Billy Wagner’s 2009 salary is not covered by insurance, reports Ben Shpigel in the New York Times, meaning the team will be responsible for $10.5 million.
According to Shpigel, “That makes it extraordinarily unlikely that they will pursue a high-priced closer like Francisco Rodríguez of the Angels.”
…thanks to Kenneth T for the link…
Shpigel also reports on the state of Ramon Castro, while profiling Brian Stokes, who allowed a run last night for the first time in 10 appearances.
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{ 104 comments }
I saw that this morning. Of course, the NY Times also thought Beltran would be a Yankee and that the Mets didn’t have a shot at Santana.
The Mets have enough money to spend on both one year of Wagner’s salary and X years on a closer like K-Rod.
But will they have enough money to add the extra 15 million, plus retool the rest of the bullpen. Plus bring in 2 starters? And possibly retool the bench?
They need 1 rightie, 1 leftie, one closer, some bullpen help and a bench. Pedro and OP are up, do you resign either one of them? OP has shown that he still inconsistent but will still want mega money. What to do?
Totally unrelated and off topic…..
Go to the Mets schedule on Mets.com. Apparently we’re playing Darth Vader on the 16th.
Yeah, that’s on every MLB schedule. Has to do with a release of some Star Wars video game.
Lol, I saw that last a few days ago and was wondering if the Mets were big video game fans. Now, if you’re a next gen geek like myself, you’d know this game (whether you’re a fan of SW or not) should be pretty rediculous. It’s got great potential and SW fans are gunna go bezerk!
I’ve been lobbying for K-Rod since BEFORE Wagner went down. I could care less how much it costs the Wilpons, and quite frankly, they shouldnt care either! They are going to be making money hand over fist with this new “stadium” they built, not to mention the network. Pay for K-Rod and Wagner, it wont hurt a bit…
Easy to spend money that’s not yours, eh?
Very easy, actually.
Well, we are the consumer technically, and we pay for their product…so we’ll pay for it eventually..
actually it is our money with what we spend in tickets prices,food, parking, merchandise, and our cable bills we definitly are paying for it,actually if the metss sell out every single ticket and suite for next year that adds up to 365 million dollars, by my estimate the wilpons will be very very rich
“Easy to spend money that’s not yours, eh?”
Politicians do it every day!
I’m so glad this Schmiegel guy isn’t the Mets GM. He doesn’t understand that the 10 mil is already spent and we can’t do anything about it and we will still need a closer. Whatcha gonna do about it? Sit and moan that we already spent 10 mil on one who is out for the year? OR GO GET ANOTHER ONE? DUH!
I am pretty sure that this team will get a big time closer for next year. They know that we are operating on Borrowed time with Ayala right now and that it is not a real option for next season. Wagners salary will have no effect on the decision. It is essentially a one year punch in the gut. The closer they will likely bring in would be a multiyear guy with a multiyear contract.
With Citifield opening and the success of SNY and hopefully flush with a little extra money from playoff baseball this year….I see it as a nonissue the concern over insurance paying his nut or not.
GO BRING IN THE GUY YOU NEED
Awesome
That stinks. I wonder if the insurance company found a loop hole. why would we pay for insurance if they dont insure a pitchers arm problems? Something sounds wrong with that.
I’ve written 3 responses to this and they keep getting eaten. idk why. Basically it’s not that there’s a loop holes, as far as I understand, we didn’t have insurance in wagners contract for this year. Insurance companies don’t allow teams to insure whole contracts anymore.
I think that the last couple of years of long-term contracts to pitchers are often uninsurable- I don’t think it’s a loophole, I think it’s something explicitly not covered in most policies.
An insurance company exploiting a loophole to avoid paying a claim?? I REFUSE TO BELIEVE IT!!!
/sarcasm
Would you insure any closer’s throwing arm?
My bad i re-read the post and saw we did no have a policy.
If Kunz, Parnell, and/or Holt were a year further along in their development, I’d say just let them battle for closer in the Spring. But since they are not, you can still let Parnell and Kunz battle for a bullpen spot, and leave Holt in the minor leage rotation, but you need a more established closer.
You have to take a shot at K-Rod. He’ll only be 28, is an elite closer, and would only cost money. I’d hope with Citi Field opening, and with Pedro, Duque, Alou, and others coming off the books, the Mets would look to spend to get Ollie, another starter, and K-Rod. Plus, even though there is 10.5 million tied up with Billy Wagner, they would only have to eat it for one year.
K-rod will actually only be 26.
But K-rod isn’t the only option on the market. We could always try and get Fuentes for a shorter/cheaper contract.
Fuentes is 33. No more signing old FA players!
For some reason I am skeptical about Fuentas, but you are correct. It’s not K-Rod or bust.
Bringing in Fuentas would probably mean they would need a right handed compliment. If Ayala keeps it up, I say give him the shot. Other than a few months earlier this year, he has been solid his entire career.
The way bullpens seem to shake out, if I were the Mets I would do everything I could to set up a seven man bullpen that does not include Duaner or Aaron Heilman. Not that I don’t think they are capable, but I believe they have options, so you could bring them to Spring training and let them fight to get into the bullpen, or be insurance in case of injury.
But I guess I should stop looking ahead to 2009, or else I may just miss out on a magical Fall of 2008.
fuentes stinks. how many times has that guy been demoted only to be reinstated because the replacement was worse. do you want to throw money at this kind of guy?
go for the sure thing in k-rod. he’s younger and better.
Pitcher and sure thing really don’t belong in the same sentence, at least not when it comes to this team.
Look at it this way, they signed Pedro for four years and got about two out of him and that didn’t stop them from signing players. So why should this?
Like who? Moises Alou? Santana is the only major contract we’ve brought in since then that’s spiked the payroll. Even with the new stadium I don’t think it’s very realistic to expect the payroll to balloon again this year.
Wasn’t Beltran signed after Pedro?
Billy Wagner as well? Plus bringing in Delgado’s 3yr/48mill left on his contract counts too. You’re way off base if you think Pedro was the last big contract before Johan.
He was talking about Pedro being injured, as far as I know Pedro wasn’t injured when those guys were brought in.
I agree- given the significant payroll jump going into this season, whether we agree with it or not, the practical fact is that we’re very unlikely to see a similar salary spike next season, which means that we have limited choices. As great as K-Rod might be, given that acquiring him would mean that we’d have to skimp on our other, more pressing needs like the rotation,and middle relief, and that’s without even getting into areas like the bench and possibly a 2B, it just doesn’t seem worth it.
I’d rather go cheaper on a closer, who will only pitch 70 or 80 innings a year and spend the money on starting pitching than the other way around.
No closer is worth $75 million over 5 years. Mariano is making $15 mil a year and I have never seen K-Rod come close to being as good as Mariano over the years.
…and our first round pick.
Well he’s about to brake the all time record for most saves in a year. I think that means something.
Yes, It means that the Angels play a ton of close games and saves are an reflection on oppurtunity. That is what it means. Absolutely nothing more.
“That makes it extraordinarily unlikely that they will pursue a high-priced closer like Francisco Rodríguez of the Angels.”
First, he’s the only high-priced closer. Brian Fuentes is the 2nd best closer on the market and he’s not making $15M a year. $10.5M is pocket change to this franchise. If they want K-Rod, there’s nothing stopping them from getting him. This team can afford a $200M payroll if they wanted it
when did we become the Yankees sheesh
That makes no sense. If you’re going to buy insurance, and it doesn’t cover Wagner, why buy insurance at all?
So if he gets injured during the time that insurance is offered, you don’t have to pay his salary.
Crazy idea would be to put pelfrey in that spot and find another very good pitcher from within or outside the organization to take his spot.
Pelf clearly has the pitching tools. He throws heat, has multiple pitches in his arsenal and is gaining that intestinal fortitude to show he can handle pressure.
As to what is out there…It may be easier to sign Garland and Oliver Perez than to find a suitable closer next year.
Rotation of Santana, Garland, Perez, Maine and …cross your fingers with Niese.
Pelfrey closes games and the rest of the pen is adjusted accordingly.
Its a crazy idea but may be the better option down the line
I don’t think it’s crazy, but that basically leaves us with Johan and Maine, and we don’t really know what to expect from him since he’s been everything from a strong 2 to a mediocre 4 the last two years, and 3 more spots to fill.
robbing peter to pay paul is never a good idea. you don’t waste pelfrey’s talent in the bullpen. i don’t trust maine.
pelfrey needs to keep his WHIP down to be an efective closer, and show he can do it for a full season. He just lets too many baserunners on. He does get timely DP balls, so that is a plus.
Pelfreys whip is nothing to be concerned about at all. Even if you look at it for the season, it is in the 1.3’s. In the last 10 weeks, I would bet it is much, much lower then that.
Yes, take our young stud SP in his second full year, and put him in the bullpen. I think I just barfed on myself.
I hope the front office takes all of these recent injuries into consideration (alou, duque, pedro, wagner) and decides against guys like burnett, sheets or sabathia. Let the yankees take burnett, his contract will be almost 100% uninsurable given his history.
Since when is Sabbathis injury prone??? I keep seeing posts on here saying not to go and get him because they’re worried about an injury. He’s never had any type of injury in his career. Sign him and move Maine to the closer’s spot. No closer is worth $15 mill/per. Closer is the most over-rated position in baseball.
Great poist Papdog. And besides, nobody cares how risky it would be to give a little Johan Santana with a lot of innings on his arm a 7 year deal for 140 million. Now all the sudden they are worried about injuries? We have such a bunch of hypocritical fans.
Off-Topic alert!
I’ve got 4 tickets for the Mets-Braves game this coming Saturday at 3:55pm. I can’t go, and am looking to sell. Before posting on stub-hub, I wanted to see if any true Mets fans are interested. Tickets are LOGE RESERVED BACK ROWS Section 11, Row L, Seats 18-21…face value is $20…I don’t have to sell all 4 at once. If interested, you can email me at ravikirtane@gmail.com
I would love to know the specifics of the reason behind the Mets not having insurance on Wagner….. Was it because it’s impossible to insure/companies won’t insure entire contracts for one reason or another, or is it because the Mets were foolish and or didn’t want to spend the money on insurance?
Ironically, Mo Vaughn is the reason why this is an issue.
Too bad the Mets don’t have Geico. They’ll insure anyone.
Zing!
sign k-rod. period.
why would you take out insurance on a 37-38 year old reliever?
I think they should go after k-rod as well. We paid alou 7.5 mil this year and duque 6.5. We also paid 2 mill to jorge sosa. That money alone could justify paying k-rod while still paying wags for 1 year.
To those complaining that K-rod’s velocity is down, that his delivery is violent – what’s the relevance? I don’t care if his #s are down from past seasons despite his high save total. The guy is an elite closer. Period. Period. That’s it, he’s probably with Mo and Papelbon as a top 3 closer and it’s not debatable. And as others have pointed out, he’s changed his delivery so as to avoid injury. Go spend the dough and get this guy in here because the same people apposing this move will be complaining about Omar’s inability to land KRod or any other stellar closer. Getting visions of this bullpen for all of 09 is not pretty.
Go. Get. K-Rod.
I would actually say its debatable.
It’s debatable as to whether ot not K-Rod being a top 3 closer is debatable. Who else is in there? Unless it’s the other 2 guys you don’t think belong in the top 3.
“That’s it, he’s probably with Mo and Papelbon as a top 3 closer and it’s not debatable. ”
This statement is just so wrong I do not even know where to begin. First of all, he is not even on the level of Paps, or Mo. Nathan is much better then K-Rod. So is Saito. I will take a healthy Putz over K-Rod everyday. Give me Lidge or Wagner over K-Rod. He just is not that good. Give me Luis Ayala and I am happy with it. The teams that pay huge dollars for closers are suckers. Saves are a reflection of chances, and you can get a guy for 2 million to do the same job as a guy making 13 million if you look in the right places. Ayala has been really good for his whole career, and will cost a fraction of K-Rod. I am perfectly content with Ayala closing.
And in the 6 years Nathan and K-Rd have both been pitching full years, K-Rod has has an era below 2.00 two times. Nathan has had one above 2.00 just two times. and in the last 3 years, K-Rods numbers have been …..
2006- 1.73/1.09
2007- 2.81/1.24
2008- 2.45/1.25
Nathan…..
2006- 1.58/0.79
2007- 1.88/1.01
2008- 1.05/0.93
Papelbon….
2006- 0.92/0.77
2007- 1.85/0.77
2008- 1.89/0.90
Mariano… well he has had era’s under 2 5 out of the last 6 years.
K-Rod is not in the league of any of those guys.
why would you not?
Im pretty sure Zen was being facetious…
I think it is clear that the bullpen is the only serious upgrade the current roster needs. I am sure the Mets can afford to 1)resign Perez and 2) sign Rodriguez and remain financially secure and then some. I think Rodriguez is the perfect sign. He fills in the most glaring need. He’s really, really good. And he’s really, really young. Unlike a lot of the free agent signings where you take a bath at the end of the contract when the player gets old and fades, he’s liable to be a top performer for the entire contract, in which case he’ll be worth every penny.
we’d need a nice Venezuelan nickname for Santana-Krod games.
It makes more sense to use that 15MM per year on an impact typ starting pitcher (Sheets/Perez). I really think Omar is going to make a run at Houston Street, which, as long as he’s healthy they can get at a reasonable price.
I think the 4th year for a reliever is really hard to insure or almost not worth it… In this case it would have been…
I think you can’t go for K-Rod. That money will be better spent elsewhere. I think you need to find a closer with what you have in house at this point…
Also, side note, My friend sent a couple of us this email
“Is it me, or r is the metsblog dude a little too much. Does he really need to have his sleeves rolled up all the time as though he’s buried in his laptop?”
I got a kick out of that. I think Matt does a great job, but does he really need to make it look like he doesn’t have everyone’s dream job???
Real men roll up their sleeves and get down to business. I always have my sleeves rolled up while posting hard here at Metsblog and in between doing actual, “real”, work.
Or, maybe he just likes to roll up his sleeves, and isn’t thinking that hard about what other people think…
touche Matthew, touche
By the way, doesn’t this article really just serve as an example as to why you shouldn’t sign K-rod for the money and years he is going to want. They gotta eat $10.5M. Have you seen how violent and herky jerky motion. Its freggin scary
Can’t believe i actually went out to the NY Times website…the things I do for my team!
oh no, a real newspaper! quick, go back to the post or news…your brain might start hurting!
What crap. Unless what the NYTimes is saying is that due to Wagner’s contract, they’re not going after any big time free agents, this makes no sense.
Fred Wilpon is a financially savvy guy. Certainly he understands the concept of “sunk cost”. Whether or not they go after any free agents, they will have to pay this money to Wagner. The idea that “we are only willing to spend $x on our bullpen, and if those dollars are going to injured players than we just have that much less for players who can actually play,” well that’s just dumb in my opinion.
Go get K-Rod. Or, if there is a less expensive option that can truly get the job done, fine. But don’t avoid K-Rod just because Wagner’s contract isn’t insured. Do you want to win or not?
Must be Allianz Insurance…f’in nazis
too bad we are not a big market team with money to spend, oh wait…
There’s just no way at this point to know what k-rod will actually command as far as dollars and years. It wouldn’t surprise me to see him get 15 million per, but I just don’t see him getting 5 years. I’d love to see him in a mets uni, but I could also see omar trying to put a package together for JJ Putz. Seattle would be foolish not to shop him.
Do you really want Putz pitching in New York with its large Jewish population? :)
We spent 7 million this year on letting El Duque rehab, what’s to stop us from signing a big time closer while Billy is out?
Maybe I missed it, but was there a post on here today regarding the Newsday article today about D. Wright. It was a great article about visiting a firehouse by the WTC. Apparently he has gone three years in a row as the teams representative. Very touching and shows D. Wright is a good guy and not bigger than himself.
i didn’t see it posted here, but…
newsday.com/sports/baseball/mets/ny-spwright0911,0,2031864.story
Great article…thanks for posting!
The Mets have been consistently making some of the biggest signings for the past several years.
Anybody who thinks they are just going to sit on their hands this offseason is nuts.
According to Shpigel, “That makes it extraordinarily unlikely that they will pursue a high-priced closer like Francisco Rodríguez of the Angels.”
That is an idiotic statement by Shpigel. The Mets are drawing 4 million this year and have a new stadium next year. There is no way eating 10 million is going to keep them from getting a player they need.
Omar has two things to worry about this offseson: 1) signing a new closer and 2) making sure that the Phils (the only team in the division that can afford to) don’t sign Sabathia because I just don’t see the Brews being able to afford the contract he’ll want. If he goes to another team besides the Phils, who cares? Imagine a Santana/Sabathia 1-2 rotation.
Im thinking we sign Sabathia then go trade for Roy Holliday and Roy Oswalt. Also we Should sign Sheets as the 5th starter and sign pedro as a long reliever. Put maine and pelfrey in the bull pen.
Are we at over kill yet? Ironically our payroll would still be lower than the yankees were this year, but our farm ystem will be less than non existant.
Sabathia will not happen. Id rather get Krod
Sabathia is going to the Bronx.
I’m not saying that Sabathia is a must have. I would rather have a sure fire closer also. What I am saying is that if the Phils go after Sabathia the Mets have to make sure they don’t get him. Even if it takes some creativeness.
You would rather have K-Rod then Sabathia. Roflmfao.
Yes, and I would rather sleep with Rosie Odonnel then Jessica Alba.
“Sabathia is going to the Bronx.”
No he is not.
I do not think CC in pin stripes is a sure thing, but it is pretty close.
It seems to be no secret that he wants to either finish his career with the tribe or on the west coast. Since Shapiro shot that down, it looks like he is headed west. However, it is never that easy is it. There are twor teams that would be willing to spend the money. The Angels, Dodgers. The Dodgers don’t spend much usually and they have to think about re-signing Manny. The Angels have K-Rod and Tex to worry about.
If the Dodgers and Anahiem try to low ball CC, then I can see the Yanks schmooz CC like Steinbrener did Reggie, and also throw Johan money at him, and CC will be a Yankee.
I think Wagner must have been insured by Lloyds of Lubbock.
Why do people have problems with Ayala closing? What if we win the World Series and Ayala continues to close games efficiently? Then would you people still think we should get K-Rod rather than a top starter? With Pedro gone we will have the money to sign some1 like a Sabathia… I think Santana, Sabathia, Pelfrey, Maine would be the best 1-4 in all of baseball… Who knows, maybe Neise can be a suprise 5th…
If he closes every single game from here on out without giving up a run….there’s still no chance I want him closing games in 09.
You guys have me concerned about the Thigpen situation and K-Rod burning out this season.
I still see Garland coming here after Sabathia goes to the Yanks and Sheets stays with the Brew Crew.
Maybe we keep OP as well
Santana
Maine
OP
Garland
Pelfrey
That’s a nice solid rotation, add K-Rod or trade for a closer, and we’re in good shape. Maybe even Parnell, Kunz or Stokes steps up as an option from within ala Papelbon? That would be ideal in my mind.
This is wonderful news. Say no to K-Rod, Omar. He is not even that good, compare his meaningful peripherals to wagner and Wagner comes way out on top. K-Rod is overated, not to mention he has lost 5-6 mph off his fastball at age 26. Went from throwing 96-97 to 91-93. Plus even the best closer ever is not worth the money K-Rod wants. Garland stinks. Bleh. He will cost 8 figures too. I would rather let Heilman pitch better then Garland for a fraction of the price. CC will not be a Yankee. Gaurunteed. I am done. Let the bashing begin.
As much as I actually like Heilman, he is this season’s Mota. He comes into a game and you just hold your breath. Omar may just have to trade him like he did Mota last offseason
That would be stupid. Just let him try to start. They need a starter and he will be cheap. Jon Garland will cost 8 figures for a track record of being a bad pitcher. Atleast Heilman has some upside as a starter.
THAT would be stupid. Do you REALLY want Aaron Heilman to be on this Mets team next year? Heck no. Jon Garland may not have the best record of being a good pitcher, but at least he is respectable.
Nonsense. Yes, I want Heilman on the team next year — as a starter only.
Heilman could probably pitch as a starter comparably to Garland …. only he’s not going to cost about $10 million.
I think it depends on how we finish our season this year. If we don’t make the playoffs, which I doubt, then I think the Mets will spend like money is water. If we win the whole thing, they may just look for a cheaper option at closer
If they signed K-Rod, there would only be one year where his salary would overlap with Wagner’s. I think they should do it.
Even if they have to go over the LT threshold for 1 year, it will be worth it. There is enough $$$ coming off the books that they can afford Ollie, K-Rod and if they feel the need, one mid-level starter.
I still think they should put Heilman at the back end of the rotation though. He doesn’t make millions and will be cheap.
So, it could be:
Johan
Ollie
Pelfrey
Maine
Heilman
Niese (as the backup, starting the year at AAA)
Whether they sign K-Rod or not, they need to make major changes in the bullpen.
oh hell… just bring back Balk Benitez
Can’t believe I just said that. *puke*
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