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During a chat for ESPN.com, Keith Law had the following to say when asked about Daniel Murphy playing second base in the Arizona Fall League and if it was wishful thinking on the Mets part that he will show adequate range and hands for the position.
“He didn’t have a single moderately difficult play, so I can’t tell you whether it’s crazy or not. I’m skeptical of the plan, though. The OF->2b and 3b->2b conversions don’t often work out unless the guy was a fair shortstop to begin with.”
Later in the chat, Law was asked where do you think the Mets will draw the line on Oliver Perez, 6-years $80 million or 4-years $60 million? Law’s answer:
“No way I’d go 6 years with him. That would go into the worst contract of the offseason discussion.”
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New York Mets
Six-figure signings: 3B Aderlin Rodriguez, Dominican Republic, 16
Top Bonus: Rodriguez, $600,000
Summary: The Mets’ efforts in Latin America have produced promising early returns. Outfielder Fernando Martinez reached Double-A as an 18-year-old in 2007. Righthander Deolis Guerra was part of the package that netted Johan Santana in the off-season. And last year’s two top signings—Wilmer Flores and Jefry Marte—are two of the brightest rising teenage prospects in baseball. So it was a bit surprising that the Mets only made one six-figure expenditure in the last year in Latin America, though Rodriguez did receive a substantial bonus. Given the Mets’ recent track record of sending players like Flores, Marte and outfielder Cesar Puello to the U.S. in their first season, it wouldn’t be a surprise to see the Mets skip Rodriguez over the DSL and have him start in Rookie-level Kingsport or the GCL in 2009.
It is really weird, especially since we’re desperately in need of talent. They didn’t go after the high ceiling talent in the draft, if they’re not doing it in the international game where do they plan on doing it.
Perhaps their scouts only liked this player…Its hard to speculate on decision making without knowing the rationale.
Given their s uccess in Latin American signings, I would give Omar the benefit of the doubt here….If there is nobody worth it, don’t bother.
What you should note though is that the quote from RYN only discusses Latin America. The Mets did sign a player from the Netherlands, and from Australia as well.
For OP? How about no years for zero?
Braves did a bit more in the international market:
Six-figure signings: LHP Carlos Perez, Dominican Republic, 16; OF Fredy Gamboa, Columbia, 16; RHP Ernesto Silva, Panama, 16; OF Hector Garcia, Columbia, OF, 16; RHP Wei Cheng Huang, Taiwan, 18; SS Fernando De Los Santos, Dominican Republic, 18; RHP Eduardo Castillo, Dominican Republic, 17; RHP Amabale Nin, Dominican Republic, 18; C Meng Hsiu Tsai, Taiwan, 18
NO PEREZ!!!!!!!NO PEREZ!!!!!!!NO PEREZ!!!!!!!NO PEREZ!!!!!!!NO PEREZ!!!!!!!NO PEREZ!!!!!!!NO PEREZ!!!!!!!
i’d give 33 million over 3 years. no more. maybe a 4th year option and/or an extra million per year if incentive goals are reached.
Boras would probably laugh at that.
I’m skeptical about Orlando Hudson and Murphy at 2B. Hudson could be good, but I have a strange gut feeling. We do seem to have trouble with second base - Roberto Alomar, Luis Castillo and Kaz Matsui all come to mind. Frankly, if we somehow could get Wigginton back for 2B, I’d be more comfortable with it. Murphy might be a really good hitter - the sample is too small. Him converting to 2B is a stretch. Although, it’s not impossible, but risky. And having him work on it now is investing a lot of energy in this kid - maybe in the wrong direction. Maybe he’s more suited to 1B. What is the deal - is he only supposedly a third baseman?
If the poll had a wait-and-see option, I’d have gone with wait-and-see. But there is next to no risk at all, as Murphy makes next to the league minimum, Castillo is well below average, and Orlando Hudson is not a show-stopper in any case.
“Roberto Alomar, Luis Castillo and Kaz Matsui all come to mind”
Gregg Jefferies, Jeff Can’t, Willie Randolph, Juan Samuel, Carlos Baerga come to mind too as playing below their career numbers here. And Jose Reyes for one injury-plagued season. Ugh.
Since Jefferies, Edgardo Alfonzo is the only homegrown starting 2bmen we’ve tried in the last 20 years, and amazingly, the only one not to bust. Let’s go with Murphy!
Alfonzo came up as a SS and was a plus glove at both corner and middle IF — a baseball rarity. No comparison to Murphy. I could be wrong about Murphy, but until he shows the range and footwork necessary for the position, I don’t see him as a viable option for 2B.
I agree - murphy is a 1B. The post about Wiggington is not bad- wouldn’t cost that much in $$$ or players. Don’t know if he is a free agent. Not long term fix but He would help there.
The Mets had last year for Mark Loretta but he ended up with the Cubs -again not a great 2B but sure would be better than who we have now.
Heresy alert:
I actually think that trading Murphy at this point might make sense. As determined as many bloggers are to buy players high and sell them low, this could be one case where we actually do the opposite.
I like Murphy; I just don’t see him filling a need for the Mets right now. I’m very skeptical of the transition to second, and we need more production from our corner OFers.
Plus: he could fetch real value on the trade market, esp. packaged with Evans or Niese.
I think trading him would be a bad move altogether, but what would you trade him for if you did? Give us a proposal.
trade murphy and evans for matt holliday. probably wouldnt work, but that wouldnt be a bad trade at all lol.
um…NO Chance
Yeah, lets trade Murphy, David Wright and Jose.
And Beltran and Delgado.
so, you want to trade a possible 300 hitter? the mets will find a position for him, in the outfield or 1B. you dont trade good homegrow players.
So domincan boy, you are saying he can put up O-dog numbers but from a position you expect power from? All while being a defensive liability?
You are right–can’t get enough of those guys. Oh yeah, we have Carp and Evans too.
if he cant handle 2B, put him in the oufield, he will get better playing everyday. if the mets trade delgado, you can put him at 1B. you never know, murphy can be a 300 avg, 20, 80-100 RBI guy.
more towards the 80 than the 100 on the rbi scale.
Is that what you really want out of LF? You are keeping him in the hopes he will be around average.
I just don’t see where that makes him untouchable this off season.
Look none of us can realistically come up with a hypothetical offer that would end up happening. IF and only IF there was a trade that could be made, involving Murphy and anyone else not in the team’s core - and that trade would land us a Holliday, or a Peavy, or some nice supreme superstar, I’m all for it.
But other than that, keep him. He’s looked good thus far and he has potential to improve, shore up his D wherever that may be, and be a good tough contributor for years to come in the organization he grew up with.
I’m not asking for a superstar. Just someone who could be the equivalent of Murphy at 2nd base…young, good, and cost controlled.
Trade young talent for whom we don’t have a spot in the field for young talent for whom we do.
DO NOT trade Murphy for league average veterans whom the team does not control cost wise.
DO NOT trade Murphy and the rest of the farm for a Matt Holiday, who’s a free agent after this season and who thus leaves you right back where you started.
DO NOT trade Murphy for a Victor Zambrano, for crying out loud!
Unless you can get a terrible catcher and a platoon-worthy rightfielder. Then you trade that good homegrown player every time. FOUR MORE YEARS!
hahahahaha
I would center a package with Murphy for Joakim Soria. That is someone we NEED!
I think you have to at least shop Murphy to see if you can find something that better fits this team. Murphy is not as good as he performed this season and was really exposed once he became an everyday player(hitting around .129 the last 8 games).
Yea i think the hype about murphy is a little to much for the short amount of time hes played. He might become a good player but if not, trading him now would be the best time to get something in return for him. He comes to the majors, hits .313. And wasnt he in double-A ball and then had a few games at triple A and then came to the majors and hit like he did? Dont tell me some general manager will show interest in murphy.
they will but not enough to give up something of optimum value without a centerpiece to go along with him. the sample size is such where he means a lot more to met fans than he will to another gm. we love him because he’s homegrown but to another gm, he may be just another midseason callup who had a nice run for a month.
I think the hype from mets fans is probably a lot bigger than the actual value surrounding any of them. Most scouting reports I’ve read on them think they can be solid major leaguers but nothing spectacular. I think we’d get more value keeping them and finding a place for them. it’s not like we don’t have enough holes for them to fill.
Keith Hernandez thinks he will be a 3 hitter. (Murphy) I trust his opinion. I wouldn’t trade a guy that will be a 3 hitter.
Murphy’s approach and swing reminds me of Don Mattingly. If I remember, Donnie started his career with a great opposite field approach with little power, but was a doubles machine. His power came with time and age. So did chronic back trouble, but…
I think he’s a piece worth keeping too, Mikey, limited sample size and all.
Yeah, definitely. A 22-23 year old kid with plate discipline and pitch recognition … who hits to all fields is worth keeping. Everyone wants to focus on power … but that will only develop later. Can’t trade this kid.
I think he should be moved to 1B-if we have picked up the option for delgado move him to the AL since his value will never be higher. Murphy is challenged in the OF - may work out at first. Delgado may be able to give you some decent talent back-maybe Oakland - H. Street/OF? Worth a shot-include heilman on the deal and see what is attracted back.
That gives Murphy a position he may excel at.
I think it would be a mistake to trade Murphy now, but if he performs at anywhere near his ‘08 level as a part-time OF-1B next year, teams will part with major talent to land him.
First off, I believe in holding onto our own players wherever possible and building from within. I just have grave doubts about Murphy’s fielding and his ability to hit with consistency from a corner OF position.
In a year, I think he’ll be the odd man out.
Who would I trade him for? Well, any of the names we’ve discussed: Holliday, Peavy, Ordonez, Soria (in package of players, obviously). I think there will be some GMs, especially in the AL, where he could DH, who’d love to have him. Others? I don’t know: Cain? Greinke? Cano? Roberts? Putz?
MealTicket it wouldnt be bad to get players like peavy or soria, but to get players like that and matt holliday the price would be to high and our farm system isnt deep enough to give away the good young talent we have.
Yes, if we trade Murphy, which is something we will have to do if he’s incapable of fielding 2nd base, we will have to get young, cost-controlled production from a position of need–left field or 2nd base.
This is very doable, as a lot of teams could use Murphy’s offensive production at 3rd base. Unfortunately for Daniel, we have the most valuable 3rd baseman in baseball not named Alex.
If a win-now team needs a 1st baseman and is a bit weak at 3rd, you could trade Daniel Murphy and Carlos Delgado for a stud 2nd base prospect and relief change while you field Castillo for one more year.
Please, no castillo lol
I am not sure how that trade helps us for next season? The fans would never stand for that. Take out Delgado’s and Murphy’s production for a reliever and a prospect?
If you are going to trade Murphy then it has to be in a package for Holiday or Roberts. Guys that can impact this season.
Wouldn’t you be better off trading just Delgado, puting Murphy at 1B and going from there? Say you do that and sign a big bat like Manny or trade for Holiday then you have not really missed any production from Delgado.
The price for Holliday (in prospects) is going to be huge if we don’t include Murphy. I doubt we have the parts to get it done.
Trading Delgado and replacing his production with Manny might work. But then there’s the contract (5 years?) to consider.
And I’m just not sure we get good value back for Delgado.
They don’t even need Murphy. They need guys like Church, Fmart, Niese, Kunz and Parnell. Murphy would not sway them one way or another.
Besides I am sure that teams like the Jays would love to have Delgado back. They had a great BP but no offense. Looks like we would be a good match there.
murphy is a stud 2nd base prospect
In a trade for Holliday Murphy would be a throw in. We’d have to include guys like F-mart and Niese, or Maine it would have to be built around a guy like Maine because they want young controllable pitching. No team is going to take a package with Murphy as a center piece based on like 126 at bats.
Church and Neise … and another lesser prospect can get Holliday.
Pretty sure Holliday is one year left on is contract, no?
Exactly, not to mention they just don’t need him. It’s not like they can then spin him off for a bunch of prospects. If you could do that then we would trade him for prospects to trade……
Not sure how everyone is trading away Niese. Don’t we need this guy to be our #5 starter next season?
I wouldn’t trade him unless you were getting a Holliday back-and that with a 4 yr contract signed.
BTW-why is Fmart such an untouchable-heard about him for 3 yrs now- never saw him in the majors because he is always hurt or overmatched. there have been a lot of players with that rep through the years. if the right deal is there make it
perhaps because he’s 19 yrs old????????
You’re right about those three, I think. But a semi-salary dump like Ordonez or Putz or Ryan might work. Or Francisco Cordero. Or a player under control for one more year.
wow every SINGLE player you mentioned is not worth dan murphy i’m sorry. magglio is 36, putz is a disaster, bj ryan is expensive, and francisco cordero is an average closer.
I am done with the Murphy Hudson debate for now. Lets just wait and see how Murphy plays and what Hudson wants.
As for Perez, nope don’t want anything to do with him. He can take his 5 2/3 nail bitting innings somewhere else. Get Lowe and Garland.
how bout Lowe and trade for Sonnanstine?
I still believe that Perez has some of the best stuff in the league; however it frustated me that he was unable to stay focused. He did do a better job of it in the second half of 2008, though he should be able to be a consistent 7-8 inning a night guy, but seemed always to peter out earlier.
Even with the above complaints, I would bring him back.
I think he will get a four year deal worth 13-14 per year. I would not gove over that amount, but I would offer it.
You really need to look at his effect on the bullpen. He is just a 5 2/3 inning pitcher. His max this year was 7 2/3 which he only did 2 times if I remember. Yet he pitched under 5 2/3 a few times.
I loved watching Ollie pitch at times during her tenure as a Met, but I agree with you completely.
Yes, Perez can be one of the more dominant lefties in the game when he’s on. He can also be one of the most atrocious pitchers in the game when he falls apart or just doesn’t have it.
The bottom line is that his overall numbers are the type you expect from a 4th starter. In 2007 he was better, but a close look at the numbers show that he wasn’t better by that much.
He’s a 5 2/3 - 6 1/3 inning per start pitcher. He puts up an ERA around 4. He strikes out about 6 batters per start. He walks about 3-4 per start.
Is that worth what he’s likely to get on the open market?
No way.
I meant “his tenure as a Met”…
… or did I?
…and yet Perez pitched 194 innings, or only 6 innings shy of 200 innings, which is considered very good for a SP.
Only 34 Pitchers threw 200 Innings, or about 1 pitcher a team. Point is Perez didn’t kill the Mets bullpen any more then say, Joe Blanton, killed the Phillies bullpen.
Would you give Joe Blanton 5 years and $70-75 million?
Oliver Perez is 27 though. He has more upside than any free agent pitcher. And he does not cost you a type A. I’d rather him as our 4th or 5th starter than any other 4th or 5th starter in baseball.
That’s because most #4-5 starters don’t get as many starts as Perez did.
Keith Law has now been added to my list as mostly useless it seems.
And yet your list for “mostly useless” does not include Castillo or Willie Randolph. Law has forgotten more about baseball than you will ever know.
Aargh I just feel like Murphy has the right offensive skills for a middle IF and the defensive skills for a corner IF position. I think you have to at least look at what he could bring back on the trade market.
I am sure the O’s would not mind having Murphy at 3B or 1B for the future. IF you could work out a package around him for Roberts then maybe. Otherwise, it’s just better to sit back and see.
roberts is not THAT good. I like him, but not for murphy. he is basically the inferior, white version of o-dog with less defense and less attitude.
Are you serious? Look at their numbers and then come back to me on that. Roberts beats him in EVERY catagory.
LETS GO DODGERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Very difficult to have faith in Perez .Watch him go to another team and another pitching coach and watch him fall apart.
My prediction
Mets 2009
Reyes
Pedroia
Chipper Jones
Pujols
Manny
Josh Hamilton
Holliday
Soto
Rotation
Santana
Halladay
Sabathia
Lincecum
Cliff Lee
Bullpen:
K-Rod
Lidge
Soria
Rivera
Papelbon
Wood
Marmol
you get the picture. Get this done Omar!
Only if Papelbon closes.
So Wright would basically have to get us both Pedroia and Papelbon, with Lowell going down this seems reasonable.
Beltran could net us Soto, Wood and Marmol, and with Pie’s lack of production the Cubs could use a CF.
In a small ballpark, Church could hit 50 HR, so let’s deal him for Hamilton.
Pujols… someone plant some sort of incriminating evidence about him so that the Cards need to ship him out. I’m thinking Murphy & Evans get it done, let THEM worry about who plays 1B.
Trade Heilman, Castillo and F-Mart for Holliday.
Re-submit the paperwork you have to submit to the league office for the above trade claiming a “mistake”, and get HAllAday. (Cross fingers it works)
San Fran needs to get younger. How about Carp and Niese for Lincecum.
Indians need to get older, we’ll ship Delgado for Lee.
Y’know who’s awful? Chase Utley’s awful. The Phils would be silly to not jump on Lidge for Castillo.
The Royals need “veteran presence” on their team, so we’ll deal Endy, Tatis, Easley and Castro for Soria.
The Yanks need a 1b… let’s convince Cleveland to Delgado to the Yanks and we get Rivera in return. Shapiro’s not that bright.
Sign Chipper, Manny as FA… distract the league office with squeaky toys… sign KRod and Sabathia as FA…
…y’know, nastyslider, you just might be onto something here.
damn straight!
THAT was a great post. Genius! You should be GM. Find out a way to move Omar and you’re in.
in the words of one of the great literary minds of the 20th -21st century Mike( I’ll eat your kids) Tyson ” IT’S LUDICROUS I TELL YOU, LUDICROUS”.
What about working out some swaps with Detroit.
Placido Polanco would be a nice pickup. They need middle relievers and starters. Maybe they would want Heilman and Show? If took on a salary dump guy like Dontrelle, Robertson, or even uping our end so they included Carlos Gullien. He does not really have a spot for them.
Follow up on Gullien. The Tigers for some reason want Inge to play 3B fulltime instead of catcher. He is signed through 2011 with 33 million left on his contract. He has played SS, 3B, 2B, 1B, OF.
TRS86, how about Maggs from Detroit? His contract is terrible but they may eat some of it to shed payroll. They’d probably use the Sheffield deal as comparaison, meaning Niese (comparable to Humberto), Moviel & maybe Tejeda. Would you do it? Do you think it fills a need?
If the Tigers decide to cut payroll and emphasize youth, then maybe there’s a chance. Maggs is a major cog in that system, though, and they’ll want REAL value back for him.
But I’m guessing Dombrowski is not going to cut payroll very much, if at all. They may not go after big FA’s, but it looks like they’ll try to play for the division in 2009.
MealTicket, they’ve already declined Renteria’s option and MLBTradeRumors has links to multiple local articles about Ilitch being pissed and slashing payroll below $100mil.
Case in point: “The Tigers have about $115MM committed for 2009, not including arbitration raises to Santiago, Thames, Rodney, Glover, Seay, Zumaya, and Verlander. So, they should be over $120MM with the current group. The Tigers had an opening day payroll of $137.7MM in 2008. Lynn Henning says to expect a drastic payroll reduction - “perhaps by $40 million or more.”"
I agree that that package I proposed will likely not get Maggs but if the Tigers are looking to move him, it (or something similar: AAA pitcher + 2 A prospects) just might.
Can’t get Maggs. They will have enough offense next season which is why they are not bringing back Rinteria and may look to trade Placido Polanco or Gullien.
SR, I see it the opposite that they will not reduce payrole. It’s just they will not increase it. Obviously they would love to dump Willis, Robertson, Sheffield etc and that would drastically reduce salary. But I would not see a fire sale at all.
Polanco is cheap but if we took on a bad contract then it would be more likely. Maybe Robertson and slot him in at the #5? Or here’s one for fun. We take Willis and Polanco for Castillo. They shed 27 million and take on 18.
The Tigers off-loaded so much young talent last season–to get Dontrelle, Cabrera and Renteria–that a fire-sale now, involving the loss of a fan favorite like Ordonez, might be too hard to bear. They don’t view his contract as a bad one, given how solid a hitter he is.
But obviously, for a good enough offer, they might reconsider. And I’d love to have Mags in LF.
Obviously, but with our weak system I would think it would be better to concentrate on guys like Gullien and Polanco.
You took the words right out of my mouth. Both are definitely worth a look.
NO
I like this idea. Polanco would give us what LoDuca did offensively in 06
You laugh, TRS86, but that’s the kind of deal Omar should be looking at for Castillo. A swap of two (or more) “change-of-scenery” types.
True, you would have Willis competing for 5th starter at a price of basically 9 million for 2 seasons and switching out Castillo for Polanco. That’s real funny math though.
Reyes, Murhpy, Wright, Beltran, Guillen, Church, Polanco, Schnider/Castro
Trade Delgado and Heilman for Ryan?
Sign Juan Cruz or Brian and Darren Oliver
Ryan, Cruz/Tallet, Oliver, Smith, Stokes, Parnell, Feliciano/Sanchez
Sign Garland and Lowe.
Johan, Pelfrey, Lowe, Garland, Maine and Niese as #6.
I am talking to myself now but that would be a moneyball lineup if I ever saw one. The lowest OBP other than Schnieder’s who has a respectable .339 would be Ryan Church with a .346
Reyes .358
Murphy .397
Wright .390
Beltran .376
Guillen .376
Church .346
Polanco .350
Schneider .339
That’s a lineup Billie Bean would dream of.
It’s also a payroll Billy Beane would dream of!
Would actually be less than what we had in the lineup this season.
My feeling is that the Mets need to improve their pitching. They are a pretty good hitting team in my opinion.
If I were Omar I would
1. Sign Fuentes
2. Trade for Soria (Martinez and Heilman should come close to getting this done).
3. I think we can afford CC and should go after him 100%.
4. Trade Castillo for Eric Byrnes.
A Byrnes/Evans/Tatis LF is good enough if the team pitches well. We can ride the hot bat through the season. If someone steps up and wins the postion, great.
We have 3 of the top 5 RBI guys in the NL. Let’s keep focused on what’s important…. Pitching.
some fans are truly unbelievable …they swear you have to have an ALL STAR at every position…
MURPHY is unreal. the discipline, the maturity, the gritt, && the work ethic. at 23/24 this kid has major upside && hes OUR PLAYER.
he might never be an all star but hes that one homegrown piece that you’ll always count on to be consistent hitter.
good teams need to develop these kind of players.
we all mention how we need players who put it all out on the line… did no one see MURPHY was that && much more then we could ever have expected?
2nd base? Kent was horrific at start && slowly learned to be an average fielder who makes steady plays ala UTLEY who was precieved to be a poor fielder.
MURPHY has the kind of work ethic that you KNOW hes gonna do everything to get comfortable in that position if it means hes gonna play.
id rather see him succeed then any single money hungry free agent.
SO LETS SUPPORT OUR GUY!
MURPHY CAN DO THIS !! 2nd BASE! 2nd BASE!
ps: CASTILLO, i hate you.
agree, I dont get how people want to trade him, before we see what he does in a full season.
It’s not that I want to trade him. But if he doesn’t find a place on the field–in other words, if he doesn’t prove adequate at 2B–then a year from now we’ll be spinning ludicrous trade scenarios based on his old value rather than his current value.
For a laugh, check out some Yankees blogs. Everyone seems to want to trade Cano for big-time talent, even though he had a lousy year. One trade proposal–treated quite seriously on “Was Watching”–proposes Cano for Beltran, with a minor leaguer or two coming from the Skanks to even things out.
Other scenarios involve Cano for Peavy or Holliday.
Hankee fans are still convinced Cano’s going to be the stud he seemed to be in ‘07. And yet they can’t wait to get rid of him.
If Murphy doesn’t pan out –and I really hope he does–we’ll be kicking ourselves for not “selling high” when we had the chance.
I get wat u mean agony, but 2nd base isnt the place for him. he def does have the work ethic to be a decent 2nd baseman but it would take a couple of seasons to be an acceptable fielder if not longer. Overall though i dont think hes the 2nd base type. And i feel the attitude for the mets is more of a win now team, not a “wait for murphy to be a good 2nd baseman to win” team. If he is truely a good hitter to stay, left field should be his place for now. And it sounds like they are picking up the delgado option (ive heard they have but im not sure). if they dont, or they trade him, or even if hes around another year, murphy could always learn first base aswell and take it over when delgado is gone. I can see him being a decent fielder there.
best post ever
until the 2B part, which is unrealistic. he has 1B allll over him.
Is it just me, or should we actually trust Niese as our fifth starter? I mean, he has a bright future and has some nasty stuff, but are we going to seriously put him in a position where we put Pelfrey when he first came up and expect to win now with him pitching. I think that if the Mets really hope on competing next year, they have to get someone better from the FA market or trade, a small under the market pitcher, and allow Niese to mature and use him as a security blanket.
What I’d hope for is the Mets really address the situation of the rotation. What killed the Mets rotation this season was a lack of depth at the back end and injury. If a team expects to win, it has to know who it’s 5 pitchers are. And all of those pitchers should be more than capable of going out there and winning immediately.
The Oliver Perez void has to be filled. A solid 3 pitcher. A Derek Lowe. Maybe even re-sign Perez if the price is reasonable. In the 5 spot, the Mets need to look at options.
I can see signing Paul Byrd or Odalis Perez as a 5 pitcher.
I would draw the line on Ollie at around $13 million/year for 4 years. If someone else wants to pay him more, let them.
If the Mets decide to keep Delgado for 2009, they should focus on pitching, bullpen and Starters and a 2B, platoon Murphy, Evans, Tatis on LF or if they get a Ibanez, Halladay, or whatever OF with Church as a trade piece.
If not, then play Murphy at 1B then trade for a OF by any mean to compensate the 38 HR and 115 RBI from Delgado.
In any case, Mets should put Murphy on 1B or keep it on OF until 2010 when he can play 1st.
I think it’s really questionable to whether or not we can depend on Delgado for similar production. I know Manny Ramirez will have similar numbers next season. I don’t know this about Carlos. He might be hitting .200 in April and May and get knocked out of his position all over again.
Carlos really did everything he can just to help the Mets remain competitive, but I won’t lie. He’s much of what is wrong with this team. He’s an old player who’s got a big ego. He’s a good guy, but he’s been every representation of the Mets ups and downs in the last three seasons. He’s too old. And his value will not get any higher than it is now. They need to trade him for what ever it is they can get and use Murphy at 1B.
The price to acquire Halladay will be too high. Just for that reason alone, I don’t want him. I think the same can be said to the availible closers like Putz and Street. I say you sign a closer like Fuentes, trade Delgado for prospects and/or bullpen depth and sign another reliever.
This team has to think about the future just like now. One can’t be preferred over the other. The best thing Omar did for us was keep our prospects at the deadline. By doing this and accumulating even knew ones via trade and replacing our stars on the FA market may be the way to go.
Yes, I’d agree. Oliver Perez really doesn’t deserve anymore. His agent may believe otherwise, but they’ll always be a Texas Rangers Chan Ho Park type deal around. I’d think there’s only a 20-25% chance he’s a Met next season. 4yr/52MM is still a risk on him, but it’s probably worth taking. Maybe throw a team option in there. Something tells me he won’t even get that much though.
SIGN MANNY NOW!!!!!!
“SIGN MANNY NOW!!!!!!”
lol, we at least have to wait until he is done winning the World Series!
The Mets need to take a risk worth taking. I think that’s Yu Darvish if he comes on the market. The Mets have gotten all the Japanese stars no ones wanted. That should change. As for the Phillies, you got to tip your cap to them. Cole Hamels is a really good pitcher. The Phillies were supposed to win this game though. If LA comes out with a split, they’ve done alright. Manny continues to show why he’s an awesome hitter.
for the 80th time, HE IS NOT BEING POSTED!
I said if he does. And you know things can change as the market does. It doesn’t have to be necessarily for next season anyway. They should keep their eye on him so the Red Sox and Yankees don’t steal him before they can in the future.
As for Delgado, his option is basically picked up. The question is what kind of value can you get for him? For the best of the team, they may need to trade him. Not because we don’t want him here. We’d love to have him pick. I just don’t think he can have that kind of season again.
And let’s say he were to have a 28 HR 100 RBI .260 type season which would be reasonable to expect. Than what? Do you re-sign him? What kind of a contract would he want? If the Mets had not heated up in July, I would have been loved to see the Mets trade Oliver Perez to a contender for a couple good prospects. If Oliver Perez hadn’t pitched so miserably before the Mets getting hot and Willie getting fired, the Mets may have been overwhelmed into moving him. Carlos Delgado after this season is much more than Oliver Perez though. He can get us more. He can get us some good pitching prospects. What ever money he was due could be used towards Hudson or Manny. And than let Murphy move to 1B with a possible platoon with Evans.
The suggestion of Carlos Guillen up there is interesting. Also Sheffield and Willis. I know Guillen’s coming off somewhat of an off year so the Tigers would probably be willing to move him. I think it’d take more quality pitchers though for the Tigers to be willing to a potential multi-player trade. This would be my suggestion:
Trade Scott Schoenweis, Luis Castillo, Carlos Delgado and Aaron Heilman to Detroit for Placido Palanco, Gary Sheffield and Dontrelle Willis.
Show (3.6MM) + Castillo (18MM) + Delgado (12MM) + Heilman (1.2MM before Arbitration) = 34.8MM
Palanco (4.6MM) + Sheffield (14MM) + Dontrelle Willis (22MM) = 40.6MM
The total difference comes out tothe Mets paying 5.8MM - a much lower number than the 18 Million the Mets would basically lose on Castillo.
Palanco is much better than Castillo. Delgado is coming off a much better season than Sheffield - both are in contract years. And Schoenweis is a middle reliever the Tigers have shown interest in the past with. As a player, Dontrelle Willis has much more hope than Aaron Heilman on this roster. Maybe he can become the next Oliver Perez?
From Detroit’s perspective, getting Delgado into their line up is a big boost over Sheffield. He’ll go back to the AL. He can DH and get some games at 1B. Sheffield can serve as the corner OF the Mets can use. If he’s hitting 6th or 7th, it’s not so bad. He actually complained about DH’ing in Detroit and would probably waive the no-trade clause.
also terrible ideas.
How are they terrible ideas? And what are others presenting? Spend 70 million on Manny, Hudson and the whole Free Agency? Sure, good ideas. But realistic? Listen, I’m all on board for trading Delgado if the prospects or relievers we’re acquiring back are right. I still don’t understand why Omar can’t just pull out a Fuentes instead of trading everything for Putz or Soria. Or why he can’t sign a Russ Springer and Dennys Reyes instead of trading Delgado for guy’s who aren’t as good as they are.
Getting Palanco would be an option. Offering a swap of Castillo, Show and Heilman for Dontrelle Willis is an idea. Willis has been a bust in Detroit. Coming back to the NL can help him. He wouldn’t be worth taking the chance on without dumping some of our own trash on them. Heilman’s still cheap and might turn into a decent starter if given the chance and new scenary. As Schoenweis is not a bad pitcher either but in desperate need of a new environment.
Bringing Eric Byrnes to play LF wouldn’t solve anything. All it would do is give us enough Nick Evans platoon guy to crowd the bench with Angel Pagan, Endy Chavez and Marlon Anderson. Sadly, a better option than Castillo - but not a legitimate six or seven hitting LF. Trading Castillo will bring back nothing except for stuff for as low as quality as him.
This is what’ll probably led to Murphy and Evans platooning in LF. I don’t mind this if Delgado stays and they sign Hudson. Otherwise, Murphy moving to 2B will be twice as important. And in the event he’s not at 2B and Hudson isn’t either, Ray Durham or Damion Easley starting out 2B sounds pretty damn weak. So exploring the trade market would be a smart idea. Palanco sounds good, don’t he?
You can’t want Shefield. He has played about 20 games in the field the last 3 years.
The new line-up look would be this if that trade were to happen:
1. SS Reyes
2. 2B Palanco
3. CF Beltran
4. 3B Wright
5. RF Church
6. LF Sheffield
7. 1B Murphy/Evans
8. C Schneider
I’d flip Beltran and Wright to get a S-R-S-R-L-R-L combination going. The main upgrade would be Palanco. The way I see it, Sheffield’s still a better hitter than Byrnes who many seem to recommend. I don’t know if Detroit would do this kind of trade. If the Mets threw in another reliever like Duaner Sanchez I think it might get it done.
Sheff can’t field.. Isn’t that why he’s in the AL anyway?
A lot of people are said to not be able to field. Just look at Manny Ramirez. If it weren’t for David Ortiz, Ramirez probably would have been playing DH all those years. Sheffield’s played the majority of his career in the NL and at a corner OF position. He knows how to do it. He was upset about moving to the DH role probably more so because he thought he’d lose money in a future contract.
Detroit wants to trade him though. There’s no doubt about this. The Mets had rumored in the past about trading for him. He’s a hitter who can get hot quick and do big things. The good thing is like Delgado, he’ll become a FA so he’s not a long term option.
I’d obviously rather have Delgado over him, but I’d rather have Polanco over Castillo so I think the 2 for 2 swap plus Willis contractual reasons and Schoenweis to even out at the economics of the deal. Throw Heilman or Sanchez at them too so they can expand their bullpen depth.
I’d even turn around and see if it’s possible to pull off Rowand. Maybe Church and a mid-level prospect. Imagine having Polanco and Rowand in this line-up? And possibly Varitek? This team would get some fire back.
Please go look up the Japan versus Korea youtube with Koji Uehara, who is a free agent and won’t cost us one of our type As…..guys stuff is NASTY and was both a starter and a closer.
Yeah. He should be looked at. He’s a little older than Darvish, but the price wouldn’t be as high. I know with the Japanese system it sometimes requires the team to give up a payment to the club. I don’t know what his particular circumstance is, but he does look good.
What about signing Eric Hinske to platoon at 1B with Evans and trading Delgado for Ryan? Seems like it would be worth a shot. Not to mention that Hinske can play IF and OF. Hinske and Evans can’t replace Delgado’s 08 production but they can his 07. Which one will we get?