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The Red Sox have been in contact with Scott Boras about free-agent RHP Derek Lowe, according to the Boston Herald.
…it seems to me that lowe will wait until CC Sabathia signs with the either the Yankees or Angels, at which point he will shop himself to the Yankees, Angels, Mets, Dodgers, Red Sox, etc., all of whom have been linked to him in rumor so far this off-season…
Speaking of Sabathia, according to Joel Sherman in the New York Post, the Yankees intend to make him an aggressive offer, i.e., six-years, $150 million in Sherman’s opinion.
Meanwhile, “Freddy Garcia has drawn interest from a few teams as a potential lower-budget option for starting pitching on the free-agent market,” writes Jason Beck at MLB.com.
…we are bound to hear garcia’s name linked to the Mets, you can set your watch to it…if you recall, the Mets were said to have mild interest in garcia last off-season, spring and around the trade deadline…though, i sense he had more interest in playing for the Mets, than the Mets had in signing him…
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I would just as soon to sign Garland and trade for Vasquez. Stay out of this year’s pitching market.
A rotation of
Santana, Pelfrey, Vasquez, Maine, Garland while RH is good enough for me. If Niese does well this season then you can look at a trade of Garland or Vasquez.
good point.. i’d do that too as well.. that can also free money to sign TEIXEIRA and get more bullpen help for delgado..
I know we’ve gone down this road before.. but Garland is terrible.
Throw out his wins and his numbers awful.
I know we have, but he is still a quality #5 that will not cost us picks nor prospects. Considering Silva gets 12 a year then signing Garland for 3/36 is not a bad option at all. Especially considering what Lowe is going to ask for or even Ollie.
12 million for Garland is terrible.
Could easily plug in someone younger and cheaper.
Would much rather omar make a similar deal for how the Nats got Scott Olsen them commit 12 million to a guy who posted a 4.9 era last year and a whip of 1.5
EWM, who would you suggest that is younger and cheaper, that you know is major league ready and that can be had without trading major prospects nor surrendering picks? Garland is an “ok” option, which is all TRS pegs him as. Considering how many times Figgy & the poo poo platter couldn’t get into the 5th even, I think Garland would be an “ok” pickup.
And, unfortunately, 12 million may be the going rate for “ok.”
12 million for a guy who gave up 237 hits in 197 innings… to go along with 59 walks, and 107 earned runs, and only 90ks?
I’m pretty sure our very own Jon Niese could do that.
How about listing those plenty of options? IF I could get Sonnanstine or Jackson instead? Then sure. Otherwise going with Niese is risky and Garland is the best Type B FA out there. If you want you can bring in a guy like Livan for 1 year?
And once Niese gets shelled and sent down, who do you go to?
You sure about that? Look at Niese’s numbers last season. Look at Pelfrey’s numbers his 1st season where he started 0- and forever.
I’m just saying no way Garland’s numbers dictate 12 million bucks a year..
You’re on here saying why spend x amount for Fuentes when x plus a little more will get you k-rod.
Well why waste 12 million bucks on a guy whose career ERA is 4.47, and career WHIP is 1.4.. it wasn’t just last year.. he’s not a good pitcher.
Either spend a little more and bring back a guy whose much better (to go along with your k-rod example)
Or bring in a few guys to compete for the 5th spot.
Take a look at Silva’s numbers and get back to me.
Of course they do not warrant that much, but that’s what 200 innings of under 5.00 ERA gets you right now.
Personally Omar should of jumped on Scott Olsen if he was available.. he’ll post better numbers then Garland and cost about 8 mill yes then the 12 you quote.. go find a guy like that on a team… since he’s supposed to be so creative.
And please give an example of this bring in a few guys or spend the extra….
Agreed on Olson but there is no guarntee that he was even available to the Mets or that we had what they wanted.
You want carlos silva? I bet you the Mariners would send him to you on a silver platter for a bucket of used balls.
You could probably pry Gil Meche from the Royals…
There are a host of guys ought there that will do more for 12 million.
Once you’re up to 12.. at least get a guy whose actually good.
Agreed but that is now the going rate because of guys like Silva and Menche. Garland is better than Silva so why will he get less.
Again, if we bring in Vasquez and his innings then I could be tempted in looking at other guys but besides the Sonnanstine and Jackson idea’s who’s out there? Guys like Garcia or Prior that are huge injury risk? Livan?
Brad Penny comes to mind… I bet Meche could be had from the Royals… I dunno just not crazy about Garland for 12 million.. I’d rather the 09 poo poo player of the Mets farm then him for that money
by the way Gregg just went to the Cubs
Hmm? bye bye Wood? Will they go with Marmol for Closer and Gregg as setup man?
Or even more will Marmol go in a deal for Peavy?
I’d be inclined to agree, TRS, but I would only say to stay out of the FA pitching if we upgrade other places. For instance, if we get an outfield bat & a closer, then I’d be fine with the above plan. But if we go forward with a similar offense, I think we need to be players for FA starting pitching.
I just hope some of these dominos start falling early, so that the front office can adjust accordingly.
I disagree, I think our offense will be just fine. As long as we don’t have the injuries again. Murphy in LF and a better Castillo or signing a guy like Grudzy should not hurt the offense at all.
You’ve been pimping Grudzy for some time! I agree that’s a good signing, I just don’t know if that’s enough. I think the offense you list below is not that different from this year; and while offense wasn’t our major problem, I definitely feel it could use an upgrade.
I’d be fine jumping into FA starters, offense, bullpen… The bottom line in any move the Mets make in the offseason is that I want the payback to outweigh the cost. Vazquez for Castillo? Love it. Vazquez for Niese, Parnell, FMart, Murphy… not so much.
Where did we finish in Runs scored last season?
Again, is the offense perfect? No. But it’s just not high on my priority list. We are not going to get every thing. We have young position players ready and developing. We don’t have much in the pitching department.
Have it your way, but if Daniel Murphy is hitting .240 at the trade deadline next year, you can’t start crying for a big trade for a corner OF bat
At this point I sign
Krod 14 million
Garland 12 million
Trade for Vasquez 11 million.
Sign Eddie Guardado 2 million
Trade for Betancourt (swap a salary there)
Sign Grudzy 2 million.
Let Murphy start in LF and Castillo and Grudzy at 2B if Castillo can’t be traded.
Reyes, Murphy, Wright, Delgado, Beltran, Church, Schnieder/Castro, Castillo
Rotation
Johan, Pelfrey, Vasquez, Maine, Garland
BP
Krod, Guardado, Betancourt, Stokes, Show/Feliciano, Smith, Sanchez
Bench
Endy, Castro, Grudzy, Pagan, Tatis
Then if you want to look at trades for Molina or trading Show, Feliciano, Sanchez etc you can.
Do you like Beimel? I think I’d like him better than Guardado.
Yes but Guardado will be cheaper and has closer experience. He most likely will come in on a 1 year deal instead of a 3 year deal.
Very true, if you’re looking at it from a money perspective.
Come on Guardado?????????????
You can’t have all stars there buddy. Look at Guardado’s numbers last season in Texas. He is reliable and can pitch to RH and LH.
I totally understand that we cant have all the stars. But this is the part of the team that cost us big time last september and i just feel like you have to go all out and try your best to fix it. With all the players available out there, i would go in a different route
He had a 3.62 ERA in Texas last season with a 1.12 WHIP.
But then you are wanting us not to get Vasquez by trade. Thus you want us to spend tons of money on SP, BP and bring in a LF. That’s just not going to happen. I would much rather have all the top names too but it’s just not realistic.
Bringing in guys like Guardado and Betancourt that have experience and are cheap and short term is exactly how you should build your pen after the closer spot. Look at how that worked for Philly and the Rays.
I just think there are soooo many better options. and he owuld be a last resort desperation move type of guy.
thereal some people here think if baseball as a fantasy league and not a real life business. Obviously we would all love to krod,fuentes,CC,tex etc.. but it aint gunna happen. First and foremost this is a business and they will TRY to make smart business decisions. Some people on this site think that the mets are the only team in baseball. Other teams want good players too guys and you cant have em all. I like garland because I dont think lowe will end up here.
…and he’s also 38 years old. Haven’t we had enough of these guys in the past couple of years???
(Guardado, that is)
Age is not that big of a deal for a guy like Guardado on a 1 year, repeat 1 year deal.
The point is the Mets have to UPGRADE their bullpen. It has to be World Championship Winning caliber or else on november 13, 2009 we will be having the same convo!!!
But you can’t upgrade a pen by throwing a bunch of money at it.
I am not saying the MEts should go out and sign all of the MLB players union. Im just saying that you have to be willing to spend a lil extra cash to increase the level of talent. If a better reliever is gonna cost you 3 million per year more, so be it sign him. This is NY for god sakes we dont have a budget!!!
But we do have a budget. They are not going to go over the luxury tax just like they don’t go over slot.
Thus, you can’t have every thing. Look at last year’s best pens. Most have 1 premier guy and a lot of if’s and’s and but’s.
I would love to go get
Krod, Cruz, Biemel, Affedlt and the works but chances are we are not going to sign but 1 or at most 2 of them.
I think a pen needs 2 top notch guys to be successfull. IF you can sign 2 guys of that list that would be great. but like you said earlier, a pen sonsisting of Guardado, Betancourt, Stokes, Show/Feliciano, Smith just does not cut it for me. Now say KRod and Cruz, and a bunch of throw ins would be a better idea. Cause remember, you have building a decent bridge to get to Krod. and you need a solid 8th inning guy. Eddie just isnt that.
MOST (NOT ALL) BUT MOST bullpens have 2 guys who come in and you know are gonna shut things down.
Not a bad idea…. I love Garland as a 5th guy. If you going to aquire 11 mil for vasquez i’d rather sign lowe for the extra 2 or 3 million.
I think everyone stating that Pelfrey is already a #2 quality guy is a little ahead of themselves. While he shows for a few months he’s finally coming around, that’s all it is…. a few months. Don’t we as fans ever learn. Heading into last year all of us, myself included, thought Maine was going to win 18-20 games. So to say all of a sudden Pelfrey is anything more then your 3rd or 4th pitcher is getting ahead of ourselves, cause look maine went from our #2 18 game winner to our #4.
So i’d like to see a Johan, Lowe, Pelfrey, Maine, Garland. Though in garland’s place i’d like another lefty to break up the righties, if at all possible.
I also want Delgado gone. His 12 million dollar one year deal has to be enticing to some AL team looking for a DH. I blame him as for the collapses as much as i do anyone else. He is supposed to be one of the so called Leaders of this team, but then says he leads by example, which was sulking, non-hustling. Get rid of him.
Dont’ agree with much of this. As for Vasquez or Lowe? Vasquez is much younger and is only signed for 1-2 years. Lowe wants 4 years and at least 60 million. That’s a big difference.
Maine only had 15 wins in ‘07 (and a pretty mediocre 2nd half of that season, as well). I think most people are reacting to Pelfrey b/c his stuff much better — throws harder, with good sink — and has shown a lot of heart in trying to finish off games late in the year (when the bull pen needed rest)… which is something Maine never showed, mostly b/c by the 5th inning he’s nearing the 100 pitch count.
I 100% agree with you now. Nobody thought that heading into last year. Please. Everyone thought we had him, Johan, Ollie winning 15 at least each, Johan at 20, then hoping for 10 from each of Pedro and Pelfrey.
While Pelfrey did look good the 2nd half of last year, I would want him Slotted as our #2 starter. I’d rather have someone who has done it for a few years there. That’s all i’m saying. I think pelfrey will take another big step forward this year and have a way bigger W-L record and be one of our best pitchers.
Also TRS, 4 for 60 is a lot more then 2 for 22, but year by year it’s only 4 million. Plus if you back load it you can have Lowe at the same price year one. I’d much rather have Derek Lowe then Vasquez. Vasquez is also a guy who has one winning season over the last 5, while Jon Garland has one losing season in the last 8 years and Derek Lowe has had 2 losing seasons since 2002 when he became a starter.
Sorry I’d much rather spend on Lowe and Garland and have Vasquez as my fall back. Now if i could only have one of those 3, based on possible salary’s and everything, give me garland. The guy just wins. He’s nothing fancy, just 32+ starts, 190+ innings and 12+ wins. Every year.
I hear you on Pelfrey, I’d love to have someone else step in as a #2 to take pressure off of him — I just don’t see anyone out there who’ll do that (outside of the big money guys, ie. CC, Burnett — I honestly don’t even put Derek Lowe ahead of him — he only leads in reputation — and salary).
And speaking of Maine, there’s cause for real concern — even if he is healthy — his ERA the past 3 years has risen from 3.60 to 3.91 to 4.18, so what’s next, 4.5?
Perez over Garland !!!
Perez @ $15/4 years is MUCH better than garland @$12/3 years. The upside is MUCH higher and so is his proven track record Vs. Phillies, Braves and Yankees.
Money wise, we are replacing Pedro’s yearly salary with KRod, Vasquez replaces Alou + El Duque (less $2mil I believe) and Perez gets bumped up.
The $20 mil coming in from Citifield’s naming rights easily takes care of the upgrades to bullpen and Perez’s salary.
Once the pitching is addressed…how about Furcal batting 2nd and playing 2nd ? Leaving Murphy playing most of the games in LF with Tatis starting vs. tough lefties ?
In theory, not a bad idea. But in reality, Furcal is going to command a lot of $$$ (12/year I’m guessing, maybe more?)… a lot more than Orlando Hudson even.
AND then you’re asking him to change positions for you as well…
I just don’t see it happening.
Off Topic…Kevin Gregg has just been traded to the Cubs for a 22 yo minor leaguer.
i know it won’t happen, but i’d sign sabathia.
having two aces at the top of the rotation cuts down on bullpen innings, which is the only way to have good middle relief. the middle reliever across the league are pretty bad.
mets current offense + a gritty role player or two + sabathia + closer (k-rod or fuentes or jenks) = world series
Garland is pretty mediocre. And is exactly the reason that Heilmann should be (or chould have been given!) a shot at the rotation.
I will go out on a limb and say that if he gets his injury (knee?) taken care of and is healthy, and preps over the winter to start (and in ST), he can easily put up comparable or better numbers to Garland (wildcard being innings total). And if he doesn’t do it in NY, he will probably do it on another team.
Also saves about 10 million in payroll next year.
I understand being reluctant to give a rookie like Neise a rotation spot to start the year, but for all the angst he generates among the fan base, AH is no rookie and has the “stuff” to be a starter. Plus he is a big, storng guy and was a starter for eyars, so he certainly should be able to ahndle the load.
Beyond that, Get K Rod and Cruz or Affeldt, and a flyer on Cordero, and the pen will be solidified for nothing but cash.
ANd notice, this leaves all the prospects around to use or trade. And I would look into the Sox deals for Dye and/or Vazquez, since they could both fill needs and not lock into long term deals.
Add: K rod, Affeldt/Cruz, Cordero (or another B list pen guy) Dye and Vazquez.
Delete: Castillo 9any way possible!), Shoe, Feliciano, Heilmann (from the pen).
Murphy at 2B (hope and pray).
These changes, which cost money but other than K rod at 26 YO don’t have any long term commitments, IMO fill the gaping holes from last year, and won’t cost a ton of prospects.
Rest of the roster filled out from internal guys, or minor trades/FA agent signings.
I totally agree with you stickguy.
I would go KROD, Cruz, and Cordero, but as far as everything else, looks good to me!!
I dont believe Heilman can thrive in any kind of role in New York anymore. He would be better off in a new enviornment where he’ll probably pitch fine. Though you and a few others wish to give him a chance, the moment things go wrong in a game the fans will be all over him. I dont believe he can handle it anymore. He would be better off somewhere new.
…at this point it wouldnt surprise me if we ended up with a rotation of Santana, Pelfrey, Maine, Jason Vargas, and Garcia/Byrd/etc/etc.
Everyone seems to have 3-6 teams after them, and the Mets dont have the payroll flexability to get into bidding wars on one player.
Maybe Jon Garland will fall in Minaya’s lap, who knows…