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The Mets (53-47) lost to the Phillies (54-46) by the score of 8 to 6 in Shea Stadium tonight.
With the loss the Mets are now one game behind the first place Phillies.
For a recap, boxscore, stats, etc., go to SNY.tv.
- With the Mets up 5 to 2 in the ninth inning and Billy Wagner unavailable to pitch, Duaner Sanchez, Joe Smith and Pedro Feliciano combined to allow six runs. Unreal. In the preGame, due to their struggles versus the Phillies, I noted how the Mets bullpen was the key to the series. I hate that I was right. However, it should have never been left in the bullpen’s hands.
- Johan Santana was very effective in his eight innings of work, allowing two runs on eight hit. It’s mind boggling why after 105 pitches Santana was not allowed the chance to finish off the Phillies. That’s the second time in three weeks Santana was not allowed to complete a game in which his pitch count was low enough to do so. No excuses needed this time, Johan, this one is on your manager.
- Carlos Delgado continues his resurgences, going 2-for-4 with a 2-run HR.
- Luis Aguayo was on a mission tonight to have Endy Chavez thrown out at home and he accomplished it, twice. Although, the first time it was on a perfect relay by the Phillies.
- Ramon Castro homered for a second straight game, going 2-for-4.
- Nothing worse than watching the Phillies celebrate.
This was a devastating loss, but tomorrow is another day. The Mets need to put this behind them and not let a loss like this stop the momentum they’ve built over the last three weeks.
The Mets continue their series against the Phillies at Shea Stadium tomorrow night with John Maine facing Brett Myers.
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You better win tomorrow, Maine. Thats all Im saying.
Oh and please let Joe Smith close. the only pitcher with balls on this team.
Nichols, we lost to the Phils, not the Reds. Thank you for your optimism though.
Someone’s been copying templates! oopsies! ;-)
This game was hard to watch
This is probably the most depressing loss since Game 7 of the ‘06 NLCS. Still, I must call into remembrance the July 4 game when Johan gave another great performance that eventually resulted in a loss. Then it was viewed as the game we must win; after the loss, we took the next three from the phils and went on to win ten straight games. Despite Wagner not being available, despite the fact that I refuse to watch ESPN until 7pm tomorrow night, we MUST keep believing. Tomorrow is a HUGE game. With Brett Myers on the hill, we must get to him early and often and remind him why he was sent down to the minors. After that, I’m certain Oliver Perez, who, believe it or not, is a big game pitcher, will win it on Thursday afternoon and this whole mess will be behind us with a 1 game lead.
YA GOTTA BELIEVE!
yeah they better win tomorrow. and tonight i dont see why johan came out before the 9th inning. for all the money he gets he should finish out the game himself. whether he wins it or loses it. im not blaming this on him but still. i give him credit for what he does but honestly, we shouldnt be losing games like this
Everyone blames the manager for pulling Johan, but Santana is notorious for not wanting to be overworked. Remember last year when he had 18 strikeouts through 8 innings? He took himself out of the game with the chance to break the major league record for Ks in a game because he had thrown over 100 pitches.
Everyone blames managers for pitch counts, but the pitchers need to take the blame too. The are concerned about their own health (ie: their ability to make more money), and thus get all nervous when they see their pitch count over 100. Thats what separates guys like Halladay from guys like Johan.
Manuel even said it in the post game, only occassionally in his career has Johan pitched over 100.
how much more money is that big pussy going to mmake? after this contract, he’s done
I threw up in my mouth last night..
The next week will determine buy/sell. A couple more of these and we should look to 2010. If we stay even, do we have enough to get a reliever and a corner OF?
Gimme a break…we are one game from the lead. We are not sellers. That is ridiculous. Manuel screwed up big time tonight as did Aguayo. Come back and win the next two. Yes, this loss sucked and hurt big time. But we are in the thick of it. Let’s let a little common sense prevail here. You don’t become sellers when you are right there a game out. Stupid suggestion to become sellers.
that logic was famous in 2004
Yeah well that was four years ago….so what the hell application does that have here?
i can only assume you’re talking about the kazmir trade. that trade was made when the mets were 6 games out … not even close.
Now the true test: Can they recover from this ugly, ugly loss? Curious to hear what Manuel says about pulling Santana after the 8th.
Unbelievable…
That is the test, indeed. Last year, the Phillies got a couple of these wins and the Mets kept on folding down the stretch–especially against the Phillies. So, now they need to make sure that they come back strong and win the next two–certainly tomorrow. They need to bounce right back. A loss–and especially another brutal loss like today’s–could send them reeling and bring back all the bad stuff from last year’s collapse.
it’d be nice if we had Huston Street
Street will pull his best billy wagner crap on the mound if he becomes a met.
the only closer that i would be interested in is the Mexicutioner from the Royals.
Like we would not have wanted Wagner tonight.
That was just incredibly ugly. Not much more to be said.
Jerry took full responsibility for his choices that ‘didn’t work out’.
I live and die with these Mets but man….some of you on the pre-game post really need to be talked down from the ledge. One loss tonight and the season is done????
Those that can handle it, those that aren’t sore losers, strap in. It’s going to be back and forth the rest of the way. And we’re gonna get this done.
Decades is right. As ugly as it was, it is just one loss. No need to panic. We are right there. I have no doubt by Thursday afternoon we will be a game up.
No need to panic, but this team’s inability to put the hammer down in a “big” game has become comical. I hate obsessing on things like “heart” and “grit” but dating back to Game 7 ‘06, this team has just shown an inability to win the big one, and this is an epidemic that reaches all 25 guys on the roster, as well as the coaching staffs, whoever is leading them. And it’s not just the hired guns like Beltran and Delgado failing either. When will Wright or Reyes make a big play in a “statement” game? rather than a big error, or a big K on a pitch at your eyebrows?
And I wish I didn’t agree with this…..
it was one loss evertime the last week of September as well…that’s the problem, this team is soft if last year didn’t happen i would agree with you but look at what keeps happening.
*everytime
That’s some incredible confidence you have. It is only a loss. But a bad bad bad loss.
I guess any loss to Philly makes me think about ‘07, but that was particularly evocative.
you smoke nice, this was not some oops loss this was a disaster, this was the night more than any all year that Manuel needed to look Santana in the eye and say I need you to close the door on this one for me, instead he gives the lame, if then maybe nonsense.
THIS WAS A TERRIBLE LOSS.
Geez….come back from the ledge, will ya? It’s a new day tomorrow.
While it *is* still only one loss–and there should not be any panicking at this point, when the Mets are still only 1 game out–it was a terrible loss, and Manuel was crazy to not send Johan out there for the 9th. Yes, he got hit a little in the 8th, so have people warming up, and ready to come in at a moment’s notice, but if Wagner wasn’t available, Johan had to go for the CG.
That being said, when Duaner came in, I never expected this. Just brutal.
Its a long season, we have alot of baseball left to play, We will get them tomorrow, We just have to play better baseball, where have we heard this all before? Sooner or latter the cream floats to the top and we are running out of latter. All this dogfight talk is just excuses, we HAVE to win against the Phillies and Fish, its simple. And when we send our ace to the mound and he gives us a game like this there is NO excuse for letting it slip away. This is the type of loss that will destroy a team and give the other team faith. We need to make a move and get in first place so the pressure is one them to catch us, not the other way around. 1999, 2000, 2006 and 2007, its time to make a statement. LETS WIN !!!
Incomprehensible that Santana didn’t at least start the 9th inning. And as Mazz was saying in the post-game, if Duaner is your “closer” for the night, let him close. Manuel was doing his best LaRussa imitation tonight, overmanaging us out of the game.
And why is Feliciano pitching in any big spots anymore? The guy had a nice one and a half year run, but he’s been incredibly ineffective since last July, walks too many guys, and has become incredibly combustible. Either bury him to mop up duty or give him the Jorge Sosa treatment and call up Collazo or Kunz.
man, the bullpen cant get three outs?
Agree on Feliciano this year. His WHIP was 1.51 before this debacle and is nowhere near what it needs to be for a reliever. That last appearance against Cinci was horrendous and this one was unconscionable.
When you’re not a good manager, you often get stuck in that ‘having to do something’ mode, where he felt he had to do something when it was on his players, and all he did was screw it up.
Fire Manuel. He did it already once in Philadelphia by pulling Santana with even less pitches, and then he does the same thing tonight. Is anyone going to remember that Santana has pitched 16 innings of winning baseball against the Phillies in his last two starts against them?
Fire Manuel!
It’s closer to 23 or 24 innings if you count his first start against Philly when Heilman screwed up his line with a gopher ball.
Yes, fire Manuel. Makes great sense…and then replace him with God knows who…who you will then want fired the next time we have a bad loss. maybe we can go through 3 or 4 more managers this year and set some kind of record.
Great suggestion you have there.
At least give somebody a chance. Manuel was a joke of a promotion.
Dude shutup, the Willie tenure was much more brutal but I bet you can’ honestly tell me if you’d rather have Manuel over Willie. Yes, Aguayo and Manuel fcuked up big tonight but it happens, either way but it’s no excuse for what happened tonight.
I was there and I was so pissed. The Mets after Willie was fired have played better, yea ten game win streaks help but that wouldn’t have happened if willie was still in the dugout.
You my friend are a fairweather fan.
I don’t think Feliciano should be given up on, but, until he gets back on track, he can’t be put into such critical situations. Just like Heilman earlier in the season, when he was pitching so badly that he only pitched earlier in the games, and when the games weren’t particularly close. Then, all of a sudden, he figured things out, and has been great since the beginning of June. Feliciano needs to be given the same opportunity. Still, they can’t keep sending him out in critical situations until he straightens himself out, practically dooming him to failure.
its always about shane victorino. that little man….always does crazy stuff against the mets. this game replay on sny right now is insane. the mets have had three games like this , this year. how can anyone evaluate this team?
it is him and jayson werth. along with a side of so taguchi.
Does anyone have any confidence in John Maine? The league has caught on to what he does (since last year’s ALL-Star Break) and he has done nothing to change.
Next 5 games Mets for 1-4
you’re an idiot.
Maine will be fine.
It’s very possible if the Mets go 1-4 so do the Phillies, but they won’t. They’ve showed plenty of bounce back potentional this year.
you’re the idiot for thinking maine will be fine, he’s been mediore to bad the last calendar year, just look at his records and era
tomorrow they’ll get to a lead, maine will go 5 or 6 and the bullpen will blow it. its happened all too often
So if you feel that way go root for some other team and stop frustrating yourself. If you’re a genuine Met fan you will hate what happened tonight and suck it up and come back cheering tomorrow.
or they will get a lead, maine will go 7 and the bullpen shuts the door…it too has happened all too often
reading the comments of these nut-cases is difficult. The game of baseball is fickle. WHo knows what Maine will do. Pelfrey seems to have figured it out, but in his last game he got hit. Ollie Perez has the talent to get us a no-hitter (while walking 5) but half the time they tee off on him like he’s Mike Bruhert. We’re only 1 game back, have patience for these guys. Maine should be fine, (I hope) but who knows.
“The Mets (53-47) lost to the Reds (54-46) by the score of 8 to 6 in Shea Stadium tonight.”
we lost to the reds? Thank god, I must been watching an SNY replay of the end of the ‘07 season.
Let’s give Matt a break. He’s done a great job with this site and too often he’s made the whipping boy for mistakes like that. Perhaps your comment was meant in jest, but there are some guys on this board who give Matt FAR MORE crap than he deserves. (And, no, I’m not his Mom or one of his buddies. Never met the guy, but appreciate what he’s done with this site — which we all get to use for FREE thanks to his hard work.
agreed, i’d be so pissed to write those comments that i wouldn’t care what went on as the teams or the final score
If were “whipping” anyone it would be Mike, not Matt. Yes copy editing mistakes are part of the fun of blogging and trying to get information out there as fast as you can. Indeed the guys on this sight do a great job.
Oh how I wish that would have been a loss to the Reds rather than the Phils.
this loss hurts BAD but at least there isnt much time to reflect with another game tomorrow. last series we rebounded after a late loss to the phils and ran up 10 wins. lets hope for a similar response. going to the game tomorrow. this team should be PISSED that the phils did this to them in there house. now lets knock meyers all over the park and take back that game!!! LETS GO METS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I still think they’ll take the series. I now can’t wait for Billy to return, does anyone know when thats supposed to be?
I feel a trade afoot
Manuel for Mota? We’d make out on that deal..
I totally agree with decades, there are 59 games left and they are one game out. The Mets will be in 1st and 2nd the rest of the way but I still think somehow after watching this awful display of baseball tonight that the club will win the east
I applaud your optimism. I have a feeling the Mets aren’t beating the Phils for the rest of the season….kinda like last season.
Either you are the world’s most positive human being, or you just packed away pound of those special brownies.
I’m betting on the latter.
Well, I’m the glass half full kind of person but I could definitely use those ’special’ brownies after that game tonight….
Whose got these brownies? Mets Fans? Anyone?
Please provide the link to buy. I have a feeling I’ll be needing those the rest of the way…..
some of you guys smoke really really good grass
“some of you guys smoke realy good grass”
No, some of us are loyal fans who don’t jump ship after a horrifying loss.
oh Spare me the
“I am a better fan than you because I believe” crap
There is no ship to jump, you were all too busy swimming back to it from the life rafts the last two weeks to notice it was still sinking.
patrick, go find another team to root for if you are that disgusted.
we’re the ardent fans who can remember the days of Kelvin Chapman and Kevin Kobel, or even Roy Staiger and Jackson Todd or
What…
Was…
That?
Just when ya think this team finally turns the corner. This is exactly what the Phillies needed for them to turn THEIR corner. And believe me, they won’t be taking their foot off the Met’s neck.
Just like last season when the Mets beat the Phils regularly in the first half, the second half is looking like it’s shaping up to be a mirror image of last year.
Oh, and here comes Santana pitching the best game of the season to date, and after 105 pitches through 8 innings he is taken out for… what? Closer by committee? Cmon! Now the Phillies get their egos all blown up again and the Mets once again get to be the joke of Major League Baseball.
Hey Johan! You got a free pass to throw anyone you like under the bus tonight. Go for it, pal. It’s all yours!
As I said in a previous thread. Pulling Santana is the right move. You can’t give away outs when you don’t have your closer. Had to pad the lead as much as possible. Luis Aguyao really only cost us one run. The first out at home was a chance we had to take to try to get a lead if the game stayed in its pitchers duel state, second time: bonehead choice but Endy should have been on third anyway. The players lost this game plain and simple. Tomorrow is the biggest game of the year because over the past few years both long win streaks and long losing streaks have come after bad losses to the Phillies. Hopefully we go on a win streak. Hopefully Maine throws strikes too. Lets all step back from the ledge and root for the Mets tomorrow, As Jerry says Gangsta fans in front of your TV’s, all others watch something else and get ready to hop on the bandwagon later in the Season. Lets go Mets
I would’ve at least let Santana start the ninth. If he looked tired I could pull him at that point. Jerry just made the wrong call and then the pen just crapped the bed.
Your Ace has 105 pitches thrown through 8 and there’s no closer available. He HAS to start the 9th inning. It was 8,9 and 1 in the bottom of the inning and Argenis Reyes was our last worthwhile pinch hitter. It wasn’t like his batting was going to kill a rally there.
I’m just saying that Jerry had the mindset that without Wagner there is no way this bullpen is going to keep them off the board so I gotta get as many runs as possible by sending up a PH. I would be on his case if Santana didn’t have to bat but I agree with the choice since he did.
How about come the 9th inning you put the ball in the hands of your best pitcher, who today, was very clearly and obviously Santana. If Santana can’t hold a three run lead the way he was throwing, what makes Manuel think Sanchez or Feliciano, pitching out of their “role” can?
He had no such mindset.
He has no such mind.
I don’t care what your role is. Roles went out the window when Wagner had an MRI. You have to think that any collection of pitchers good enough to crack a ML roster could get 3 outs before giving up 3 runs. As for the arguement of A. Reyes being our least reliable PH, consider Tatis had already batted, Castro and Anderson were in the game. I also can’t remember who had that hit before Wright’s HR in Cincy.
that makes zero sense, because all the while Santana is dominating the Phillies if you do not have your closer you ask your starter to get you as many of the remaining three outs as possible.
And as for captain plan mr. manuel, there clearly was NONE with Wagner unavailable. Sanchez was warming in the 7th at one point.
The deck should have been shuffled and the pen should have known at 2pm who would pitch the 7th, the 8th and who would close.
Sanchez spent the better part of two innings loosening up before coming in.
That does not sound like a guy who “knew” his role coming into tonight.
How is it the right move? Yes the closer is out, but the ace is pitching. He’s the ace for a reason. If it was, say Oliver Perez, I’d understand a bit more, but not Johan Santana.
In hindsight and foresight it was the wrong move. I said it when he didn’t hit in the 8th. Just plan idiotic. Give the ace the ball and let him decide how to end it, not a bullpen without it’s closer.
And yes the bullpen had the chance and they failed, so the players are at fault, but Jerry is at fault to for not letting his players (namely Santana) succeed.
1. I lost alot of respect for both Jerry & Warthen. Santana should have been allowed to at least start the 9th.
2. Wagner was available but I don’t think they wanted to risk putting him out there in case he might blow the game. I think Wagner is ’soft’ and I’m being kind because I don’t want to use another term.
3. Yes all reliever blow saves but Wagner has blown the big ones.
4. Sanchez is not anywhere close to the pitcher he was before he was hurt.
5. Yes, Rollins made a great throw but Endy should have been held at third as it would have been second and third with 0 out.
6. That was strike three to Wuerth in the 9th, not even close. The guy is 6′6″ and that pitch was too high??
7. Everyone keeps talking about a corner OF and I agree to a point, but you can expect to pay big time for anyone worth getting. I believe that pitching still wins ball games. The Nats were not going to trade Rausch to the Mets – same division and so far we might have gotten the better in the trade for Milleage [as long as Church comes back].
8. Winning teams win the big games. Stars come through in clutch situations – the Mets better wake up.
9. This is at least the 4th time this year the Mets have had a blown a four run lead.
10. Jose Reyes is one of the stupidest players I’ve ever seen. He misplays balls in critical situations and makes baserunning mistakes to take us out of innings and games.
11. I still root for this team but truthfully I don’t think they have enough to win.
12. Not even $20 mil a year gets you 9 innings anymore
You sir are a moron. I only needed to read a couple of your line items to see that. It’s baseball. It happens.
You’re absolutely right – it did happen LAST YEAR and this year too. What is so wrong about about my evaluation of the Mets tonight and this year??
How is Sherlock a moron? With the exception of spelling Milledge’s name wrong, essentially everything he said was spot on. That is a game you have to win. Tomorrow is another day and whether, the fans, put this game behind us is for the birds. The only people that matter whether tonights disaster is behind them are the players. Let’s hope John Maine can give the Mets a strong outing and tie us at the top again, then we have 58 games ahead us to race the Phils for the division (I can’t take the Marlins seriously, yet).
Again though, Sherlock is far from a moron for stating which almost be looked upon as obvious at this point. That said, let’s get them tomorrow, and LETS GO METS!
How can everything be going right and have everything go wrong so quickly?
Its unbeliveable.
Have the Mets come back like this all year? Down 3 in the 9th?
Devastating? Really? It wasn’t that. Tough? Yes. It’s OK, these games happen. The important thing is that they go out and win tomorrow. LETS GO METS!!!
Is that you Tom?
I guess according to you EVERY game is the wolrd series? Tough loss, I agree…but there is tomorrow at this point.
Not at all. I’ve been one of the more measured Mets fans on metsblog since i first started posting here in 2005. Unfortunately, I’m tired of getting kicked in the groin by the same cast of characters over and over again. I’ve seen this movie one too many times and until some of these guys on this roster shoot a different ending where they actually succeed in a scenario where expectations are heightened, whether it be a win or go home playoff or regular season game, or a game that would give you sole possession of first place after being left for dead about a month ago, I’m going to continue to feel incredibly disappointed and frustrated with this roster. And I repeat, the aptitude for failure in these kinds of games the last three seasons runs 25 deep, which is what’s even more disappointing.
Thanks Mr. Glavine, we missed you.
‘Devastating’ = the most overused word in baseball since the final game of ‘07.
New Adjective please, guys (talking about the SNY crew).
Can’t listen to that description after every loss.
YES! It was ugly. I get it.
How about crushing? It certainly took my breath away b/c I’m just speechless.
Get it done tomorrow, boys.
This is NOT the end of the world, or the season. I cannot agree with Jerry on his reasoning on why Johan didn’t go out for the 9th. He got through the heart of the lineup in the 8th and didn’t have a high pitch count. One time he should be able to go out there and get you a CG. I don’t know if Johan was down with going back out, so some blame can be reserved for him if he was fine with being done. Jerry has to stop worrying about pitch counts, and get the job done. Sure, he cannot be blamed for what happened in the 9th as the bullpen sucked horribly. I just think he is to fault for not allowing Johan the chance to end this game.
I know we all think the sky is falling, but its only one game. We made up a much bigger lead and we should be fine. Game 2 now becomes a really big game. Maine has to show he’s over the slump he has been in, as he is a huge part of the Mets second half.
I am a huge observer of momentum and the way baseball “runs”. I don’t like that Myers comes back against us as the story of him coming back and pitching well after the demotion rings too good not to happen. Couple that with Maine’s struggles, and I think the Mets could drop the 2nd game…..lets just hope I am wronger than ever……Lets Go Mets!!!
I love the Mets and all that, but please, stop saying “We.”
Anyone who is calling Wagner soft needs to stop. He has an injury that if most of us on this board had (myself included) We wouldn’t even go to our desk job. This guy has to pitch in the Major Leagues, If he’s not feeling good in his shoulder I support a choice to keep him out. No excuse for ML Relievers to not get 3 outs with the bottom of the lineup batting before giving up 2 runs.
your right these guys need to step it up when they are needed
I hurt so much right now. I know it is overreacting, believe me, my wife has told me so a thousand times, but nevertheless it still hurts.
I thought Harold Reynolds was right on the nose after the game. The Mets positioning in the Ninth was horrible. Playing for a DP instead of playing for outs created the indecision on Reyes part. They’ve got to just make sure to get an out and not try and force the issue by playing for two. The outfield playing shallow when you need to get outs, you can’t worry about cutting off the tying run from scoring from second. Bases loaded no outs, 5-3, you can’t worry about the runner on second scoring, you’ve got to play normal depth.
I was all for Willie’s firing towards the end as I think this team needed a new voice, no matter who it was, and I’ve been very pleased with Manuel, even beyond the win-streak.
But that 9th inning was one of the most poorly managed innings i have ever seen. From what you and Harold said, to the countless other things that went wrong.
I liked Willie, but was okay with his firing because I felt a new voice couldn’t hurt. But Manuel isn’t a new voice, it’s just a louder one.
I really don’t think the Mets will beat Moyer, so they better take tomorrow’s game to avoid the sweep.
BACK TO .500 WE GO!!!!!
get some bullpen help bring up kunz and neise for some help in the pen trade heilman while hes still hot pick up ebanyez and start this thing a rollin the more we wait the less likley people will be available
i disagree with trading Aaron heilman. the only guy that i would trade right now would be feliciano, he seems to always walk, hits or gives a hit to the first batter that he faces in tight spots.
it is one game, the mets better get the next two. i have confidence in Maine getting a W tomorrow, but not so much with Perez especially when the game is at 12 pm this thursday.
Memo to jerry, if you want someone to close the game, give the ball to Heilman or smith if wagner is not available tomorrow. i have more confidence in these two than the rest of the bullpen.
LET’S GO METS!!!
let’s go Maine….it is time for you to get back on track and please give us a complete game.
Hahaha. Maine tgrows 100 pitches by the 6th inning. Don’t think Jerry will allow main to throw 150.
dude, this is Maine vs the Phillies. it really blows that the Phillies does its best to make Hamels avoid a match up with maine. i would be greatful if maine gives the mets 7 innings of winning baseball.
i’ll puke if myers has a big game agaist us, but i have a bad feeling that it will happen
me too
I’m going to go jump off the Whitestone Bridge….they finally drove me to it….PEACE BE WITH YOU!
at least wait till the series is over
nah, I’m taking the plunge
ugly finiash. I was shocked they didn’t have Santana come out for the 9th. Especially with your closer down.
But still, everything off of Sanchez was weak. Should have stayed with him.
And I have been anti-Feliciano for a long time now. He pretty much sucks every time out. In that situation, better to go to schoe.
Still, mets made enough goofs in the top of th e9th that they still could have gotten out of it no worse than tied.
And someone needed to remind DW that a walk was the same s a HR in his spot, so don’t expand the zone swinging for the fences.
Yes i almost threw my remote at my tv during DW ab. What was he swinging at YOU NEED TO GET ON BASE. Even with a HR you would be down by 1. Not a good ab by DW back there
I agree with Harold too and guess who that is a reflection of. . . none other than Mr. Manuel. I’m really scared that we could actually hire this guy after this season. I can’t stand him and for the first time, I was gonna let him off the hook but NOO. I could see the Johan situation both ways, but then I listened to him explain his reasoning and I was dumbfounded. Then of course the Reynolds point about the defense. In the end, Duaner should have been able to get the job done, but no game ever comes down to one thing. You can’t forget Aguayo, Feliciano, Reyes (although not as much) and even Johan a little for allowing THREE straight two out hits in the first.
They gotta put this behind them. I say they get Mangenius to show a boxing match and give a pep talk on the 5 second rule and then maybe hire him to replace Jerry altogether.
back to 500?? What was everyone saying when they lost the first game of the Phillies series in Philly 3-2? They were what 5.5 back then? Anyone think they’d win the next three?? A well pitch game and Maine is due for it, and we’re back even with Ollie who dominates good teams with lots of lefties. It hurts like a mother, but it still counts as one game. Just sleep it off
How many times do you expect them to take these brutal losses and just expect them to win??
maine is definatley due for a win or else he will be due for a demotion to triple a he is definatly not the guy I want pitching tommorow but hes a big boy he has got to pitch well
This loss sux. It hurt but to look on the bright side
1) Delgado is still on a tear…(yes i know he went 1-5 but every one except for the last one was hit hard)
2) Santana did not give away a lead and did his job.
3) Endy went 3-4
This was a tought loss but they can get even tomorrow. Lets go mets
Would Jerry have pulled Johan in a playoff game? Heck no. This should be treated no differently. I’m more dissapointed in him for not taking blame right off the bat for not leaving Johan in. Sure we need our pen to get 3 outs with 3 run lead. But just as badly we need Johan on the mound in the 9th when he’s on fire, has 105 pitches, and got out of the 8th with six pitches. I’m bummed that Johan wasn’t screaming at Jerry to leave him in too.
Worst loss of the year by far.
What the hell was Manuel thinking? Santana was handcuffing the Phils and only threw 105 pitches… leave him out there in the 9th and finish it, especially with Wagner not being able to pitch. If the Mets are going to lose, lose with Santana not Sanchez or Feliciano or Smith. That said, there’s no excuse for this bullpen. You have a 5-2 lead with the bottom of the Phils lineup coming up and they put a 6 spot up there? I don’t care if they’re not used to pitching in the 9th, if they can’t perform, what good are they? What a disgrace.
“Worst loss if the year by far”
That’s funny, we’ve had about a dozen of those. Is each one worse than the next??
considering how this team has a tendency to prove us wrong every time we say that it scares me to think of what they have up their sleeve to top this one.
And what was up with the 3rd base coach tonight. The first play with endy showed aggression and thats fine but the second he was out by a mile…
the bullpen was doing their best wagner impersonation out there tonight. feliciano was pretty much throwing batting practice.
ok so when do we dump feliciano and make scho the full time lefty specialist. when was the last time feliciano had an effective outing? im done with feliciano the guys a whiffle ball pitcher.
This is one of the games where I thought I wouldn’t see for awhile, I thought they got past this bs. This is why they need Street or Fuentes, because without Wagner this bullpen is a ****** joke.
everone was talking about how good the pen was before the deadline yeah that was against the rockies and giants when we face real teams they implode
CAN WE STOP BLAMING SANTANA????
This is getting ridiculous. He pitches 8 innings, gives up 2 runs, and leaves with a 3 run lead. Yet people STILL blame him. This is Sanchez, Smith, and Feliciano’s faults. They are more than capable of getting 3 outs with a 3 run lead.
Let’s blame the players who were actually responsible for the loss tonight and not the guy who did his job.
some moves have to be made to salvage the season or do we wait till its to late and complain in september about what needs to be done at the deadline
wow i was so angry i didnt know what to do with myself…
well now TOMORROW is the biggest game of the year…please Maine pitch 9 innings!
Since that wont happen please have joe smith close…Duaner clearly isnt cut out for it (which is odd since he is a solid set up)
Also can somebody do me a favor…
run to the phillies hotel, sneak into Victorinio’s room and steal his toy fire engine. Maybe thatll stifle his enthusiasm
Thanks!
-The Vod
Bad loss tonight but it can all be fixed with two wins. Even one win in this series isn’t a big deal. Mets can still finish the series in 1st place. Still early to be slitting wrists.
Bottom line tonight is that Sanchez should have been able to get 3 outs. 0.84 ERA in his last 10 appearances. Bringing him in was the right move and he blew it. Simple as that. Couple more bad breaks and the Mets lose. Put it behind us and let’s tie things up tomorrow night.
I could swear that was Willie in a Jerry Manuel mask.
Willie who in a similar situation this year let Pelfrey start a 9th inning only to pull him for Wagner after he got in trouble for it and got absolutely lit up for it? The next day this whole board was “The closer has to start the inning rants” The managers of this team can’t win with you people. Also spare me the “Santana’s an ace he should be out there Pelfrey’s a kid crap” baseball is a what have you done for me lately game and Pelfrey that night was at least as dominating as Johan was tonight, sometimes its the players fault, not the manager’s.
Wagner was available for Pelfrey’s game. He was not available last night. If he was, I would have no issue with Manuel taking Santana out. If your closer is not available in a big spot, you’ve got to lean on your ace more than you would normally.
thank you. santana did his job. taking him out with a 3 run lead and 105 pitches through 8 innings for a pitcher who rarely goes over that over the course of his career is a sound decision. no team should need a “closer” to get three outs before surrendering 3 runs to the 5-6-7 hitters in a lineup struggling to score runs. stop second-guessing manuel. we’ve enjoyed watching inspired baseball for the first time in over a year since he’s been at the helm. now, the third base coach on the other hand, he was atrocious. the impact his bone-headed plays had on this game cannot be overstated.
Been saying it all day yesterday and earlier today on this blog, the Phillies could take 2 of 3 from the Mets, but everyone was busy throwing out “favored pitching matchups” and “we’ve won 7 of 10 from the Phillies”, etc. etc…..talk about all the statistics you want, you still have to hit, and you still have to pitch….
And I’ve been saying also, to watch out for the Fish…Im telling you all…..watch out. Now we’re tied with Florida. If the Mets dont take the next 2 from the Phils…..could lead to disaster next week with the Marlins…
Be wary of the Fish…
Regards to Jerry Manuel for taking our $140 million ace out of the game knowing he had no closer…..great job….ughhh…..
This game really goes back to the Mets inconsistencies. All of us really need to ask ourselves a question though. Hypothetically even if the Mets were able to get into the playoffs on the behalf of the Phillies and Marlins inconsistencies, how far can they really make it in?
Yes, it probably wasn’t the right call to take Johan Santana out, but we have to be real with ourselves. If a bullpen can’t handle a three run lead, that’s pretty sad. You know what the worse thing about this was? The notorious big-game save blower didn’t throw. Heilman didn’t pitch until the game was already over.
The guy’s who the Mets normally count on and place the burden upon are the same guy’s who lost the game. If anyone’s going to lose the game, at least it were the guy’s who aren’t continually blowing it. Sanchez, Feliciano and Smith have all been solid this year. They all lost it all at the wrong time though.
This game was very sad. It was embarrassing. But you know what the best thing about it is? It’s only one game. I felt the same way when they lost two straight to the Reds. Than they came back and won on Sunday. The team played well tonight, but let it all go. I saw an article in the Daily News about if Santana’s worth the money or not. He really can’t be judged on wins anymore because of this kind of performance by the Mets bullpen. It’s almost become useless to have him because of it.
Why play hard for eight innings if you’re going to crunch under pressure? With all due respect to Duaner Sanchez, I think he really enter lots of doubts into people’s minds about possibly succeeding Billy Wagner as closer after next year after those three consecutive base hits. This game was just totally unacceptable. It was a collective mess. The truth is the Mets just may not want it that bad.
I don’t know who else saw the game on Comcast if it was with the Phillies announcer’s, but it kind of was refreshing even as a Mets fan to see a decent amount of Phillies fans at Shea Stadium. Usually you see a lot more Mets fans when they play in Philly, probably because there’s more people in the NY area, even though the game’s prices are practically the same. That one guy with the straw hat in the first row on the first base side really seem to love giving it to the Mets fans, but when the Mets take the next game or hopefully two we can rub it back in their face.
The Phillies are a team that struggles with momentum too. They got just as much emotion as Mets fans. Same thing with Florida. They may be the team to take the division if they get hot. I’d probably rather see them do it than Philadelphia if the Mets can’t. Now’s the time though. No trade’s going to fix this crap. Billy Wagner sadly probably wouldn’t be able too, because he barely was able to hot onto 10-7 lead in game 4 of that series in Philly. He blew the game before that and those three straight blown saves will be well-remembered by Mets fans. I guess the only guy we couldn’t blame in this is Schoenweis, but I still remember when he hit that guy with the bases loaded. This is very typical of the Mets though.
I don’t know if it’s worth giving up Niese for an OF, but I guess we’ll see what happens. I wouldn’t for Ibanez, but probably Nady or Bay.
did you ever see neise pitch he is very talented I dont think I would let him go for nady or bay your selling this kid short
I don’t want to see Martinez, Niese, Kunz, or Flores dealt anywhere. Those 4 should be untouchable.
Flores should be untouchable because there’s no way you get much value back for a 16 year old with like 100 career at bats. It would be worse than selling low. I wouldn’t like to see Martinez dealt either but for Niese and Kunz it would depend on the deal. IMO if we deal Niese it should be in a deal where we’re getting a pitcher back.
Most scouts say he is middle of the rotation guy at beast. His fastball sets around 89-91 and his other stuff isn’t very impressive or well developed.
Good ol’ ‘07 Mets:
Wagner is injured for a big game
Mets can’t close out a big lead
The Bullpen looks like little leaguers
De ja vu
amazing its the age thing bitting us in the buts again
Can someone tell me why carlos muniz didn’t close the game, he has closed at every level in his career, who cares about his mlb track record, he has balls to end the game
You guy’s got to look at the bigger picture though. It wasn’t 3-2 or 4-2. It was 5-2. The Mets put up extra runs with Castro’s home run (who’s been playing great lately). When I say look at the bigger picture, if we can’t trust our bullpen to get through 3 runs even by committe, that’s pretty sad. All of us have the same doubts with Wagner and I don’t even think anyone would want to see Heilman enter in a crucial time (if there’s a time to trade him, now is it).
Even if Johan did go out there, and got through the game or part of the inning, so what? Who the hell are the Mets if they can’t trust their bullpen to not give up 3 run’s? Sanchez practically gave up the same hit off the same pitch to the same part of the field three times in a row. That’s sad.
The Mets learned something tonight. They’re not that tough. They’re not competent. They need to work on the mental part of the game as much as physical because that ”Oh no” factor is going to be staying with this team in the 9th inning with or without Billy. I’m glad I was able to see that in definite writing tonight, although it would have been good to win the game. The bigger picture is though even if the Mets are lucky enough to make the playoffs, they’ll be dealing with St. Louis or Milwaukee in the playoff’s who look like they’d take good care of the Mets after this kind of performance. Especially with Milwaukee having Sabathia now.
I think what they learned that when your playing a team in contention you better think it through a little and not place bets on a win
you have to be kidding “The first out at home was a chance we had to take to try to get a lead if the game stayed in its pitchers duel state”. if endy is held at third we have 2nd and 3rd no outs with beltran and delgado up. the score is tied. we have to send endy home with out 4th and 5th hitters up and no outs (who have been hot lately) because it might be a pitchers duel and we have to get that 2nd run in there? that’s just awful baseball. you HAVE to be safe at home if ther eare no outs and the heart of your order is coming up. that’s not agressive baseball, it’s just stupid baseball. and to do it a second time, don’t even get me started. with that said if maine pitches well tomorrow i think they will actually find a way to win the game. but maine is a BIG quesiton mark to me…
Everyone is talking about this game being lost with people out of their roles. Then how is trading for Street or Fuentes who are closers going to help us in the 8th inning. If you have the closer mindset you usually struggle pitching in the eighth. If we make a trade it has to be for a guy who is used to any inning 6-8. First it would satisfy the “role” arguement and second it would cost us less. Now I don’t know if any such player is available but its not my job to make crazy trade proposals, I’m not the GM.
I don’t give a s**t about roles………I WANT OUTS!!!!
Willie really blew it tonight with the way he handled the pen. Willie never should have taken out Johan. 60-games left or not, this was a big game. Damn you Willie…I mean Jerry.
i am just shocked the mets are even where they are, but it doesn’t make it any less painful tonight.
serioulsy, pedro goes down after three innings and gives them just about nothing all season. alou gave them about 8 games or whatever it was. church, who was a godsend, has been out for what, month and a half? the bench is a mess. castro was out for a month. schneider was hurt a bunch of times and can’t seem to catch since the first two weeks. castillo (ok, bear with me) has been out for weeks. billy is hurt now. this is just a sampling, but with all of this, who would really think they would even have a chance?
still hurts, but if they pull off a win tomorrow, first place. i don’t understand it, but i will take it.
You guy’s really want Billy out there? Why so you can laugh? Didn’t any of you watch the All-Star game? In regards to Muniz, don’t any of you remember that gave in St. Louis? He gave up back to back bombs only until the second one went over the fence. If Endy caught that, he would have found still found a way to blow that game. Muniz doesn’t have the experience and he’s never going to develop consistency when if he continues to treat like that revolving door in the Day after Tomorrow. It’s the same reason why Heath Bell never grew with the Mets even though all of us knew he threw darts. Omar’s got to do a better job.
Muniz may have no experience but no one else in my mind has any significant experience in that role
thats why they need a closer ,depending on a older pitcher to be there for you at the end of the year is suicide if billy dont like us getting another closer and take on the set up role then trade him you can get alot for a old dog named wagner
John Maine better step up tomorrow. Hes been pretty good in this situation hopefully he’ll get it done. so whats the over under on when we win a santana start? august 31st?
Say what you want about it being just one game, just like the one game we lost to these turds at Philly. It sucks so bad.
We owned them for eight innings. We played better baseball. In the end, over the course of an inning, they end up owning us. It is totally unacceptable.
I swear to God I’d rather be burned w/ a cigarette right now than suffer this F-in loss!
Of course, we can come back and win this series, and I will be happy, and you will all be happy. But why the F- are we losing games that we basically have wrapped up!
Yes, it happens to all teams, and it’s BB, but tonight just has such a sickening feel to it that I cannot simply let go.
I am as diehard a Mets fan as anybody and I always will be, but F! this hurts.
id prefer that the phillies beat us before the 9th so the loss isnt as bitter.
this just proves the importance of bringin in huston street.. pretty self explianitory
Don’t sell the farm for street, wagner will come back, three games to the phillies is something we can over come, it just hurts
we wont have to sell the farm, the asking price is two prospects
They have a good enough roster to get into the playoffs, although that might be as far as they get. You never know though. It’s all about who’s hot. The Mets can’t allow this game to drag into tomorrow. They got to go out there tomorrow forgetting about this. Remember, this could be a lot worse if the Mets didn’t win on Sunday. It’d be a 4 game losing straight and it’d really be lingering.
That guy’s right. The Marlins may be the team to shine out of all this. Let the Phillies enjoy their moment. They won’t be tasting it for long. Charlie Manuel’s anguish didn’t come all from that strike, trust me. The Mets should have never expected anything out of Pedro this season. He may not even want to pitch next year because no one may be willing to pay him enough to stay around. The Mets have reverted back to their mediocre ways though. The best thing that’s happened to this team was that 10 game winning streak. It’s what brought them back into competition. The Phillies and Marlins normally play a little above that though which is going to be a problem for the Mets. With the exception of that 10 game winning streak, the Mets have related more to the Braves who continually hover in the same spot.
How is it possible that Jose Reyes is becoming a stupider BB player now than he was two years ago. Please explain this to me.
Um, why is he so stupid? Because the guy hit the ball so crappy and Reyes was trying to make a play?
For all the clamoring by the SNY booth for Reyes to just go to first, that still leaves the tying run on second with 1 out (and that guy on second base is one of the 5 fastest runners in baseball). A DP would have been huge there.
The Phillies were so lucky that Victorino was the guy on first base. He’s the only guy on the roster that makes it.
But hey, split second decisions are always easy to make.
Lets just hope the phillies don’t get holliday and fuentes then were screwed
i just don’t see how they are going to bring anyone in. street, fuentes, bay, nady, holliday…….i hear all these names, but i just don’t see it. i don’t see any of these guys coming to the mets. who are they going to offer up? what is the deal? unless the mets offer martinez, which i really don’t ever see happening, how are these white knights going to save the day?
it is so tough now, they are so much in the race, but i feel it is all being done with smoke and mirrors. this team can not win with chavez and tatis as the starting corners. without help i don’t see it happening and i just can’t see where the help comes from. of course, if church is indeed ok…
Speaking of Hutson Street and the A’s and hence Billy Beane….
Is anyone else pissed off that Beane virtually gave away Harden and Blanton, but when the Mets were interested in the past 2 off season Beane held the Mets hostage for every last prospect???
I think the same will go with Street, Beane will want Martinez. Niese and Kunz, but then trade him to the Yankess for Ian Kennedy.
I hate Billy Beane!
He didn’t give away Blanton, that was practically highway robbery.
Please, those Philly prospects were a joke.
All 3 prospects were in the top 10 in their system. For BLANTON.
Are you seriously trying to say that the A’s lost out on that trade?
You’re right about Muniz. He deserves a shot. They need to keep him on the roster consistently though if they expect any progress. You got to win with the same guy’s and lose with the same guy’s though and Muniz hasn’t done much of each this year.
Huston Street would help, but he’s not going to fix the Mets problems. The Mets bullpen collectively embarrassed themselves and we just have to accept them. It’s only one game. Duaner Sanchez, Pedro Feliciano and Joe Smith all threw like crap and they’d tell that themselves. This is a matter of team chemistry. Throw Fuentes or Street into that equation and the Mets woes can linger on them. The Mets have to think about the future as much as they do now. The best thing they might be able to do is nothing. There farm system’s pretty dried out. We got bigger needs than pitching though. The Mets bullpen doesn’t have bad number’s. Same thing with the rotation. It’s just a matter of being clutch or not that seems to matter.
You know what really bothers me though? The Phillies got the Mets number when it comes to losing. The Mets haven’t been blown away by the Phillies, but it seems like when the Mets are down a lot to the Phillies, they play with less confidence. The Phillies do have a powerful offense, but it’s like the Mets are a referee who’s purposely making calls to get the other team back in the game. It’s really sad.
If they weren’t 1.0 game out, I would sell my tickets for tomorrow but I still have hope.
There’s no fate but what we make!
Are you Jon Connor?
Reyes has learning to do, but he does a lot for the Mets. Little thing’s are what’s killing this team. Not the overall make up. I definitely agree with that a trade may not be feasible. The best they may be able to do is a Jay Payton or Chad Bradford type deal which would help, but it wouldn’t change the dynamic of the Mets. The market has it’s price. They’ll be competing with the Yankees to get Nady, as they would with the Dodgers to get Street. Wagner will be back though. I don’t think anyone should get that nervous. If the Mets bullpen didn’t collapse tonight, I guarantee all of you would be like screw Billy. Don’t let one negative favor over the other though.
When they win tomorrow, all of us will have a different mind set. We’ll look at it more positively. It’ll probably be a continual back to 1st and 2nd show down for a little while until one or two of these three teams breaks out or breaks down. You guy’s should have heard what Phillies fans had to say about their back to back losses to Florida. They’re just as down on their team as other’s and I don’t think they were that impressed with Blanton either.
***If they win…
Church will make or break the offense too, but Delgado deserves a lot of credit for this transformation at the right time. They actually can depend on him now. The more rest they give Castillo, the more productive he could be too in the future, even if it only is as a platoon guy. Castro’s come on too. Tatis is keeping up well too. There’s a lot of teams in the NL who’d die to have a lot of the Mets roster. Either way, for as bad as thing’s seem, I’m still more confident with Jerry and do see the Mets winning this division. The Mets got to get tougher though. There was a girl in the crowd with the sun glare thing’s under her eye’s who looked more tougher than Beltran lol
i don’t know what it is, carlos beltran will be tearing the cover off the ball, then he just goes into a two week coma, then he kills it again. it drives me nuts. right now, if church comes back and performs as he did, the team can really put it together especially if delgado keeps killing it and if david can get hot. for all the numbers david has put up, other than that one push to get him around 290, he has not had that run we have become used to.
but, that is a lot of ifs. still, as i said earlier, given all that gone down this season, i am still shocked they are even where they are.
This loss was depressing. Sometimes I wonder if the baseball Gods are still getting even with the Mets for the 1986 postseason. Yes, there have been some good times since 86, but think about all of the things that have happened against the Mets since then:
1987-Roger McDowell meet Terry Pendleton
1988-Hello, Orel Hershiser
1990-Strawberry leaves
1993-Worst team money can buy
1994-Dwight Gooden’s final demise with the Mets
1996-Generation K goes bust
1999-Kenny Rogers ball four
2000-Loss to the Yankees in WS
2003-Art Howe
2004-Goodbye Scott Kazmir, we hardly knew you.
2006-Yadier F**king Molina
2007-The Collapse
2008-???
Think about it, how many times in a situation as big as tonight (or bigger)have the Mets really ever come through since 86? More often than not, they fall flat. I love this team, but they are taking years off of my life.
They just took about 2 years off mine. No lead is safe with this team.
Speechless. words can’t describe what I’m feeling inside. Three lousy out. I guess that’s why they say (By the way, who the f…ck is they?) the last three outs are the toughest in baseball.
It’s amazing how these types of games always happen when ever Santana pitches. This guy can’t catch a break. It has to be a mental thing at this point, how else can you explain why this keeps happening when Santana pitches. It’s like one of those old black and white “twilight Zone” episodes. Unreal.
i go back to endy’s catch, for me, the past 2 years come down to the next half inning when the mets did not take the lead. they have been cursed since then.
Hopefully this curse won’t last as long as Boston’s. I feel sory for my kids since they are Mets fans also thanks to me. Hey, isn’t that a form of child abuse? What a bad father i am subjecting my kids to a lifetime of agony! LOL
funny, my dad is a sox fan having lived in boston and i remember balling my eyes out during game 6 only to have have it turn around, thinking winning in baseball was easy.
fast forward 20 years and i am still waiting while the sox can seem to do no wrong.
What goes around comes around I guess. I think that game six was as good as it ever was for as a baseball fan. Winning the World series in game seven was great but it was almost anti-clamatic after that unbelievable game-6.
Also, in regards to trades, since the Hernandez/Carter trades, when have the Mets made a trade that it was by far a huge win for them(Santana still pending)? Jason Bay, Kazmir, David Cone, Jeff Kent, Fernando Vina, Isringhausen, Mora. All of these guys were traded for pretty much nothing, except for Cone, but then Kent was traded too early. Even a trade that seems to work out like Church somehow goes bad. I’m just depressed….
Piazza is one that did work out. Although I agree that we are usually bad in the trade market.
That’s just one hell of a depressing list.
Excuse me while I slit my wrists…
True, the game was unreal… Or at least that 9th inning was. We all know that this team can play better than that, so I’m not worried yet, although i was pacing and throwing things after Sanchez came in.
I just can’t sto[p thinking how nice it would have been with a nice, clean, 5-3 victory with our ace getting the victory and the first game in the bag and looking forward to tomorrow. Now I dread tomorrow and will have an uneasy feeling all freakin day tomorrow at work. My job is tough enough without having this frustration linger all day.
I meant 5-2 victory. Nice and clean.
we dont have a power strike out pitcher in the bullpen other than wagner. we need someone like scot shields,delcarmen, marmol,etc…someone than can strikeout a batter with a runner on 3rd and less than 2 outs. call up kunz and see what he can do
You’re right. Most of our pitchers are contact pitchers.
cuz none of our relievers have a true 12/6 curveball. did you see that curveball from the royals closer in the ASG
Because Peterson did not allow any pitcher to throw a curve.
seems like none of the starters do either.
If we plan to continue to bring out the Three Amigos, Schoenweiss, Heilman and Feliciano for the rest of this season, we better start setting up our golf plans for October now. These three losers couldn’t get out grandma moses if she was laying on a gurney at home plate!!
Schoe and Heilmann can still get the job done. At this point, and pretty much since mid-last year, it seems that Feliciano is almost automatic to cough it up to the first batter. and he can’t face a RH.
I also still am stongly on th eside of making AH a SP again. He is certainly better than Blanton!
All this adversity and heart break will just make it all the more sweeter if they for some miracle go on to win the WS.
That’s what made the Giants SB victory so sweet, no one gave them a shot. Similar to the Mets season this year. They were going through all these controversies and in house strife. Every one left the Giants for dead and then all of a sudden out of no where they went on this great run and the rest is history. It’s all about getting hot at the right time. Example: Colorado last year.
100% correct. Other than the Giants winning the SB being sweet. For a Jets fan there could be no winners in last years superbowl. Like a Yanks-Phils WS.
I hear you, I’m a Giants fan but I don’t dislike the jets, I just don’t root for them or care. But I feel for all you Jets fans, can’t be easy. If it came to Dallas and the jets in the SB, I would be a die hard jets fan!!! hate them Cowboys!! Have you noticed most yankee fan are also Cowboy fans? wonder why?
Again right on the money. I really didn’t want the Patriots to win the SB because they wronged us so bad in week one but I think my tune might be a little different if I lived in NY and had to put up with Giants fans. Anecdotal evidence suggests they are not gracious winners but if my team won the SB I guess I wouldn’t be either. Its been great to post about football for a while to get my mind off this trainwreck that just happened.
That’s why you have to put it into perspective. I loss in baseball is nothing compared to a loss in football where they play only 16 games. And even so, one loss in football is not the end of the world as evidence by the Giants season. So if a loss in football is not the end of the world where you only play 16(unless of course it’s the game you need to make the play-off) how can one loss in baseball in july be so important when you play 162! Of course every game counts and every win is important (if the Mets had won two more in July or April last year, they would have won the division) but from one game to the next, hey one down………………………………59 more to go.
man, can you imagine the mets beating the redsox in the WS, dejavu..that would be great, but for now I will be happy if we make the playoffs, anything can happen after that
We already did that in 86′. I think it’s time we get even with the ‘Spankees”.
Like MetfaninFL said, can you imagine, a Yanks-Phils World Series. Dear God, that just made me shutter a little. I guess I would have to root for the Yanks. For the longest time my favorite team has been the Mets and my second favorite was anyone who was playing the Yankees. I can honestly say the Phillies are my most hated team now. I never would have thought the Phillies would be important enough for me to even dislike. Last year changed everything.
Agree. I hate the Yankees but I hate the Phillies more. So if it came down to Yankees-Phillies, I’m rooting for the City of New York (not neccesarily the Yankees, but the city they represent).
What would really be funny (and sad from a Mets point of view) is that here we are debating all year which team is going to win the NL east , the mets or Phillies……………………………………………and the Marlins are the ones!!! LOL. Everyone keeps expecting and waiting for them to eventually fade away but I don’t man. They are just sitting there letting us battle back and forth with the Phillies and just beat each other to death.
The only reason I don’t see the Marlins winning this division is the schedule. Other than the games against Mets and Phils (which will be battles and we play well against them) They play @ CHC, @ ARI, have 4 vs. STL, have 3 @ STL. We already played at Chicago, Arizona and Saint Louis. I know last Sept, taught me that any team can beat anyone on any given day but I think for a young team that schedule is an absolute backbreaker.
I also think Philly has already played @ STL, ARI, and CHC, but I refuse on principle to visit phillies.com to confirm this especially after tonights fiasco.
Agree, heard Mike and the Angry Puppy discuss this on the air. Marlins have a pretty tough schedule. I believe out of the three teams (mets, Marlins, Phillies) the Mets are the ones that actually have the easiest schedule of the three.
I know, I could just imagine what the Phillie anouncers must be saying, enough to make me puke!
I have a strong suspicion Heilman WILL be part of any trade the Mets make for a LF.
I hope your right. We really don’t need to mortgage whats left of the farm for someone like Raul Ibanez. Ibanez or Winn is not the difference between this team going to the WS or not. Heilman is a proven commodity. We already know what we have with him and I’m convinced we could find someone else who looks great in any low pressure situation but has trouble when the heat is on. I would hate to give up one of our better young guys for an aging OF’er who might not even be a difference maker .
Live chat tomorrow at Mets Prospectus
We won’t know the true implications of this game until at least a week passes. Will it serve as a spring board for a struggling Phillies team? I hope not but only time will tell.
It takes a special mentality to be a closer. If Sanchez had converted on this save opportunity it would have been his first as a Met.
Santana said he was fine and could have gone out for the ninth. He is the best pitcher on the staff and if he is not spent he has a right to go out there and nail down the victory.
You have to admire the mental toughness of the Phillies. They just don’t quit. They also seem to be mentally sharper on the field than the Mets.
I believe the wind milling by the third base coach was simply an attempt to seek an alternate form of energy. He must be admired (and fired). :)
I was looking at Feliciano’s splits this year. Against lh he has .222 ba, .315obp, .286slg, .601ops while against rh he has .324ba, .398obp, .911ops. BTW over the last 2 weeks his era is 36.00. Relievers have good years and bad years and they come and go. If the Mets can’t afford to keep him around only to get lh out then he should be replaced. I realized he has pitched well for the Mets in previous years but this is professional sports and sentimentality doesn’t win pennants.
IMO we should keep him as a lefty specialist, but if the front office thinks he’s even the slightest bit dispensable they need to sell while the market for lefty relievers is so high.
WHY DOESNT JERRY MANUEL LET JOHAN FINISH HIS GAMES .. I WAS AT THE GAME TONIGHT AND EVERYONE THOUGHT HE WAS COMING BACK OUT .. HE HAD 104 PITCHES .. GROW A PAIR!!!!
I think this sums it up best, idk if anyone’s mentioned it. Was just listening to Tony Paige on the wfan, and he said that in the news story from the associated press jimmy rollins said that in the top of the 9th once he saw the phils weren’t facing wagner nor santana they felt they had hope.
Rollins was so confident he felt they could do something he went down into the cage to take some extra swings, despite the fact he was due up 6th in the inning.
This is what i’m most upset about, we gave the phillies hope. They thought they had a chance and took advantage of it. Bottom line we throw santana out there for the 9th were sitting a game up in the division.
To the doomsayers:
You IDIOTS. Yes, the end of the game felt like 2007. But it’s July, not September. We’re still on an incredible hot streak, with the chance to win the series, and even if we don’t, there are lots more series this season. And except for the Phils’ hitting against the non-Santana pitchers, they looked completely lost against good pitching, as they have for more than a month. Plus, they make middle of the road starters look like Santana. So hold off on the eulegies (sp?) just yet.
No, the Mets (not “we”, unless you’re not a member of the organization) ARE NOT on an incredible hot streak; they’ve lost three of five since the All-Star break. The hot streak is over.
Last night could’ve been the start of another. Instead, the over-managing bug strikes again, and we get a devastating loss rather than a complete game masterpiece by Santana.
At least Manuel admitted to making bad decisions. Small consolation.
2 and 3 since the break ….. thats incrediably hot ????
some of you guys saying sanchez has been lights out are lost ….. sanchez has been babied.. and any time he’s in a tuff spot he coughs it up….
This was totally Manuel and Aguyao’s loss.
Manuel should have had Santana at least start the 9th. Let him suck it up and get it done.
I thought Sandy Alomar was the 2nd worst Met thrid base coach behind Matt Galante. I had hope for Aguayo, yet he sends Chavez on a play where he’s going to be out by a mile. Doesn’t he know Wert has a pretty good arm.
This was a tough loss. Maine better bring his A game.
Look this is the METS we are talking about here. They will always find a way to break your heart, they will tease you with flashes of greatness and get oh so close, but, when the smoke settles and the big game is on the line, they will loose. After this 9 game series with the Phillies, Cards and Fish I think that we will find ourselves sitting alone in third place 2 games behind the Phillies and Fish. I mean if this team cant win a big game behind the big ace what hope do we have? Sure it has been fun to watch the last 11 games, but, that fun is held in check by the pain of the next 9 games starting with this debacle. Its not even the fact that they lost , its how they lost and to who. We left the door open and gave them hope and they took it. They now know that they can beat us in the 9th and at home and they have the momentum now. I have little faith in Maine tonight and Ollie, well, you never know. It was a sloppy poor played game, and, I think it was the true Mets that we saw. The ones that collpase under pressuer.
It took me until now (7:18 am) to actually log in here.
Why wasn’t Santana allowed to start the 9th? 105 pitches??
C’mon Jerry-let him finish what he started.
He’s better with after throwing 105 pitches than any of the guys that go thrown out on the mound. Especially without Wagner as amn option.
Between Dirt and Pedro I thought I was watching Calvin Scharaldi again-scared to death!!!
Any momentum we gained over the past few weks is long gone.
Big one tonight -gotta have it.
I think I’ll go back to sulking now-it’s only 12 hours to game time.
How about a Jerry confidence Poll?
I’ll start.
ZERO
Tough One–but NOTHING COMPARES TO LAST SEPTEMBER…Bounce back tonight and things will be back to normal….It’s JULY—Manual screwed up last night –SANTANA SHOULD HAVE BEEN OUT THERE IN THE 9TH—Lesson Learned I guess…but a TOUGH one…
NY METS — SNATCHING DEFEAT FROM THE JAWS OF VICTORY SINCE 1964…LMAO — I hope they have a short term memory — gotta win the next two — lets go Mets
Last night was just another typical Mets meltdown. Everyone except Santana, Delgado and Castro is to blame. Wright, Reyes and Beltran again fail to come thru under pressure. Anderson, Chavez, Easley and Tatis, the super subs are just, that quailty bench players and we can’t expect them to win us huge games.
This team is no different now that they were a month ago or even a year ago. Last night proved that this squad still lacks what it takes to win important games. I say trade for Holliday, sign Teixeira over the winter, shop Beltran and Wagner and start fresh @ Citi Field in 2009. Good Luck down the stretch guys!
The only ones to blame last night are the Manager who had NO PLAN, and the bullpen who had no stones.
And also the 3rd base coach for being dumb as a box of rocks. TWICE
Lets be real here-
SInce the break they’ve played 5 mediocre games. They’re lucky to be 2-3 to be honest.
By the way….lost in all of this is that Reyes with ANOTHER brainlock play.
Is he the stupidest player in the league? Honestly, in a big spot I don’t want up at the plate (1st pitch popup) or fielding the ball (as we saw last night)
He is on another planet sometimes, probably thinking about what night club he is going to after the game.
When the bases were loaded top of the 9th and no outs, I knew the worst was yet to come and what the outcome was going to be.
A tough game to watch, alot of frustration yet again for us METS FANS. They need to kickass tonight and tomorrow to end the series 2 of 3 and end up Solo in first place. They need to do this NOW to show they are in it to WIN IT!!!!!
Last night I thought I’d taken a time machine back to Sept. 2007.
Thank You NY METS for ruinin my entire day today,and for allowing all my yankee friends, to light up my phone with TEXT messages, and once again the yankees have a better record… lets see how many times well get thrown out at 3rd today!!