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The first-place Phillies are currently playing .600 baseball, and are on pace to win 97 games.
However, if they play just slightly-better than .500 baseball the rest of the season, they’ll still win around 90 games.
This means, at 30–32 today, the Mets may need to go roughly 60–40 over the next 100 games to catch Philadelphia.
The problem, as I suggested in an earlier post, is that the current roster has been unable to play better than .500 baseball over the last 162 games.
Therefore, as I mention in the following video with SNY’s Ted Berg, it may make sense for the Mets to simply make a change for the sake of making a change, which could include side-step moves such as Kenny Lofton or Scott Hatteberg.
The point is, as is, it’s hard to understand how the direction of this team changes with the current group of players.
To watch Ted and I discuss this is more detail, click play:
60-40 is asking allot of this group. Then again look at it this way, the Phillies were 7 games behind with only 14 to play so using that analogy it’s not inconceivable to expect the Mets to make up 7.5 games with 100 left to play. I said not inconceivable, but by the looks of things, highly unlikely. This is the beauty of baseball……………anything can and will happen.
“This is the beauty of baseball……………anything can and will happen.”
THANK YOU!!!
This team is so inconsistent… just like the Phil’s were last year at the beginning off the season before they took off. After last year, we should know anything is possible. We are 4-2 vs Phi this year… Lets keep it close and we can still make a move when we play heads up. This is exactly what Philly did to us last year. Beat us straight up!
Talk of winning 90 games means nothing, just get into the playoffs… in 2006 cards were about a .500 team and they won the WS. Doesn’t matter how you get there just get it done.
This is so beyond numbers atthis point. This team is certainly capable of winning 65-70 more games. Just as Philly is certainly capable of losing 65-70 more games.
Philly’s at it’s peak right now. They’ll cool off a little, and if the Mets play hard over the next few weeks, there is no reason they can’t be in position to sweep the Phillies out of first place in early July. That’s the goal they should be aiming for right now.
You really think this Mets team could win 95-100 games??? I like your optimism, but I’ve seen nothing to suggest they can even get to 90 wins, no less 100.
Even worse, you think this Phillies team could lose 90 games? Barring major injuries, that’s absurd.
The Mets can still get back in the race, but only if the Phillies come back down to earth. It’s certainly feasible that they could go .500 the rest of the way, and the Mets right the ship to get back in it. But the Phils aren’t finishing in last place (where 90 losses would put them), and the Mets aren’t winning 100.
Overestimates perhaps. I didn’t look exactly at the numbers. I think the Phillies could lose 80, and I think the Mets could win 95, although they are starting to put 95 out of reach. It’s not even that I think they will win that many, just that there have been weeks, and stretches of games where they certainly look capable of it. But it’s all a lot of what-if, and it’s up to the Mets to figure out their path, we’re unfortunately only along for the ride.
The Phillies aren’t as good as they’ve played these last two weeks, and I really think the magic carpet is going to come out from under them soon. I would’ve guessed 87 or 88 before the season, and I expect it’ll be within 3 of that. but as I said, it’s up to the Mets to play, and it’s not really about the numbers. 12 games against the Phillise can scew those numbers nicely.
” It’s not even that I think they will win that many, just that there have been weeks, and stretches of games where they certainly look capable of it.”
weeks? stretches? when, and how did I miss them?
And this talk about the phillies not being able to sustain thier pace, and not as good as their record…blah blah blah. The phillies are a good team. they play hard, have an awesome offense, and as long as their pitching does not collapse, are capable of playing very good baseball over significant periods of time. they are never out of any game the way they play. stop kidding yourself, or at least stop trying to kid the rest of us. what about the way that the mets have played make you think they can win 65 more games this year?
“and as long as their pitching does not collapse”
That is why there still is hope.
Over the last 14 games while they have made their move the have averaged 7 runs a game and only given up 3.36. Do you honestly expect either to continue?
Are you really resting your hopes that it won’t?
The Phillies or overperforming, and the stress of having to play hard just to win normal games is geting to them. look at Rollins not running that ball out.
They almost lost that game to Atlanta, if not for a play at the plate. Sure, it counts, but it’s not exactly clean, crisp wins. Most of the times that throw comes in a little slower, a little more up the line, the runner is a little faster, the ball is a little slower, and the Braves tie and maybe win it. And that’s just one example, there are dozens. any team that pitches well shuts down the offense, and offenses rarely blast the ball every day, they are all somewhat streaky. The back of the lineup isn’t very strong, it’s just playing well right now.
kjmcc0729, are you resting your hopes that it will?
Of course I hope their pitching comes back to normal and sucks. What’s the point of even discussing this if their pitching staff is going to have a 3.36 ERA that would be a friggin modern day record, especially in that bandbox.
it is not going to matter what the phillies do if the mets don’t get their heads out of their asses. that is my point. don’t rely on other teams falling off instead of holding this team accountable for not playing the way they should. if we sit around and say all is well and the phillies are going to collapse, than we are wasting out time.
Ceetar…you are so delusional. Rollins did not run out a ball due to the stress of having to play hard all the time? The stress is getting to them? That is the most ridiculous crap I have ever heard on this blog. Please…give me a friggin’ break.
I hate to bring you back to reality, but the Phillies have an awesome ballclub. Rollins and Howard have won back to back mvp’s. And they will have a third mvp at the end of this season at Utley’s current pace. They have great complimentary players in Feliz and Jenkins and Victorino.
Oh…and how can us Mets faithful forget about Burrell.
Don’t pin your hopes on Philly slacking off. It’s so off base. And did I say….DELUSIONAL!
The Mets will have to play at least 60-40 over the next 100 games to even sniff Philly’s arses. Does this current team as is really give you any hope of that?
Think before you post. Geez…
I do think the Mets can make a run… But if the Braves and our other NL East compadres lay down for the Phillies, then it may be hard to catch up. (It would be nice to be in the race, though!)
Hey, there’s always the Wild card. It seems lately that the Wild Card team goes on to win the World Series anyway. Boston not with standing.
That is a good plan, we are only 6.5 back there.
I cant watch the video im at work so forgive me if you addressed this already.
The phillies are playing very good ball right now. I dont expect that to continue as the season continues. I have faith the mets can put together that kind of run but of course you have to also keep in mind that percentage i believe can be infulenced based off what we do against our division.
I dont know if omar has anymore aces up his sleave but also keep in mind alot of the roster is injured at the same time. Not that im making excuses but perhaps when the pieces come back we can do more damage.
The mets have their work cut out for them. They are certianly capable of making it to the playoffs just as any team is right now. We all knew it was going to be a dog fight going into the season.
Certainly there is the chance that Philly’s bullpen isn’t the best in the league (as they have been pitching) and are due for a regression.
not to mention that they’ve been pretty healthy…only used five starters all year.
What happened to Jose Valentin? I’m not saying he is a savior but he brings a good attitude to the team. He must be ready by now.
I hear that logic all the time, but it’s really pointless at almost any point in the season. I remember last year saying, “If the Mets just go 7-10, the Phillies would have to go 16-1…” (And we know how that tuened out.) It sounds impossible at the time, but one winning streak one way and losing streak the other way and it catches up.
The last two seasons, they also figured the Yankees had to go 65-35 to make the playoffs. Guess what? It happened both times.
Things work themselves out. Just sit back and enjoy the ride, however it turns out. Forget expectations and predicitions. Just watch the games and root for the team.
“Things work themselves out. Just sit back and enjoy the ride, however it turns out. Forget expectations and predicitions. Just watch the games and root for the team”
Lol where were you in the other posts. You summed everything up right there. Like dave is acustomed to saying often..its a journey not a sprint. Yes the mets have a huge task ahead of them because alot of teams are competitive this year. We as fans just gotta have some hope that they will figure it out. Still got alot of baseball to be played. Got alot of time to right the ship.
Man, have we been journeying for a while…
Possible yes, probable no way! Not this group of uninspired heartless ball players.
Agree. I can bet my last dollar that almost every single prediction made in June does not pan out by the time Sept. riolls around. There’s no way of telling what will transpire over the next three months.
its going to be a rays/angels world series. rays in 6.
As good a preictions as any other. Did you bet on da Tara at 38-1 odds?
I bet on the Rays to win the AL East in February. 30-1… Let’s Go Rays.
Although, I don’t really thing they will play the Angels in the world series. It is very uncommon to realign divisions and leagues in the middle of a season.
lol yeah woops — wasnt even that funny — um lets say rays/marlins.
dont hold your breath
I wish the Mets would follow in thge footsteps of Major League the movie and have a full size portrait of someone with 60 pieces attached and removed one everytime they win a game, revealing, like in the movie revealed the owner in a bikini, someone or something.
The questions would be of what? A stand-up portrait of Jimmy Rollins revealing Beltran after 60 wins? Anna Benson in a bikini? Or better yet, all the division team listed but revealing a banner undereath. In which case, they may need 70 pieces.
I’ve suggested Suzyn Waldman, but I’m not sure how popular that idea was.
Mrs Met!!! Mrs Met!!!
My idea with that was a thing of Fred Wilpon, but they remove a piece every time they lose. Nobody wants to see that.
How about Omar Minaya, once they win 60 more games there will be nothing left and that means he’s fired.
For starters stop even thinking about first place, now because of a miserable series the Mets need to get back to .500.
Then they need to show they can get 5 games over .500 and remain there. Then if they ever get 10 games over .500 we can discuss the merits of their “chances”.
As far as shaking up the roster, at the moment if they are going to shake up the clubhouse with some “event” releasing a guy really does nothing, especially not Delgado, whose bat is the problem not his attitude or presence. He is a guy I’d approach trading should a situation benefit all sides.
Beyond that call up some guys like Pasucci or whatever his name is, then bring up Carp at very least if not all three, Murphy and Evans.
Trade Perez and Heilman to a team that is looking for pitching, recall Tony Armas Jr and Figueroa for the time being.
Adam Dunn is a really terrible hitter in every situational category.
I’d pass on him in terms of being an IMPACT player.
I don’t understand who you are trading delgado to. Nobody will give up anything of value for him. The only way this guy will eb off the team is by releasing him.
I don’t see the market for an over the hill slugger who can’t slug anymore and who can’t play defense. And before you say it, no AL team could afford to have him as their DH either and especially not for 17 million (his current salary).
His salary is not that much because of the Marlins. Yes we would have to eat a large chunk of his salary or take a bad contract in return but every one on our team has some kind of market for the right price.
I just hope that change for change sake isn’t doing something Kazmir-esqu. That 05 team was limping a bit around the trading deadline, but was alive enough to make folks think they could make a push for the title (I was one of those fans).
Hope is an awful strategy, but unfortunately, it may be the only strategy this club has. Hope Pedro can give us solid innings, hope that church isn’t effected by this concussion all year, hope Alou can give us 70-80 games, hope the bench returns to form
It is all relative, the trade for the return that is.
When they dealt Kazmir in 2004 the problem was not nearly as much dealing him but what they got in return.
In 2005 they could have dealt say Milledge for an impact player they could control, or was at least if a free agent worth signing after the season.
I don’t get that there is a lot of interest in the Mets system, even with guys like Murphy, Carp and Evans producing, for whatever reason they are seen as AA fluff.
If they were going to deal anyone it would have to be Fernando Martinez. Or at least centered around him. What are you going to get is the question?
If you did deal him, you’d prefer to keep it to the American League.
Make a short list of guys in the top 50 in OPS in the American League that MIGHT be available and consider would you want them based on age and or mental aptitude.
Magglio Ordonez
Milton Bradley
Carlo Guillen
Lyle Overbay
Raul Ibanez
Jose Guillen
Kevin Millar
Adrian Beltre
Aubrey Huff
Melvin Mora
Not an impressive bunch to bet the turn around on.
So to me for hitters you’d have to be okay with dealing prospects within the league.
Which gives you
Holliday, Dunn, Rowand, Bay, Nady?
My prediction (since everyone else is on the prediction wagon)
A complete Boston year.
Celtics Win the NBA Title
Boston wins another WS
Patriots get pay back and win another SB
Let’s pray to god that doesn’t happen.
especially the Patriots.
vom
This is pathetic rationalizing. Why should this group NOT be better than a .500 team? They have some of the best players in baseball at all the marquee positions. Wright, Reyes, Beltran, Santana, and Wagner are the best of the best. A healthy Pedro makes 2-4 in the rotation among the best in baseball. They have a great bullpen, if used properly and infrequently enough. They have an offensive beast waiting in the wings in Alou. They have great defense at 2nd and catcher. Delgado has been turning it around lately, unnoticed. On paper this is the best damn team in the NL east. One of the top 4 teams in the NL. Without question. Look at the other freaking rosters. Look at the other freaking pitching staffs. The Phillies are an offensive force, but look at their rotation. You’re telling me we shouldn’t be able to compete? That’s total B.S., and that’s the kind of losing mentality that’s swept over this team since the collapse.
Sure, the Mets have some great players, but great teams are not composed of simply great players. That have other things – camaraderie, chemistry, fire, etc. – some of which the Mets may have, some of which they do not.
That’s why you play the games.
A “great” team has to be better than the sum of it’s parts, and I’m not sure this one can be that.
It is up to the manager to pull a group of players together and create a team. Willie is not able to do that. you have a group of talented individuals with no team concept. That is on the manager. get him out of here and find someone who can get the most out of his players!
There is no point in imagining these things. There is a better chance of getting a permanent colony on Mars by the end of the season than there is of the Mets playing .600 ball the rest of the way. It is delusional to think they will win the division.
It’s not a loser mentallity. baseball games are not won on ‘Paper”. I agree with you, the Mets on “Paper” do have a champion roster but that’s in a vacuum, a perfect world. Injuries and under performing player will throw a curveball to your way of thinking. There is still time, and hopefully they’ll start playing to their potential.
The point is, there’s no reason they can’t be a .600 team — they’re underperforming; they’re not living up to their potential. To whine about how it’s impossible for them to play better than .500 is pathetic. They need new leadership. That’s all their is to it. Willie hasn’t been inspiring them. The next guy might not either, but at least there’s a chance.
And our injuries are no excuse. Rollins was injured, Howard was hitting .190 and the Phillies were still winning. Why can they do what we can’t? Because they have confidence in themselves. They play relaxed and energetic. You couldn’t get farther from the Mets mood than that.
The Mets are not underperforming. They are going out there everyday and playing to what they are, an under .500 team.
That’s utterly absurd. They were a better team at the beginning of last season with a patchwork rotation and a revolving door in RF? Please.
This year they have a patchwork bullpen, patchwork back end of the rotation and a revolving door in LF. whats your point.
So the padres, without Peavy and Young, are a better team than the mets and that is why we lost 4 in a row, right? whew, i feel better now.
Underperforming player throwing a curveball? You must be talking about Heilman, Pedro, or Perez, because if it were Beltran or Delgado it would be missing a curveball.
Look at the Yankees. They ahev AllStars in almost every single position on the field yet they haven’t won a Championship since 2000. On paper the Yankees have the best team every single year. On Paper.
What are you getting at?
I think he/she’s getting at the fact that the game is not played on paper, but on an electronic box in your living room.
the yankees have made the playoffs every year since baseball was invented. your point is moot.
Lets get to, and stay above, .500 for a few weeks first, eh?
Agree. Baby steps.
There is a feeling around the Mets that the next 10-14 days will determine what happens to Willie and the coaching staff. Another losing home stand and 9 or 10 games out of first and the Wilpons will be forced to make a change. The next 10-14 days will determine what happens going forward in 2008. It’s going to be very intereting aqround here, stay tuned.
I’ve been hearing that for weeks and I’m sick of it. If I performed as poorly at my job, I wouldn’t have it anymore. He needs to go yesterday.
Agree, but chances are you don’t have a guaranteed contract worth 10M if they fire you. That’s the difference. It’s not right but money does play a mayor factor on who and when players and managers get fired or released.
If that’s the case, then they need to read up on sunk costs and opportunity costs. I don’t know how much they’d losing in cutting Willie, but baseball is a massively profitable enterprise, and having their fan base think they’re destined to be a .500 team has to be costing them already.
There is a far bigger difference, your jobs nor mine are nothing like professional sports.
Every year 22 teams are going to fail in major league baseball no matter how you attempt to caveat it or couch it, 22 of the teams will have failed on the mission make it to the playoffs with an opportunity to win it all.
Jettisoning everything and starting over from scratch is not ever a really good answer, and dumping the manager is only going to provide at best short term comfort, even if they were to turn it around and make the playoffs.
Whatever they choose to do they need to focus on the problems on this team.
The corner outfield spots have been a revolving door since the 2005 season, due to injuries and poorly planned resourcing. That becomes a blistering hole with Delagdo struggling to produce big numbers.
Hear, hear. Well put. Let’s please stop the short-term answers and start planning for a sustained run at post-seasons.
If you boss gives you a $140 million budget and you don’t perform up to expectations, you lose your job. it is accountability. I am tired of hearing that it is all the players fault, the manager bears the responsibility for getting this team to perform. Before we start jettisoning off players, why not put an end to the willie randolph experiment and see if it is the manager or the team. The last thing i want to to do is put together another team and have the same thing happen.
Fire willie, if for no other reason than to show the fans that ownership is not sitting on their hands wathcing the ship go down. Their apathy will lead, eventually, to our apathy. from the comments on this blog, we are almost there. the last thing that freddy coupon and his dopey kid wants is an apathetic fan base to trumpet the opening of Citi-Field.
blah, blah, blah, this is the fans way of trying to imagine how they can justify a losing or bad season in sports…
Businesses routinely don’t meet the expectations of their budgets and the best ones DO NOT automatically run to fire a department head or CMO or whomever. Sometimes they evaluate the situation and realize it is not all easily explainable.
Before we start jettisoning managers, why don’t we get rid of some of the players and see if it is the players or the manager.
Fire Willie if for no other reason than to please the fans? Brilliant.
Didn’t we already get rid of some of the players in Milledge, Loduca, Green and Glavine? It’s time to try a new manager so we know what we need to do next year. If we get rid of Willie and we still stink then Omar knows he has a lot of work to do.
patrick, i don’t know what business journals you are reading, but reorganizing is done all the time. It is much more efficient, and practical, to bring in a manager who gets his people to perform rather than replacing the people.
What is this allegiance to willie randolph? I don’t get it. it is like you guys owe him money or something. what is he a family member? What the hell does it matter who our manager is? this is baseball, managers lose their jobs, players don’t. who cares if willie is fired, he isn’t good at his job, that is what happens.
They’d still keep you through an existing project rather than have to bring in someone new to train and have to turn over the project to a competitor.
Well hang on willie because I don’t have warm and fuzzy feeling about the diamondbacks series.
You guys, no worries. We have 12 games left against the Phillies and winning 8-9 of them would turn the whole season upside down.
Then again, we’ll probably lose all 9 games against the Nationals and Marlins in September, making it all irrelevant.
Its just so frustrating watching this team lose to BAD teams. You can call this team a .500 team all you want — and it is — but it is not a Giants, Nationals, Padres, 10 games under .500 type team. It’s just pathetic at this point.
No, it’s not, because they’d beat us.
Hey, with a 140M payroll, .500 is not acceptable. With a 40M payroll……………..500 is dam good.
Who cares what anyone makes? It’s the talent on the field that forms my expections, not the paycheck they get in the mail. You could theoretically pay Carlos Beltran 30cents and Fernando Tatis 20mill, and the expections would be the same.
1986 – Giants win Superbowl
1986 – Celtics win NBA Finals
1986 – Mets Win World Series
2008 – Giants win Superbowl
2008 – Celtics halfway to NBA Finals
2008 – Mets ????
2008……………………………….Mets?
After going through the Biggest collaspe in the histroty of baseball the year before (2007)…………………..
The 2008 Mets stage the Biggest come-back in baseball history and win the WS after being 20.5 games in late August!
The Giants won the superbowl in 1986?
Yes, Giants won 86/87 Superbowl after Mets win WS, what a year!
Oh, the 1986-97 season. The Bears won it in the 1985-86 season.
1986-87. Technically the Giants won the Superbowl in 1987 not 86′.
I know it was the ‘86 season and the superbowl was technically in ‘87, but I’m trying to be as optimistic as I can be here. Work with me here… :-)
i like it Cuban. gotta believe
yer off their pal, the Giants won the 1987 super bowl
Imagine if the Phillies had engaged in that sort of quantitive speculation in mid-August. . . .
I’m really starting to think this is primarily Omar’s fault, but I also see no reason to keep Willie around on the off chance dismissing him might reveal a team that can keep focused.
Once that experiment is over with, however, we’ll see what we really have. My guess is that it’s about an 85 win team, which is not good enough to absolve Omar, especially when you look at how dismal the farm system is. I don’t want to hear about Carlos Gomez, either. It was bad before and it’s horrible now. No depth.
So, Omar goes, too. Just takes a bit longer. Ideally, we’ll manage to trade some dead weight for a player or two worth rooting for. Unfortunately, to get any young players worth a damn, we’d have to give up Beltran or Reyes. Beltran has his no-trade, and Reyes is himself a young exciting player who is now producing, at least at the plate. So, when we finally Botox the roster, we’ll be left with the likes of Ike Davis, rushed to the bigs. I have to tell you, folks, “rebuilding” is just around the corner.
Here is the problem I see, First if you are trading our guys to contenders all you are gonna get in return is prospects. If you are in contention you won’t part with any guys that are producing. I don’t think I trust Omar to make those talent decisions. look what he has already done to the farm system. And to say we are a contender and going to try and get proven talent just isn’t realistic.
When I said “young players,” I meant prospects. Beltran and Reyes are the nuclear option, and I agree that it just doesn’t make sense to try to convert either into prospects, considering Beltran probably won’t budge, and Reyes is still very, very young.
Reyes has been the best player on the team this year. We should probably keep him.
Um, yes, but the point is that we have NOTHING to trade if we want to “blow this thing up.” Reyes and, say, Wright are about the only commodities we have, and for obvious reasons, we can’t really justify trading either one. They’re young enough to be prospects, and are performing fairly well, though Wright is underachieving a smidge at the plate — nothing horrible.
Reyes has hardly been perfect, incidentally. He’s been hitting and running of late, but he’s still making critical defensive gaffes, and he didn’t give us much earlier in the year.
What farm system, you act as if Minaya dealt off a bunch of studs who are coming back to haunt the Mets, he dealt of a bunch of mediocre to less than mediocre players.
You wanna get on him for being slow on the uptake in player development and drafting since 2005? Have it, fair assessment.
But he has traded away right now what has amounted to nothing special, the worst you can say about Minaya in his trades is that he waited TOO LONG to deal Milledge.
Do you guys think the Wilpons could pry Terry Ryan from Minnesota?
Would you want to dive into this dysfunctional disaster?
What about Krivsky? I realize that the Reds are hardly a model franchise, but they do operate on a budget, and they seem to be able to develop some young talent.
more like 40-60.
I don’t think a Total Rebuild is necessary. Unless you consider a new Left fielder, a new 2nd baseman and a new 1st. baseman a total rebuils. Not too mention a coyuple more pitchers to take the place of Pedro and Duque and throw in there Perez. On second though……………………..yea, rebuilding around the corner!
Well, they’ll allegedly have a “core” to work with, but the problem is that the drop-off from Santana, Maine, Reyes, Wright, and Beltran (and perhaps Church if he isn’t forced to retire) is precipitous. It’s not that they lack stars at the other positions, it’s that they lack even players suited for bench jobs. What’s more, there’s nothing in the pipeline but the Val Pascuccis of the world. Position by position, compare the Mets to other NL teams in left, at first, behind the plate, and at second.
The ONLY encouraging sign on the last trip has been that the pitching has been decent, save the — dare I say — COLLAPSE yesterday. Pitching is generally the harder part of a roster to build, so we’re in OK shape there, at least this year. But with no Ollie, Pedro, Elduque, etc. next year, can Mike Pelfrey really step in as a No. 3?!?!?!? Dare we waste anymore resources trying to tame Ollie Perez?
Where’s Freddy Garcia, incidentally?
Why do we have to compare just 4 positions? Because they would win some of the other spots? What about rotations 1-5 or BP? ON paper we still have one of the better teams, they are just not executing.
Please read in context. The point was that we have a “core” and then absolute squat. It’s probably better to just look at offense than to look at specific positions. Get past our “Big Three” and we have nothing. Everyone (worth discussing) has “stars.” We have nothing but, and that’s no compliment. We have an answer (sort of) to Jones, Teixeira and Escobar. But where’s our McCann? Our Francoeur? Our Matt Diaz, for chrissake? That was my point. Our stars are on an island. Even add Church and we still come up short because our answers are broken down oldsters — Delgado, Alou (great when healthy; never healthy), Castillo, etc. Feast or famine on our team. A guy like Chavez used to be interesting; used to push for playing time. Now no one pushes for playing time.
Francouer is the most overrated player in all of baseball.
After his miracle run during his first 70 games his rookie year, he has failed to crack a .780 OPS in either of his two full seasons and is way shy this year.
By the way Jones is Atlanta’s broken down “oldster” who can’t seem to stay on the field.
Atlanta is not the problem in case anyone has been watching.
TMU
Bare with me here
DelgadoCastillo Although Castillo has a higher OBP and Johnson has more errors this season than Castillo does for this year and last year combined.
Reyes>Escobar in offense and defense
Wright>Chipper just because of wear and tear. Chipper is an unbelievable hitter but will turn into their Alou.
McCann >Schnieder don’t know enough about McCann’s defense.
Alou/Endy/Pagan=Matt Diaz. How can anyone list him as a positive? The guy is hitting .250 with a .270 OBP. Not that great of a defender either.
Beltran> than any OF on the Braves both offensiviely and defensively.
Church> Francouer. Frany can’t hit for nothing. Church is a great defender.
How on earth can you compare the entire lineups of the Braves and Mets and say they have more stars and role players than the Mets. Come on.
It’s not about stars!!!! The point is, their lineup/bench is much, much deeper.
Diaz is really worse than our cocktail? Really?
I didn’t even want to bring the Phils into this. . . .
You would rather have Castillo than Kelly Johnson?Please go on record, yes or no.
Kelly but I don’t mind Castillo.
And there is no way that their team top to bottom is deeper than the Mets. Take the poopoo colored glasses off and look at the entire team.
Looking. Not seeing. And if you’re trying to equate Delgado/Alou and Chipper, you’re nuts. Chipper has been better than Wright this year. Escobar and Reyes are comparable. Really. This is an objective appraisal, as much as it hurts to make.
But with some of those bigger name-contracts off the books, there will be money to lure a true stud here. Tex, anyone?
I don’t think we can or should get Tex. Focus on more pitching. Go out and get CC and Garland. Then let some young position guys play or make a trade for a reasonable replacement.
Johan, Maine, CC, Garland, Pelfrey
Reyes, Castillo, Wright, Beltran, Church, Kendry Morales, AA guy, Schnieder/Castro
That could be a fun team to watch.
I havent paid attention this year much to the AL. What’s CC’s deal?
As in how is he doing or that he is a FA at the end of the season? I am assuming you mean how he is doing. He is coming on strong after a terrible start. Adding another dominant pitcher to the rotation to me is much more important than any other move we make.
Talking about his performance. I know he is heralded as the class FA pticher in the upcoming off-season, but then I saw last week where he was 3-8, and that really surpirsed me.
3.42 in his last 10 games. Thing is he is still averaging around 6.5 innings a start. He will get a big contract but not any more than Tex and less than Santana. Something Zito like most likely.
Pitching is the way to go, but 1B and LF are big-time offensive production positions, and we just haven’t had it the last 2 yrs. I remember defending the Mienkewitz (sp?) aquisition a few yrs back, for all the unearned runs it would save. What the hell was I thinking?
I just think it will be easier to find league average production out of LF and 1B than it will be to find 2 above average starters. We can’t compete with the Phillies on offense so we have to be their polar opposites. Besides as a Mets fan I always love great pitching.
Also, on a side note we have POTENTIAL replacements on the farm at LF and 1B that could be able to take over in a year or 2. With pitching, it’s well uh… pretty bare.
Is CC a Boras client as well?
Scott Parker, Brian Peters, Legacy Sports
I think the mets should try an get salty from texas and give carp a shot..
I think the Mets should quickly go sign and develop the blue chip prospects that would be required to get “Salty.” They should then keep those blue chip prospects, and realize that with a healthy farm system producing a steady stream of talent, they don’t need “Salty.”
I have been trying to be productive at work today and not post… but that was pretty funny.
not SO far fetched, Texas dealt Cueto for Hamilton prior to this year, and as good as Hamilton is hitting for a franschise that is pitching starved that is what is what stings for them at the moment, deal Perez, Heilman and some lower level prospects for JS, he does not appear to be high on Texas radar any how.
LOL, a FA, middle reliever and a AA prospect for Salty.
That is very far fetched, why would texas want an inconsistent starter (who is almost guaranteed to go to FA), an inconsistent and unreliable setup bullpen arm and “some lower level prospects” for a guy who is projected as a good defensive catcher with power to all fields that they just traded Mark Texeira for?
also they traded Edinson Volquez for Hamilton.
The “some lower level prospects” part is what gets us into trouble.
(1) we don’t have them
(2) when we try to trade the closest thing, we have even less of a chance of finding one.
We are not getting “Salty” for peanuts (no pun intended.) Forget about it.
Indeed my mistake I wrote Cueto, I meant Volquez.
There is nothing far fetched about it, Texas began the season with JS in AAA.
No matter the inconsistency of Perez, he is still only 26 and they are a pitching starved franchise.
Texas has made worse trades in yours and my lifetime and I am not certain their dealing a guy they seem less than ready to use for a second tier team as a bad idea to bolster their pitching.
We do have prospects in the SAL and FSL, more so in SAL.
Do you know why Salty was in AAA? Because they want him to play catcher and not 1B and they already have a catcher that they will trade when Salty is ready. You will have to start any conversation on Salty with BOTH Fmart and Neise and then they could most likely get a better deal than that.
Or he is there because they fear they made a mistake in acquiring him for Texiera, either way they are a mediocre team playing over their heads with terrible pitching.
Every conversation about Santana had to apparently begin with Reyes or Fernando Martinez btw too.
And Martinez has to say healthy for at least a season in the minors before being granted a nickname other than Disabled.
So do you think a FA pitcher, middle reliever and low level prospect could get him?
That’s silly. All in all if the Rangers decided to get rid of Salty there are teams that would give their best prospect to get him and that would have to be Fmart for us and even then I don’t think that gets it done.
I absolutely agree on bringing up Carp. The guy is tearing it up in the minors and could provide a bit of a spark ala Reyes and Wright a few years back… which is exactly what this team needs.
“Doing the same things and expecting different results is insanity, defined”
And most likely he would come up and be an Evans clone. He’s just not ready.
how do you know he isn’t ready? He has been hitting a ton all year, played very well in ST a year back, etc.
Maybe he will struggle at first (ok, probably), but almost all players do when they are first brought up.
If you don’t give them a try, how will they ever become ready (or prove that they are?)
Evans wasn’t tahht bad. After the first couple of games, he got sporadic PT and some PH duty, tough for a guy just getting started.
Carp seemed to be more ready than Evans anyway, he just isn’t an OF.
I do want to see Carp at some point this year, so he can (hopefully) prove competant enough that they will give him the job for next year.
Evans was not THAT bad? After his first game he started 6 more games and had 1 hit in 17 AB’s. He was not ready. Carp is even a little younger than him and because of injuries I think he has even less minor league AB’s. But sure, he would do better.
60 – 40, not going to happen. Fughettaboutit.
What a mess.
If Adam Dunn is actually available, he’d be a significant upgrade, but like Ted I haven’t heard his name brought up just about anywhere. The idea to try to make a move for Hatteberg, Lofton, or Millar is backwards and pointless. I would be really disappointed to see Omar go after one of those guys, because it just reeks of desperation.
I really think if the mets aquired (or if Pedro or El Duque prove themselves to be) an average or slightly better than average starter, the mets would make the NL East interesting come the All Star Break. Until that happens, I can’t imagine the team playing much better than .500 baseball.
I’m getting real tired of the “blame the fans” mentality I see a lot of around here. People post an opinion that the team might just be an 81 win team and they’re accused of not being real fans. Well, the real fans were there when 81 wins would have been grounds for a parade. Let people post what they want to post. It’s not changing how the games are played on the field.
And that brings me to the people who want to blame the booing at Shea for the teams struggles. I know that hasn’t come up today, but it comes up a lot. I never boo, but I’m one of the fans at Shea and so I am going to defend the ones who have booed even if I don’t agree with them.
Home: 17-11 Away: 13-21
The point of all of this: Let the fans be fans. Stop telling people what to think and what to post. Everyone here puts enough heart into being a fan of this team, and they deserve to be able to express themselves, even if they don’t think the team is going to be very good this year. In the end, whatever happens happens.
thats what i dont understand ….” it’s ok to say it’s baseball anything can happen and will ”
but it’s not ok to point out that that statement can go the other way ..
like the mess go into complete freefall and could be out 15 by july……
The way i see it..I dont think people are telling others what to say/feel/do w/e but rather they engage in a debate. I would like to believe that people put some brain power behind posts they make and if someones opinion is different than others, i think its okay to debate your point or rational. Is it wrong to debate?
I understand this is a blog and im sure its an outlet for many people to vent…but i dont see anything wrong in debating a post that goes up. Is that wrong?
Debate is good. Some people go about it on more of a personal level with name calling and stuff like that which doesn’t accomplish anything.
Incidentally, I have agreed and disagreed with some of the things you have posted, but I think you do a great job making your points, and I respect that. That’s how I feel about most of the people who post here. But sometimes people do go too far (not you) in calling other people out for their opinions without offering an alternative point of view.
Dirtysanchez= best poster on this blog.
As for AMS you are #2 of course.
i’m a lock for #3 right……..?
Is that the good #2 or the bad #2? :)
I vote these folks take over in the dugout:
Manager: thereal86
bench coach: Dirty
hitting coach: AMS
3rd base coach: NY Cuban
1st base:Slappy
GM: Matt Cerrone
Me: fan.
now continue to get this team going. well done, enjoy the debates everyday.
real is to nice …. better for bench coach ..
this bunch needs a firey f–k ,like me……. real can talk me out of my explosions…..
I really just talk a good game on here. I am guessing none of the kids that I coach think I am too nice. LOL.
I collect RBIs like baseball cards.
(By the way there are 3 of us McSingleton is speedy so he can play center)
Totaly agree. Just because the front office sells you a lemon, doesn’t mean you have to swallow every bite with a smile.
The caveat to that is, venting is OK, but what’s the constructive way to fix the situation…?
Well on one level I feel like as paying customers people should be welcome to vent about the product without necessarily offering up solutions. If you don’t like the dinner you’re served in a restaurant, you can say so without having to come up with ways for the chef to make it better next time.
BUT, if you’re gonna do that, I guess sooner or later you can just stop eating there. Baseball is different because of the emotional bond we have to our team.
There just aren’t any easy answers. If there were we would be talking abou how great they’re doing.
ya see this is classic ams…… ya gotta love the bad dinner analogy….lol good stuff…
“excuse me chef… toomuch garlic and a tad heavy on the salt..”
I had a kickass sausage parm sub for lunch, so I had food on my mind at the time. Later on I’ll be posting about beer and hookers. Just kidding. I’m out of beer.
How ’bout we look at the rest of June (not an easy schedule, by the way…) I tried to be fair (losing series against the Angels and Yankees)…
2-1 vs. Arizona
2-1 vs. Texas
1-2 vs. LAA
2-1 vs. Col.
2-1 vs. Sea
1-2 vs. NYY
1-0 vs Stl.
That’s 11-8– a pretty successful end of the month, but it would get us only 1 game above .500… And July we play the Phillies 7 times…. It’s not going to be easy…
60-40 would be great. But back here in the real world…what makes you think that this team won’t go 50-50? I’ll even give them the benefit of the doubt, 51-49. For a grand total of, you guessed it…81-81. And then the healing can begin. No more Willie, no more Omar, no more Delgado, no more Pedro, no more Alou, no more Duque, no more expectations. We can go back to being the Mets and hopefully enjoying baseball again.
If the Phillies continue to pull away, the Mets will have 2 options: Wildcard or Retool.
The Mets are 6.5 games behind the Cardinals for the wildcard (Matt Cerone: only 5 losses back! Woo-hoo!). Unfortunately, that’s not much better than the distance for the division title.
I hope that if the Mets don’t make any ground by the end of the month, they are honest with themselves, and shoot to win in 2009. They usually don’t do this.
I really don’t think shooting for the wildcard is a terrible option. Playoffs is the playoffs, who cares how you get in?Even though the mets are 6.5 out and 6 teams to jump, 3 of those teams have negative run differentials and will definitely come back down to earth as the season rolls along. The year is far from over, there’s no reason to fear that the sky is falling just yet.
I’m with you, Hendu!
ALLREADYMISsSHEA = best poster here… love this guys posts….
Thanks, but I’m pretty sure you’re the only one who does. :)
believe it or not ,i luv REALS posts too, i think the mans analysis are usually spot on……. but he’s so god d-m optimistic ,it makes me wanna puke………
I wouldn’t like these threads nearly as much if he wasn’t posting in them. Sometimes I feel bad because we have a lot of exchanges and we disagree a lot of the time. That’s what talking about sports is all about. I still think if everyone got together for a couple of beers all anyone here would do is get along.
same here……..
AMS I have a lot of respect for you. John well…..
who ya kidding ….. ya know ya luv me…….lol….
As much as Alou loves his hands, LOL.
one mans p-ss is another mans gold…. en hand cream….
I miss Arte Howe!!!
No, he’s not the only one AlreadyMissShea, I also agree your posts at least make common sense. But like you said, everyone should have a chance to speak their mind and voice their opinion without having to be called names or accused of not being “True and loyal” fans. I thought the whole idea of a blog is precisely that, for fans (and non-fans alike) to have a voice. Keep up the good work.
I think the Wild Card is not an option it is win the East or bust. I am just so frustrated with this team right now, I don’t know what to do. We are old, emotionless and not good. With that being said changes should be made while the team isn’t completely out of it. What changes I don’t know, Willie should probably go as soon as possible. I think the Ramon Castro incident sums up the team so far. They have overslept through the first 62 games. It’s time to wake up boys and turn this thing around!!
That’s assuming they have it in them to turn things around. Big assumption. Maybe they are what we’ve seen so far, at least we have to consider it. I want them to win as much as the next fan but this is a full season going back to last June playing UNDER .500 ball. It’s not a fluke or some blip on the radar. They have been consistently inconsistent for a very long, long time now. There comes a time when we just have to face reality and call a spade a spade, or a mutt a mutt, which ever.
The RC issue shows how little drive this team has and what they think of the manager. I said after the collapse of last year, how does a manager report to duty and command respect of his team. Worst collapse in team history. Arguably in MLB history? Then you want him to be able to manage this squad?
Bravo Knuckles99!
I’ve been saying the same thing since the season began. I actually rooted for Willie and against my better judgment hoped that he would get this team off to a fast start this year to help wipe away the bad taste from last Sept. but it’s becoming obviously clear that this team has lost respect for their manager in light of the biggest collapse ever.
Something seriously wrong happened to this team last Sept. and Willie was unable to find a solution and maybe was even the cause, who knows. One thing is certain, this team has under achieved for almost three seasons now if you believe they were the better team against the cardinals (I do) and nothing has changed what’s so ever.
Time for change if for no other reason than for the sake of change, this can not continue. We keep saying Willie will get them turned around, It’s not Willie’s fault, Willie can’t hit or pitch or field, the players need to step up…………..etc. etc. etc. Time to end the excuses, time for a change.
ironically though, if the change is what actually changes things, then it was the players fault all along and not Randolph’s, if ADULT Millionaires need a fall guy for their own failures that is pretty sad.
You are correct in that. Unfortunately just because they make millions has nothing to due with charactor or maturity, I think we tend to give these players too much credit and use words like Professionals and Adults to rationalize why they should not need to be motivated or even require a manager to push them and motivate them but the ole saying “It’s a Kid’s Game” probably still holds true today and quite frankly allot of these guys are nothing but overgrown kids and sometimes need a good kick in the butt.
Yeah, and a lot of athletes have been coddled their entire lives. So many of them DO need to be motivated and pushed to get them to do what they’re supposed to take pride in doing for themselves. Many of them grew up having coaches and parents who overlooked a lack of maturity and sense of responsibility because of their athletic ability.
All those years of being excused from practicing with the rest of the team, having other people “help” them with their schoolwork so they could remain eligible to play, etc. There are plenty of exceptions, but so many of these guys do need people to act like babysitters to get them to be where they’re supposed to be.
or they just are not a good team and time has past by a lot of the players, I know I guess it sounds more encouraging to imagine they are spoiled and need to be beaten by Lou Pinella, but it makes absolutely no sense.
No one who has tasted winning enjoys losing let alone getting ripped in the papers and by fans day in and day out. If their was a magic button everyone would have pressed it ten times a hundred in that clubhouse.
The fact is, they are just not a good team, no matter who manages them.
I believe we can win 60% of the next 100 games. One other probelm though is it seems the mets never win on days when the Phils lose. the rare days we do win these days the phils also win and if the phils lose we lose, we never seem to make up any ground.
I’d like to see a little comparison since say August of 2007 through the present of days when both teams played: if the Mets won did the Phillies also win compared to days the Mets won and Phillies lose. Elias, Matt, get on it…Thanks.
Not to sound smug but that obviously has happen a lot. They did come back from 7 down and have now got a 7.5 game lead.
14 games. 7 down, to go one game up, then I think they are 6.5 today. Round it. That’s 14 games.
i do agree with real on the phils…. i cant see that pitching holding up all year…… the hope is the fall back a bit…..
they’ll…
It would be Poetic Justice if the Mets return the favor and overtake the Phillies in the last week of the season to win the NL east. One can hope right?
You know what I think would be better? If the Mets knocked the Cards out of the playoff picture to take the wild card, then worked their way to the NLCS where they knock the Phillies out of it. I guess I already talked myself into a corner today by saying I didn’t think they would turn it around this year… But man would that be sweet revenge.
Yeah, that would actually be better. Why even stop there. Then they go on to beat the Yankees (another cinderalla story season) in 7 games and Arod goes 0-20 with runners on base and they beat the Mighty Mariano with two outs and this time Carlos beltran instead of looking at a called strike three he hits a game winning walk-off home-run after the ball hits off Johny Damon’s glove which he helps over the fense and a young fan reaches over and grabs the ball which would otherwise be fan inetreference but the umps miss the call and call it a home-run. End of a perfect season.
Or… The Yankees don’t make the playoffs at all. AND the Mets win it all. WFAN would sound a lot different for a few weeks after that.
Good point. Mike F. and the “Angry Puppy” would be beside themsleves. I can hear it now. Go Mets!!
In the words of the Immortal Tug Mcgraw “You Gotta believe!”.
that would be awesome, but that won’t happen with Willie at the helm.
Absolutely bring up Carp and FMart when he comes off the DL. The Mets aren’t going to win anything with the current roster. We may not want to admit it, but deep in our minds we know it’s true. So let’s bring up the rookies and give them a taste of the show. It may help Omar (or whoever the next GM is) determine which FAs to sign and which to pass on. For example, if Carp looks halfway decent, it may mean that we don’t have to make a run at Teixeira.
“To watch me and Ted discuss in more detail…
To win 97 games the Mets have to win 2 out of 3 for the rest of the season (67-33).
Just keep winning series…every one of them!
Winning 97 games would most likely give the Mets the best record in the NL and maybe the MLB. They don’t have to do that. 90 will get them in IMHO.
not that they will, but sweeping the phils in the 4 game series at the start of july would completely change those #’s. it’s less difficult with head-to-head match-ups…
…as the phillies showed the mets last august/september.
The Mets record is 2 games worse than the Phils record from last season. The Phils record is 2 games better than the Mets record from last season.
So the Mets will have to out-finish the 2007 Phils and the Phils will have to out-collapse the 2006 Mets. That’s a big if.
That’s not fair. The season is too long for that. The Phillies did not do anything last year until September.
The Phillies have much more time to lose their lead than the Mets did and the Mets have much more time to turn it around. It does not take a season of a Philies collapse the rest of the year and .750 ball from the Mets for the rest of the year.
All the Phillies need to do is play mediocre ball 50-47– would put them at 89-73. The Mets go 60-40 and they win the division. with 90 wins. That would be poetic justice.
Now, while I think the Mets will fall short and win only around 85 games, wouldn’t it be crazy if the Mets had a Yankee-like second half and won 65 games, and ended up winning 95 games? The Phillies would have to do no better than 55-42 for the Mets to win. Look folks, we are in a hole here, but it is not out of the realm. I just want the Mets to make it a race. And, as someone said earlier, the head-to-head matchups will be key, and we have a lot of them coming up (and we’re 4-2 thus far against them. Extrapolate that out for the rest of the season and with 12 games remaining, that would be 8-4, making up 4 games.)
For everyone on the Phillies jock. Take a look at their June schedule. If they are still on their same pace after this then I too will admit they are a good team.
3 games in FL
3 games in St. Louis
3 games vs. Boston
3 games vs. LA Angels
3 games in Oakland
3 games in Texas.
If they go 11-7 during that span then they will still be at a .600 winning percentage and I will admit they are good.
so 10- 8 means they suck ?
I’m seeing 10-8 there. I’ll never believe in the Marlins. I think they take 2 from the Cards. Sox and Angels should clean their clocks. They should handle the rest of the interleague OK.
I’ll predict:
Phillies
2-1 vs. Marlins
2-1 vs Cardinals
1-2 vs Red Sox
1-2 vs Angels
2-1 vs Oakland
2-1 vs Texas
10-8
Mets
1-2 vs D-Backs
2-1 vs Texas
1-2 vs Angels
3-0 vs Colorado (this time they get it done)
2-1 vs Seattle
2-1 vs Yankees
11-7
I’m not trying to be negative. This is really how I see it playing out. Of course the games have to be played on the field. But unless I’m way off on this, the Mets don’t gain much ground in June. Depending on how the Mets handle the Phillies in July, the Mets July schedule should be much more favorable.
Right now the Mets just need to not fall any further back. Do what they can in June, and pounce in July. I CAN see them doing that. Still a long way to go after that.
Oh and I gave the Phillies one win vs. Boston. I rarely ever predict a sweep. I did give the Mets one vs the Rockies at home. But I COULD see the Sox sweeping the Phillies. Still, this is a lot of work left to be done.
Ok here is mine, LOL
1-2 vs Marlins in FL
1-2 vs St. Louis in ST louis
1-2 vs Boston
1-2 vs Angels
1-2 vs. Oakland
1-2 vs Texas
6-12
Mets win all 18 and lead the division. LOL, you guys are always saying I am so damn positive so I thought I would give it a shot.
You know, now that you posted it, that’s probably what will happen. Then I’ll never be able to disagree with you again. :)
OR…
All of that will happen, except the Met will go 17-1. And someone will copy and paste your prediction and say “SEE? YOU WERE WRONG!”
jesus!!!! i wouldnt know what the hell to do with myself than…… maybe i could bitch and whine about not having anything to bitch and whine about….
Forgot the Yankee makeup game, which I assume will be played during that weekend.
I think the Mets pick up that win, and also pick up one more win against either the Diamondbacks or Angels. 13-6.
Think it’s morely likely thate Phillies lose one more game than that. 9-9.
Of course, it’s only numbers, and neither of these teams have performed to perdictions thus far.
The Mets need to get into striking distance for the Philly series in July. Play well and make up one game in the standings a week.
Will this happen? It certainly could. I wouldn’t be surprised if the Mets go 15-4. I also wouldn’t be that surprised if they went 8-11.
Yep, I missed the makeup game. I’ll give it to the Mets. Yankees have their own problems. So make that 3-1 vs the Yankees. I still think the Mets best shot is to hold their ground in June and then strike in July.
I gotta tell you guys. Doing this is more fun than actually watching most of these games has been lately. :)
The same team that went 0-4 in SD is gonna go 12-7 in their next 19 games? Awesome!
once again we agree….
TheReal, you do realize that the Phillies have a better lineup, a far better bullpen, a better, deeper bench, and a rotation that is just as good if not better than the Mets’. And you do know that they have the best road record in baseball and have handled the “elite” teams on their schedule thus far(Cubs, Diamondbacks, Braves, Marlins). And eventhough the Mets are 4-2 against the Phillies, none of the wins were exactly convincing, and Eric Bruntlett won’t be at shortstop for those games either. Mets fans need to wake up and realize that this team isn’t that good, and that Omar Minaya, not Willie Randolph, has ruined this team. You’re really underestimating this Phillies team also. They have played almost every team the mets have and have beat them, which the Mets haven’t done. And trying to find links between this year and last year is just a sign of desperation and false hope.
The Phillies don’t have a “far better” bullpen and the Mets still have a slight edge with starting pitching, but the Phillies everyday lineup is laughably better than the Mets at this point. Never thought I’d say this,but they may have a better manager too, both of those guys couldn’t manage out of a paper bag, but at least Manuel appears to get into the face of his team.
Apparently Phillies have the best record in the NL since Manuel’s been the manager. Kinda surprising.
The Phils starters have the most innings in the league. Sure, CBP wreaks havoc on their ERAs, but they keep their offense in the game. Sometimes with the Mets you figure if the other team gets 2 runs the game is over.
Their team ERA is 3.84, Mets is 4.09, so they’re getting some kind of edge from somewhere, considering Shea’s a pitcher’s park.
Starting with 2005, Manual with the Phils has the most wins. in 2nd place, right behind them? The Mets and Willie.
If that doesn’t prove managers are overrated, nothing does!
you will never convince him to take the champagne off the ice……
LOL, so you really think that in the long run that the Phillies have better SP and BP? That’s a big stretch don’t you think?
Everyone says that CBP is a joke of a bandbox. How much better does their ERA have to be over the Mets before it’s acknowledged that the Mets pitchers aren’t all that.
They don’t seem to have a Heilman in the bullpen, giving up runs in crucial spots over and over and over.
They don’t Coin-Flip Ollie going out there every 5 days, or Even-Though-He-Lost-We-Are-Encouraged-By-His-Progress Pelfry types either.
Sure, Moyer’s 100 years old, but he keeps his team in the game and gives them a chance. Same with Eaton and Kendrick. Myers is the wild card, if he does what he’s done recently, their SP is better now than it was at the beginning of the year.
And Hamels has two CG shutouts so far, so he’s doing OK.
Comment by therealsince86
2008-06-09 18:26:40
LOL, so you really think that in the long run that the Phillies have better SP and BP? That’s a big stretch don’t you think?
It’s not a thought, it’s a fact that their pitching has been better than the Mets’. Their staff has been consistently giving strong outings, and despite what that idiot Ken Rosenthal says, their ‘pen is nowhere near being over used because Romero, Gordon, and Lidge haven’t pitched two innings all year, and are still as fresh as backend pitchers can be in June. Compare that to the Mets’ bullpen that is over-reliant on guys like Heilman, feliciano, and Sanchez who will be burned out by mid-July.
They are allowing fewer runs PG and have a lower ERA. And what has the Mets’ pitching shown to even make you think they’ve been that good? Honestly, Mets fans need to get over ‘06 and realize that those days are gone with this group, and that the Phillies are the best team in the division right now. People are on here saying the Phillies are going to lose 80 games and the Mets are going to blow by them-what teams have you been watching this year? Again, not that it’s an excuse, but the Mets won games that weren’t convincing in any way, and in 3 of those 4 loses Rollins would have been the difference. The difference between this year and last year is that the Phillies are playing better as the season is going on and they know that the only way to get where they want to go is to play and win games. This team has received no credit for what they accomplished last year, and people really underestimated the talent that they have, while overrating the talent on the Mets.
Phils had a horrible April last year. After that they did do ’something’-they made up a lot of ground on the Mets.
The Mets had losing months in June (12-15) and
July (13-14). August was 15-13 and September 14-14.
Sure, the Phils went 17-11 in Sept, but they did have some good months before that-August (16-12), July (15-10), June (15-13) and May (15-13).
So the Phils picked up ground on the Mets every month between June and the end of the season. A Mets’ good streak early in September obscures that some. But all those other months helped but them in a spot where they could withstand that early September streak.
Randolph wouldn’t want for us to think ahead — he wants to take things one-game at a time.
HA.
Can people please stop comparing us to the Phils of last year.
That team got swept in the first round of the playoffs…
Anything can happen in the playoffs. They ran into a team that nobody in the NL was going to beat at that point. The Phillies did win the division before getting swept in the first round. Where were the Mets?
Hey, at least they got to the playoffs.
as much as i hate the mets right now and think they have no shot at winning the division…they could still easily win the wild card if they start winning a few games…the cardinals are lead the wild card and to me they stink…maybe not as much as the mets do but they still stink…and after that the next best team is somethling like 2 games over 500 which isonly 2 games better than the mets…so im prety confident that 90 wins will win the wc but i think phillies have just ab taken the division by now…the only way to catch the phillies in my mind is to do what the did to us last year and that is win practically every game against them…especially late in the year
I hope I’m not the only one listening to Steve Somer’s monologue. Good stuff.
If I learned anything from all these blogs/comments it’s that all us Mets fan have various opinions on what ails this team right now and how to fix it.
I’ve been a Mets fan since 1968. I’ve watched the best and the worst. Someone recently made the comment the difference this year is the high expectations we all had for this team – as good as they looked on paper. That and we WANTED it so bad after the collapse last year. Problem is, they have yet to field the starting 8 they had on paper coming into spring training b/c of injuries. Would it have made a difference in the win/losses? I believe so. How much of a difference is the question. We do have some aging players, the bench has little depth, the pitching is one big question mark.
That being said, I will watch just about every game this season as I have all past seasons. I can’t write them off this early. I don’t know if they’ve got a chance to make the post season. All signs point to no but I’ll have faith. Bare minimum, by watching all the games, I’ll won’t miss some good games, some spectacular plays, possibly some record breakers and best of all, I’ll at least have my facts straight when I comment here on the mets blog – which is so far turning out to be the highlight of this Mets baseball season for me…….
First off, I’m new here and (obviously) I’m a Phillies fan. I enjoy reading other teams’ blogs and MetsBlog.com is one of the best.
OK, I’ve weeded through some of the arguments here, but not all of them, so I do apologize if this has been discussed.
Mets’ optimists are hopeful the Phillies’ pitching comes back to Earth and the hitting cools off. Problem with that logic is, the Phillies have NOTORIOUSLY been a very, very good team during the June, July and August months, dating back to the Larry Bowa era.
Hey, Mets fans, you have to have hope. I expect the Mets will play decent baseball at some point, but their chance to hang with the Phillies is slipping fast.
The Phillies’ problem was slow starts the past four or five years. At this point a season ago, they were a .500 team. But this seaosn, they’ve been playing above .500 baseball since mid-to-late April and never looked back.
My point is…
The Phillies are just heating up. As Charlie Manuel said, it’s “hitting season” and, as recent history would indicate, summer is when the Phillies’ bats come alive. Granted, I know the Philies are going to slow down at some point… like, say, loste 4 of 5 or 7 of 11 at some point.
All in all, though, this team is built to perform well as the weather heats up. It’s not a team that’ll struggle for weeks and weeks and allow its NL East competitors to leapfrog it. Frankly, the team’s talent and chemistry is too strong to allow that to happen.
Oh, and as for the CBP argument, it’s nonsense. The team can win at home and on the road, as the records would indiciate.
Barring injuries to key players, the Phillies are set to win consistently this summer.
In other words, the Mets (and Braves for that matter) better get real hot real soon before it’s too late.
Matt makes a great point….take a look at the stats last year at this time….If I remember correctly, Philly was fighting for THIRD PLACE. Atlanta was in second, the Nats were in fourth and the Marlins were in fifth…..we we’re #1 even with the sweeps out west and at home against the phillies. While I agree that it will be a complete and total crapshoot for this team to win 60+ games, I don’t think its impossible. While the series out west was horrible, the team is playing slightly better than before and….anything can happen. Did you honestly believe that either the Phillies or even the ROCKIES were gonna make the playoffs? Neither did I…..take it out of baseball and apply it to football….did anyone see the Giants even going to the playoffs, let alone win the super bowl? Neither did I. Point is, we can still win this….LETS GO METS!
The bottom line here is not if the caliber of talent is there or not, just if the caliber of play will get them there. Can this team win 90 games and get to the post season? I think the individual stats of each player would say yes, but the combined sum of the team does not add up to a likely pennant.
In watching the team (less Wright and Church) play they seem to lack energy, enthusiasm, or passion. Before the Padres series it looked like things were turning around, then everyone seemingly went into a coma. Where is the attitude and fire? Beltran is having a great year in the field, he has made some seemingly impossible plays look routine, then he gets to bat and all but falls asleep. Reyes is just a mystery, he’s gotten his average and OBP up but still loves to swing at the first pitch, regardless of how good or bad the opposing pitcher is throwing, and strikes out once for every two hits. One day he’s on fire and the next he’s a mess. The relief pitching is starting to show the same inconsistency as last September, and it’s only June.
It’s just not looking promising. This team needs an emotional boost from somewhere. Whether from Randolph, or a player (personally I’d like to see Wright take charge as a “team captain” per se) but someone needs to motivate these guys. If they continue to play the same way, come the All-Star break we won’t be asking if they can win enough games to get to the post season, rather what players we will be looking to trade off before the deadline.
This season, whenever I read about “If they go blank and blank all we have to do is go blank and blank to win,” I remember last September, “If we go 10 and 7, they have to go 17-0 just to tie us…”
Just play a game at a time. There are 100 games left. We’re 6 behind in the loss column, and we play them more than 6 times…a game at a time…a game at a time…
Is this Willie Randolph on here?
i think it’s time to stop doing calculations of what it will take to finish in 1st… and start doing calculations on what it will take to make sure we don’t finish in last…
I think they do take it seriously, but it definately is in their best interests for things to turn around. Like now. Without boat-rocking before the new stadium enters. Shame though, it should always be about winning.
We have been perilously close to the “Change for change’s sake” line this season. It so did look like we had pulled away from that until we hit S.D. If they tank against Arizona and the Rangers then Willie is gone, no question about it. If we bounce back and can win 4 out of 6 or something we pull away again…
you greatly over estimate the impact of a manager on how a team performs, why did if we buy into your logical this team put of crooked numbers and sustain in 2006 and magically become complacent there after? you really think Randolph had a “chill” meeting with his guys to tell him it is all good….
new bloods, lol
I am with dr. jones, 100 percent. managers have to get the most out of their players. the team adopts the personality of their manager, his urgency. willie is emotionless, motionless, and witless. sort of how the team is playing right now, coincidence? I think not.
And patrick, you greatly underestimate the impact that a manager has on a team. your logic is silly. 2006 has nothing to do with 2008. that was willie’s 2nd year here, not hardly a chance for him to have instilled his “go get ‘em tomorrow” attitude.