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…from what i understand, Jeff Wilpon, and other members of the front office, did not want Willie Randolph to return as the team’s manager following last season’s collapse…
…i believe he and others felt that randolph didn’t deserve to return, and that the entire organization would never turn the page while under the same leadership…also, while randolph is always given given credit for his work ethic and old school style, the sense i get – from people in and connected to the the organization – is that he did not work well with the media, was not aware of how important fan relations can be, he was stubborn with regards to how he could better relate to and motivate players, and he bristled with how upper-management involved itself in on-field decisions…in short, while people inside the organization may have valued his past success as a player and a coach, they have long questioned his ability to be a leader…
…at the end of last season, though, the team’s ownership accepted Omar Minaya’s recommendation to retain randolph, but made it quite clear that this was his decision…which may explain why this took so long to play out over the last week or so…my hunch is that there was a lot of talk in the last week between the front office and minaya on what to do, and how to handle this, all while omar tried to make his case to keep willie on…in the end, though, things got so out of hand, be it on purpose or accidental, that a move had to be made…
…all along, Fred Wilpon continued to believe in willie, mostly because omar did…plus, i sense fred is an honorable, loyal man, who wanted to see willie pull through this…
…however, i believe the final straw came when willie made his comments about race to the Bergen Record…from what i can gather, Fred Wilpon was far more upset with the racial remarks than he ever was with willie’s comments about SNY…in fact, some would argue that his comments about SNY make the network appear more impartial…nevertheless, fred prides himself on the work he has done to help bridge the racial divide in this country, and he speaks quite passionately about it…look no further than the Jackie Robinson Rotunda, which will be the cornerstone to the team’s new ball park, Citi Field…from what i understand, fred was very upset by willie’s comments, regardless of their intent…
…and so, without fred’s support, and omar’s back against the wall, and the team having gone 40–47 since September 1 of last season, the curtain closed on the Willie Randolph Era…
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FIRE JEFF WILPON
Never thought these words would come from my keyboard, but: Jeff Wilpon was right. Willie (and Peterson) should have been cathartically released after last year’s fiasco. Redemption was a feasible theme and goal after a disappointing end to a season like 2006, but it’s a joke after 2007. The fans demanded accountability and ownership choked. The chance to open the windows, let the stench out in the off-season, and come back with at least the guise of a real fresh start in 2008 was all lost.
Yep. The problem is, they thought Santana would have been a sufficient way to change the subject, but it turned out to be just a band aid. With that being said, Omar’s sole decision to keep Willie against the Wilpon’s wishes make the 2008 disaster (so far) 100% his fault.
It’s the Steve Phillips theory.. if you fire the manager.. and you still loose… then there’s only person left too blame.. yourself..
I give the Wilipons credit for trying to let baseball people make baseball decisions.. but firing him after 07 was a no brainer…
Now we’re halfway into failed season… Rangers got Jarmaillo instead of us…and they make it even more bizarre by dismissing him one day into a road trip..
True, keeping Willie to kick around again was Omar’s tactic to keep the heat off him a bit longer should the Mets continue to underwhelm. The timing of Willie’s firing, and the way he was left to dangle game to game all this time has truly been despicable and shameful. Omar couldn’t have intentionally undermined the team any better with all this distracting nonsense hanging over everyone’s heads and clouding the clubhouse. Having Omar front and center now in the line of fire is great, however, an “autonomous” guy with his job on the line can be apt to do some more stupid things.
If you think Jaramillo or any manager would have this team in the division lead at present, you are sadly deluded.
No, but maybe they could have had this team in second place or at least above .500.
Whether you want Jaramillo or not.. firing willie on June 17th makes it harder to move forward with a new manger.. that’s all I said…
Sry , but the decision needed to be made At sometime, Omar did state to Willie that he would make a decision no matter what on Monday. It just happened to be for the east coast people to late in the night or too early in the morning. Either way it happened, see sry willie wish you the best of luck, Yes i did like willie , I’ve been a met fan all my life , watching games day in and day out the whay they develope and ended was too much for me to deal with as a fan. I work at 2am so for me the timing was fine to hear about it. The sports writers world in our area is upset that it couldn’t get the news when they needed to, so they can post it and batter the mets organization as they always do especially here in the N.Y. area. IF you hear alot of the comments being made by alot of the media within this area majority of them are pro yankee new and writers. Willie ’s decision making for the most part during games was questionable which in my opion led to alot of mistakes and negative outcomes during games. For me i would stay up late into the night watching these games when they would be winning , get myself maybe 3 hr’s sleep to find out the’ve gone on to lose who can enjoy watching a team with all that talent and with such a high payroll underachieve all year it has to fall on the manager he is the motovater of his players and without any fire in him he just wasn’t getting it done. Maybe this will piss the players off to the point they decide to wakeup , while i’m sleeping and play to WIN!!!
Here, here to “In Omar, We Trust!”
This isn’t directed at JDuelz….
Wow, this is a nice way to spin what happened. All that’s missing is a pretty little bow! As a longtime reader of Metsblog, I sure am glad SNY has NO CONTROL over anything on this site.
Any Mets fan that is not ashamed of the way this was handled is insane. This team is the laughing stock of professional sports after this fiasco. It’s a shame that a good man like Willie has to take the fall for Omar’s poorly devised plan of old, broken down players and a weak bench. You can say what you want to about ownership questioning Willie’s leadership, but it didn’t seem to be a problem when they got within an out of the World Series in 2006. I could go on and on, but I have to go throw up…
excerpt from “I Trust My Guys: The Willie Randolph Managerial Experience” by NY Cuban
The Collapse
…so we all lived through what factually can be considered the worst collapse in baseball history. Some may argue that the Yankees losing a 3 game lead to the Red Sox was worse, but I beg to differ. This team lost a 7 game lead with 17 games to play. These games were not versus tough opponents, 13 of those games were versus the Marlins and Nationals. We stood by this team, game after game. And every post-game was the same. We heard how Willie trusts his guys. How this team needed to find a rhythm. How it was just one game. And game by game, the time dwindled. But it was all ok, because we heard about champagne and how great it would taste when they won the division. Well, Sept 30th came and went and we all know how that turned out. And then came October 1st and 2nd, and we waited and waited. We waited for the inevitable. Someone had to pay, and it obviously had to be Willie. Well, we were wrong. Omar came on and said that Willie was a winner and he would continue being manager of the Mets in 2008. And just like that, the organization that was on the right path took major steps back. It was like quick sand.
The Mets Go As Reyes Goes
…it is often said that the “Mets go how Jose Reyes goes”. Well, then, Willie deserves much of the blame for ruining young Reyes. Sure Reyes is a bit of a primadona; he deserves criticism. However, on July 7, 2007, the respect young Reyes had for Willie was erased. Reyes check swung at a pitch and grounded it down the third base line. Thinking it would roll foul, Reyes watched the ball stay fair and was easily thrown out at first. Willie was irate and subsequently benched Reyes. Reyes looked at Willie in disbelief, mostly because Beltran and Delgado were notorious for not running things out hard. This was a typical Willie doublestandard where he treated veterans and young players differently. Reyes never looked at Willie the same. He adopted a “who-cares” attitude and struggled for the remainder of Willie’s tenure. The “Mets go as Reyes goes”, which meant the Mets also subsequently struggled for the remainder of Willie’s tenure.
I Know My Team Better Than Anyone
…loss after loss, Willie was questioned about his managerial decisions. Interview after interview, Willie stood his ground that he knew his team better than anyone. For Met fans in the Willie era, there are names that sound like nails on a chalkboard. Think back to 2007. Now say the name Guillermo Mota. How about Scott Schoeneweis? Julio Franco? Night after night, Willie would go to them with some rationale about his gut guiding his decision making. Even after the Collapse, fast forward to 2008. Say the names Aaron Heilman or Jorge Sosa. How does that make a Met fan feel? Time after time, we saw these players fail. The fans knew way before the manager the outcome of the managerial move. Yet, Willie Randolph was steadfast. He was out to prove that he was smarter than the average Joe(…or was he.) …
Willie is not Lou Pinella
…over the course of his tenure, Willie Randolph was always hesitant to stand up for his players and risk ejection. Apparently he felt that his strategic superiority would be drastically missed and his absence would consequently hurt his team. It would be a fine assumption, but it was at the expense of the respect of his players. Willie’s players never got the sense that he was there to defend them. They could clearly have a case with the umpires and Willie would just blandly discuss the situation, nod his head and walk back to the dugout. Well, in a way, Willie did get through to his players; he instilled the same passive malaise that he portrayed in the dugout. By the end of his tenure, the team was a shell of itself, going through the motions game after game…
I Treat These Guys Like Men
…perhaps the biggest flaw in Willie Randolph’s managerial tactics was his refusal to deviate from his personality. During a 2 year span, the NY Mets went 74-75. In this time, Willie continued to affirm his notion that there was no reason to yell or call out his team. “I treat these guys like men” was repeated on multiple occasions. Well, that would actually be commendable if that approach worked for the players on his team. However, perhaps, there were players on the team who needed to be treated differently. Perhaps, Willie should have tried different approaches to find a fit that worked for his team’s personality. Instead, like many tragic figures, Willie was a victim of his own hubris. He expected all players to conform to HIS style and personality. Unfortunately, that conformity was never adopted and Willie continued to be steadfast in his ways…
Conspiracy or Paranoia?
…On May 18, after a sweep of the rival Yankees, Willie did the unthinkable; he gave an interview in which he sounded completely delusional and paranoid. He managed to insult the Mets home television network, the fanbase, and insinuate that his perception was skewed due to his race. The fallout from the interview was coupled by horrid roadtrip, where the Mets managed to be swept by division rival Atlanta and lost a series to the last-place Rockies. On Memorial Day, upon the return to Shea, Willie was asked to meet with Mets ownership. Although it was speculated that his job was in jeopardy, Willie remained as manager with a firm edict to right the ship…
The End of the Willie Experiment
…in 2005, after 14 interviews, Willie Randolph finally fulfilled his dream. He would be the manager of a New York baseball team; he would be the manager of the NY Mets. After just over 3 years, Willie Randolph was relieved from a nightmare. After being spared his job in 2007, the NY Mets floundered during the first half of a season in 2008. The Wilpons became increasingly anxious to see the Mets turn the ship around. After 2007, Willie lost the team’s confidence. Shortly after, the fans turned on him. Even the most ardent supporters could no longer find rationale to keep Willie. Weeks after the Memorial Day Meeting, the Mets were still floundering near the .500 mark and were 6.5 games behind defending Division Champion Philadelphia. After sparing him his job on Father’s Day, Omar flew to Los Angeles and fired Willie Randolph. The Willie experiment was now over…
Upon hiring a Jerry Manuel as interim manager, the Mets promptly went on a 5 game winning streak and found a new energy that had been missing since 2006. On the shoulders of Johan Santana, and a re-energized Jose Reyes, the NY Mets won the NL East and returned the NL pennant to Flushing…
I will bet you they go on a five game losing streak before a 5 game winning streak.
i mean, you really get off on this, don’t you? congratulations, you’re the big winner!
you get the gold star, big boy!
LAME.
Agreed.
I guess IN YOUR WORLD Delgado, Alou are still 25, hell even 35.
Heilman never blows a game, in fact the bullpen is perfect.
Nobody is ever on the DL.
Nope in your world Willie single-handedly blows every game.
You are just absurd. The Wilpons should fire themselves.
BRAVO CUBAN!!! Well said as usual.
You put a lot of time into this…which is really a bit p@thetic.
You strike me as a one-trick pony. Can’t wait to see your tirades on manuel, oberkfell, or whoever the manager is….oh wait, i can.
Nope. I promise I will be positive. I will talk real baseball. I’m not anti-manager. I’m anti-Willie. Anti-comatose. I would be anti- Manuel, but he already showed me some fire by getting tossed in that game while Willie had his head down and the ump told him to shut up.
Keep up the good posts, Cuban.
This to me is your best point: “I Know My Team Better Than Anyone
…loss after loss, Willie was questioned about his managerial decisions. Interview after interview, Willie stood his ground that he knew his team better than anyone. For Met fans in the Willie era, there are names that sound like nails on a chalkboard. Think back to 2007. Now say the name Guillermo Mota. How about Scott Schoeneweis? Julio Franco? Night after night, Willie would go to them with some rationale about his gut guiding his decision making. Even after the Collapse, fast forward to 2008. Say the names Aaron Heilman or Jorge Sosa. How does that make a Met fan feel? Time after time, we saw these players fail. The fans knew way before the manager the outcome of the managerial move. Yet, Willie Randolph was steadfast. He was out to prove that he was smarter than the average Joe(…or was he.) …”
Willie would go back and back again to the same arms in the same situations expecting different results. Now, I’m not going to get on him for trusting Heilman as long as he did this year, because Heilman’s track record was better than he’s shown. But Mota last year, game after game, after game after game. Just unreal.
And for all those who say the starters didn’t go deep, it’s mostly because he didn’t let them. One sign of trouble after the fifth inning and the hook. Only since the Memorial Day meeting has this guy managed. Only recently has he let his pitchers fight through trouble in the 6th and 7th. Too late.
If a strategy works, fine, be rigid and stubborn and stick to it. But when it doesn’t work, change. Willie refused to change. And when he did, it was just too little too late.
Willie’s not the worst manager ever. And Omar deserves a lot of the blame here too. But I’m glad it’s over. He wasn’t a good manager, and all of the ink about his job status was a distraction. If not for the players, certainly for the fans.
And he definitely was not a good manager for this team. He might have been ok for the AL, but not for “this” team.
Your take on Reyes / Willie is a bit warped, to say the least:
1. I saw that play last August. Reyes wasn’t “easily thrown out,” Cabrera JOGGED ACROSS THE DIAMOND with the ball and stepped on first on his way to the dugout. It was one of the most embarrassing things I’d ever seen in a ballgame, and Reyes knew he’d been totally punked.
2. Willie has no obligation whatsoever to treat the young and developing Reyes the same way he would treat a guy like Delgado, who is ten years older, slow to begin with, and is NOT part of the future core of the team. And if you think Beltran doesn’t hustle, you’re not watching.
3. Yours is the only opinion I’ve seen that suggests that Reyes has ever “lost respect” for Willie. So either you have some special intimate connection to the team that you haven’t revealed, or this is the product of a very active imagination.
And thank God that curtain is now closed. I posted the following excerpt in another post that everyone should give an honest read, regardless of what you think of myself and my posts.
I posted this above in response to a comment, I think everyone should read this and whether you agree or not with all this drama that has taken place over the past 24 hours, everyone has opinions and thats what this arena is for. Now it’s time to swallow your pride (regardless of your stance) and rally around the mets.
***A lot of people don’t agree with me or see eye-to-eye and that’s all right. We are all mets fans and want them to win some, make that multiple ball games, c’mon put this behind us, rally behind Jerry, he didn’t create this drama, but he is now responsible for our team to play championship caliber baseball. Isn’t that what we’re all in this together for anyways? Let’s get to it!****
pac_manjones: the voice of reason.
Delu