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Last week, in a chat for ESPN.com, Baseball America’s Jim Callis ranked Mets 17–year-old SS Wilmer Flores as the organization’s top prospect – ahead of Fernando Martinez.
Yesterday, in a mailbag for Baseball America, Callis was asked how he could rank Flores over Martinez, to which he responded:
“Both Flores and Martinez have interesting bats, and the big difference between the two is that there’s more to Flores’ game than just his offense. He has a chance to play a premium position and at worse will be a third baseman, while Martinez will be a left fielder…While Martinez has been pushed aggressively by the Mets and consistently has been very young for his leagues, he hasn’t been overwhelmingly impressive since a 45-game stint in low Class A…Flores will be 17 when he heads to low Class A next year, and I think he’ll outperform Martinez. It’s still very early in Flores’ career, but I’ve had scouts compare his ceiling to Miguel Cabrera’s.”
In 275 at bats between Single-A Brooklyn and Kingsport, the 17–tear-old Flores hit .306 with eight HR 47 RBI during 67 games.
Callis also answers questions about other top outfielder prospects, as well as Yankees C Jesus Montero, and the state of signing players from the top of the draft, among other questions.
Also, for more on the minors, check out Mets Minor League Blog, where Toby Hyde answers a mailbag question about the pros and cons of moving Triple-A to Syracuse or Buffalo.
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cabrera? really? wow.
I saw Flores on SNY and you have to be impressed. The guy is a STICK. He has so much room to fill out and already has power, which is normally the last tool to come.
I think both are elite prospects.
Callis is a known Martinez hater.
Callis is not a kown Martinez hater… first of all.. ranking F-mart our 2nd best overall prospect is hardly “hating”.. secondly what does he say that’s not true?
He’s had a hard time stay healthy.. and he’s under performed at AA which everyone excuses cause of his age…
It’s hard to know what he’s gonna be yet….
Callis ranks Martinez second because he thinks THAT lowly of Martinez.
Whereas most guys have Martinez in their top 20 of overall prospects (or higher), Callis has him way down after the top 50.
Hater.
Callis ranks Martinez second because he thinks THAT lowly of Martinez.
i meant Callis ranks Martinez second because he thinks THAT lowly of the Mets minor league system.
It’s kinda hard to give a guy props when the numbers arent there… yes hes young for AA.. but the play on the field just doesn’t back him up…
His age and projection do balance that out somewhat… but sooner or later he needs to play consistently or he’s not going to be ranked as a top prospect..
That’s just the truth.
Does anyone else rank Flores ahead of F-Mart?
There haven’t been any prospect rankings released from any credible outlets, so it’s hard to say at this point.
Based purely on upside, Flores gets the nod. However, it’s so hard to accurately project players that are that young and at such a low level. For all that has been made of Martinez’s lack of production (which is way overblown), Flores has accomplished absolutely nothing at any meaningful level. As such, I still rate Martinez higher than Flores.
“There haven’t been any prospect rankings released from any credible outlets,”
“I still rate Martinez higher than Flores.”
And now… well there still hasn’t been a ranking by a cedible outlet.
You are a fool.
“credible.” now I’m a fool. But you still are, too.
Oh and Matt it wasnt a chat.. it was his weekly ask BA segment.. he does have another chat on ESPN today at 2PM.. I’m sure he’ll get a few more questions on this
Fernando Martinez might actually get to play with the Mets before the decade is out.
Flores will be interesting to keep an eye on but I’m sure a lot will change as he works his way through the system.
I can’t wait to see how Goldstein ranks him at the end of the year.
The Mets farm is not that bad after all.
From what I’ve heard about Flores, mostly through here, defense isn’t his strong suit. I thought it was known he wasn’t going to play SS very long past this year.
I dunno.. Flores is good and Martinez is in injury bug.. hmm I’ll still choose Martinez over Flores.. more experience..
So if Flores plays short and may one day play third and with Jose Reyes and David Wright firmly entrenched in those positions, where the hell would Flores play?
how about 2nd?? or try catcher??? or left field??
How about 3b when David Wright moves over to 1b in 3 years?
I would rank Flores ahead of F-Mart also.
Wilmer was 16 years old and hitting home runs against professional pitchers in professional parks. To top it off he also hit over .300. That is no small feat. He is just past pony league and he is playing on a much higher level and succeeding as well. By the time he is 22 or 23 he would have had 6 or 7 years experience behind him. That is about the age many guys are first making it to the bigs. the difference with him is he would have started getting all of his experience at a higher level than those other guys. He would only be better. The odds are also that he will play in the bigs before he is 20 years old. And usually that makes a guy a bust or a hall of famer.
F-Mart may be good, but Flores has shown more promise.
Now if you want to rank our organization this year against it last year I like what we have more this year.
Last year, we had F-Mart then Humber , Guerra and Mulvey.
This year we have Flores, Niese, Murphy, F-Mart, Holt and Evans and all of them are hot commodities. The beauty of it is that we don’t really need to make many big trades this off-season.
No trade?!? hmm I dunno.. we might need to trade for a closer.. like Street or maybe Cordero
And not sign one?
The operative word is “need”
We could sign a closer.. but K-Rod asks too much money.. we need that money for SP like Sheets or other big pitchers..
Silly. We are not goint to get Ollie AND Sheets because of the market. However, we very well may be able to get Ollie, Krod and a #5 pitcher.
Of course these are the same pundits and talent evaluators that proclaimed the Mets Farm system so bad, and so barren that they just did not have enough there to even get Johan Santana.
Well, they did get Santana, and still have young players like:
A. Reyes
Evans
Murphy
Kunz
FMart
Flores
Niese
Parnell
There is a reason these experts sell subscriptions and don’t work as talent evaluators for Major League Franchise.
Exactly…history is littered with expectations that were way too lofty and conversely, players that were a surprise success. Otherwise, a guy like Piazza would have never fallen to the bottom of the draft and there never would have been a #1 pick that was not a perennial all star.
Why on earth would you include A. Reyes? He is terrible. Every farm system has a guy like him. He will never be more than a backup on an average team. AAAA
Yeah, I don’t get the love affair with Argenis. He is pretty bad. Yeah, he plays good defense and has a ton of energy, but his offensive is nonexistent. He has a negative VORP! An EqA of barely over .200! The guy is terrible.
Not to mention he’s not even a product of our system, which would maybe make some of the love make sense. Wasn’t he an FA signing. He’s basically a young AAAA, except he may not even be good enough for that offensively.
Reyes is really not a prospect. He’s not good on offense and he’s older than Jose Reyes.
What have you seen in Kunz that has you excited?
Parnell wasn’t great in the minors.
I think your list is a bit optimistic.
But I’d add Holt to your list.
“there’s more to Flores’ game than just his offense”
What happened to Martinez being hyped as a 5-tool player?
He still has all of the tools. However, his skill set is more suited to the OF or 1B. You have a guy like Beltran whose tools play well in the OF, whereas they might not play in the IF. Martinez has a good arm, good fielding instincts, good speed, and will hit for at least average, if not power. The tools are all there, especially if he slips into the OF.
i hope f-mart is great and flores is even better :)
a m. cabrera who plays d works for me though we have a couple of guys at ss and 3b. know what i’m saying
Why does it even matter who is 1st? History says that both will be flops., If we are lucky enough maybe one of them works out. Hopefully it’s for the Mets.
Thank you. It really doesn’t matter at all.
It’s so far away. We don’t need to be ranking guy’s who have barely even been here who don’t have college experience. If you put that kind of a ceiling on it, it’s obvious he’ll turn out somewhere below it. You’re expecting Miguel Cabrera? You may wind up getting Todd Zeile which isn’t that bad, but still. He won’t be playing SS or 3B on this team even if it’s another 3-4 years until he’s up here. 2B is a possibility. Or perhaps even the OF if the Mets don’t re-sign Beltran in a few years or they don’t have Church anymore.
Martinez is going to be good. It’s just we been through this with Milledge and Gomez before. Both of them are going to be good ball players, but I don’t know if they’ll be great. I know they wouldn’t have been in New York, although I was more confident with Carlos than Lastings. Fernando’s run into the same wall as those two guy’s in that he’s gotten hurt. Reyes did too though. I wouldn’t dim any confidence for Fernando. Look at his age. Even if he weren’t to play for the Mets until 2010 or 2011, why is that a bad thing? Wouldn’t he still be younger than Murphy, Pelfrey and a bunch of other guys before making their debuts? I want to see what a guy is made of in the pro’s before judging other prospects over him. That’s what led us to believing Gomez was better than Milledge and F-Mart was better than Gomez. It may turn out that we would have preferred trading F-Mart over Gomez to Minnesota for Santana who would have done that. One reason why the Mets wanted to trade Gomez more was because of injuries. They rushed Milledge and Gomez. They’re done it a little with F-Mart, but they should turn on the breaks until it’s time.
Why is it silly? He’s younger.. plays a more premium position.. and had a better year then F-mart..
If prospects are about as much as projection and stats.. then you can certainly make a case for Flores.
‘…BA always is low on the Mets, and were pimping the most mediocre Yankee prospects…’
i agree. i am still waiting to find the media outlet that gives met farmhands love.
pretty much anyone with knowledge who has seen fernando martinez swing the bat predicts the boy will hit major league pitching.
ralph kiner, who knows a thing or two, loves that sweet swing and approach.
you just keep acting like the world’s against you
they are