The Mets lost two of three to the Braves this weekend.
In Game 1 on Saturday, Johan Santana handed off a two-run lead to the bullpen, who let up three runs and the Braves won.
On Sunday, Oliver Perez handed off another two-run lead to the bullpen, who let up five runs in the ninth and the Braves won.
As such, the Phillies were able to pick up two games in the standings, and move to within two losses of the Mets for first place in the NL East.
Manuel, on the loss, and September, speaking to reporters following yesterday’s loss to the Braves, said:
“For us, coming down the stretch, at this point, every loss will probably be a reminder of what happened last year. So, what we have to do as a team is get through it.”
As far as I am concerned, it’s all about the bullpen.
The way I see it, the Mets, like most teams, will only go as far as their bullpen allows them.
It’s that simple.
The problem is that, since the news on September 8 that Billy Wagner would miss the rest of the season, the Mets bullpen has a 4.11 ERA in five appearances, during which the Mets are 3–2.
Prior, the team’s bullpen had not been charged with a run in its previous seven appearances, during which the Mets were 5–2.
Again, bullpen, bullpen, bullpen.
{ 88 comments }
Its just really frustrating when our team is playing great baseball for the most part and it is the bullpen that we live and die by. We have great players on our team and they are all on point right now yet it is a collection of inconsistent unreliable relief pitchers that we rest our fate on.
Our bullpen S-T-I-N-K-S.
*Period*
The bullpen is probably looking at your stupid magic number before they go into the game, TAKE IT DOWN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Take it down, take it down
I agree– take it down.
(even though we can’t actually blame that for the Mets bullpen struggles)
Can we take it down now? It isn’t a magic number, it is a disappointment waiting to happen.
Taking down a magic number count is not going to all of a sudden make the bullpen pitch lights out. It could be possible they go on another scoreless streak even with the magic number there, we are just finding things to blame this loss and series loss on as bad as it is.
What’s going on with Al Reyes though? Is he still hurt? Why isn’t he being used? They have to bring in Show for important innings? Al Reyes at least has an idea of how to get important outs in the later innings.
Ayala was going to eventually contribute to the inconsistant bad bullpen foundation and blow the game, a guy doesn’t have a over 5 ERA for no reason.
The offense went into snoozefest after the 5th inning, it’s like they are allergic to tacking on runs and scoring runs with the bases loaded with no outs and all this against a bad Braves team that’s just playing out the season.
Or how about getting a hit with runners in scoring position. They had ample opportunities on Sunday to add some runs but failed.
Blame it on the bullpen if you want, but as always, you win and lose as a team.
As much as the bullpen is horrendous, the clubs inability to add on runs, and take advantage of offensive situations is also critically to blame….
Yes, why don’t people get that?! It’s right there, people, watch a game and you’ll see it. You may see the bullpen blow it to, but like I said, you win and lose as a team. So if it makes you feel better to blame the bullpen, go ahead, but you’re missing half of the problem.
I believe they were 0-10 with RISP. This a trend that was happening earlier in the season. They were terrible at getting runners in. It seems like they are regressing. Same thing in Game 1 on Saturday. 2 different innings with bases loaded no outs. They got 2 runs. It is shameful.
Real teams don’t need their offense to get them a 5+ run buffer every night
Its is shameful that a closer blows a game with a 2 run lead in the 9th inning. He even did so with out recording an out.
Our offense HAS been better in the late innings in the last few weeks, you can argue it that, but its true. We have stuck around late in games and have come from behind in a few of them.
blame it on the magic number.
its 13 with 14 games to play. totally irrelevant.
Agreed 100%…I was at the Johan game on Saturday, and when Easley hit into that DP with the bases loaded and 0 outs, I could just tell that it would come back to haunt them.
The Brewers have lost 8/11 since we swept them, and in those games, they have never scored more than 4 runs.
The Mets have the Wild Card to fall back on, God forbid they give up 1st place. I don’t think they will…but it’s worth noting.
You are right…we are essentially tied for the WC as well. Knock on wood, but if the Mets are to win the division, I want Philly to take the wild card, as the Mets would then go on to face the Dodgers in the LDS, as opposed to C.C. and the Brewers
What was the deal yesterday with Shea looking half empty in the 9th inning? At the same time I turn on the Phillies and there stadium is packed with people waving white towels. That concerns me! There fans are pumped and confident and the Met fans are scared to stay an watch the 9th? We need to rally behind the Mets and that last weekend Met fans have to go there with the attitude that 2007 never happened and try and will this team to the division crown. I truely believe a home crowd can help and if you watch the Phillies when they play at home you can’t tell me that there fans are not helping. Lets do the same thing! Lets get these guys over the hump and help out a little bit. Not leave in the 7th inning so you don’t have to watch them fail! That just sucks….
There were a lot of boys and girls scouts there and they along with other families lined up outside for the Mr. Met dash. Last time for kids to run the bases in our ballpark.
Was at Shea yesterday. Not a lot of diehards there with it being football Sunday and the Jets playing the Patsies. Eagles play tonight so Phillie fans were not distracted. Also very hot at Shea yesterday, so some folks decide to leave. For me I left too as my 2 year old son only lasts so long.
Overall the upper level and the loge level had tons of empty seats. My seats are outer loge box and 1/3 of the seats were empty.
I can understand having the 2 year old and having to leave. I just don’t get how in September the Mets are not getting soldout weekend crowds. I almost laughed when Gary said that yesterday’s was the biggest crowd EVER for a Braves game at Shea. Was he serious? I mean did 55,000 purchase tickets and only 30,000 came? It’s just frustrating to not feel the energy at Shea in late September when they have a 2 game lead in the division. This seemed to be just like last year, The Phillies fans really jumped on board and that place was rocking!! Can’t we do the same??
The game was actually sold out from my understanding. The day of game ticket office was closed when I got there about a half hour prior to the game.
There were a lot of families at the game but I did see a lot of groups of adults start to leave in the 8th. A bunch had small tv’s watching the football games and what not. I stayed until the end despite knowing what will happen. It was funny the crowd was getting into it after Wright and Delgado got on in the 9th. I turned to my fiancee and said wow you are so gullible as she was clapping and getting excited.
It was also 95 a horrendously humid out.
Well us fans need to suck it up! Football is just starting and it should all be about the Mets!! We need to help this club because it’s obvious that they can’t do it alone. 50,000 screaming Met fans the final weekend is what we need! I am going to purchase tickets now, well with the exception of the last game..lol There a little pricey..
Lets not allow the Phillies to do this again! We hate there fans and I want to help the Mets hold them off. Lets go!!!!!!!
BTW – You people left to watch Favre throw one TD all game? Good! Maybe next time your keep focused on the Mets!!!
Where’s the magic number for the wild card?
Given that Schoeneweis and Heilman can’t get anyone out, Manuel needs to see if Al Reyes and Ricardo Rincon have anything left……I can’t see them being any worse…..
I have to believe we will not see parnell/rincon/reyes until the mets have a blowout game….that seems to be manuels style
My problem with Manuel is why he did not take Ayala out right away after the 2 straight hits. Norton gets announced he should have brought in Feliciano right off the bat. It was a long string of lefties. I get that Ayala has been good but it was clear that he did not have it. The first 2 hits were loud singles.
Rincon struck out Ryan Howard didn’t he? I mean, Manuel should stop pretending Scott is good at getting big outs with the game on the line. I mean it’s like he is so in love with Scott that he’ll overlook a few guys for him.
Last time I checked, the bullpen is inconsistant and Jerry needs to use ALL his weapons in the bullpen and not just overwork and lean on one guy. I wonder if “The Gangsta” is getting bored of feeling success and wants to give us something to be frustrated about and start using guys that have no business in those games.
It is funny nobody in the media is questioning Manuel. Why is that? Is it because he is good with the media unlike Bill R? If Bill R made these decisions as Manuel did I wonder what the media response would be.
The thing that puzzles me about the sudden reemergence of Schoenweis, is that Manuel had all but buried him in the role of a mop up guy, and all of a sudden he brings him into a tight spot on Saturday and Sunday? Feliciano , (not that he did well yesterday,) should have come in Saturday with runners on and Sunday after Ayala put the first two on.
You know, guys, not for nothin’, but Jerry has to put all of his pitchers in the game now and then — he can’t keep pitching the same 3 guys; they will all blow their arms out and be useless. I think he’s doing a great job managing what he’s got.
I would like to see him use some of the guys he hasn’t used yet (Reyes, Parnell, …), and I suspect he will, but let’s acknowledge that Menuel is trying to manage “Team Tightrope” here, and it’s a pretty tough job. He’s got to balance the “playing the hot hand” / meritocracy concept he’s advocated with the need to get everyone into the game now and then to keep them fresh. I don’t think any bullpen pitcher (except possibly for Aaron Heilman) has been so consistently bad that putting them in translates to a sure loss. Jerry has to mix it up a little, and to some extent, he has to go with his gut a little. And that gut has been right more often than it’s been wrong, so let’s give him the benefit of the doubt one in a while, okay?
I’m worried too… but it’s not the end of the world yet, and even if the world does end, it’s not going to be Jerry Manuel’s fault.
Well im sure a closer is overrated anyway…….
The braves STOLE 2 games away from the mets. Yes the offense does share in some blame because of the men left on base, but the big culprit as matt said is the bullpen. This closer by committee thing is what it is. Omars job in the offseason is cut out for him. The offense must get the message that they cannot coast on 4 runs..if they have an opportunity to score 10 or 11 runs they must take it. Its going to be a white knuckle ride the rest of the way folks….
Indeed. Roller Coaster ride for the final 14 games.
Hopefully ATL can play spoilers against the sillies this week, while we regain our Mojo against the Nats.
It’s not all about the bullpen – how about an offense that can get a clutch hit after the 4th inning? I’d take one of those please.
YES YES YES!!! The offense on Saturday and Sunday had multiple chances to add on and they failed many times. They must take care of those opportunites. But you know, we’ve been saying that all year long. If the Mets don’t make it, it will be the bullpen and the inability of the offense to tack on runs that will have cost them.
Where are all those other pitchers in the bullpen?
Where is Al Reyes, who saved 26 games last year?
Where is Ricardo Ricon?
Why aren’t these guys being used?
cause manual wants to go with proven talent(doesnt want to lose important games in sept) UNLESS the mets are in a blow out situation that the new guys can have a bigger leash. Kind of reminds you of someone……
Enough with you people crying about the magic number. Seriously give it a rest. I;ve got news for you, the magicv number on Metsblog.com has absolutely nothing to do with how the Mets play baseball. The number is what it is whether or not its posted here. Start worrying more about this incapable bullpen the the Phillies propensity to actually win under pressure.
Clearly posting a magic number has no bearing on what happens. However, let’s be realistic about it, the Phantic is way too blurred out. At this point he should be right behind Mr. Met with piano wire in hand.
The problem I have with the magic number is that it is pointless to look at. When your magic number is 1 game less then the amount of games you have less it makes no sense. Why not start the magic number at 163 in the beginning of the season.
I do not think the magic number is a jinx at all. I voted to put it up (stupid on my part) and when it got put up I freaked because it brought back horrible memories. BTW I now do not see the magic number as I have hidden the image in firefox
the bullpen and the offense are definately connected. Bullpens are not perfect especially the mets bullpen. the offense needs to add on more runs during some of these games too.
that being said, the team still looks a lot better than last year.
enough with complaining about the magic number. you sound like a bunch of idiots. if the mets had it in their locker room then perhaps i can see the foolishness and stupidstitiousness, but it’s on an independent blog. g-d.
“that being said, the team still looks a lot better than last year”
-thank you
that is true though…Unfortunately the bullpen looks the same, but every other facet I would say is improved.
if we can take anything from these series
Santana/Niese/Ollie threw a pretty good game out there
Yea but we can also take that no matter how good our SP has and will be, we wont win if the bullpen keeps ruining productive outings.
Thats true and i agree. I was just looking for a silver lining
Niese looked real good…and that is def encouraging…Santana continues to be great…and Ollie bounced back after a rough start last time out.
Plus Dwright is looking pretty good I’d say.
DWright looked pretty good last year too. Didn’t get them anywhere
thats because dwright is not the only player on the mets last year and this year.
Bobby Parnell throws in the high 90s. We called him up more than 2 weeks ago and never had the foresight to, I dunno, give him a look… now he’s rusty and worthless … maybe he woulda been worthless anyway … but this is a case of bad planning on Jerry’s part … i mean, to just waste an arm like that when everyone knew and knows now that we need all options…
Yea but parnell has not been tested in the majors yet. Manuel does not want to be second guessed if that kid costs us the game. He wants to win as many games in september and he has chosen to go with proven talent. The mets have yet to have a blowout game in september but i bet ya if we EVER do, you will see parnel/rincon/reyes. Otherwise we are going to see the same guys try to take care of business
the only way to test someone is to give them the test… nothing in this game is risk averse … what— jerry goes with “proven talent” like Heilman, Schowenweiss, Knight and Figeroa? … c’mon… bad job by jerry… too short-sighted not to let parnell get in a game at all.
And what do you expect parnell to do??
Strike out the side….Give up 5 runs(or put us in a deeper situation)…
There is no evidance or indication he could do one or the other and due to the resiliance of the teams we are playing and the score, manuel is not going to take a chance on some kid that throws hard but has never pitched in the majors before. Im telling you if they mets get a blowout game you will most likely see parnell but otherwise get ready for the same crew
Niese was untested as well.
niese is a different story. They needed a starter to fill in for maines start. Omar im sure infulenced that decision to pitch niese against the brewers but be sure that figueroa was teh back up(and he was). This week was the same story. We needed a starter and niese who showed great ability to work out of jams got another start(plus he was nervous as hell that game against the brewers). Niese has the start of the game till whenever hes maxed out, then the pen follows to either try and keep the lead or clean up the mess. Who are you going to put after parnell if he messes up? Nobody in that pen is a sure thing as we can ALL tell given the last few games.
i never said Parnell would be any good… all I’m saying is you have to be resourceful and take risks.
Calculated risks my friend..calculated risks. I dont think anyone in here would give the task of getting out the 8th inning(2 outs/men on base/1 run lead) with a R up to parnell over smith. Gotta go with what ya know and if you are going to go with unknown talent..ya gotta give them as much slack as possible so you have an opportunity if things go bad to clean it up. Now if that talent succeeds then little by little you give it more challenging roles until you get an idea of how good/bad this talent is.
right — i mean, obviously you don’t give Parnell a “hold” situation off the bat … but we didn’t have to be in a blowout game in order to keep him fresh either… there were chances such as the Pedro game against the phillies when we coulda put him in.
look at the DRAys, they were by no means getting blown out yesterday when playing a crucial game against the yankees when they had David PRice make his MLB debut … granted Jeter took him yard… but nonetheless, you gotta try to work in new arms that you might need later.
I understand your point about bringing in the new arms but if theres no good situation or if theres someone else better fitted to handle a situation what do you want manuel to do…put him in for the hell of it. We must win games from here on in. We dont have the luxury of leaving games in the hands of unproven talent. Nobody in the bp is “officially” hurt so manuel doesnt have a choice but to use people he has used in the past in a particular situation. The rays are a differnt team than us in many ways. Perhaps it just boils down to 2 different managerial styles but in a game we had to win, manuel is going to go with proven talent over unknown talent.
Why did Ayala pitch in the ninth inning of the game Sat night with a 5-0 lead in a non save situation.? All it did was tire him out and give the Braves a chance to measure him.
I thought the same thing at first…but i started to think about it and the only rational i could come up with is the mets just got rocked their first game of a double header. They have a day game after this night game and so i guess he put ayala to finish the game up asap(stress free) so they can rest up for tomorrow. They only got i think half an hr to an hr rest between games on sat..they must have been tired.
good point…He doesn’t really have over-powering stuff to face lineups multiple times.
You know what’s hilarious?!
The Phillies MAGIC NUMBER is 15, just 2 more than the Mets. What the hell is the point in putting up a “MAGIC NUMBER” right now???
The fact that it’s still up is an absurd sign of stubbornness, and desire to show off a cute picture.
That is exactly right. I’m not saying the number is a jinx, but it is couldn’t be more stupid to post it at this point when it is only one less than the amount of games left to be played.
If you need to put it up wait until it is around 5. If you had actually put that down as a choice on the poll, you would have gotten that as the response.
That’s why you shouldn’t worry about it, because by the end of tomorrow the Mets will not have a magic number.
btw, its not all about the bullpen. in game 1 the mets had bases loaded and nobody out twice and all they were able to get were two runs and grounded into two double plays in that situation. the mets lost these games because they could not tack on.
Thankfully I missed the two bullpen disasters over the weekend. If I didn’t see it, it didn’t happen, right?
lolll i would be inclined to agree with you but the fact that there is a skinny little 1 instead of a 3 may just give it that dash of reality. Good try tho lol
I totally agree with everyone saying that the “Magic Number” needs to be taken down, especially with it sitting at #13. Is it a coincidence that this is also Billy Wagner’s number? Hmmm. Shades of a curse.
Baseball, especially for the Mets, has always come down to pitching, pitching, pitching. This is the time of year when you’ve got to rely less on pitch count, and let the starters gut it out through late inning jams, especially when you are operating without a reliable closer or bullpen.
What bothers me is that I find myself looking more and more at the wild card standings, because I feel like we’ll have to back into the playoffs to get there. We’ll need Milwaukee to continue to implode, Houston to be swept away by another hurricane, and the Marlins and Cardinals to stay where they’re at.
As I look at my Keith Hernandez autographed ball, which I got in Milwaukee two weeks ago, I’m hoping that 1986 won’t be the last time I’ll taste a World Series victory before I turn senile or die of a broken heart.
Matt,
All your READERS want the number down. Why do you still have it up? Its a joke. We say it isnt like last year but it is. We had the number up last year and look what happen. Just make all your readers happy and take the damn thing down. Put it up when the number is much lower like 3.
If you dont take it down please explain why you have it up?
Its a joke!
Let’s Go METS!!! You can do it guys!!!
He ran a poll not too long ago and unfortunatly all the readers who were opposed to the poll lost so thats why he put it up.
I think our Magic Number for 2007 is still 3 and holding.
Its the magic numbers fault the bullpen blew 2 games over the weekend.
Who cares about the freaking magic number? Give it a rest.
Is it babe ruths fault the red sox didnt win a world series for all those years..People think its a jynx and thats why they are not giving it a rest.
no one would complain if it was a win the last two games….
at this point I’d rather have Mr.Met closing games with his t-shirt gun than any of the Met’s relievers.
lmaoooo
…gary cohen: “And Mr. Met beans chipper in the head with a 90 mph Medium size t-shirt”
Matt, if you’re going to keep the Magic Number up, you might as well have a picture where the Phillie Phanatic is right behind Mr. Met and just about to run him over.
Who gives a crap about a magic number?
The more important question is what exactly has Luis Ayala done to warrant Rivera/Wagner/K-Rod-like confidence in the 9th inning? Manuel will lefty/righty teams to death in the 7th and 8th innings, but you get to the ninth, and suddenly it’s Ayala’s to win or lose? Regardless of who is coming up, or regardless of how big or small our lead is?
What happend to bullpen by committee?
In any case, what does it really matter? They aren’t winning anything with this bullpen anyway, so whether they choke away another division title or lose in the playoffs, doesn’t matter much to me.
Actually, the magic number really doesn’t matter at all. However, it is a psychological barrier for a lot of people. Plus, we need to be able to vent when things go bad, so it might as well be the magic number and the bullpen, since Willie isn’t there to kick around anymore.
The magic # nearly matches the games left to play. Why celebrate a number that has as much meaning as it did the first week of the season?
shrewd analysis knuckles… seriously…
Thanks for the Jinx Matt. Moron.
This bullpen has 27!!! 27!!! Blown saves!!
11 in the 9th inning
We are lucky to br a game ahead.
CAPSLOCK ACCOMODATES DISABILITY, SORRY.
LIVING IN NC WHERE BROADCASTING RIGHTS ARE HELD BY BRAVES, NATS, REDS I’M OFTEN FORCED TO FOREGO SNY FOR COMPETITOR BROADCASTS. I’M OFTEN AMAZED AT THE MATCHUP INFO THEY IMPART THAT’S EITHER UNKNOWN OR IGNORED BY NYM FLD MNGT (BOTH JERRY & WILLIE). BRAVES ANNOUNCERS HELD OUT HOPE DUE TO THEIR SUCCESSFUL HISTORY FACING AYALA. IN ALL THOSE PAPERS CARRIED BY MANUEL ISN’T THERE ONE THAT HAS MATCHUPS? ARE THEY ALL STICKFIGURE DRAWINGS? 20+ YRS AGO DAVEY JOHNSON HAD ALL THAT INFO PRE-ELIAS
AT LEAST LAST YR WHEN WILLIE REPEATEDLY MUTTERED THOSE 4 LTR WORDS(SOSA,MOTA) IT WAS ALL THAT HE HAD AVAILABLE. WHY ARE RINCON, PARNELL, MUNIZ, REYES BEING PERSERVED? CAN THEY BE WORSE THAN BSs & Ls?
WHILE USUALLY REPEATING THE SAME ACTIONS EXPECTING DIFFERENT RESULTS IS DEFINED AS INSANITY. IN FLUSHING IT’S UNEMPLOYMENT! I THOUGHT JERYY IMPLIED A BULLPEN BY COMMITTEEE NOT CLOWNCAR
Our bullpen, although being at times quite good, does generally stink – no newsflash here. Omar didn’t address it properly in the offseason – also not news. What also is a concern is the injury to Damion Easley. Him and Tatis have been big parts of the Mets resurgence in the second half and as I think Jerry Manuel mentioned, he offers the batters in front of him, some needed protection. Easley being sidelined for the next two weeks and possibly beyond might be at least as big of a loss as Wagner, since with the bullpen being as it is, we need to comeback with runs and add on when we can. Luis Castillo made the last out yesterday. Also, it was interesting how Niese got snuck in and won. Probably there wasn’t any scouting done on him by the Braves and he had less time to get nervous. I hope they sneak him in again at some point. I hope we can blow out the Nats in a game and try out Al Reyes, for goodness sakes. We might need him, if he’s any good.
They have been streched..hell even niese has been streched. A pitcher that is overused and is tiring at the end of the season(when games are at their most important) and perhaps into the postseason doesnt help either. All the Starters went deep into games and did not give up more than 2 runs this series. Its the late inning insurance runs and bullpen cant do their job. As of late..the starters are our least concern
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