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Yesterday, Omar Minaya announced that Moises Alou could realistically miss the remainder of the season should he chose to have surgery on his torn hamstring.
Meanwhile, as I mentioned on SNY’s The Wheel House yesterday, which you can watch by clicking here, it would be wise for the Mets to approach this year’s Trade Deadline assuming Ryan Church will miss additional time this season, even if he returns healthy from his current stint on the disabled list.
And so, during his talk with reporters, Minaya said:
“Right now, we’re going to give the guys we have an opportunity. But, you have to continue to look at things and see if there’s somebody out there that we feel is an upgrade…Are we going to be in the marketplace looking for guys to improve? Yes, but it has to be the right guy.”
That said, in the New York Post, Joel Sherman recently wrote that names such as OF-1B Xavier Nady, OF Raul Ibanez, OF Randy Winn and OF Adam Dunn are will be most associated with the Mets.
Sherman also mentions that Minaya might be willing to take on a bloated contract, if it helped to reduce the value of the prospect needed to acquire a corner outfielder.
The sense I get from people in Seattle and San Francisco is that neither the Mariners nor Giants are eager to trade Winn or Ibanez, who are both relatively affordable, under contract and are both still useful and productive players.
The buzz from Cincinnati indicates that the market for Dunn is surprisingly quiet. Additionally, Dunn will likely be a Type-A Free Agent, and could net the Reds two draft picks, assuming he is not re-signed to an extension - in short, the two draft picks could end up being far more valuable than the type of prospect a team will trade for Dunn today. What’s more, the word around baseball paints Dunn as an apathetic strike-out machine, who, while he occasionally walks, is more or less useless in the field, and so he will bring more in name recognition than actual results.
As for Nady, who is the player I would like the Mets to 
acquire, and the name that is mentioned most to me by other fans, at this point, from what I can gather, the Pirates are not feeling pressure to trade him.
In fact, the buzz from Atlanta suggests that the Pirates recently asked for at least one top position prospect, such as SS Brent Lillibridge. In terms of the Mets, I believe Nady would likely cost a package including Fernando Martinez, or Mike Carp, Jon Neise and probably another pitching prospect.
There is no indication that the Pirates will ever accept a package built around Aaron Heilman, as so many fans like suggest.
Regarding the free agent market, Omar Minaya essentially ruled out Barry Bonds while speaking to WFAN earlier this week. What’s more, according to a recent report by Ken Davidoff in Newsday, citing an e-mail from Minaya, the Mets are not interested in Kenny Lofton either.
Lastly, according to SI.com’s Jon Heyman, 
speaking yesterday on SNY’s Pre-Game show, the Mets are most interested in 1B-OF Juan Rivera, who is hitting just .194 with three home runs in 34 games for the Angels.
In 2006, Rivera hit .310 with 24 HR and 85 RBI, but has struggled to return to that level of production ever since.
Rivera can be a free agent at the end of this season.
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rivera wouldn’t be a bad solution. comes cheap.
But there is a risk. What if he continues to hit .194?
He’s more likely to get hot in order to trend back to his career norms.
He’s a solid Buy Low candidate.
Nady is such a horrible idea because this is the best he will ever play, and then we would buy high on him and then get him just as he would begin his regression.
Trend back towards his career norms? So he will have to go on a hot streak to bat .220 huh?
I would rather go with Endy and Tatis than trade a prospect for a guy that was really never all that great and is batting .194.
Omar will not make a move for the sake of making a move. I can’t see any of those guys brought in here. A quick solution is Bonds. See what he’s got left.
i think anybody on this list is risky–i want to get a lower-level player so that we can keep our top prospects.
Nady was buried as a part time player his whole career until he came to the Mets. Ever since then he has been more than solid as an everyday player, so there is no reason to expect him to regress. At 29 years old he is more than likely going to stay the same or better, not worse. Hes the perfect option not only for this year, but depending on the market in the offseason, he also could be our starting first baseman next year.
There’s Always ‘09, Rivera’s career line is .287/.336/.468
So yeah, your post made sense.
One Day, if Nady finishes the year with an OPS above 900 I’ll give you a nickel. The chances of him keeping this up are not good at all.
Danny, I think we can all agree that the problems the Mets have had this year have been mostly hitting. So, tell me how adding a guy that is batting .194 (when steroids/hgh are supposed to be out of the game and lots of guys are coming back down to earth) is a solution. Especially when we couldn’t wait to run Delgado out of town and wanted to buy him out for hitting .230, with 10HR at one point. Compared to Juan Rivera, Delgado looks like Pujols.
So, my post kind of did make sense. Juan Rivera is not the answer. I’d rather give up nothing and go with what we got, than trade for a guy batting .194 with lots of power in those 3 home runs (they went really far) . At this point, Tatis looks like a much better option. But we can agree to disagree.
I think I should get a dime for that.
Here’s a quarter, for what it’s worth.
… just don’t spend it on Bonds.
I think Bonds would be worth a quarter.
Just a hunch, but I think if Tatis plays everyday, he’ll slug 10 HR’s with 40 ribbies in the 2nd half.
And really the only other OFer who can match that is Holliday and Dunn.
Since they seem out of the picture, we should stick with Tatis, thats assuming that Church returns in a reasonable time frame.
I respect your hunch. You use the force.
Did you just put Mike Carp and Fernando Martinez on equal prospect ground?
nope. i think he was saying that it will either be a package centered around fmart…OR a package around carp, niese, and another prospect.
i say no to both. and to drugs. sign bonds.
oh sweet irony…
What about bringing Jay Payton back???
ugh…i’d rather drink the still water that sits in random areas of the stadium through a straw.
That is quite a statement!
LMAO!!!!!
Glad you enjoyed it. Jay Payton sucks. He sucked when he was a Met too. Over-hyped steroid user.
Wow…why the venom for Jay Payton? Payton was and is a solid, if extremely streaky, player. For cheap he’d fill in well.
Btw - How crazy is it that Payton and Hampton are the only two players who played in the 2000 WS for the Mets still active (unless Timo is still kicking around someplace)? And that’s using the term loosely for Hampton.
Was never enamored with Jay Payton. There are about 55 outfielders I would rather have.
I still can’t shake that image of him passing second on a routine fly ball and then cutting across the field to get back to first without touching second again
Well, along with Piazza and Zeile, he was one of 3 players to show up for the 2000 World Series. That’s what I remember.
Jay Payton owes me $10, the jerk.
Always ‘09 - So Payton, the jerk-steroid-user is no good, but bring in Bonds, because he is a nice guy and plays it clean….is that a joke?
TBlz:
At least Bonds the cheating jerk is an awesome ballplayer.
Dave27:
Actually, it’s Payton, Hampton, and Glendon Rusch, currently in the rotation for the Colorado Rockies.
BRING IN BONDS!
Bonds is “clear”-ly the solution. Obviously the “cream” of the crop.
Maybe this is the answer after all? Bonds would take all the media pressure off of everyone else. He could play the of and he would generate a ton of walks. Just stick Bonds in the #4 hole and wow.
Reyes
Castillo
Wright
Bonds
Beltran
Tatis
Delgado
Catcher
Pitcher
just stick bonds in left field and wow, every pitcher’s ERA goes up a run/game
Why is virtually every post that includes a proposed lineup in some way fundamentally flawed?
I think the “Bonds would take the media pressure off of everyone else” is the silliest thing I’ve ever heard. It’d make no sense if Bonds was a go-to guy. Add in the media loathes him, and he loathes them, and they don’t want to ever have to talk to them…how is he deflecting attention? Bonds is going to engage the reporters so Beltran doesn’t have to? Are we talking about the same guy?
Could we please STOP WITH BONDS! Suggesting Barry Bonds for the Mets is the same as posting “I don’t know anything about baseball.”
He won’t help this team. He’s old, gimpy, can’t play defense and will do everything in the clubhouse BUT deflect attention. Stop. Please.
I don’t know anything about baseball.
Haha. Bottom line is a move has to be made. Not going to panic or anything, but they need another legitimate bat. Where does that bat need to play? The outfield. Forget Kenny Lofton, we already have Endy, Castillo, and Schneider with zero power. If you don’t want to gut the farm, the why not Bonds?
I think thre’s a happy medium between gutting the farm and Barry Bonds. We don’t really even have a farm to gut.
“I believe Nady would likely cost a package including Mike Carp or Fernando Martinez, Jon Neise and probably another pitching prospect.”
I hate it when you speculate on what it would take to get a player. You have no idea how Pittsburgh values our minor leaguers. They might be thrilled to get FMart and here you are throwing in Niese and someone else! You’re just making wild guesses.
Nady isn’t worth getting rid of F-Mart even if that was all Pitt demanded of us.
F-Mart has had his injury problems, but the Mets have invested a lot in this guy who’s still a teenager and anyone who watched spring training games know his bat potential is real.
Anyone who watched spring training from 1995 thru 1998 was awaiting for the real potential from Butch Huskey’s bat too.
Fernando Martinez might not be worth trading at the moment, but he also has done a big fat goose egg thus far, so people should stop expecting his arrival as the second coming.
Bad comparison. Butch Huskey was never hyped to the degree F-Mart has been and was viewed as a one dimensional power hitter.
To say martinez has done nothing is another bad statement. He’s had a very good spring and is having a decent year at AA, which was unfurtunately interrupted by another injury.
In his defense, he says “I believe…” Besides, all he is doing is identifying that it should cost more than 1 prospect and then naming all of the prospects on our team that aren’t terrible
So should nobody talk about possible trades because we don’t know exactly what other teams are thinking? Maybe Matt or some people are undervaluing our prospects, but it’s far more common on this forum for people to *overvalue* them. People suggest trades all the time sending our detritus in exchange for valuable commodities. I don’t think Nady is worth what Matt seems to think would be required, but at least he’s trying to be realistic.
probably why he started the sentence with “I BELIEVE”
and dude is a blogger…what the hell else is he supposed to do besides speculate?
I’d rather he stuck to facts.
If someone from Pittsburgh hears him spout this nonsense on SNY they might actually think they could get those players for Nady.
Riiiiiight because if I’m a GM I’m going straight to a Blogger’s TV spot to get the behind-the-scenes scoop on the Mets front office.
Also, stuck to facts on possible trades? Should every blog posting be “UPDATE: Mets have not made trade. They may do so, however they may also not. Too early to tell.”
That’d keep ME coming back for more, I’ll tell ya what…
What about Jose Guillen from the Royals. I know he is making pretty decent money this year (not sure about his future contract situation) and KC is going nowhere. He is a headcase, but can sure rake.
I dont know if Guillen has the temperment to play in NY. I can see him going off on the media after a bad game or two.
I think Jose Guillen is a possible solution. Putting up really good numbers.
They shelled a lotta money for Guillen. They wont trade him for garbage (which is what I’m sure most of your hypothetical packages would include on the Mets part).
The fact that they shelled otu a lot of money for Guillen tells me they are more likely to trade him for garbage before they have to actually pay out that money.
Two prospects and cash.
It’s interesting — Guillen has played almost his whole career with bad teams, most of them lacking a manager with the strength and security to keep him in line. I wonder whether he could be disciplined a bit by Manuel and the Mets’ veterans. Unfortunately, he did play for the Angels and they had to axe him before the postseason. I thought that was an incredibly strong and gutsy move by Scioscia and the Angels, but it does suggest that even a good team is going to find itself better off without Guillen than with him.
It seems kind of sad when the market for an outfielder is that tight.
I guess it is a good thing for baseball, as so many teams are still in the hunt and don’t want to give up on players.
If the prices for these average-good players is so high, then why should we give up anything for players who will be no more valuable than endy, pagan, tatis, f-mart, nixon or any of the other Met’s bench/minor league players in the outfield?
I say give Nixon a chance to play RF until Church comes back. Tatis, Beltran and Nixon doesnt look all that bad.
id rather have chavez be in there every day, because he at least provides gold glove defense. let tatis pagan and nixon split the other spot. maybe easley too if the mets insist on trotting castillo out there again (ugh)
Chavez is hot right now and when he regresses back to his norm he is not a player you want starting every day. He’s great to start occasionally, play the later innings as a defensive replacement, pinch run, and pinch hit in a small-ball situation. Lets all hope Church comes back healthy and that Beltran remains healthy too.
he started a lot in 06 and had his best season ever.
Beltran, Nixon, and Tatis/Chavez doesn’t look bad. It looks like a good lineup for a 3rd place team…especially when 2B and C are black holes.
Tatis Beltran and Nixon doesn’t look all that bad? Can i borrow those rose-colored glasses when you’re done with them?
I can live with them. There is no way they will give up Fmart for a marginal outfielder after refusing to give him up for arguably the best pitcher in the game. That being said it would probably cost them 2 or 3 other prospects. So you have to weigh the potential upgrade over what we have vs giving up another chunk of the farm.
To me, it’s not worth it…
I’m not saying give up the farm — or anyone — for mediocrity, but to say an outfield with Tatis and Nixon in it doesn’t look that bad is absurd.
Just because there’s no obvious solution, doesn’t mean there’s not a problem.
I think we ride out Tatis and Endy until they stop hitting, which may not happen — what if Tatis is back to the form he had prior to his multiple injuries? Maybe it was not steroids. Endy is a 4th OFer, but Pagan is coming back soon. If Church makes it back, this OF could piece it together untiL FMart is ready in a couple months. Omar said if he didn’t miss 60 games last year he’d be up now, so does that mean in 60 games he will be manning LF for the Mets? If so, I think we bridge it to him and only get another OFer if in the next two weeks we hear news on Church for the worse.
Bernazard said that, not Omar. And I think he’s referring to development time over last year and this. It’s not just 60 games and you’re set. It’s learn as an 18 year old, apply those lessons as a 19 year old and learn new ones.
19 is awfully young to be playing in the big leagues.
I would think that Tatis was on the roids when he had was hitting.
In 1999 he hit .298 with 34hrs and 107rbis in 537abs in 149 games. He hasnt come close to any of those numbers since and he disspeared from the game for a couple of years.
I would add that Rivera has struggled to regain his 2006 form….just like the Mets.
Match made in heaven?
rimshot
This is where Omar needs to go back to his roots. Time to pull off one of those out of LF trades that no one saw coming.
Rivera might be that type of deal. As long as he comes cheap (player wise), and the Angels should be hapy to free up a roster spot and clear some salary.
Or, he can get some guy that no one is expecting (or maybe no one heard of).
The package associated with Nady seems way too hig, given the Mets holes to fill this off season especially. Now, getting the next nady (like when they got him the 1st time) could work out a lot better!
Idelly, if they give up value, they get back someone that can plug the LF or 1B hole in 2009 as the every day guy. If not, and they go for a rental, it has to be cheap in prospects.
Rivera just might get a 2nd win coming to the NL, and getting some real PT. Heck, Tatis is hitting .300+ now, so there must be something good in the fetid water pouring out of the broken pipes at Shea!
I actually blogged about this yesterday, and I called the notion of sending Heilman to the Pirates unrealistic and illogical.
First of all the only reason they may trade Nady is because he is arbitration eligible. The last thing they would trade him for is another arbitration eligible player like Heilman who is expected to command $3 million dollars next season.
Second of all, the only speculation driving the availability of Nady has come from blogs and there has been no indication from anyone on the Pirates that Nady is even available.
Third, Jon Heyman is windbag full of hot air. Over a hundred of his illogical rumors have been wrong and are never based on any reality or inside information. He likes to make some believe he has a red phone on every GM’s desk but he is so full of you know what! Most of the stuff he says that comes to fruition are actual fact based rumors he reads from other beat writers and fails to credit them. That’s Jon Heyman.
That is a horrible assessment of Dunn.
I agree, Dunn does strike out a lot but to say “occasionally walks” is an understatement. The guy has an OBP of .382, he’s slugging .524 and he’s also got 24 home runs this season. Now, I do imagine getting frustrated over watching him strike out so much (assuming he comes to the Mets of course). But its no better than a guy who grounds out or flies out a lot. In the end an out is an out.
Although, he is pretty bad in the outfield.
I’m with you on this. A strike out is only marginally worse than any other out. Who cares? I’d love for him to be near the top of this line up.
Wrong! A fly ouy can score somebody from third, a ground out can advance a runner, a strikeout does nothing. Stay away from Dunn, Shea is not the place for a guy who just hits home runs.
Bonds gets on base. Period. At 42 he had a OBP of .480?!!! That’s just sick, that practically 1 out of every 2 plate appearances, he’s on base!!!!
Please at least talk to the man. If he want 8 mil then ok, but at least talk to him, what could it hurt?
On the strikeout vs. ground out/fly out, you also have to note that Adam Dunn grounds into a double play at the same rate that I have one night stands with Victoria’s Secret Models.
…about once yearly ;)
@JSC1968
That’s why I said a strike out is marginally worse–because you’re right, there isn’t the potential for a runner to be advanced in a fly out or ground out. Still, an out is an out, and I think Dunn’s peripherals more than make up for his many strike outs.
As for Bonds…I know this sounds stupidly conspiratorial, but you have to get the feeling that he’s simply been blacklisted by baseball. His agent has come out and said that not one team has inquired about Bonds. For him not even to get a question from any of the teams seems strange to me.
I really don’t know why we wouldn’t want the Apathetic Strikeout Machine hitting behind the Teenage Hitting Machine at Citi Field for years to come.
Can strikeouts be frustrating? Sure. But it’s not a double play. Productive outs are generally overrated in traditionalist circles. A guy who is on base 40% of the time and hits 40 home runs a year has a place on my team every day.
I also really think it’s a bit lazy to use that Ricciardi line about Dunn as a “word around baseball” generalization
“productive outs are generally overrated in traditionalist circles”
Is that “gem” from the circle of Jeromy Burnitz, Mo Vaughn, and Mike Cameron?
Could be.
Have you ever seen a run expectancy matrix?
Yes, and I saw the sequels too. Keanu is really not as bad as people say.
No on Dunn. No defense, beat to first by a tectonic plate, strikes out a ton, would end up in myriad double plays, price too high. I’m happier with the OF-by-committee approach.
I would do some research on that double play comment. He’s one of the best in the league when it comes to avoiding DPs.
He very rarely hits into DP’s. Where do you get these numbers?
he did say “would end up in…” Perhaps he feels he would add to his deficiencies upon joining the mets
I’ll gladly remove the DP component. Yeah, a K is usually better than a DP, and a walk better than both. I’d prefer a hit, though.
Nice to see someone actually retract a statement…but um…a K is “usually” better than a DP?
What instances occur that make 2 outs better than 1?
I am on the other side, I want Dunn.
However, if there is 1st and 3rd and no outs and a tie game in the bottom of the 9th then a DP is better than a SO, if the runner scores. LOL>
Well, if you have a tie game and it’s first and third, with no one out, a slow guy coming up next, etc. — I’d take the DP if a run comes in. Which is sort of like what MetsGuy said, although a club going for the 6-4-3 in that situation would be kind of brain dead.
So the answer is, we have no legitimate options. This is why a deep farm system is so vital to a team’s success.
Yes. A strong farm is a key to prolonged success.
Forget about Church and his ongoing head issues. Until that is resolved, Church is out of the equation. As long as the Mets don’t try to give Lofton a Mets uniform, then I am fine that Bonds does not come. Juan Rivera looks like a good option as he can spell Carlos Delgado at first base, PLUS - he can take over first base in 2009 while having Carp and Evans at Triple-A. Other options: Nelson Cruz (Texas Rangers, Triple-A); Franklin Gutierrez (Cleveland); Marcus Thames (Detroit); or one of Oakland’s young outfield studs - Carlos Gonzalez or Ryan Sweeney. These are just names I am throwing out there after navigating the MLB team sites and look at the outfielders on each team. For now, the Mets will have to do with Chavez/Evans, Beltran, Tatis and Anderson/Easley chipping in as well while they can yo-yo Chris Aguila all they want.
I would absolutely love Thames, but the Tigers would be crazy to deal him, especially since they think they’ll be in the thick of the playoff race in the Central. We don’t really have any pieces that could help a contender.
If what Matt’s sources says is true and mets would prefer to get a bloated contract so they dont have to give up much, how about O’s DH/RF/1B aubrey huff?
the guy is having a great year offensively, but the o’s hate his contract. i have read elsewhere that a midlevel prospect and cash might be all it takes.
the guy hits around .285, has power, gets ribbies, and would be a solid righthanded hitter for the #5 spot and an excellent #6 hitter if church comes back.
the negative is he;s weak defensively in the outfield. i dont think to the point he’d be a liability, but he wont help either. he can be moved to 1b in 09 if the mets fail to get texeira.
i think carp and cash could be all it takes.
They can have a fish called a carp and cash for Huff, and maybe Val Passucci.
Texiera is more likely to end up in the Bronx or in Boston than here in Queens. I would guess that the Mets will pick up Delgados option for next year. He is crushing the ball right now and maybe just maybe he has turned the corner.
i can tell you this….there is 0 chance the mets pick up delgado’s option. 0
Huff bats Left
I likes it!
We need a bigger bat than Rivera.
No, no, Rivera is good. Rivera hitting .194 is less of a teller than his career numbers in the majors and minors…
Riveras Career Majors: .287 avg, .336 obp, .467 slg
Riveras Career Minors: .294 avg, .345 obp, .471 slg
in a combined over 4000 ABs.
So basically what that tells you is that you know what you’re going to get with him, and its very solid. He hits lefties and righties the same and has a very strong and underrated arm. Getting Rivera I think would be absolutely perfect for the mets. He will drive in runs, provide good consistent defense, and to be honest he kind of reminds me of a right handed Churchy (minus the concussions).
And I know it’s been talked about before but I love getting someone like Rivera because he will be our permanent starting corner outfielder and that therefore stregthens our bench a lot. All of a sudden we have endy who can pinch run, pinch bunt, and be a great defensive outfielder. Pagan who can pinch hit as a switch hitter and play good defense. Tatis who can give us decent enough defense but be a good pinch hitter… Ok mets.
Lets keep the winning most importantly :)
Come on Ollie!
Like I’ve said, I would rather go with what we have than bring in a guy like Rivera. Doesn’t move me. If you want a long term solution in a corner outfield spot, you gotta think bigger than that.
Anyone think San Diego would be a decent match? They’re retooling and Giles is entering his free agent year. I know he’s ancient but he’s still getting on base at .394.
A really cheap option (free agent next year too) might be Luke Scott of the Orioles. I think it would take less to get him than Huff like someone mentioned above.
i dont know why they would want to part with luke scott. the kid is just starting to come into his own.
He’s a free agent next year though right? He’ll be 31 and has no ties to Baltimore or the organization so I figured he’d just follow the money and go to the highest bidder–which I doubt will be the O’s. I think if they could get something for him, they’d pull the trigger.
”kid ”? luke scott is 30 yrs old.
I say let Tatis and Chavez play.
Why give up a prospect like Martinez.
Wait the season out and we can bring up F-Mart next year.
Tatis/Chavez seem to be working out well so far….
Even if we give the majority of playing time to tatis and Chavez we still need to improve the bench
What about Ty Wiggy from Houston. Strong RH bat,knows NY, can play 1B,corner OF as well as 2Band 3B.
Houston is out of it and he could not cost too much.
Well, all of a sudden this isn’t a “wait out the rest of the season” team…it’s sorta a double edged sword, because now they are catching a little fire and this division has been so mediocre that the Mets could play poorly (really averagely, but based on their PECOTA, I’ll say poorly) and get within 1 1/2 with a little win streak. They are DEFINITELY not out of this one and if the Phils are unsuccessful with finding another starting pitcher we could move into the first place spot in the next few weeks.
All of that being said, as much as I love what Tatis and Chavez have been doing, smart money says they probably aren’t going to keep it up for the next 80 games…I don’t want to deplete our farm system anymore but the Mets are going to need to add a bat to this lineup to avoid regressing to the kind of performance that got Willie fired.
I’m far from a fan, but sign bonds. We don’t lose anything, and ya know what? if it turns out to be a mistake DESIGNATE HIM TO ASSIGNMENT. There’s already been talk that he’d take the league minimum in pay, and if that’s the case, who cares if the Mets throw a couple thousand at a rental?
I believe now is probably the best time to deal a guy like Mike Carp
I love how we’re calling Juan Rivera a 1b-OF, when he’s only played in one game at 1b in his career, yet Carp is basically written off as unable to play the position.
If Omar thinks he can get Dunn for less than F-Mart, let’s pull the trigger. Sit back and enjoy his career 130 OPS+. Remember, if he’s striking out, he’s not hitting into double plays.
or hitting balls into the parking lot.
Dunn “occasionally” walks?
Here are Dunn’s ranks in walks the last few years:
2002 - 128 -3rd NL
2004 - 108 - 6th NL
2005 - 114 - 3rd NL
2006 - 112- 2nd NL
2007 - 101 - 5th NL
2008 - 69 - 1st NL
He just occasionally walks more than 99% of the league every year.
But so does Mr Bonds
2002 - 198
2003 - 148
2004 - 232!!!
2006 - 115
2007 - 132
The reason I am against Bonds is that its my impression that his defense is non-existant, whereas dunn is just bad. Bad is fine by me, unable to field, that seems risky.
Also I am tired of aging veterans. Dunn is only 28. I would be fine with seeing Dunn given a 4 or 5 year extension. The guy is going to the hall of fame.
Bonds? Dunn is NOT going to the Hall of Fame.
I’m actually shocked that your post actually made it to publication. The only way that should be published is if it were part of Borat’s NOT jokes.
“Dunn is going to the Hall of Fame pause not”
“Dunn is NOT going to the Hall of Fame”
He is still young, it remains to be seen. The guy baring injury will finish his career with around 600 HR and an .900 OPS.
Adam Dunn’s walks are more than “occasional.” They are consistent and in huge numbers. His OBP is .382 and his career OBP is .381. He’s on pace to hit 40 homers for the fifth consecutive year. Stick him behind Beltran and Delgado and those guys will get a lot more pitches to hit. Dunn’s defense is lousy, but that is also the case with Ibanez, and Nady isn’t great either. Dunn is the only guy on that list who would have a major impact on the offense.
I have no idea why he is getting a bad rep for attitude. Maybe it’s because he’s tired of losing with the Reds? He’s at least worth inquiring about.
Because, Seth, strikeouts are an indication of a man’s heart, don’t you know that? Statistics be damned! Adam Dunn is a faker phony McStrikeoutMachine, who has no heart and hates the game of baseball.
Take a guy like Eckstein… his heart is huge. He rarely strikes out, plus he looks like he’s putting every ounce of energy in his tiny elfin body by throwing from SS to first. That means he tries and hustles! That’s what we need!
(channelling MajorLeagueSarcasm/Ken Tremendous)
How many posts that follow this tired, humorless model do we have to endure from stat-heads? We get it. You don’t like Eckstein.
Hey, how are those Reds doing with the majestic Adam Dunn leading the attack?
Because Dunn is single-handedly responsible for leading the Reds to the playoffs?
Seriously, though, toomanyuniforms, show me a guy in the Mets lineup right now that is putting up anywhere near the power numbers of Dunn.
You can argue he is not worth emptying the minor league system for.
You can argue that his defense isn’t great and that he’s slow.
You cannot argue that his power and OBP would dramatically increase the potency of the Mets lineup.
You can’t even argue that he is slow. Watch some of their games, look at his stats. He has decent speed for his size.
Chavez = Timo Perez
Tatis = Benny Agbayani
And thats with Beltran in CF instead of Jay Payton….
this team is def winning the WS this year. No need to make a move!
It would have been a totally different ws in 2000 if Perez ran out what he thought was a HR in game 1………Ugh!!
Dunn has an OPS over .900, again. That seems like actual results to me, and the reason why he has name recognition. If Church isn’t going to come back, the bat Dunn has might outweigh his lack of a glove at this point.
Not with our starters pitch counts stratospheric and our bullpen always a couple pitches away from blowing it. I’ll take the outs, thanks.
Batting average counts when you have RISP. Dunn’s average in such situations sucks pre-Ruthian dead balls (but indeed, it always sucks.) So, the solution is to hit him “high in our order”??? When, second? First? Holy station-to-station.
You are a moron. BA is far less relevant then the OBP of those in front of him. Of course his RBIs seem low, the guy ahead of him has a .320 OBP!
If BA and RBIs were that closely linked, please explain Wright’s season. His BA is mediocre but he is wracking up RBIs.
Or even Delgado who has still manged to get 50. I guess that has nothing to do with Wright and Beltran batting in front of him with high OBP>
You can’t hurt a team by puting a hitter with a .905 OPS in it. END OF STORY.
BA with runners in scoring position, you blithering idiot.
That is a terrible stat to use. I mean come on. Castillo leads the team in that category. I guess you woudl rather have him up instead of Dunn. LOL.
Again he is not that slow. And look at his run production numbers, and that’s with the Reds.
We are not saying he is a baseball god but he is a very good player and a guy that would help this lineup tremendously. For all the people that continue to mention that Beltran is not a cleanup hitter, and you are prob. one of them, we sure are defensive when we mention getting one.
matt, i disagree with you on adam dunn. i’ve read buzz that says the reds may refuse to offer him arbitration which would forfeit their right to compensatory draft picks.
also, he is awesome.
Dunn is not awesome, and he has mostly warning track power when you take him out of the NL Central.
Stats indicate otherwise when concerned of his awesomeness.
It is a lot easier to hit bombs in that park than it is in shea but im sure he would be able to crush some pitches
He has only hit 22 less HR on the road in his career than at home.
Also this year;
HR @ home - 13
HR @ road - 11
His SLG% and OBP are higher on the road as well.
Warning track power??? Hahahahaha.
Dunn may not always make contact, but he hits tape-measure HR’s. Did you see him last night? I mean, wow, wow, wow, wow - WELL out of Wrigley and on to the street.
I know he hits his share of bombs. But his 40 homer totals are a product of playing in small ballparks at home, Chicago and Houston on a regular basis.
And yes he walks, but it proves little help as he cant run the bases without a tour guide and mostly gets stranded and slows up the offense.
take a deeper look at his stats and you will see that his RBI production is ghastly for someone who hit so many home runs, and his run production is terrible for someone who gets on base as much as he does. Not to mention how many runs his nonexistent defense helps the other team score.
His production is hollow, you have to see past the gaudy numbers and actually look at his lack of production.
He is better than Delgado, but not by much. And he is worse than Tatis in the OF.
Do you have any numbers to back this assertion up?
Don’t change your argument, fool. You said “warning track power.” All I said was that his power is decidedly above warning-track range - he hits bombs. Take it or leave it, but don’t change your argument.
they arent stats that are kept, but if you do some simple division you can see how he compares to others.
RBI / Hits
RBI / HR
Runs/Hits+BB
they expose his lack of production.
Umm…………..so then there must be a reason sites like Baseball Prospectus and The Hardball Time don’t keep track of those.
Also, all of those stats you posted are awful and meaningless.
You know how ESPN always uses modified stats for sensationalism - like “this guy is hitting .900 on day games after night games, when batting third and hitting against pitchers with the letter ‘q’ in their name”?
It’s pretty easy to manipulate stats to say anything you want. The reason BP doesn’t care about RBI/H is because it doesn’t mean much.
It would be helpful to this discussion if we could look at stats that take ballpark effects into consideration there are plenty of sabermetric websites that do that. Dunn’ OPS+ is 130 (average OPS+ = 100). His OPS+ in 2008 is 133. Baseball Prospectus gives Dunn an lifetime EQA of .301 (average EQA =.260). His EQA in 2008 is .310. These are stats that adjust for ballpark-effects. So even if’s true that Dunn’s stats are inflated by playing in a lot of hitters parks, he still puts up awesome numbers.
I agree that Dunn is a bad defenisve player, but his bat more than makes up for it.
j_k
that is exactly what warning track power is, imo.
He isnt going to lose all of his home runs, no one does. So his tape measure shots would get out of all parks, but his homers that are 10-15 rows deep in Cincinnati would die on the warning track if he played his home games at Shea. And that is a significant portion of his homers. Hence my opinion.
you are wildly overrating the size difference between GABP and shea. GABP is 370 to right center and 325 down the line, shea is 371 to right center and 338 down the line. also, dunn will be playing in shea for less than a half season and no one really understands how citi will play.
honestly, you are pretty much wrong all around, and you’re making me sad.
LOL
Nate, was your comment about “playing in the NL Central” due to the pitching staffs or the ballparks?
Dunn’s average home run length is 82 miles*. He’s a 40-HR guy no matter where he plays.
*may not be accurate
you’re so wrong you should be arrested.
wow, you dont understand stats very well do you…
Nate… seriously, are you using “RBI Production” to help your case?
Is this Dusty Baker?
Nothing wrong with that. If I have a runner in scoring position, is it better to get (a) a walk, (b) a single (c) a double.
Well, (c) is the best, obviously, because you’re putting the next guy in scoring position. But if you’re glacially slow, like Dunn, you’re probably not scoring on a lot of singles, and the .
Meanwhile, (b) a single with a guy in scoring position is a lot better than (a), a walk. Dunn’s .211!!!! with RISP is Not Good, no matter how much the walks and the odd HR might improve the “OPS.”
-refore the advantage is lessened.
RBI / Hits
RBI / HR
Runs/Hits+BB
Shows his lack of production? I think it shows his teammates inability to get on base. You can’t get an RBI with no one on (solo HR excluded, of course). And its pretty hard to score a run when no one else on your team is hitting.
RBI/Hits is really a way to get at RISP average with a bit of slugging in there as well, but it’s got to be corrected for his opportunities, yeah.
Toomanyuniforms, I understand your point. But you’re assuming that those are the only three options in a Dunn at-bat. Let’s expand the list to include:
d) a fly ball/ground ball to advance the runner (if <2 outs);
e) a strikeout or other out that does not advance the runner;
f) a lineout double play
In that context, I’ll take an infinite number of walks over D, E or F.
Where do people get that Dunn is slow? The guy has AVERAGE speed. He even had 19 SB one season and continues to get between 7-10. That and the Reds dont’ steal many bases. He was 4th on the team. Who knows for the Mets he might put up 20.
the irony is murdering me
call the stat police!
you must be kidding? warning track power? this guy can hit the ball out of any mlb park without a doubt. have you ever seen this guy swat one?
the Mets would be smart to include a Delgado for Helton swap in a trade for Holliday. This would give Colorado salary relief for next year and forward, and it wouldnt cost the Mets as much in prospects and actually increase production at 1B. Kind of an NBA approach to the trade, but makes sense with these smaller spending teams.
Helton’s contract is awful (57 mil for the next 3 years) and Helton would clog 1B for 3 years, but it might be worth it to get Holliday and keep some prospects.
Doesnt Helton have horrible numbers away from Coors field also?
Helton has horrible numbers
away from Coors field also. End of sentence.yea his .880 and .925 OPS numbers the last two years sure are horrible. Especially compared to that beast we have at 1B currently.
And now he can’t even get on the field. His contract is absolutely terrible. It’s just not worth it to get Holliday. Think of how much money it would cost as Holliday is due for a raise as well. You are talking over 30 million. No pitching for us I guess.
Although Helton could bat 2nd.
keep in mind the point of the trade is to get Holliday! Helton is what you have to take in return to make it happen. and Helton is still better than Degado for now.
While it would be nice to upgrade the outfield, you can’t be thinking solely about this year. While the Mets find themselves in the thick of a divisional race right now, should they actually find themselves in the playoffs, their realistic chances of challenging any of the teams in the central is minimal.
Mets need to make moves that are going to improve or at least not hurt for 2009.
Anyone who thinks spending a dime in prospects on a sub .800 OPS OF is on crack. As is anyone who would rather have Nady over Dunn.
Getting Dunn would be amazing.
Absolutely - people are sheep. Ricciardi makes one stupid comment and everyone thinks he has some inside info about Dunn. Even if he were apathetic, his numbers speak for themselves.
Adam Dunn stats from 2005-2008
2005 - .247, 40Hr’s, 101 Rbis, 114 walks
2006 - .234, 40Hr’s, 92 Rbis, 112 walks
2007 - .264, 40Hr’s, 106 Rbis, 101 walks
2008 - .226, 24Hr’s, 54 Rbis, 69 walks
Those batting averages hurt my eyes but the other number make up for it.
Don’t forget runs scored. Dunn would give us a third player (with Beltran and Wright) who averages 100RBI and 100R/season, along with the 40 bombs.
People - 40 - let’s put this in perspective. Adam Dunn, in the last four years, has TWICE AS MANY SEASONS WITH 40 HOMERUNS AS EVERY SEASON FOR EVERY SINGLE MET IN HISTORY PUT TOGETHER.
If you don’t think he brings something to this team - you’re insane.
Agreed. He would be perfect for this lineup. A guy that would be worth 3 AA guys not named Fmart.
but for every homer he loses (and it will be many) he loses both a run scored and ~2 RBI. Thats a serious expected drop off in production.
because runs scored and RBI have absolutely nothing to do with the joke of an offense he has around him, right?
Nate, you are a moron. OPS+ is park adjusted. The guy hits for power EVERYWHERE. I will gladly pay big for a guy with high OBP and 35+ HR power.
Just stop looking at BA. It is a worthless meaningless stat.
i don’t agree with the name calling but nate you are just shockingly and belligerently wrong.
And that’s playing for the Reds with crap ahead and behind him.
You forgot to mention the amount of runs scored too. If you put him in a lineup with Reyes, Wright and Beltran the guy would put up monster numbers.
Reyes, Church, Wright, Dunn, Beltran, Easley, Delgado, Castro/Schneider would be a run producing lineup for sure.
Hmmmm he looks like a real decent fit now what would it take to get him?
It seems like Heilman, a AA bat, and a minor league pitcher.
Interestingly, a lot of these deals have “throw ins” from both teams - and I wonder if Krivsky could pluck a few gems from the Reds as throw ins. Homer Bailey, for instance, has fallen completely out of favor.
I have no idea but guessing it would take 3 AA guys. Something like Evans, Carp and a pitcher.
The choice is clear: Let’s ride this Donkey to the World Series!
David Kingman????
Had a friggin .300 OBP compared to Dunn’s near .400. Not the same player by far.
I’d take a shot on Juan Rivera. Buy low (and cheap) and hope he gets back to 2004-2006 levels.
The object of buying low is assuming the “low” that you bought is going to get “high”. Unfortunately, Juan Rivera is probably at his ceiling. Wonder what the floor is.
My guess: Marlon Byrd or Emil Brown. Brown this season.245/7/45
Why would the mets go after either of those guys? They don’t provide any upgrade over the bench players the mets are throwing out there today.
For now. You can’t expect Tatis to continue to swing the way he has. He MIGHT, but you should not count on it. You can bring in a lower guy to take Evans or Augila’s spot and not lose any of the bench guys.
I’m not saying they’ll be starting, but both of these guys are at least a defensive upgrade (over Tatis), and frankly the Mets need numbers in the outfield.
A: Get Dunn and Rivera
B: Get Morales and Rivera
C: Get Ibanez and Rivera
I think it needs to be more than one move, especially with Church a question mark.
All of the guys I listed can play OF and 1B and give LH RH platoon situations too.
None of these guys should cost Fmart or any of our top prospects.
For Dunn I am guessing the Reds want quantity instead of quality. Something like 3 minor league guys 1 of them being one of the super AA guys not named Fmart and one of them being a decent pitcher.
For Rivera and Morales the Angels are trying to win so they will want pieces for this season. Maybe Show, Muniz and a prospect.
For Ibanez it should not take more than what we gave for Castillo last season.
yup, rivera should be an automatic move. if not him, sexson. delgado is hitting now but it would be foolish to count on him not to slip back.
also, omar clearly has to be on the hook for this outfield mess, right? with alou predictably contributing nothing, and his complete bungling of the church situation, how can he not be held accountable?
One the Alou mess was expected but not to this extent. I think he expected about 100 games and Endy and Pagan taking up the slack. Not a bad plan considering our options and not wanting to block Fmart.
As for the Church situation, only someone who has never dealt with concussions would say this was bungled. You can’t tell how bad a situation it is until you keep puting them out there. Sometimes it takes weeks for a symptom to show up and sometimes its even mental. Church’s is obviously not but I have seen it happen before.
The real judge of Omar will be this offseason as to me it looks like he had it setup all along to get younger right before moving in to the new park.
did omar send him to at least three different neurologists that specialize in post concussion diagnosis and care?
because i missed that post.
Sure, it’s Omar’s fault that a baseball player suffered two concussions in one season while playing baseball. It is also his fault that Alou (a bargain at $8MM…taking taht option was a no brainer) gets hurt pissing on his hands.
People need to wake up. Our bench would be really strong if our bench players were playing on the bench.
and our bench players would be on the bench if our starters were on the field.
Why is the #1 question “Who should we blame”? I’m more interested in what we do *now*.
judging from this thread, it’s like question #17.
Either way we should get Rivera. It’s a classic buy low move. I would not be suprised if he returned to form getting everyday playing time and was our LF next season.
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They only think he won’t bring actual results because many people “around baseball” still have no clue what they’re talking about. An OBP of .382 and a .523 slugging percentage…but oh no, he strikes out! And look at that batting average!
Of course the strikeouts are a minus (I think some people who rely on the more sabermetric stats sometimes forget this and claim Dunn is better than he actually is), and he’s not going to benefit us in the field. He’s not a great player, but he is a good one because he gets on base and mashes the heck out of the ball. Also, I love the “occasionally walks” line - he leads the NL in walks, so I guess nobody walks more than occasionally. He’s far from perfect, but he’s clearly underrated by most baseball people.
That all said, Nady is probably just as good an option (the way he’s hitting this year, mayer even better!) and might come cheaper - so I’m on board with that one.
<>
This is a common misunderstanding of the “law of averages.” Nobody is ever likely to “make up” for a bad start. What does happen is that they’re likely to play like themselves going forward - effectively making short hot/cold/whatever streaks little more than statistical blips that don’t effect long term results much - which, if Rivera is really still a good player, would still be a good upgrade for us. And given how little he’s played in the last two years, and that he’s still in his prime, I wouldn’t be shocked to see him put up decent (maybe even better than average?) numbers if he played full time. I mean, his supposed “struggles” are over less than 120 plate appearances…that’s nothing compared to the three years of solid performances he put up before that.
Wow, I really failed at quoting properly. :) The first part of my comment replied to this: “What’s more, the word around baseball paints Dunn as an apathetic strike-out machine, who, while he occasionally walks, is more or less useless in the field, and so he will bring more in name recognition than actual results.”
While the second part (the Rivera stuff) was replying to a post that he was likely to get hot because he’s been playing badly lately. In any case, I think any of Dunn, Nady, or Rivera would make good pickups - Dunn or Nady being clearly the best two options.
ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ
seriously dude, you need to self-edit. i skipped right over whatever you said
This is great. I love it when guys who study spreadsheets refer to “baseball people” derisively. Buddy, all Adam Dunn does is prove that “OPS” is an incomplete grade. He’s an aberration — the player who gives youa solid OPS and ABSOLUTELY NOTHING ELSE. Speed: none. Defense: none. Average: none. I’m not even getting to the Ricciardi issues. Is he the worst player ever, beloning in AAA with Val Pascucci? Of course not. Is he worth what he would likely cost the Mets? No.
Who cares how they get on base as long as they get on base? I don’t care if he sticks his hand out and catches the ball and gets a free trip each time. And as for speed, he averages 7-10 SB each year for the Reds, he’s not slow. His defense is AVERAGE not as bad as people make it out to be. I swear it’s like some of you refuse to look at any number other than BA.
It should read
Power: Exceptional
Patience: Exceptional
Contact: Poor
Speed: Average
Defense: Average
I agree. I might even go so far as to say that Dunn is a bit below average as a fielder, but I don’t think he’s terrible. He looks worse thant he is. And his speed is adequate — he’s one of those guys who can actually get moving a bit once he gets a little momentum.
I’m not sure he’s a NYC kind of guys, though. He looks like he should be playing in Nebraska.
I agree with you that OPS is not everything, but it’scertainly the most important aspect of a good offense.
I don’t think Dunn is as slow as his repuation suggests. He’s stolen 58 SB in 8 years, which is hardly the mark of somebody who’s another Ramon Castro. He’s not a good defensive player, but having Beltran in CF mitigates some of that.
Adam Dunn has power, but he reminds me of Cliff Floyd in a way. You feel like he can hit a home run at any time, but what about when all you need is a single to plate two? You never get it……and I love Floyd. Could play on my team any day. But, with the lack of 2 out hitting (until recently), I don’t know about a guy that strikes out this much and will rarely get you that clutch 2-run single.
But 40% of the time he will get on base and bring up Beltran. That’s not always a bad thing. With RISP just get on base and usually good things will happen.
Nady will cost MUCH more than Dunn. Nady is not a FA at the end of the season and is having the season of his career. Dunn is a FA and is having a subpar season for him. I don’t get why people keep missing this.
Nady will most likely cost you Fmart. Still want Nady?
What about Manny? His contract would seem to fit the bloated description. The Red Sox dumped Nomar and then went to the World Series that year, so I would not put it past them to dump Manny’s contract.
If it were not for the fact that Ortiz is out. Come on, no way that happens. NO MORE MANNY RUMORS, I am starting to have flashbacks.
Forget about the trades. Go raid the LI Ducks roster, and grab Carl Everett or Jay Gibbons. These guys are htting 321 and 307 respectively in the Independent League. Worth a flier.
I saw the Ducks last year with Carl Everett, Fonzie, Jose Offerman, and Ed Yarnell (it was like a Mets-Has-Been reunion) Put the those guys together and you still don’t have the equivalent of a major league player.
was bill pulsipher there too? the guy got married and now looks like trailer trash. with a gut.
I think Gibbons is worth a look. Everett is crazy. Like Tyson crazy. No thanks. Everett doesn’t believe Toronto’s NBA franchise exists.
Say yes to dinosaurs, say no to Everett.
We need to sign another guy to AA Binghamton named Fernando Martinez. Then trade Fernando Martinez for Nady. Problem solved…Next?
Adam Dunn….. Citizens Bank Park….. Thank You
I could only imagine what kind of bombs he would hit there for us. I think the Mets go back to Philly only one more time though. 8-26 and 8-27…..
Please elaborate. Are you saying Dunn is a product of Great American Ballpark? Or that we should get Dunn to prevent him from going to Philadelphia? I’m confused…
Never mind. I’m an idiot.
Crasnick just suggested Austin Kearns as a realistic option. Honestly, the guy makes $5 this year and I have to think the nationals would love to get rid of him, even if it’s within the division.
The guy has been banged up this year, but the upside is there.
Kearns is the guy Cincinnati preferred to trade away instead of Dunn. No thanks.
I’m not sure I follow your logic. By my estimation, Cincy hasn’t made a good baseball move since the Carter administration
stole my thunder by a minute and a half!!
Austin Kearns sucks.
isnt nady the guy who cost us the immortal v.diaz when nady was given his spot without the brass even giving diaz a chance in the competition? why would we want nady back after breakin so many knowledgable mets fans hearts? bring back diaz!
just kiddin there, but id prefer to not get an ex-met back. it will inevitably lead to people bein disappointed when the fans realize he wasnt exactly all that they remembered him to be.
Joel Sherman threw out Austin Kearns as food for thought. Looked over his stats and they suck this year, but years past the numbers have been slighty (very) above average. Maybe a change of scenery would fire him up a bit and cost the Mets very little. I’m not sure what his contract status is but he is making 5mil this year.
8 Million next year and a 10 million dollar club option with 1 million dollar buy out for next season. Decent defender but his not hit well since leaving the Reds.
too steep for a big question mark. Pass.
Mets most interested in Rivera? Big surprise.
People can say what they want Omar is obsessed with Latin players. He shows a clear bias.
You’re boring
Or the fact that the guy would cost almost nothing and has shown the abilty to hit. The guy is only 1 year removed from a .887 OPS over 450 AB’s.
If you do it now then he has a few weeks before the deadline to prove he can hit. If not then you put him in the minors for depth. It’s a no lose situation.
That’s a new one. Great insight.
It’s not that he favors buying low and hoping to get an undervalued player who can rebound, he just wants latinos.
He was probably just upset about a poor start yesterday from Juan Maine, and worried about Ryan Iglesia’s concussions.
and stupid.
Changing subjects real quick but has anyone else thought about the Santana CC matchup that could take place in Milwaukee at the beginning of sept??
OH MY GOD!!!….. no
Was thinking the same thing. Who looks that far ahead? How do you know that they will face each other? Please tell me you did not sit there and figure it out.
Nope was just looking at the schedule..
its a real slow friday here in the office lol
Check out wwtdd.com that’s a great way to kill a few minutes
FJM is even better!
Not sure if this would mean anything but the Mets also go to Cincinnati right after the all star break…..maybe they can just toss Dunn on the team flight and take him back to NY.
It’s an interesting thought, but then the equipment guys would have to wait by the oversized luggage door, and that takes forever.
Dunn occasionally walks? He has the highest walk/plate appearance ratio in the NL.
Gina, this comment is soooooo 12:37:46
did you actually look up what time that took place?
haha, maybe.
I thought I was having a slow day at the office!
Oh c’mon, that took like 3 seconds.
I usually read through the comments but there’s so many replies I just couldn’t keep track and decided to give up before my brain crashed.
Interesting, I usually read through all the comments to figure out where some wise-ass humor is needed.
Bonds is better than all those guys, and he costs nothing.
I would love to have him on the team but someone said he would rather not play on the east coast for whatever reason.
But at this pt I think he would play anywhere for anything..Throw him some peanuts and he would suit up. The lawyers are just going to take whatever money he has anyway…
I agree. Even if he doesn’t play every day, he would be better coming off the bench than the guys we have now.
The question that should be asked: Is Barry Bonds, even at his age and with the baggage he brings, better than Aguila, Evans or Nixon?
If the answer is yes, which it almost certainly is, then the Mets should bring him in.
They would never sign him though…….PR nightmare and Omar might as well get ready for his release…
nothing but our dignity. Stop pushing your scumbags on us
Great point. Changing gears, have you guys heard anything new on the Lewinsky scandal?
Wait, it’s not 1998?
I could see Omar waiting a couple weeks for the deadline to draw closer. More teams will realize they are out of the play off race, and he’ll pull off a trade no one sees coming.
Don’t forget, a lot of taxi cab accidents can happen between now and the end of the month.
(slams head against wall repeatedly).
Church comes back off DL. Trade Church to a team that isn’t in a playoff hunt and have the new team give him “time” to rest and heal with occassional trips to the DL.
Trust me, I know, speaking of trading Church is blasphemous.
but so was tradin for church.
i think they should trade for a guy who the fans only see as bein a platoon caliper player. both nady and church were viewed that way, and howd they work out?
Barring the concussion and the unfortunate necessary trade of Xavier, both really would have solved our Right Field needs. Church was going to have a great year with, conservatively 20-25 HRs, 280 Avg. and 15-20 doubles. You can’t expect that or any type of regular production from RF.
The Mets winning is a great result of very good play. You look at wins and I think people are saying this is a very well made up team. The same question marks are there as when we were 3 games under .500.
i agree completely. both those trades came out of nowhere and were not real popular deals because fans viewed church and nady as platoon material at best. instead of focusing on the dunns and nadys out there, it might make sense to look for another of those semi-blocked guys who havent had an everyday job again. be cheaper, and they have had proven succes doin it.
If anyone thinks Adam Dunn is a product of the park he plays in, why don’t you actually take a look at his splits…
Home: .221/.368/.514 13 hr
Away: .231/.395/.531 11 hr
As you can see, he has only hit 2 more hrs at home..and his slugging percentage is actually higher away..
Also, according to hittrackeronline.com, a site that measures hr distances, Adam Dunn leads all of baseball in “No doubt” hrs…he also leads the league in home run distance at 471 ft.
The guy will hit home runs wherever he goes. and he gets on base.
I’m pretty sure Gwen Stefani leads No Doubt in home runs, but only because the drummer is really shy and hasn’t gone past second with any of the groupies
Hey Matt…need to change your banner to:
1 team, 2 million GMs
Some of these acquisition posts above are good for one thing, and one thing only….humor.
Kearns would not be a bad fit.
Ibanez I think would be a perfect fit because i think he’s a FA after this year.
Nady probably won’t happen because the pirates will be stingy about him.
ANd not to say that Dunn is as good as him, but would anyone complain about us having Ryan Howard on our team. He hits for as low of an average and strikes out more than Dunn does. But I would love Howard. If we can get Dunn for anything less than F-Mart, then do it. Maybe we can get a package deal with Aaron Harang in there because he is having a bad year and makes a lot of money. Send them Niese/ Heilman as starters and build the package from there.
There’s really nothing else to add to the Dunn conversation, but I do want to point out that there is literally no sense to saying “he’s the example of how OPS doesn’t always mean everything.” That betrays a total misunderstanding of what OPS is and why it is important. The reason we look at OPS instead of, say, strikeouts or batting average, is because OPS means an awful lot and strikeouts and BA mean very, very little. His poor average and high strikeout rate do not, in any way, detract from his steady, year-in-year-out, .900+ OPS.
BTW, number of Mets with a current .900 OPS: 0
If Dunn is available, the Mets HAVE to get him. Perfect match. He makes the team a hair younger, too!
The only misunderstanding here is yours. If he is poor defensively, K’s a lot, and doesn’t get HITS with runners on, those factors will tend to counterbalance OPS when you are trying to figure out his value to a team (real value — not some ridiculous park-adjusted BS that multiplies uncertainty by assumption, by assumption, etc.)
Now, if MetsGuy is right and he plays a decent left field, runs OK, etc., his value is more than I’m giving him credit for, obviously.
Also, please note, no one is saying he shouldn’t start in the majors, or wouldn’t be better for the Mets than say, Fernando Tatis. Just let me know when the Reds send the Mets Dunn for Tatis, Carp and cash. Ain’t happening. It’s his value — i.e., production/ cost.
His OPS with RISP is not bad at all. Stop looking at BA. Like I said before, Castillo leads the Mets in BARISP and BARISP2/Outs. I am sure you would rather have him up than Dunn.
OPS w/ RISP is great and all, but in that situation, a single scores a run and a walk doesn’t (unless he’s constantly walking with the bases loaded, which would be an interesting and unique league-leading category.)
Well, that’s the key issue. If it’ll take FMart for 2 months of Dunn, then it’s not worth it. But if Matt is right that not too many teams are interested in Dunn, then we might be able to get him for cheap. If he doesn’t require top-level prospects, then he’s definitely worth acquiring.
I THINK it will cost Evans, Carp and a lower pitcher. Or maybe even Heilman. That’s a lot but considering that we would most likely resign Dunn it’s not a terrible loss.
For Evans, Carp, and a lower pitcher, I would gladly welcome to the Mets one Mr. Adam Dunn.
I think Harang is hurt
Anything that might help the Mets is going to cost alot and since the Mets only have a little that means FMart.
the best solution for LF is the guy who Omar should have signed instead of Alou: Carlos Lee
sure he makes $17 Mil, but that is the sort of bloated contract that a team like Houston (11 games out and an ace who has lost his zip).
if you really want someone good, it will take FMart and if that is the case, I would use him as a centerpiece in a package for Lee.
can you imagine:
Reyes
Church
Wright
Beltran
Lee
Delgado
Castro
Easley
He is the solution and given where the Astros are at and what his contract costs, there has to be a package the Mets can put together, but it will include Fmart
I like it, but it would still cost a few pieces
not bad still young and based on his salary he may not cost alot. His average is way better, he is batting .369 over the last month and almost .300 on the season and he has 4 base swipes.
Can you imagine Lee playing LF in 2 years? He’d make Dunn look like Willie Mays
NO, because Carlos Lee will be 34 in 2 years. He will be Carlos Delgado Part II, and we will be dying for him to get off the team. We have a certain prospect by the name of Fernando Martinez who is going to play left field.
You could always move to 1B
My bad Matt, didn’t know you were on my side. My B.
Umm… i’m pretty sure we’re all on the same side dude. The Mets side.
I am hurt and offended…not. My sarcasm was not clear in my original post.
we’re not dying right now! and delgado is 36, when he was 34 he was tearing it up.
Took a second for that to register…
What about Melvin Mora? The O’s are almost done.
Yeah, but Mora doesn’t play in the outfield.
Has before.
More can play anywhere
and he looks awesome when he scores game winning runs.
“What’s more, the word around baseball paints Dunn as an apathetic strike-out machine, who, while he occasionally walks, is more or less useless in the field, and so he will bring more in name recognition than actual results.”
know what really amazes me? that so many people around baseball don’t understand baseball.
haha SO true
I want Holliday for RF and Kendhy Morales for 1B. Holliday is at least as good as Alou and Morales is young with lots of power. I’d get rid of Heilman or Schoenweis or any minor leaguer except F-Mart. I know I live in a fantasy world but this team would be great:
Reyes SS Pagan OF
Beltran CF Chavez OF
Wright 3B Easley 2B/SS
Morales 1B Tatis 1B/3B
Holliday RF Castro C
Church LF
Castillo 2B
Schneider C
RANDY WINN!! YES! He would fit right into the Mets’ lineup! He’s everything that Luis Castillo was supposed to be, but even better, he’s an outfielder! And he isn’t as hobbled.
Kenny Lofton… not so great, but he’s like a lucky rabbit’s foot. He always manages to be on teams that win. Same with Timo Perez. I wonder if Timo’s available. And if he’s learned to run the bases since the 2000 WS.
it would be nice to see a mets player smack 40 hrs. get it dunn.
and remember you can always put in endy later in the game for defensive purposes.