Comments on: Poll: If Wagner is Out for Year, Who is Closer http://www.metsblog.com/2008/09/08/poll-if-wagner-is-out-for-year-who-is-closer/ MetsBlog.com features the latest Mets rumors, player movement, and news circulating around the Internet, as well as Mets related insights and opinions by Matthew Cerrone and his team of guest bloggers. Sun, 22 Nov 2009 06:15:16 -0500 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.6 hourly 1 By: stone11375 http://www.metsblog.com/2008/09/08/poll-if-wagner-is-out-for-year-who-is-closer/#comment-321899 stone11375 Tue, 09 Sep 2008 00:39:41 +0000 http://www.metsblog.com/2008/09/08/poll-if-wagner-is-out-for-year-who-is-closer/#comment-321899 i think a reyes is gonna be taking castillo's spot which lets u keep both murphy and evans (i think) and as far as the bullpen, keep sanchez and figgy i think a reyes is gonna be taking castillo’s spot which lets u keep both murphy and evans (i think)

and as far as the bullpen, keep sanchez and figgy

]]> By: stone11375 http://www.metsblog.com/2008/09/08/poll-if-wagner-is-out-for-year-who-is-closer/#comment-321896 stone11375 Tue, 09 Sep 2008 00:32:52 +0000 http://www.metsblog.com/2008/09/08/poll-if-wagner-is-out-for-year-who-is-closer/#comment-321896 please remind me when marlon anderson hit a 9th inning hr to send a game into extras that led to an eventual win. and while your at it, when marlon last made a gold glove catch in right field please remind me when marlon anderson hit a 9th inning hr to send a game into extras that led to an eventual win.

and while your at it, when marlon last made a gold glove catch in right field

]]> By: ToastyJoe http://www.metsblog.com/2008/09/08/poll-if-wagner-is-out-for-year-who-is-closer/#comment-321722 ToastyJoe Mon, 08 Sep 2008 20:34:26 +0000 http://www.metsblog.com/2008/09/08/poll-if-wagner-is-out-for-year-who-is-closer/#comment-321722 For everyone saying Wagner "only has 7 blown saves" as compared to the other closers, many of whom have 6 - have you not noticed that Wagner has missed a month of baseball? He'd presumably have AT LEAST 10 blown saves by now. For everyone saying Wagner “only has 7 blown saves” as compared to the other closers, many of whom have 6 – have you not noticed that Wagner has missed a month of baseball? He’d presumably have AT LEAST 10 blown saves by now.

]]> By: mikey_FF http://www.metsblog.com/2008/09/08/poll-if-wagner-is-out-for-year-who-is-closer/#comment-321582 mikey_FF Mon, 08 Sep 2008 19:08:08 +0000 http://www.metsblog.com/2008/09/08/poll-if-wagner-is-out-for-year-who-is-closer/#comment-321582 What you're trying to get across is you'd be a good agent for a baseball player. What you’re trying to get across is you’d be a good agent for a baseball player.

]]> By: AllChokedUpLikeFelixMillan http://www.metsblog.com/2008/09/08/poll-if-wagner-is-out-for-year-who-is-closer/#comment-321556 AllChokedUpLikeFelixMillan Mon, 08 Sep 2008 18:49:50 +0000 http://www.metsblog.com/2008/09/08/poll-if-wagner-is-out-for-year-who-is-closer/#comment-321556 After much reading/lurking, a few thoughts: * Agree 1000% that Jerry needs to work the hot hand w/o defined "roles". * Ayala has been a nice surprise and helped reaffirm Omar's skills as a garage sale genius, and agree that he has exuded confidence and balls on the mound, BUT...I will be very interested to hear from the hardcore Ayala fans who commented above after the first few times he blows a game for us badly. IMO all it will take is a few horrid outings for everyone to crave Wags again. Speaking of which... * Despite an ERA that occasionally goes one or two points north of 0.00 (gasp), Wags has been a LOT more valuable to this team for the past three seasons than the entire remainder of the bullpen, AND much more valuable than the once-great Pedro Martinez to boot. If I had to choose between Ayala as closer + Pedro as starter vs. Wags as closer + an Ayala type to replace Pedro in the rotation I'd pick the latter in a heartbeat. Personally I like Petey the dude, the personality, the smile, the clubhouse guy, etc but I am so DONE with Petey the alleged "arm". Jeezus H Christ what a waste of money. Almost every time he starts I feel like we are at a disadvantage. You just knew there was no way he was going to beat Moyer last night, and that took a lot of the fun out of even watching the damn game. * "Heilman" as a verb, too funny. FWIW I have always felt bad for Heilman and that he's taken a disproportionate share of the blame for Mets' woes last few seasons. That said, either give him a shot at starting (which he really really really wants to do) or trade the bee-otch already! It's obvious he's pissed/sad/mopey/whatever about his "role" in NY, so either change it and give him one last chance to prove himself dump him and move on. Enough is enough. And while we're at it, why is Schoeneweis still here? He was public enemy #2 last year behind Mota. I can't believe we keep trotting that deadbeat out there. After much reading/lurking, a few thoughts:

* Agree 1000% that Jerry needs to work the hot hand w/o defined “roles”.

* Ayala has been a nice surprise and helped reaffirm Omar’s skills as a garage sale genius, and agree that he has exuded confidence and balls on the mound, BUT…I will be very interested to hear from the hardcore Ayala fans who commented above after the first few times he blows a game for us badly. IMO all it will take is a few horrid outings for everyone to crave Wags again. Speaking of which…

* Despite an ERA that occasionally goes one or two points north of 0.00 (gasp), Wags has been a LOT more valuable to this team for the past three seasons than the entire remainder of the bullpen, AND much more valuable than the once-great Pedro Martinez to boot. If I had to choose between Ayala as closer + Pedro as starter vs. Wags as closer + an Ayala type to replace Pedro in the rotation I’d pick the latter in a heartbeat. Personally I like Petey the dude, the personality, the smile, the clubhouse guy, etc but I am so DONE with Petey the alleged “arm”. Jeezus H Christ what a waste of money. Almost every time he starts I feel like we are at a disadvantage. You just knew there was no way he was going to beat Moyer last night, and that took a lot of the fun out of even watching the damn game.

* “Heilman” as a verb, too funny. FWIW I have always felt bad for Heilman and that he’s taken a disproportionate share of the blame for Mets’ woes last few seasons. That said, either give him a shot at starting (which he really really really wants to do) or trade the bee-otch already! It’s obvious he’s pissed/sad/mopey/whatever about his “role” in NY, so either change it and give him one last chance to prove himself dump him and move on. Enough is enough. And while we’re at it, why is Schoeneweis still here? He was public enemy #2 last year behind Mota. I can’t believe we keep trotting that deadbeat out there.

]]> By: metsftw http://www.metsblog.com/2008/09/08/poll-if-wagner-is-out-for-year-who-is-closer/#comment-321533 metsftw Mon, 08 Sep 2008 18:37:09 +0000 http://www.metsblog.com/2008/09/08/poll-if-wagner-is-out-for-year-who-is-closer/#comment-321533 look, this guy clearly doesn't understand what we're trying to get across. i gave up a while ago. look, this guy clearly doesn’t understand what we’re trying to get across. i gave up a while ago.

]]> By: kidfromqueens http://www.metsblog.com/2008/09/08/poll-if-wagner-is-out-for-year-who-is-closer/#comment-321490 kidfromqueens Mon, 08 Sep 2008 18:12:06 +0000 http://www.metsblog.com/2008/09/08/poll-if-wagner-is-out-for-year-who-is-closer/#comment-321490 OK- so if you want to go back to basing this all on blown saves, are you suggesting that we just ignore every other closer's blown saves? Every fan base does this with their closers. We watch Mets games, not Angels or Twins games, so we remember Billy's blown saves but not those of K-Rod and Nathan- we see them getting saves on highlight shows and imagine that they're always great. Angels and Twins fans, though, certainly remember each of their closers six blown saves each as much as we remember our seven. Really, outside of Rivera, no fan base is really ever unanimously behind their closer, even when the fans of every other team drools over them. And are you seriously comparing Wags to Benitez? I don't think there are many Mets fans who would, now or then... OK- so if you want to go back to basing this all on blown saves, are you suggesting that we just ignore every other closer’s blown saves? Every fan base does this with their closers. We watch Mets games, not Angels or Twins games, so we remember Billy’s blown saves but not those of K-Rod and Nathan- we see them getting saves on highlight shows and imagine that they’re always great. Angels and Twins fans, though, certainly remember each of their closers six blown saves each as much as we remember our seven. Really, outside of Rivera, no fan base is really ever unanimously behind their closer, even when the fans of every other team drools over them.

And are you seriously comparing Wags to Benitez? I don’t think there are many Mets fans who would, now or then…

]]> By: mikey_FF http://www.metsblog.com/2008/09/08/poll-if-wagner-is-out-for-year-who-is-closer/#comment-321468 mikey_FF Mon, 08 Sep 2008 18:00:40 +0000 http://www.metsblog.com/2008/09/08/poll-if-wagner-is-out-for-year-who-is-closer/#comment-321468 Tear of MCL. Tear of MCL.

]]> By: mikey_FF http://www.metsblog.com/2008/09/08/poll-if-wagner-is-out-for-year-who-is-closer/#comment-321465 mikey_FF Mon, 08 Sep 2008 17:59:58 +0000 http://www.metsblog.com/2008/09/08/poll-if-wagner-is-out-for-year-who-is-closer/#comment-321465 I used to have this same argument with some people about Armando Benitez when he was the teams closer. People want to like a guy ... they like a guy. What can I say. Trevor Hoffman is a "great" closer too ... yet he crumbles every time in the big spot. Does that take away from his stats? NO. He'll probably go to the hall of fame. Doesn't take away from the fact that he's a choker. Billy is no different. He's a good pitcher, dominating at times ... but tell any Met fan that "blown saves" are not a "useful statistic" when the guy on the hill in game 7 of the NLCS or WS trying to close it out ... I don't think anyone will want to hear it. By the way ... Tear in his arm. Out for 1 year. Wagner is GONE. Just reported on WFAN. Let it go. I used to have this same argument with some people about Armando Benitez when he was the teams closer. People want to like a guy … they like a guy. What can I say.

Trevor Hoffman is a “great” closer too … yet he crumbles every time in the big spot. Does that take away from his stats? NO. He’ll probably go to the hall of fame. Doesn’t take away from the fact that he’s a choker.

Billy is no different. He’s a good pitcher, dominating at times …

but tell any Met fan that “blown saves” are not a “useful statistic” when the guy on the hill in game 7 of the NLCS or WS trying to close it out … I don’t think anyone will want to hear it.

By the way … Tear in his arm. Out for 1 year. Wagner is GONE. Just reported on WFAN.

Let it go.

]]> By: kidfromqueens http://www.metsblog.com/2008/09/08/poll-if-wagner-is-out-for-year-who-is-closer/#comment-321453 kidfromqueens Mon, 08 Sep 2008 17:54:39 +0000 http://www.metsblog.com/2008/09/08/poll-if-wagner-is-out-for-year-who-is-closer/#comment-321453 If you want to base your judgment of whether or not he's a "choker" entirely on those ten innings when there's a huge body of evidence over a long career that suggests otherwise, that's certainly your right, but it seems to be an unusual way for a team to make baseball decisions, and not one I'd advocate the Mets adopting. We can certainly simply agree to disagree on that, though. If you want to base your judgment of whether or not he’s a “choker” entirely on those ten innings when there’s a huge body of evidence over a long career that suggests otherwise, that’s certainly your right, but it seems to be an unusual way for a team to make baseball decisions, and not one I’d advocate the Mets adopting. We can certainly simply agree to disagree on that, though.

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