he was heading into the get-no-outs-but-walk-everyone phase of his evening, and I thought that was a great move. Too bad Willie had nobody to go to that can actually throw a pitch where he wants to. Why is everyone so SCARED looking out there, where’ that eye of the tiger? Just don’t get it.
What’s really hard to put a finger on is how great this team was in 2006. They never took things for granted, played pedal to the metal, were never complacent and had a killer instinct. They would go for the kill. Then it completely changed in 2007. And it was generally the same players to boot. I don’t understand how a team can pull a complete 180 like that.
great post
The only way to change the feeling of the team is to change the team.. the truth is.. when Johan doesn’t pitch.. it is the SAME TEAM as 2007
None of Omar’s bullpen “tweaks” have worked.. Wise already lost us a game and is now on the DL, Registar is back with the Rockies, and Sanchez still can’t pitch two days in a row without pain…
The better defense approach saw schenider have two passed balls yesterday, Church has been as advertised so far.. nothing more then slightly above average, Delgado is a year older and boy does it show.. and Reyes is still mired in his slump from last season.
Johan’s been great… Prerez OK.. Maine OK…Pedro and El Duque hurt (surprise surprise) and god only know what Pelfrey is gonna do today..
Meanwhile Bannister is 2-0 after holding the Yankees and Tiges to a total of 2 runs over two starts..Heath Bell is about to supplant the best closer of all time in San Diego, Castillo is banged up twp weeks into the season while Gotay was given away….
The fact that he play like the 2007 Mets is because they are the 2007.. and yes that includes Willie running the clubhouse…
I’d be completely fine with Willie being fired right now.. just for the sake of change.
Ryan Church is the Mets MVP if the season was 6 games and Scheniders offense has been better than anticipated, once again our troubles boil down to Reyes and the pen…..nothing else, every other fricking move Omar made was amazing, flat out amazing.
I’m with you, Cuban…. I thought it was a given that Endy was going to bunt…. for the love of God, he is the best bunter on the team.
Bad… VERY bad call by Willie to have him swing away up there.
Baseball 101.
Woah, OP lost it yesterday, we all watched him last year, and some of us watched him as a Pirate and now if he does that two batters in a row, even with 2 outs, a 6-run inning is blooming.
The problem yesterday was two fold:
1. the pen sucks, flat out, every member of our pen but Wagner is bad, I hate Joe Smith, Sosa is hit or miss, Show should be a left specialist only, Heilman is average, Feliciano tuned out last June, and Wise is hurt now…remember this when all you guys who started the “our pen i better than their pen” stuff before the season come to the realization that we may have one of if not the worst pen in baseball. Seriously who would thought Duaner and Oliver were the only keys 2 years ago…
2. Our offense has been crappy sans one game. Reyes cant hit, Castillo will hit when Reyes is on, but without the leadoff on, a #2 hitter loses a lot of options, Wright has hit some great warning track outs, Beltran has been missing a lot and then you get 5-8 which everyone complained about and they are the only ones getting the job done so far, if Easley has to play Church should bat 2nd so we can have a guy who gets on in front of Wright.
Are you gonna blame Willie for either loss to the Braves to?Or do we blame Maine and then the offense like adults.
i wish i could read what you are trying to write…
Right now, Mets offense SUCKS, Mets defense SUCKS and Mets bullpen SUCKS!!! in other words, My Entire Team Sucks….
I feel like I am talking about a high school team here, and it doesn’t excuse anything, but I think it would help to name a captain. Certainly wouldn’t hurt to empower someone to actual be player leadership.
Good call. It certainly can’t hurt.
That captain would have to be David Wright.
I have to agree Matt. Moreover, I think Willie is not using his strengths. It seems to me there are two types of coaches. You have your X’s and O’s kind of coach [squeezes, hits and runs, good bullpen usage] and you have your emotional leader-type coaches. I think it’s clear to me that Willie isn’t a strategy wonk. That’s fine. But he seems to have not put a character stamp on this team. And I think he has character. Based off of interviews he seems to be a no nonsense type of guy. Play textbook defense and focus etc etc. He also seems to be a tad old school; in a good way.
I remember he did an interview with M&MD in the offseason [it was at Shea I believe] and he seemed to have hinted that he would have liked to have seen his team get angry; bean someone, fight, something during the collapse. But then he added that it’s not for him to get the team to do that. Ummm, yes it is Willy. The best players on this team are still young. If you think it’s going to help the team, then yes, you tell them.
I’m not suggesting bench clearing brawls [that we start mind you] are the recipe for success. But if the team is tainted with a hohum malaise, maybe it is. So, if he’s not an X’s and O’s guy and it doesn’t SEEM like he’s imparting this team with a winning/fight culture, then what is he doing? We already have a GM.
This is probably because he’s been with the Yankees all those years and watched Joe Torre manage. The Yankee players managed themselves. The Mets players clearly aren’t capable of doing that, but that’s the only way Willie knows how to manage.
So then why do we have him? What is HIS role?
He’s a NY guy and he has a winning pedigree. In his own words “I’ve been a winner all my life”. Those are the only reasons why he got the job because as we all know, he had no managerial experience to speak of.
Aren’t those Isiah’s words? He was a winner all his life too.
Exactly. Willie has always tried to be torre’s clone. The Mets will never be the Yankees. Aside from Darren Oliver and Ramon Castro, try to name a player in Willie’s tenure who exceeded expectations. Somehow every1 seems to underperform for this guy. But lets be realistic, Bobby V is under contract to a very good Japanese team and he loves the country. He will not be part of the 08 Mets no matter how much we wish it. That said, for Valentine to get the axe because the Mets needed a scapegoat without Willie getting the same treatmeat is one of the great injustices in baseball. I’m tired of the talk about a suitable replacement not being available. If what you have doesn’t fit, you try something else, anything else, before its too late. Willie must go, before its too late. Its not like Willie does anything particularly well other than deal with the press. Do we really think whoever the next manager would be could be worse than willie at motivation or in game strategy. It seems unlikely. And this bullpen was given far too much credit for being overworked. They’re just bad. Schoenweis can’t pitch in NY. Sosa is a nice long man, but can’t continue in a late inning role, and Heilman, tho he is very good most of the time, always hangs that changeup at the most devastating times. This team needs a new manager and a reworked bullpen. And yes, 6 games is enuff time to start panicking. Actually its the perfect time. Do it by May and maybe we have a chance to turn the season around. This bullpen is awful and so is Willie. If nothing else, I think Reyes will at least turn it around under a new manager and that alone is reason enough to give Willie the axe. Think about this. If nothing else, Omar has at least sucessfully reversed the image of this club. Players want to come here. If we finish third in the East this year, forget that. A bad year following the collapse and this team will go back to having to drastically overpay just for role players because nobody wants to play for a bad NY team with all the media scrutiny in NY. We’ve been medicore since June of 07 and if we dont turn it around soon there will be a sequel to that worst team money can buy book from the Bobby Bonillia era. Now is the time to panic, now is the time for change.
While I don’t think we need a Lou Piniella type……someone who isn’t afraid to get in the faces of the players once in awhile would be nice. Joe Girardi is a perfect example……play hard and he’s your biggest supporter……play sloppy and emotionless and he’ll jump all over you.
And while some players obviously take the games personally I get the feeling too many of them are just out there to collect their paychecks and could care less how the season plays out. We need more players like Wally, HoJo, Lenny and Keith. They were real gamers!
Girardi would have been horrible for this team just like he will not be great for the Yankee’s. He made his fame taking young kids with no expectations and overachieving. Neither of NY teams have low expectations. When he tries the same junk with a team full of veterans it won’t work either.
Obviously the pen is not holding things right now. However, the offense is not scoring runs. That part I can’t get based on stats. I figured that it was like last season and that we were terrible with RISP. But after looking at that, we are batting .316. I know that one game inflates it. So I dug a little deeper. Maybe it’s the “big” hit. There I found that we are near the bottom with 2 outs RISP (.148). I don’t know if that is the answer but it seems like the other team has no problem with the “big hit”.
I think Manny Acta needs to make a return to Flushing. I can only assume the front office was very unhappy to lose him to the Nats.
Forget it. It’s time to promote HOJO. The second biggest cheer during pre-game intros yesterday belonged to Hojo. We need someone that fans can identify with winning and stand behind. That man is Hojo.
Hojo would not work, it would not put last year behind us. It has to be someone not in the current orgainization. I bet Acta would come over for the right price, even midseason.
Look, I like Acta personally but…what is there to say he’ll make a better manager than Hojo or anyone else?
I guess because of the fact I associate him with when we were winning. I just don’t think it can be someone involved with the team in 07.
I think most fans think of Hojo differently than the other coaches on that team. He gets a grace period. If anyone from last year’s team should stay, it’d be Hojo. He gets one pass with that one ring.
Of course, I definitely agree that (if not Hojo), the next manager should come from the outside and not someone currently on the team.
I think Peterson needs to stay too. The rest need to go.
I think Hojo would be stupid. Biggest complaint is that Willie had no managerial experience before given the job. Where’s Hojo’s experience? One year at Brooklyn short season where his game strategies were also questioned? Where they lost 12 of their last 15 games to miss out on the playoffs (sound familiar)? He refused the job at Savannah and has only been a hitting coach for 3 years in the minors before joining the Mets. Most definetly should be from the outside.
I too, agree with everything you said, Matt. I was at the game yesterday and it was a miserable experience -a waste of money on tickets, transportation, concessions and a vacation day. After last season you would think the team would be fired up to redeem themselves for that historic and inexcusable collapse. But since Saturday all I see is lethargy. No drive, no focus, and no heart whatsoever. Willie needs to start flipping tables and show some emotion or we’re headed down the Art Howe path to zombie-dom. Another team that looks great on paper but doesn’t perform. You can bet Bobby V. wouldn’t be taking things so calmly or lightly.
Frankly, if Willie can’t find it in him to motivate his players then they should find another manager pronto. As a fan, I feel like I deserve more than the putrid effort this team put forth at the end of last season and 6 games into this one. If the team doesn’t care about winning, why should I?
Again, how can you tell the team does not care about winning. The signs I see, as a coach, are they are trying too hard. They are pressing and doing things they can’t do, including Willie.
Yes, it’s early and no need need to freak and no, I’ve not been a Willie basher, but the two games in Atl and thenyesterday have really been debilitating. These losses show:
1. Our bullpen is as totally undependable as it was during that horrifying stretch at end of last season. Show is lousy and Sosa is a crapshoot.
2. The offense has major problems getting clutch hits.
3. Jose Reyes is still in a funk and it is really starting to worry me.
4. Signing Luis Castillo and his bad knees for four years was probably a short-term solution with long term liabilities. Now it looks like the short-term is in jeopardy.
5. Willie makes strange decisions. Two outs nobody in Atl and he has Reyes bunt? Then Endy comes up in a perfect bunt situation yesterday and he has him swing away. Both moves backfired and they are just examples.
6. Willie’s post-game comments are a denial of reality. Nine losses in a row to Philly and no connection, Willie? You know that’s BS. He helps no one with silly BS like that.
7. I believe Omar has done a very good overall, but he has relied too much on older guys and they are already breaking down in April (Pedro, El Duque, Alou, Castillo).
8. Yes, we have 155 games to go but anyone with a brain and an open mind has to be disturbed by these early trends. I’ve loved this team since 1962 and I don’t EVER recall being more on edge about them than I am now.
Re: #4
Somewhere in Colorado Gotay is laughing it up.
Why because he never plays on the Braves and has about the same record as the Mets? All along while he is waiting the time until the Braves get healthy and is released.
If you were him, would you not be laughing?
Why? Because they cut me and now the Braves will be in a position to do the same thing. Easley is a better hitter than Gotay anyway and can’t be that much worse on defense.
re: #5 I meant say two on, nobody out with Reyes up and he has him bunt. Often this is a good play, but not with Reyes up there..a guy who can drive the ball and give you a big inning.
Either we take it to them tonight, or we might have to hit someone. Maybe both. And I do not advocate violence, but maybe Big Pelf can be “wild” on a pitch or two.
What scares me is that this team seems to be emotionally fragile. Every team has losing streaks— this team is no different— but does every streak have to stir up the memories of last year? Against the Phillies it seems to. So, let’s end that now. Let’s pile on Kendrick and go out and score 10 runs. (if that happens, no need to hit someone, the Phillies would be fired up for tomorrow.)
Maybe hitting Utley 5 times today will help.
Unless you’re trying to injure, don’t think it will.
I think everyone is missing the big positive picture, we have Pelfry going today things are gonna get better. HA, sorry I thought i could type that with a straight face.
And Nelson Figueroa on Friday.
Speaking of Castillo, did anyone hear that the real reason why he left the game yesterday was because his knees hurt after he walked all around Manhattan looking for a place to live?? Supposedly, this is what he told his trainer yesterday….. unexcusable!
barry zito’s contract is probably the worst in history, but castillo’s is very, very, very bad. what a huge mistake that was. was gotay really that poor a defender that he couldn’t play second and get paid a small fraction of what castillo is stealing from the mets?
Do you honestly think that in 2 years if Castillo is officiallly done (which right now he is not he his .300 with almost a .370 OBP last season) that we can’t use him as a bench player? His contract will not restrict the Mets if a better option becomes available.
If you want a bench player in two years, you go get one for a fraction of what you would pay Castillo. You don’t sign him for four years and after two years of subpar baseball, shift him to the bench. That is simply the worst way conceivable to stock a bench. It’s like buying a flat tire for a spare.
Here’s the clincher:
Castillo makes $6m/yr, while Marlon Anderson makes $1m/yr.
You want to give a gimpy player coming off surgery a four year deal to force you to carry an additional player on the 25 man roster because he can’t stay healthy, just to become a bench player getting paid SIX times what a bench player should be played?
Yikes.
Thank you Charlie … I don’t know why he doesn’t get this.
I am just saying that he does not tie the hands of a large market team. Castillo was the best option for the Mets and a 3 year contract would have been generous. A 4 is bad but again it’s not enough to worry about. I am much more worried about this season than I am 3 years from now. Either way long contract or not he would have been here now and would currently be struggling and would still be a career .300 hitter with great defense.
Exactly…I need a bench player who can’t get the ball out of the infield and is making $6M a year. That makes a ton of sense.
Thereal … it was a HORRIBLE decision and a HORRIBLE contract. Stop defending it.
Yeah. I’m at a loss too.
Brian Bannister is sitting down the Tigers and Yankees line-ups, while the Mets can’t get through Jamie Moyer and that overrated Braves bullpen.
Sad…
I sense a shift in tone in here. Even the sunshiners are getting rained on. This hurts. It does feel like the last FOUR months of last year. I don’t like it one bit.
You have to hit the depths before things start to get better….
Unfortunately, this is probably not the depths yet. Getting swept would be.
anybody else catch the WE WANT MAZ chants behind yallof and maz post game in front of Gate A?
i’m not getting worked up about this today. either this situation is going to turn around quickly or changes will happen. ownership is not going to tolerate a mini-isiah situation right before a new park is christened.
how about HOJO?
Why? Do you think he would have done anything differently? Did we magically start winning last year and hitting better when he arrived? I like Hojo but we need someone with experience.
What experience are you looking for exactly? Lou Pinella experience? Joe Torre experience? Charlie Manuel experience? Dusty Baker experience? Does it have to be MLB managing experience?
There are tons of guys with experience out there. Except that most of the experience out there are not the experience that would be condusive for the METS. I think you should just look for the guy with the best personality match (to what we want for this team) and have good baseball IQ.
I think it has to be someone who can manage the media, a mixed team of youth and veterans and someone who has been through ups and downs enough to know how to pull his team out of a slump.
Maybe Isiah can manage baseball.
That’s a pretty small list you’re looking at…
i think the point is, a guy with a higher baseball I.Q. would be better, despite his “experience.”
BIG PELF…..that’s who were are relying on to steady the ship?
This team hasn’t been the same since the big celebration after winning the division in 2006. Think way back….that team went into a horrible funk after clinching. Yes, they bounced back against the Dodgers and fought hard against the Cards, but even losing that series was a huge let down. Then 2007…thats all I can say about that. Any now, 2-4 with only 2 wins against FLORIDA!
I know where I’ll be tonight at 7pm. And it won’t be tuned in to SNY.
If anyone wants to watch real athletes play their rear ends off and earn their money, tonight is game one of Rangers v.s. Devils.
This series will not disappoint. Unfortunately the same can not be said for the Mets.
I’ve always been a Willie supporter, but so far this year, I’m yet to see the team “turn the page” as he would say from last Sept.
Bottom line, in my eyes, Willie gets to June 1 to get this team righted. By righted, I mean playing to the talent level on the team. We can talk about age, the bullpen and the lefty-heavy lineup all we want, but there is still more than enough talent for this team to win this division. The starting pitching alone, even with Pedro and El Duque o the shelf, should get this done. If this team is still floundering at or below .500, can Willie and put Oberkfell in as interim manager. See if the players respond to a new message. To me, this is when the clock on Omar begins. If it’s just a question of the team tuning out their manager (as I feel a player like Reyes has done), then a new, competent voice should turn them around. If the team continues to flounder, it’s clear that the roster was weakly assembled and Omar must be held accountable. He would get the can at the end of the season. It would be easier to transition to a new GM in the off-season anyway. A mid-season firing for Omar would just put one of his henchmen in the interim spot.
I think this is reasonable. Oberkfell probably deserves a chance. Question is, what about the rest of the staff? Peterson is held in such high regard… The other option in Jerry Manuel. I know he has been a part of this and is the bench coach, but given the chance on his own, I think you’d see some different things.
On WFAN, Evan Roberts has just said what I’ve been wanting to say, but thought I’d get killed for saying:
Jose Reyes is the most overrated player in NYC.
I would expand that to the MLB.
You know, I always thought that Reyes was going to be one of the most explosive players in MLB for years to come. I also thought that he could easily turn into another Rafael Furcal. I’m not ready to give up on Reyes yet but the writing on the wall seems to be there.
You know what’s so horrible? When I read Rafael Furcal, my stomach dropped. It’s actually conceivable, when a year ago it would have been the most ridiculous notion.
Yeah, it’s not something you want to think about but it’s looking like that will happen. Rafael Furcal had a fantastic season with the Braves and everybody thought that he was the next big thing. He never had a great season again and while he’s not a complete bust, he’s never going to be a top player again.
It’s a shame because his 2006 was excellent. And I’m starting to get the feeling that it could have been his career year. I’m not ready to give up either, but I thought he’d be on the level of Hanley Ramirez at this point.
Circa April 9, 2007:
“The golden boy david wright is not all he’s cracked up to be and should go to the minors”
I dont wanna here any contradicting comments!!!!!
Look at the fan rate to see if everyone was happy with Randolph!!! Everyone loved him two weeks ago! I have said this since last year, the guy is nice, the guy was a good baseball player. The guy is NOT a good manager. He just doenst have the instinct, he really doesn’t. I mean how many f n times do you sit down in a course of a game and go willie….willie what r u doing?? or Why AREN’T you doing this?? How does everyone else including the fans know the obvious moves to make and he doesn’t????? It boggles my mind… All this talent, and NOTHING!!! Watching that game yesterday, i’m already stressed out and getting anxiety and its the first week. The problem is its just a taste of things to come…
Very worried
Angelo
I wouldn’t say everyone loved him two weeks ago. There was a lot of optimism going around and would chalk up that high rating to just that, optimism.
(I had to contradict you, just out of principle.)
how could u be optimistic about a guy like randolph
(sorry have to call you out)
it was general (more aptly put, johan) optimism. willie was just the recipient of the general optimism. he won’t get a high rating again.
I know that I sit and yell at Willie every game. My wife and 11 year old are getting sick of me getting sick of Willie. I think all those years in the AL and on the Yankees bench has made him ill-prepared for how the game needs to be played in the NL and on the Mets. Hard to believe how bad I’m feeling about the Mets this year. Meanwhile the Phillies are fun to watch, as the do whatever it takes to win. As a fan of baseball I admire them and wish we could get some of that moxie and attitude.
mets lack fire and passion on the field. Just because willie isn’t a hot head, does not mean the players can’t be that way. guys need to step up and play like they have that burning desire to win. Mets still seem to think they can just show up and the wins will come.
I heard someone on the fan say something I thought was really true: Willie trusts his relievers more than his starters to get a tough out in the 6th/7th inning. in a perfect world a reliever comes in and gets outs, but I’d rather die with a starter thats been great all day, then take a chance a reliever’s gonna have it that day.
If you can get a good bat, I’d say trade heilman. He gives up too many homers, and big hits.
Everyone including myself has gotten on the fire Willie band wagon. But the players have to stop acting like over paid baby millionares and take some responsibility and play. I just think they have been lulled with the touchy feely let’s all hold hands and sing Kumby ya, well get them tomorrow attitude.
I wish willie was more of an emotional leader too! But honestly, its on the players. even if a manager puts the team in a bad situation, the players have to rise to the occasion!
looking at the offseason, we really could have used the fire and passion of guys like Rowen, and Eckstein..
i’ve telling some of you clowns here on this very site, willie will be the death of this team. this team is overrated, but they have some talent, and if you still haven’t learned anything from managing in year 4, there is something wrong. his players criticize him, right or wrong. from floyd to bell, to lo duca, to gotay, to milledge, to wagner, to feliciano, hello, that’s a warning sign people that he’s no even a good players manager, let alone a bad strategical one. he throws players under the bus, never takes responsibilty, talks a big game, but never backs it up, and then he arrogant with it that makes it worst.
i was a big willie supporter before he was the manager, but he has to go. i said after 40 games, you make your judgement on him, but now, you have to have a quick hook on him.
Yeah, refer to the people you’re trying to persuade as clowns. That will surely win them over to your side. Brilliant strategy, wish I’d thought of it.
i don’t care if they get sensitive, i was saying this about willie since september, and all i was getting was “you’re not a real fan” BS.
ok, i won’t call them clowns, i’ll call them people. does that make u feel better?
im on a tangent this morning….
Reyes: O MY GOD! If he swings at another first pitch im gonna lose it….The guy is regressing not progressing. He looks lost and a easy out at most points. He will never do anything vs a decent pitcher with some knowledge. Just throw em junk in the dirt inside he’ll swing!
I always stuck up for him, but he is soooooooooo overrated. He is not even in the top 7 in ss in the majors…They treat him like he is the next big thing
He wants to be on a cover of a video game? Act like you deserve to be on it then!!!
Again very worried…
It doesn’t matter how good the starting pitchers are if the relievers don’t win the games for them. Sadly, Yesterday’s game is a tangible proof of that….
baseball is probably the hardest game there is to “force” yourself to win off of motivation or emotion, you could be pumped up as anything, and go out there and not win, it’s how it goes. I still think it’s amusing that posts here on metsblog are already painting pictures of the season, yes, the season, after just 6 games. I also think its amusing that people take what Willie says during his press conference as the word. He’s pandering to the media, seriously, wake up! What is he supposed to say? “this team doesn’t have it, they’re burdened by the collapse, I think we’re in for a long one.” PLEASE. It’s like you know that Matt, but you’re not actually able to separate yourself from what he says. Now if we were winning, you would be able to, because what does it matter anyway? I’m just letting you know, it doesn’t matter either way. I’m not trying to defend the guy, or defend the Mets, these are just facts. Either way, its 6 games, and if you want to call the season over now, go root for another team.
Thanks i needed that Dark….
But com on lil aggravated with Randolph?
Lil frustrated with Reyes?
Why is it so hard to get across the concern that this year’s team, looks like last year’s team? It is this that concerns so many. Is it impossible to understand that?
Willie lost this team LAST YEAR … and it has clearly carried over. He should have been fired after 07 … I was not happy that he came back but I was giving him a chance. It’s just more of the same though. Willie’s attitude has not changed … his way of doing things has not changed … and his use of the bullpen has not changed.
Get him out of here.
dude, you people need to stop, stop accusing me of stuff like that. I wasn’t saying i wasn’t concerned, I don’t need to come on here and say i’m concerned with Willie or Reyes, its a waste of time, where is it going to get me? In fact, yeah, i’m frustrated with both of them. That was not the point of my post. REad my post, it has nothing to do with being frustrated about this team. It’s about being realistic and rational
darkstar, we’ve posted back and forth for a few years now, so i’ll be honest with you. i appreciate your admitting concern, but please realize that when you reply to someone’s post about their concern with a curt relax-type post, it’s annoying and makes, at least me, think you are just one of those sunshiners.
read it however you want, but if you thought it was just a “sunshine” post, you missed the whole point. There is no shame in being frustrated at these 6 games, I am, everyone is, that’s not what I was getting at. In fact, within my post I made this statement, “I’m not trying to defend the guy (referring to Willie), or defend the Mets,” so I don’t know what to tell you. This is just the kind of fan I am, always have been, and always will be. I’m realistic, and I’ll hold by that if you think 6 games is the be all, end all, you’re kidding yourself. Personally, I’m willing to see what happens before I get all emotional and backlash against the team. Will I be frustrated? You bet.
okay, so you will wait to be frustrated. good for you. unfortunately, after waiting six months to finally get the taste of last year’s disgusting play out of my mouth, i am not interesting in waiting until this team is out of contention before allowing myself to be frustrated.
once again, you miss the point, I am already frustrated, as I stated in my previous post, but i’m not emotional and ready to backlash against the team.
Of the course the season is only just beginning. The nutcases always see the sky falling. But the type of play we’ve seen so far is scarily like what we saw last August/September. And that has even the sunshine crowd starting to squirm. You mean to tell me you don’t even feel it a little bit?
what is wrong with you people? My post had nothing to do with how I think we’re playing. We’re not playing good! Just like we didn’t play well in September last year. Jeese, I’m just going to stop posting, this is freaking ridiculous.
Dorkstar, you’re wrong..You can win by inspiration, motivation and hustle and grit…look at the Phillies!!!! .you’re far too soft on the Mets and Randolph…
I think “Mister Koo” hit the nail on the head in his earlier post. Willie learned from watching Joe Torre and, as we all know, Torre showed no emotion what-so-ever. Torre basically let the team manage itself. Well, we are not the Yankees and our team is a lot younger and less mature. They need that guidance, they need that spark and they need that kick in the butt.
I’m sorry, I’ve been a Randolph supporter for a long time but something has got to change. We have all the tools to put together, not only a winning season, but a Championship season. This season, of all seasons, we have the ability to legitimately win the World Series (providing we stay healthy).
I’m tired of people saying “it’s only April, relax”. It’s that attitude, specifically, that allowed this team to slump in September and blow a 7 game lead in less than two weeks. Those “only April” games count. Those “only May” games, count. They ALL count.
Randolph’s managerial style doesn’t “fit” with the Mets team and it only “fit” prior in prior seasons because we were winning. When you win, nothing matters. Yes, we’re not doing well, so people are hitting the panic button but I truly believe my statement. This team doesn’t have one offensive player that is fiery and plays with that emotion that you can physically see. Wagner speaks it but at least he backs it up with his pitching. It’s not always easy to watch but he does his job.
We need that on offense. We don’t need someone regurgitating that we’re the “Team to Beat”. We need someone that’s going to fire up this team and yell a little bit. Someone that’s going to get in the faces of the players and say “We need to do better…You need to do better”.
Whether that’s a player or a manger, it needs to happen. Personally, I think it starts with the manager.
My opinion is that this team needs to make a trade. Seriously.
Not for a #1 or 2 SP or an impact player in the OF. We need to make a trade for a guy who fires dudes up and tossed the post-game buffet across the room.
In the preseason, we dismissed guys like Lofton because they were too old and vocal to be anything more than a clubhouse cancer. I’m starting to think that instead of stockpiling a bunch of young guys to sit on the bench for no other reason than that they are young, we need to find ourselves a firey veteran or two.
I love our players, but it is becoming increasingly clear to me that we don’t have a team leader in the truest sense of the word.
While I agree with you that we need a player with emotion, I disagree that it should come via trade – for a variety of reasons.
First and foremost, we don’t have the players to trade right now and should focus on building within the organization. That being said, you can’t just “trade” for a player with emotion.
When you’re searching for a player like that, it has to come from within, from a player that’s already on the team. Trading for “that guy” won’t spark the team. He’d be considered the newbie and I’m sure it would cause more damage than good.
But I agree with you that we need some emotion. It should start from our manager, it should start with Willie.
The whole point is Willie gets rid of players with emotion. He tones down Reyes and the whole team reflects his coma like attitude.
I think the attitude of the Mets this year is the same as last September. It is obvious the bullpen is downright poor. At some point and some point soon, the Mets should start considering the release of Willie Randolph.
Its been 6 games and this season is already beating the sh*t outta me. After sundays loss, i was ok thinking its still early, dont get too worked up over it. No time to start calling out the manager. Things will work themselves out.
One game later….and Im on board to fire Willie. I can not take this anymore. there is nothing worse to me than losing to the phillies. and when is it going to end. i cant take it anymore.
Its time for a change. Willie is just not motivating this team right now. The bullpen is atrocious. Which before the year i thuoght would be the strength of the team.
Reyes and Castillo are garbage. They can not get on base, and when they arent on base, this team will not score.
I hate it. I hate losing to the phillies and I hate that i have to put my hope in Mike Pelfrey shutting the phillies down for 7 innings tonight.
I hate this.
Only 7 innings? You think that will be enough?
I’m not packing it in yet, or giving up hope. I still believe this team can be competitive. I’m extremely frustrated though, and it is too easy right now to look for reasons why the sky is falling. Like Bannister, but I swore I wasn’t going to go there in this post.
I’ve neither supported or been critial of Willie, as he seems too often to be a non entity. Maybe that is the issue, he just doesn’t seem to be in charge or in command. I have had a hard time with his decisions in critical spots and especially with the pen. Chavez not bunting and continuing with Shoe yesterday were just further evidence of poor judegement. Now, having said that, I’ve coached youth and high school ball for over 20 years and there is always more going on that what is seen by the fan or person in the bleachers. I’m in NO way comparing myself, but I am trying hard to give Willie the benefit of the doubt. However, if the team doesn’t start being competitive he will certainly be a casualty,
There does appear to be a cancer on the team, and if it is Willie then I hope they eradicate it sooner than later. If it is not Willie, then they need to figure it out quckly to save his job!
Something to not make light of…the starters will become extremely frustrated when the leave after pitching great, to only have the pen implode. 4 walks, 5 hits and 5 runs, wth or without an error just sucks. Absolutely sucks!
My hope right now is that Pelf has a great outing, goes into late innings and helps right the ship. Reyes goes 3-4 and steals 2 bags, and scores 2 runs.
It’s simple
HIRE KEITH HERNANDEZ AS MANAGER
he could be the Phil Jackson of Baseball
Keith wouldn’t want to be a manager. Too much time and work. He likes to enjoy his wine and steak dinners. Heck, he even complains about the length of time he has to sit in the booth during games.
Matt,
This has to be one of your top 10 posts. Good job, I believe your post speaks for a HUGE portion of the fanbase.
When even Matt is starting to turn, you know its not knee-jerk. Thanks for the site and keep up the good work.
What surprises me the most, is that last year when people were freaking out, the same people that are today saying to “relax” were telling everyone to relax last year. I don’t think these folks have the same passion for the team or the game. I don’t think they realize how rare it is to have a team capable of truly competing for a championship. I find myself wondering if they truly care at all.
They were going to sip the champagne with Willie.
Thank you NY Cuban, you made me laugh, and I really needed a laugh.
When things were falling apart last September, I never said “relax” or anything close to it. What I did say is that I think the problem was mostly the bullpen and the way Omar constructed the team. I still feel that way about last year. And I feel that’s the primary issue now too.
However, I am saying to “relax” now. Because it’s April and not September.
When it’s late August and they are maybe 8 games out of first and the bullpen still looks crappy, then I’ll stop staying relax.
Having said that, I am looking forward to next year when a few of the players now on the roster will no longer be there. Hopefully Omar stops signing so many AARP players.
I resent your implying that people who say to relax in April aren’t sufficient fans. Maybe people who refuse to look at Omar without his teflon coat are the fans who are lacking.
I totally agree Matt! This Joe Torre Jr. everything will all be all right in the end crap has to stop. Willie needs to slam the table and shake these guys up a little.
The Phillies rise to a higher level every time they play us and we need to match that intensity each game not just sit back and say we are better and will win out in the end. It’s the same message that was flying while the ship sunk last September. It’s time for a new message Willie!!!
I’m not sure he can give a new message. It might have to come from another manager.
You know what’s ironic??
The type of guy and player we need with fire and attitude, we traded to the Nationals for Church and Schneider…
A FIGHT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The mets need to fight. Hit Utley again do something! They need some unity. They need to get together and just get crazy…. There is not bonding in this team. You know damn well none of these players hang out together. I know some of you dont think that means anything but it does….
I still think a fight is great way to fire people up. Only problem is Mets might get their a$$ kicked then were really screwed…
How about if Pelfry fires the first pitch into our dugout and knocks Willie out. then we have a chance, wait the other team may fight with us if we try to take Willie out as well.
I couldn’t agree more. I would argue we are more talented than the phils from top to botome, but they play with a toughness that we are surely lacking. They obviously treat games against us as “must win” . They play tough and we play soft (as of late). I see the killer instinct in their eyes that I don’t see in our players eyes. When they tied the game yesterday, it looked like we got totally deflated, as if the players knew they wouldn’t and couldn’t come back. 6 games in and it feels like last season has never ended.
Sometimes, I wonder if we over-estimate the Mets. Maybe they aren’t capable of championship-caliber play.
I’m beginning to think this might actually be more the reality…
2006 was an aberration…
I agree 100%. You can see see the confidence in the Phillies team as well as our waiting for the other shoe to drop attitude. They clearly get pumped up for games against us.
Hey Matt,
How long do we have to wait for a new Willie confidence poll? Or do you have to have the IT dept. re – work it to accept negative numbers first?
We need the Yankees to trade Bobby Abreu back to the phillies. That will take the fight right out of them, and we can get back to beating them.
Here is the sad thing, and of course it will eventually cost Willie his job….
If the Met lose today they will be in last place with the worst record in the NL. Best case they would be tied with Giants who we all know are supposed to suck.
The NL East is going to be a tough battle this year as even the normal cellar dwellers look to be improving while everyone is planning on the Phils and Braves being contenders. The Mets can ill afford to get off to a rough start.
Man, I hope we win today. I sure wasn’t thinking about this a week ago. Shoot, I was even thinking about this when Delgado hit the solo dinger yesterday. We need 3-4 wins to get everybody’s head straight.
I normally wouldnt be worried about a 2-4 start, except that with last year I think its imperative this team gets off to a good start, so it doesnt get into their heads.
WHERE IS THE FIRE THAT WILLIE RANDOLPH HAD WHILE HE WAS A PLAYER? I WANT TO SEE THAT FIRE COME BACK, AND UNTIL I SEE HIM ARGUE..AND I MEAN ACTUALLY ARGUE A CALL, “STRIKE”, OR DISALLOWED HR, EVEN IF THE CALL WON’T GET REVERSED…HE NEEDS TO GET PUMPED! MAYBE WE SHOULD CALL IN ARNOLD SCHWARZENEGGER TO “PUMP YOU UP!” I FEEL LIKE HE’S ALREADY LOST FAITH IN HIS TEAM (ALTHOUGH I KNOW HE HASN’T) BECAUSE HE DOESN’T SHOW ENOUGH EMOTION. AS MUCH AS I HATE TO SAY THIS, I WANT TO SEE HIM BE LIKE BOBBY COX OR LOU PINNELLA. HE NEEDS TO WANT TO WIN AND I KNOW IN HIS HEART HE DOES, BUT I JUST DON’T SEE IT.
ANYONE AGREE?
I’ve been nothing but a Willie supporter for his entire tenure with the team, but I’m starting to slowly convert to the other side. His leash this season has to be shorter, as I’m starting to be convinced that maybe, just maybe, he lost his team.
That said, if the team turns it around and bangs out 5 straight and 8 of 10, I’m going to regret ever making this post :)
Maybe Willie is the right man for this job, maybe he isn’t. If you ask me, we’re going to find out which it is by June.
In the final summer at Shea Stadium we have a manger that divided our fan base and destroyed a 40 year old tradition.
R.I.P
Ya Gotta Believe
You’re right. we don’t know what Willie says to the team in the locker room, and we know that the press conference is a show.
It needs to be a different show. He’s not projecting confidence or assertiveness or any authority whatsoever.
Someone on WFAN last night opined that the team doesn’t seem to want to play for Willie. I feel there’s some truth in that, but of course, it’s all conjecture, I don’t know.
BTW Matt…..congrats on finally sticking your head out. I honestly was expecting your typical overly optimistic pie in the sky don’t worry it’searly in the season koom-bay-ahh BS.
You are right on point. This was a joy to read.
SORRY FOR CAPSLOCK – NEEDE DUE TO DISABILITY. AS MONIKER SUGGESTS, I’VE BEEN A METS FAN FROM DAY 1. MY CONCERN IS WILLIE’S ARROGANT YANKEE APPROACH. I DON’T BELIEVE WHAT HE SAYS TO REPORTERS OR CARE WHAT HE SAYS BEHIND CLOSED LOCKER ROOM DOORS. TEAM DOESN’T NEED RAH-RAH OR DAMN YOU IN YOUR FACE MNGR AIMED AT THEM; BUT A MANAGER THAT WILL SHOW THEM HOW TO BE IN YOUR FACE TO OTHER TEAMS. RATHER THAN WILLIE’S WORDS I WANT HIM TO CHANGE HIS ACTIONS. LOOK TO MAEUVER TOWARD FAVORABLE MATCHUPS FOR INSTANCE, WAS SANTANA PITCHING AGAINST ATLANTA MORE FAVORABLE THAN SANTANA PITCHING AGAINST PHIL.? DON’T THINK SO. AFTER THE RAINOUT WILLIE HAD AN OPPORTUNITY TO POSSIBLY START PELFREY IN SANDAY’S GAME (CONSIDERING IT IS THE SCENE OF PELFREY’S MOST DOMINANT PERFORMANCE) AND PUSHING THE BIG GUN SANTANA TO TUES. ALIGNING OUR TWO LH STARTERS TO GO Vs PHILS SANTANA, PEREZ, MAINE INSTEAD OF PEREZ, PELFREY, MAINE. IS IT COINCIDENTAL THAT METS FACE SMOLTZ IN EVERY SERIES? I THINK NOT. WILLIE PROBABLY WOULD SAY, “I SHOULDN’T HAVE TO DO THAT” AND HE’D CERTAINLY BE RIGHT HE SHOULDN’T HAVE DO; BUT CERTAINLY DOES HAVE TO WITH THIS ROSTER OF TALENT THAT HAS EZXPERIENCED MINIMAL SUCCESS THROUGHOUT THEIR ENTIRE RESUMES. WILLIE, BY HIMSELF, HAS MORE JEWELRY THAN THE ENTIRE 40 MAN ROSTER HAS COLLECTIVELY WITH THE MAJORITY BEING OWNED BY PEDRO & DUQUE (INACTIVE). WILLIE NEEDS TO FULLY EMBRACE THAT HIS JOB IS TO SET HIS TEAM IN THE BEST POSITION FOR SUCCESS. YANKEE ARROGANCE WOULD STATE “WE ARE THE YANKEES THEY NEED TO ADJUST” WELL, LIKE IT OR NOT IT WORKS FOR THEM; BUT ISN’T WORKING FOR US. WILLIE NEEDS TO BE MORE CREATIVE AND ASSERTIVE. IS IT ANY WONDER THAT WILLIE IS PICTURED AS A BEMUSED BYSTANDER IN THIS BUDDING FEUD WITH PHILLIES? NO, IT’S NOT YANKS/SOX; BUT IT’S SOMETHING HE NEEDS TO BE INVOLVED IN. EVEN FATMAN MANUEL HAS A QUOTE,” THEY’LL (METS) TALK, WHILE WE’LL(PHILS) HIT. WHERE IS WILLIES BACKING OF BELTRAN’S STATEMENT? ANY WONDER WHY THE TEAM HASN’T RALLIED TO IT IF THE FIELD LEADER CHOOSES TO IGNORE IT? WHAT WOULD BOBBY V. DO, WHAT WOULD DAVEY JOHNSON DO?
You are spot on on the Yankee analogy. I have a long post above where I give me 2 cents on that very topic, one I’ve been screaming about for over a year.
Mets don’t have that long winning tradition that is felt and implied the second one walks into the Yankee clubhouse. No brainer….You cannot apply the techniques in the South Bronx to Flushing. That is clearly what Willie has tried to do for the past 3 years, and it’s severely backfired. But can we all honestly blame Willie for applying this technique?….It’s all he really knows.
He’s a Yankee. That means he has no idea how to manage the poker game without beginning the game with a big stack of chips.
He’s just not a fit.
Agree mostly, except with
“YANKEE ARROGANCE WOULD STATE “WE ARE THE YANKEES THEY NEED TO ADJUST” WELL, LIKE IT OR NOT IT WORKS FOR THEM”
It hasn’t been working for them at all, lately. Which is pleasing.
It’s such a shame Willie is getting all the heat when a ton of it should be directed at Omar instead. It’s too bad Matt didn’t even mention Omar in his Willie piece once. Not once.
Omar said at the end of the winter that he assembled the talent and now it was up to the players to get it done. Problem is, not all those players are the type of players who can get the job done (Schoeneweis), and many are too old to stay healthy enough to contribute now (Alou, Pedro, El Duque). Another player (Delgado) still doesn’t look like he’s come out of his boredom that afflicted him last year, despite his good BA.
About 1/5th of the payroll is on the disabled list. But it’s Willie’s fault, I guess. He should have discovered an elixir of youth for all his players.
For what is now a team hobbled by injuries, Willie will be the fall guy if they don’t come out of it soon. But there is no way Omar should get off the hook. He shouldn’t be canned during the season, for stability’s sake, but the ownership needs to take a close look at Omar and his judgment. His talent evaluation skills need to be questioned, as well as his penchant for putting so many older players on the team who are constantly hurt and unable to contribute.
You could be 100% correct but there is the question of how much input Willie has on player acquisitions.
I would bet very little. Willie has no power to tell Omar who to sign … obviously, as Omar is his boss. Ever dictate to your boss whom to hire? (”Hey boss, if you don’t give my best friend that job I’m gonna fire you!)
Willie can only suggest.
no…but my boss does rely on my work and my opinion in order to make informed decisions. If he didn’t, I wouldn’t work for him.
You make this out to be such a black and white situation. We do not have a Stalinesque dictatorsip in the halls of Flushing Meadow with Omar ruling with an iron fist..
Omar would be unwise not to listen to his advisors when making decisions. One of those advisors better be the phuking manager. And that is the point you are missing. And it’s mindboggling. This is mgmt 101.
I’ve never said or implied that Omar never listens to his advisors. I know he does. For example, he himself said that he was against signing Sosa, but that his advisors convinced him to.
But Willie is a different matter. Most managers in the majors are not consulted for most acquisitions by their GMs. They may be asked their opinion of some players some of the time, but I don’t think that goes a long way toward altering a GM’s final decision. And it in no way excuses a GM from responsibility for a move.
For example, we all know Bobby V was a big proponent of acquiring Mo Vaughn. He reportedly was the one who first suggested to the Mets that they look into him, and he even went with Steve Phillips to watch him in the batting cage before they signed him. But I don’t blame Bobby V at all for that trade. It was solely Philips responsibility to put together the right talent, and he deserves all the blame.
I recall you and I getting into a debate a month ago about Willie’s influence over player personnel (apologies if I have the wrong guy). I think he has some level of influence. You think it is all Omar. Well, I still stand by my statements. And the most recent disgruntled comments by LM and Gotay were directed at Willie, not Omar. He has some influence.
But regardless….this is ultimately OMAR’s team. And what is so clear after this first week is that this team just doesn’t have the horses. They don’t. And you are right….that is on Omar. I can sit here and rattle off names that would clearly be effective on this roster….LM, Bannister, Gotay, and Bradford to begin with. And Omar was the one that made those horrible decisions (but I still say LM was blackballed by Willie, which played a role). Our bullpen is terrible. 2nd base is a crapshoot and we released a very viable option. Left field is a bandaid. And we have become older and less athletic in Minaya’s reign. That is clear.
But a manager MUST GET THE BEST OUT OF HIS PLAYERS. And Willie doesn’t do that. Reyes is still swinging at 1st pitches and showed a clear fundamental flaw on that sure DP yesterday. The bullpen has no confidence and is clearly hung-over from last year. Willie has no confidence in Perez and will indicated that even when the guy has yet to give up a run in 12 innings. The team shows very little plate discipline. The list is endless.
But you are right…the talent level is questionable. I can’t believe I am saying that the talent level is questionable after marveling at these guys 12 months ago!!! But many of htese guys are good and certainly aren’t winners. And that is on Omar.
But a team doesn’t need all-stars to win. They need players who will kill for the manager/fans/organization/teammates for 9 innings. And Willie doesn’t get that out of a majority of his roster. And that is on Willie.
So I am coming over to your side on this. It’s certainly a combination of both. And anyone who comes on this site and blames Willie 100% is just as wrong as the guy who blames Omar 100%.
correction:
but many of htese guys AREN’T good and certainly aren’t winners.
We will have to agree to disagree about the influence. I say Wilie has very little or virtually zilch. We saw that after 2005 when Omar didn’t resign a Willie favorite — Marlon — and instead signed one of his own favorites, old man Franco. Only if Omar has noidea or no preference will he allow Willie to influence his decision making.
Also, I disagree about the players you think he alienated. I believe Milledge’s comments were directed at the team in general and never at Willie. The only one I think he may have alienated is Gotay and that’s because Willie as an ex-second baseman is tougher on players who play that position. As he was on Matsui.
As for players who “kill” for the manger/fans/teammates etc, I also disagree that this is something a manager instills in his players. No matter who the manger is, you’re not going to get that attitude form someone like Delgado. It’s up to the GM to bring in players with heart and grit and who can grind it out and hustle. A manager can’t turn laid back players into that.
No Omar isn’t 100% to blame. Willie isn’t 100% to blame. But I feel Omar more than Willie is to blame if they don’t make the postseason.
If most of their roster were intact, I might not feel that way. But as I said 1/5 of their payroll is on the DL right now.
Also, fans need to chill out. It is too early to panic.
now you are just arguing to argue.
forget I even extended the courtesy.
Uh, no. I am not arguing just to argue. I wouldn’t waste my time doing that. I just disagree strongly that a manager can influence a player’s heart and mind in the manner you and others think he can.
Lets just agree to disagree, OK? No hard feelings. We will never see eye to eye.
I don’t know what Willie have said to the team in the locker room. What I do know is this: whatever he’s said or done isn’t working. It’s time to make a change while we still have a good chance at making the playoffs.
Willie have not only lost the team but his baseball IQ is non-existent. Does anyone realize that Wagner hasn’t had any work for a week now? Are you kidding me? And was that double switch really necessary yesterday? Someone please end this before it’s too late to make a memorable season at Shea.
I am so tired of Willie and his deadpan looks, his BS excuses game after game, his game time field decisions etc. His team has the same ho-hum attitude as he does. The reason all those teams passed on Willie wasn’t because he was black. It was because they saw that while Willie was a good player and great guy, he didn’t have half of what Torre did on how to manage, or motivate his team.
I think teams play us like we are a overrated heartless team who can be beat at any given time. This team has to understand that nobody is afraid to play us. Nobody is like “damn, we gotta play the mets today”. We don’t strike fear into any team and the division is not gonna be handed to us. I do agree that it’s early in the season but with the braves and philles both eyeing the division every game is going to count.
All Mets fans who are near the ledge need to read this column at espn about slow April starters who turned it around to make the postseason. The Mets aren’t even as bad as those teams were.
For example, the ‘69 Mets started out at 9-14 … and the Marlins in 2003 started out at 19-29!
It’s too too early to panic as many fans are doing.
Here’s the link:
sports.espn.go.com/mlb/columns/story?columnist=crasnick_jerry&id=3337401
it’s not our record that concerns us, it’s the level of play, the lackluster attitude, the lack of a sense of urgency and oh yes, even though it’s early we DO need a sense of urgency. and it’s the similarities we as fans all see in the way this season has started compared to the way last season ended. it’s a bad trend and is a sign of very bad things to come.
And how good do you think those teams who started out 19-29 and 9-14 looked :?:
They looked as bad as these Mets or worse. And their fans were calling for those teams to fire their managers as they are doing now for Willie.
reyes is a great fielder but awful at the plate, castillo is a joke and chances are pretty good we won’t win one game against the philthies this series. i hate to admit that but it’s true.
OMAR? HE’S PUT TOGETHER A VERY GOOD ROSTER. SCHOENWEISS IS ON THE SQUAD AS A LOOGY, FELICIANO IS THE EVERY OPPRTUNITY LEFT HANDER. IFVWILLIE DOESN’T USE THEM AS NECESSARY IT’S NOT OMAER’S FAUILT. A SCREW IS A USEFUL FASTENER; BUT NOT WHEN USED WITH A HAMMER. DELGADO, ALOU, DUQUE? INSTEAD OF COMPLAINING & POINTING TO FAULTS, TRY ALTERNATIVE/REALISTIC SOLUTIONS. THESE PLAYERS YOU DON’T WANT WHAT WOULD YOU PROPOSE BE DONE. TAKE DELGADO, HE’S I YR LEFT WHICH COINCIDES WITH TEIXIERA’S FREEDOM. DUQUE ALSO IN LAST YR. IN LIEU OF SOMETHING/SOMEONE BETTER HOLDING ON & HOPING FOR BEST IS ALL THAT’S FISCALLY PRUDENT. ALOU? THERE WAS CERTAINLY ADEQUATE BACKUPS IN HOUSE, CHAVEZ, PAGAN, CLARK, ANDERSON. YOU WANT YOUTH, GO ROOT FOR NATS OR FISH THEY’VE PLENTY. IF NO CHAMPIONSHIP SOON CITIFIELD & SNY WILL WOUND WILPONS SIGNIFICANTLY.
Seems you’ve been yelling since 1962, & I understand the frustration, but you should get a keyboard that includes the letters of speech as well as those of shouts. (And the “love it or leave it” logic was lame even in 1962.)
Just read your prior post re caplock…sorry, forget my smartassery about the font. (though not the other.)
The last thing I want to see is a brawl with the Phillies . . . is there any doubt that the Mets would tap out???
Willie is wonderful
Omar is wonderful
It’s just another game
It’s only a few games
It’s only a quarter of the season give them time.
It’s only half a season give them time.
We still have a quarter of a season to catch them.
No reason to worry
It’s a different team
you can’t be real Met fans
No the team doesn’t have the same ho-hum attitude of their manager on the field.
Willie was a great player he knows how to manage.
It’s only his 3rd year.
Willie didn’t pick his coaches.
It’s the fans fault for booing and not having faith in their players.
It’s not Willies fault look at the old wasted players Omar gave him.
We’re still in first place…oh wait,
nevermind.
And last but not least…WAIT TILL NEXT YEAR
Feel free to pick whatever excuse you like on any given day.
None of them are appropriate.
How about it’s just the first week of April and the 6th game of the season?
curious. Is your last name “Randolph”?
… Is yours Minaya?
:smile:
For 3 years Mets have gone as Reyes has gone. And since his funk began last year, which was well before the last 17 games, team has done poorly. What irks me about Willie here is that we need Reyes on base, and he was never taught how to bunt. Castillo, with all his faults, is one of the best bunters in baseball, as is Chavez, and they could easily teach Reyes how to do so. If he could bunt even a lick, with his speed he’d have 50 more hits, create havoc on the basepaths 50 more times, and set up 50 potential rallies. I fault Willie for this. And despite the bullpen horrors, going back to last year’s collapse, the offense is what has killed the team. And if your offense is so dependent on the guy who leads off, you’d better make sure he knows how to get on base.
how about if it looks like a fish and smells like a fish , it is a fish…….. and storing it away for a few months wont change that….
VCarver,
You must have missed where it said:
It’s only a few games.
No, I didn’t miss “it’s only a few games.”
I interpreted that to mean it’s only a small sample size (ie, within a season) and not it’s only a few games into the season.
But now that you’ve explained what you meant, that is the reason fans are silly to panic right now. Not the others.
Reyes Ordonez
“you know, if we go out and win the next 10 then it’s a moot point”
How about you just win ONE game first? You haven’t beaten the Phillies since June 30. You have got 6-13 in the last 19 games against them. WIN ONE FREAKING GAME!!!!
Should have fired him when they had the chance. Having Cliff Floyd on one knee cost us a chance at the pennant in 06. His “It’s another game” attitude cost them the division last year. What is it this year? Is his flat personality and inept managing going to cost this team a winning record? I’d like to not find out. Just dump this moron ASAP. They haven’t won anything in 3 years with him despite having the best team in the NL the past 2 years. He’s shown nothing to suggest anything will change.
Willie just doesn’t have that “charisma,” you know…the kind of persona where one look at the manager is enough to inspire a player with instant confidence. A confident manager would never have given that press conference as it was.
This, coupled with an overly conservative approach augmented by a seeming unwillingness to adapt as necessary to NL style, troubles me indeed.
A number of young stars, a lot of upper-mediocrity & age, & nothing at the moment to make the mix gel.
Upside: by season’s end, we may be able to move down from bad to good seats at whim.
That’s what I have been saying. I will have to either be someone who was a Met and comes back or someone completely out of the organization. It can’t be anyone on the team right now. That would be like dating your ex-gf’s best friend. It would not put last year behind us.
I am not turning on him as a manager. I don’t think he caused the collapse, he is part of it. I just don’t think at this point he fits the team anymore and to move on we need to move on.
Why not? He went to a World Series with a Met team with one third the talent of this one. Bobby has more baseball knowledge in his left hand than Willie could ever dream of happening.
So after 4 games, (and about 480 befor that), everyone was crazy for saying fire Willie, but after 6 games, you feel totally justified in saying it….ok
Do some research on Felipe Alou before you start advocating him for manager. He would be worse than Willie.
first off, you can’t blame Willie for the players poor performance. Pulling Perez was the right move, and criticizing him for struggling at the end there is fine, because Perez should’ve been able to go 7, but even had Willie left him there, it was only going to be for 6. (And if you want to fight about pitch counts, that’s obviously Petersons dept).
The Phillies didn’t score in the 6th, Joe Smith got them out of it.
Maybe this criticizing is what Perez needs, how he succeeded all last year. You don’t know, and “willie can’t manage” is not an argument. You have no idea about his relationships with anyone. And did you not agree that Jose Reyes needed a reprimand? His comments in the spring certainly suggest that Willie has been a good manager to him, and just because he struggled in the first 6 games, means NOTHING.