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Last week, in a report for the Daily News, Bill Madden wrote about Phillies GM Pat Gillick, who discussed how his team and the rest of the NL East hate the Mets.
Yesterday, in a report for SI.com, Jon Heyman quotes Gillick as saying of the Mets:
“I think sometimes it’s good to be celebratory, but sometimes it reaches the point where they’re taunting the other the team. Everyone should have the opportunity to celebrate. But there’s a fine line, and sometimes they tend to go over the line and taunt the other team.”
According to Heyman, Phillies SS Jimmy Rollins agreed, when asked if teams in the NL East ‘detest the Mets, adding,’ “In spring training next year go to each clubhouse and you’ll get a number of answers.”
Last week I wrote, “So, does this mean the Mets can now only win if teams love them? What does that even mean? Seriously, who cares if teams hate the Mets? Hey, how about the Mets just play better baseball and win on their own effort, and not care about 
what other people think of them. How about that? How about, instead of backing down, the Mets fight back.”
This is going to be a story in spring training, mark my words. These reporters will not forget about this – at least, I hope they do not forget about it. Because, instead of the Mets running from this, and letting these teams get in to their heads, they should take it on as something to rally around.
Jerry Manuel should use this to his advantage. He should make this an us-against-them type of fight, more than it usually is. He should make his team aware of the apparent fact that his squad is on the outside, that they have not won anything in two years, yet that they’re hated and nobody likes them. He should try to put a chip on this team’s shoulder, get them in a foxhole, make them gangsta, whatever you want to call it, and challenge them to truly give this division something to hate them for, like winning, and winning hard.
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I share this mantra. I know it sounds trite, but athletes really do derive motivation from the “us against the world” and “nobody respects us” mentalities. It would be very wise for Jerry to tap into this well.
I watch a lot of baseball. They have the extra innings package where I work. I really don’t notice the Mets celebrating more than other teams. I have no idea what Rollins and these other NL East teams are talking about. I’d like some more information about this. Maybe SNY can dig into its video footage and find some proof. The Mets do their hand shakes but I hardly find a handshake to be inflammatory. Reyes does his dancing and clapping but thats his personality, he just seems like a goofy guy. Unless there are things actually said between the players that no one is mentioning this whole story doesn’t even make sense.
And all season long, Reyes has kept most of that stuff in the dugout. It’s nowhere near as big or obtrusive as it was in years past.
I understand that point…It doesn’t seem too much. I think the other teams despise us for a number of reasons like Rollins said, and this was just something that gets him. Its easy to find things you detest when you don’t really like each other.
I think playing in the biggest sports market in the world (New York City) has something to do with it, as well. I mean, players of other teams, especially the peripheral ones, don’t get anywhere NEAR the attention ballplayers in New York get.
For example, I would venture to argue 50% of all baseball fans know who Aaron Heilman is. Yet when someone asks about Ryan Madson or Matt Lidstrom, they won’t konw who they are.
It’s just the way the sports media is configured. ESPN, most of the major news networks are situated in the heart of the city so naturally players of New York’s two franchises will get more coverage.
Jealousy. It’s an ugly thing…
i tell you what…to me this is more of a knock against those other nl east teams than it is against the mets. If these teams like the marlins, braves, and nationals only play as hard as they can against the mets that is very, very sad and it shows why these teams have finished in the bottom 3 spots in the division the past few years. I mean these 3 teams are pathetic now seriously and so are the phillies for still bringing it up on the verge of a ws title…i truly think the mets talk less than any other team in the league…i mean they may dance but whatever theyre having fun…heyman even said it himself yesterday that the phillies are bad in the clubhouse and the mets guys are nice
We need to start rolling gangsta
Everyone hated the 86 Mets too!
I def agree…but it would also be wise to provide Jerry a team that is capable of winning.
So is this the type of post we are going to get every slow day this offseason? Who cares if teams like us or not. Have we not covered this over and over?
aparently not enough
the celebrations are just as silly and juvenile as they look.
people defend them here, yet it’s the same people who love that Daniel Murphy means business, and is the no nonsense player we’ve been waiting for.
You may find this shocking, but it’s very possible to mean business while having fun at the same time.
you may be shocked to know too that you can have fun and not display juvenile look-at-me antics
How big is that stick up your arse?
yep… juvenile… like i said
This is coming from a guy who 90% of his post have something to do with firing Omar even though the Mets just gave him a 3 year extension. Pout much?
that’s pretty funny and true … but I’m convinced that Omar is clueless, and so until he’s gone that issue trumps all else, imo
who cares if we celebrate? I want to watch a team have fun winning…whenever that is. We have many holes and many weaknesses but these last few years have provided us, at times, with some fun baseball to watch. I’d rather watch them celebrate and lose than look plain and boring (perception-wise) and lose.
This is NYC…not Kansas City…we do things in style here…
Now…if you were to tell me we could win a WS while watching boring plain baseball…then I’m all ears…but thats no slam-dunk.
It does not matter though. It’s not something that will change in the near future. Move on. It’s like complaining about not winning in 2006. You can’t change it.
its just not a valid argument to hate the mets when you team does it too…thats my opinion
That is also Murphy’s personality. That is not Jose Reyes personality. You can not change Jose Reyes into Murphy. He won’t be himself and won’t perform like he does.
Jose has be himself just like any ball player should be themselves.
Ok Jose stop being yourself because other teams don’t like it.
WHO CARES IF OTHER TEAMS HATE YOU.
Remember early in ‘08…Reyes attempted to be more calm and quiet, and as a result, his level of play declined…Beltran told Jose to be himself, and when all was said and done, Reyes led the league in hits.
I think the point is that for whatever reason, Rollins and others in his head seem to feel that the antics are done with the other team in mind. When Reyes celebrates, I feel he is genuinely happy for himself and his teammates and doesn’t care who the pitcher or opposing team is. Reyes clearly is NOT trying to show anyone up. Darryl Strawberry walked around the bases when he hit a HR against someone he didn’t like. Hernandez, Carter and Knight were clearly aware of their enemies and played harder and celebrated more against them. Joba Chamberlain celebrated extra hard when he Kd a guy who took him deep the last time they faced each other. I’m just not sure where this is coming from. Wright doesn’t do it at all. Delgado only does handshakes, but otherwise refuses curtain calls to not show up opponents, Beltran is the quietest guy ever… WHO IS ROLLINS REFERRING TO?
Well put Matt,
The Mets should care less if other teams hate them and other teams comming out and saying they dislike the Mets should be considered “bulletin board material” to the Mets.
To me these other teams comming out and saying this BS, is just as bad, if not worse than anything they claim the Mets do to tick people off. I mean why are the Phillies GM and thier so called on the field leader even talking about the Mets right now in the first place, when they are on the verge of winning the world series.
Sure, why not.
For the last 2 years, they couldn’t get motivated enough over bitter defeats the previous season. Now the new motivational tactic is is to “give them something to really hate us for”
Yeah, this is gonna work.
It’s not about the motivational tactics, it’s about how soft this team is. I’m sure Reyes has danced around a few times today and it’s only 9:48
And Wright is still a scared b*tch.
New players please. WINNERS please. Tough guys please.
don’t worry. Omar’s gonna get us Randy Winn and Benjie Molina.
As-suming we upgrade our SP and BP what would be wrong with that? You really think that a lineup of
Reyes, Murphy, Wright, Beltran, Delgado, Molina, Church, Winn is not deep enough?
So Omar is admitting that he threw Milledge away to get Schneider, who he now suddenly no longer has the hots for.
He really has no plan for this club does he
I think it’s plenty deep. You get two guys in Winn and Molina who each will hit near .300 at the bottom of the lineup. And yeah, they’re in the mid 30’s - but we have a couple of big prospects for their positions who may be ready in a year or two.
as-suming we upgrade SP and BP, sure…
So if we traded Milledge for Schnieder and Church and then turned Schnieder and a couple of lower prospects into Molina and Winn then it’s a failed trade?>
I am sure we HAVE to upgrade the pen and SP as we have too many holes not to.
Church was a bigger part of that package than Schneider was. Yes we needed a catcher, but Church (ideally) provided us with a more seasoned all-around player than Milledge. Lastings may have had more upside, but Omar was going for the playoffs in 2008, and I think we had a better chance doing that with Church than Milledge….Its easy to say thats not true, but its unfair to knock Church b/c of the unforeseen injuries. And he wasn’t the same the rest of the year.
Milledge has a really good chance to already be more productive than Church next year. There is an emormously great chance that it’s going to prove a bad trade, and it was always leaning heavily that way
So it looks like Omar failed on all counts in that deal.
Church is lucky he got concussed because he would’ve reverted to his mediocre self given time
have you looked at milledges numbers compaired to church..milledge barley has better numbers playing almost double the games that church did…
Can someone please give you a concussion so you would revert back to a Mets fan?
Church in 2007 had over 60 Extrabase hits. That’s not bad for your first full season. He came out hot and we will see next year if that was a fluke or not. But to whine about Milledge is laughable at best. This is a guy that was self destructive and his trade value had fallen so badly that getting productive major leaguers at all was a stretch.
Shhh, stop providing stats Dirty. It does not help their point. Then they will say that Milledge is young, like that some how proves that he will be good. Then they will say that Church’s season was a fluke, yet Milledge’s was a sure sign of an allstar. Leave it alone.
Who knows which Ryan Church will show up. The may-version was a very balanced hitter who went the other way and played steady to above-average RF defense. Milledge will never be a balanced hitter. He will provide alot of pop, but he will be a streaky hitter with a big hole in his swing. Plus, he is very inconsistent in OF. I do love when he was playing as a softball-roamer while he was a CF against us.
There is certainly more potential with Lastings…and it may turn out to be a bad trade…but will it be slightly bad(hopefully) or really really bad(kazmir-style)..that remains to be seen.
I say hopefully…b/c the trade’s in the past and it wasn’t that great of a trade to begin with…but we’ll see what happens.
Look at Milledge’s second half numbers.
Look at Church’s.
And this is Church 2.0 post-concussion. He might never be the same. I’m not an unreasonable poster.
It was a bad trade in theory at the time of execution and looks like it will play itself out as a bad trade on the field.
So you want to forget the first half of the season and just use the second for Church. Yet for Milledge just the 2nd half and not the first? Nice.
Dude, I haven’t even brought up their relative ages. I’m taking it easy on you with this one.
of course real..that would help their arguement…
you are going to hang your case based off their age…danny please tell me you got something more than milledge is better because he was born in 1985 lol
Yes, age has nothing to do with how a player should be expected to progress. Silly me.
just an fyi-2008 stats
Lastings Milledge-138games 523ab’s
.268avg/.330obp/14hrs/61rbi/.402slg
Fielding CF
.986field%/ 2.65rf/.864zr
Ryan Church-90games 319ab’s
.276avg/.346obp/12hrs/49rbi/.439slg
Fielding RF
.995field%/ 2.33rf/.887zr
right now how about we focus on what we DO know rather than what he is “expected” to do….
If you base all trades on what a player has already done with no consideration to what he might do in the future, you would make a horrible GM.
Oh, and Milledge after August 1 last year: 223 PA, .318/.378/.485/.863
Dude stinks and has no promise.
But he’s younger Dirty…..
I guess Danny also expects that Milledge would have had those numbers here in NY with all the distractions of NY media and a playoff race. Right?