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According to the San Francisco Chronicle, 
the Rockies may look to ‘spin’ Huston Street to the Mets, Tigers, Indians or Brewers.
However, as Ken Davidoff writes in Newsday, ‘The Mets don’t love Street, and the Mariners, who want to contend in 2009, could hold onto J.J. Putz.’
Interesting, in that the Rockies, along with the Cardinals, Cubs and D’Backs, have interest in Heilman, according to Adam Rubin in last Tuesday’s Daily News.
…also, from what i recall, the Rockies expressed interest in heilman during the trade deadline…
…i wonder if the Rockies would be interested in heilman…in that they’d be trading a set-up man in street, who is under contract through 2010, in exchange for heilman, who they could use as a starting pitcher, and who is under contract through 2010…
…nevertheless, i get the sense that street will not be traded until later in the off season, after Francisco Rodriguez and Brian Fuentes have signed, when the demand for a late-inning bullpen arm can go up…
…which works just fine for the Mets, who, i believe, prefer to utilize the free-agent market for a closer, then use the trade market to support the rest of the bullpen…
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If they can trade Heilman for Street straight up, I would do that in a heartbeat. That probably is only a pipe dream though.
Street will be worth SO MUCH more than that in March.
We’d probably have to add Kunz or Evans in that deal.
Still, a Chad Cordero – Huston Street – Francisco Rodriguez tandem, blows the DOORS off what we’ve had the last 2 years..
You don’t want Cordero on the Mets
He’s finished. His fastball wasn’t even breaking 80 before he was DL’d last season.
Forgive me if others have posted this, but Street blows 23% of his save chances! And this is consistent throughout his career—the year he saved 37, he blew 11!!
Let’s hope Omar is not even thinking about this guy…..
Agreed, not for closer. Still better than giving Fuentes what he wants.
Oh I agree, no Fuentes….KRod, and if not him, I say Putz or Jenks maybe….NO Fuentes….he is another disaster contract waiting to happen….he will be 34 next summer!
There are so many more options I would consider over Fuentes. He would be last on my list. Which is why I think all interest in him is a smokescreen and not even a good one.
I don’t know for sure, but something about the way last year ended has seriously decreased my interest in offseason moves. Call it apothy, or whatever, but I have just lost interest. I’m not sure if it’s faith that I have lost. I just don’t have the hunger after two crushing years to hang on every single offseason rumor.
Anyone feeling this way?
I keep hoping it stops so I can enjoy what is typically my favorite thing about winter – the hot stove.
wake up kid and get your a-ss back in the game. This is usually all our METS give us…terrific offseasons.
I think Street could be solid in our BP. I’m a fan of risk guys like Street and Cordero. Yea, they have their issues but when they’re on, look out.
I’d go after Cordero too, since he’s a FA. But trading a package of Heilmain + ? for Street would be solid too.
You are not getting Street with out giving up a top prospect. As for Cordero, perfect move.
No way if COL inquires about F-Mart, Murphy, Niese, Holt or Parnell.
Everyone else is expendable for Street.
Holt cannot be traded yet, so don’t worry (has to be a full year after the draft).
sign krod
trade hielman and prospect for street
sign biemel
krod
street
biemel
smith
parnell
stokes
etc.
Where do you guys keep getting that Heilman and a prospect could net Street? Maybe Heilman and Fmart or Heilman and Niese or even Murphy. But you are not getting him for something like Heilman and Parnell.
hielman and evans would do it…the rockies are extremely high on hielman
The Rockies are high on something, alright………if they want Heil-Boy that much!
i’d take him to be our #8 inning guy that’s it!! but you never know, after seeing the nats get olsen and willingham for bonifacio anything is possible!!
I agree with phukthephills. Heilman and Evans is a fair offer for Street. Street won’t cost a top prospect.
And there is no possible way F-Mart is even mentioned in a deal for street. He didn’t go for Santana, he ain’t going for no relief pitcher.
i think the ideal situation would be to sign K-Rod to close games and sign Juan Cruz to set up K-Rod. But, i know they are both type A free agents, so i am dreaming. Maybe sign Affeldt and Beimel (both type B) as well as K-Rod would complete the pen.
It does not really matter about the type A part. If we let Perez walk then we get 2 picks back.
Why worry about draft picks? You’re already looking to get rid of 2007’s first round pick in Kunz after he’s only been a professional for over a year and a half. All because his manager didnt want to pitch him and Parnell, showing no confidence in either of them. Next year it will be lets get rid of Davis, Havens, and Holt. Stop worrying about losing draft picks if we’re not going to give them a chance to develop anyway.
Eddie Kunz was their first pick, not a first round pick. That was given up for signing Moises Alou. Which no one seemed to mind giving up for a broken down ancient ballplayer…now we won’t give up a lower pick in a trade for something that’s actually valuable?
Fine but the jist of my post was that why should we worry about draft picks if we’re never going to let them develop and get rid of them anyway.
Heilman has got nasty stuff. He needs to get outta NY and the rockies seem to think he can be a starter. You’re saying Colorado wouldn’t trade a “closer” with close to a fifth of his save chances blown for a potential starter with a 95-96 mph fastball and Evans, a young guy who’s shown he can play at the major league level?
I think being a mets fan has jaded you towards Heilman. Luckily I don’t think the Rockies front office is full of Met fans.
No they would not. Someone will give more in March.
Ask yourself this, would that package have worked if we wanted Street while he was with the A’s?
No because Beane is with the A’s. Every GM is different and has different needs. The Rockies don’t even like Street that much.
The A’s never expressed interest in Heilman. So no I don’t think the A’s would have made that trade. I honestly think Heilman can make it as a starter. He doesn’t have the mentality for the pen and he’s not a good fit for the Do or Die NY fans.
I just don’t think the Rockies are going to wait. and if they do, I don’t think they’d be able to get a starter who could give you what heilman can when he’s on his game, and a proven prospect
But even if the Rockies value Heilman, don’t you think that they know that his value right now is low?
Lower value …yes. That doesn’t mean he has no value though. He’s still a valuable piece … Mets fans just love to hate the guy, that’s all.
Street’s value is low as well though, so it wont take as much to acquire him as a couple of years ago. I agree that Heilman is a valuable piece who could net more in return than any of the Mets other relievers. I dont like Street much at all because his numbers have gotten much worse the last few years.
I don’t think his value is that low. I mean everybody is clamoring for starters and they could turn street, who’s value isn’t that high itself, for a starter with his velocity aaand prospect. I’m tellin you right now, if Heilman starts for another team this year, he’ll get at least 10 wins. Less pressure and a change of scenery should do it for him. It’s not like he’s been losing his velocity or movement on the ball.
I am not down on Heilman, it’s just that his value is not going to bring back Street right now. Not unless we include more than just a guy like Evans. Maybe if you did Heilman, Evans and Parnell. But is that too much?>
can someone tell me why do people here think Javier Vasquez is good enough to be our #3 starter?????
to start: the mets only have two signed, healthy starters going into next year.
maine will be healhy for next season
thanks, doc
lol
Because of his k/9 his walk per nine and the fact he put up a semi decent ERA in a notorious hitters park with one of the worst defenses in the league behind him.
I’d sure as hell take him to be our #4 starter … I’ll tell you that.
but what about the fact that he doesnt pitch well under pressure, his career era is 4.32 and when he was in his prime, he got ran out of NY.
When he was in NY he was viewed as an ace type. If he’s 4th in the Mets rotation … all you want from him is quality innings, which he’ll give. We don’t need him to be a savior … just a horse.
thats fine but we need a 2nd or 3rd starter not a 4th starter.
if we can get Lowe and Vasquez then i’d take that in a second but having to rely on Vasquez or Maine is a mistake
Thats actually what I stated on a comment below. You have to look at this with the premise that Ollie will be replaced on the free agent market.
as of right now we have santana and pelfrey, then maine and niese… if we get vasques what u think he’d be right now?
4
Basically the only non question mark we have right now is Santana. and sort of Pelfrey. We know Pelfrey will be at least a solid #4 pitcher but anything else is a question mark.
pelfrey is a solid 3 and a good 2…i dont kno if u watched him pitch last year but most of the time he was our 1
I wouldn’t call Pelfrey or Maine question marks. They are both good middle of the rotation pitchers who you can basically get what you count on from them, if you are being realistic.
You have to look at the rotation on the premise that you’re going to add a free agent like Lowe or someone else … if that’s the case and you can trade for Vasquez then he’s a solid 4 or 5 pitcher. Very solid.
if we added lowe and vasquez then our rotation would be
johan
lowe/pelf
lowe/pelf
maine
vasquez
think back to when maine was healthy in 06 and 07…he was one of our best starters
That is a very solid rotation.
Phuk the phils look at Pelfrey’s home away splits. He had nearly a 5 ERA on the road when you consider that and the fact that the fact he doesn’t k many guys and his WHIP is fairly high, and that its a well known fact his off-speed pitches are a work in progress, it’s hard to see him as a solid 3 or a number 2 at all. I’d imagine his ERA to go up a bit this
Also mikey_ff I would call Maine a question mark because of how many pitches he throws a game and how many batters he walks. He’s not going to be able to give you more than 5-6 innings a game and throwing so many pitches an inning is going to tire out his arm so you’d expect him to start the struggle down the stretch.
Well like I said … if you’re being realistic about Maine then you’ll get what you expect, which is a 6 inning pitcher in the middle of the rotation. Sometimes you’ll get more from him but you’ll get what you expect. You can do worse than Maine in the middle of the rotation, for sure.
i agree with Gina all the way around here. Pelf has 1 full season and that is not enough to say he is a lock for 200 innings/35 starts 3.50-4.00 era. He could go either way this year( sophomore jinx) and he is probably a #4 starter at best right now. We have 2 spots in the rotation to fill by trade of FA signings. Maine is even less of a sure thing than Pelf with the surgery and his inconsistency playing a factor here. We need 2 starters any way that you look at it
* by trade or FA signings
No ones saying that we don’t need 2 starters. Just saying that Pelf and Maine are good pitchers for the middle of the rotation, from 3-5, however they slot in when the other 2 slots are addressed.
I would definitely slot Vazquez/Lowe in the #2 and #3 slots and then Pelf and Maine in #4 and #5.
Why does everyone keep forgetting to add a LHP to our rotation if Ollie leaves? Omar is not very good at many things, but balancing the rotation has not been one of them. We can’t have 4 RHP’s in the rotation or we’ll get clobbered by teams like Milwaukee that load up to kill the RHP’s.
Chico … it’s all about what is out there. What left handed starter is there for us to add?
Niese
Do you not look at stats? Who was our #3 last season? Perez? Compare their stats with Perez pitching in a pitchers park.
I think Vazquez would be the #2 starter on the team, and I don’t even think it’s close. No starter besides Santana has been a solid starter for a full season. Vazquez in the NL in a pitchers park with a far better defense than he’s had the last few years makes him a very, very good pitcher.
Please do not spin Street to us, unless it’s a reasonable deal. His numbers do not back up the hype his name has. He’s a very good righty specialist and that’s about it right now.
I agree … people over value Street.
gina, he’s better than a righty specialist.. this year he was bad but he’s had a so and so career so far.. although he has blown a lot of saves!!!!
if the Mets rotation is Santana, Lowe, Pelfrey, Maine, Vasquez, Dye is added to our lineup and K-Rod and D.Reyes are our closer and set-up man then we have then we can feel very confident about going far this year
far? that’s worl series or bust!!!
I would have to agree there, but then again, the bridge to the 9th isn’t all that sturdy. Cruz, Biemel or Street…….then I will go right ahead and purchase a partial season ticket plan.
dye, jenks and vasquez for kunz, church, niese and hielman
not gonna happen..
kenny williams is not dumb, he knows he can get aa lot more than 4 players ( 3 prospects) for them..
I just don’t see the need to trade a young cheap under control Church in a deal for an old 1 year of Dye.
no need to trade for Jenks or trade Church when K-Rod is available.
Parnell, Evans and Kunz for Vasquez and Dye. That is what it will take to get those 2 together.
Evans and Kunz can go for all i care both of which are not part of our long term plans but Parnell is hard to part with.
if Colorado really likes Heilman maybe we could trade Heilman and Muniz for Taylor Buchholz. He had a 2.14 ERA in the Rockies bullpen.
Way too low considering the market for SP. That might be enough to get just Vasquez.
You might have to throw in Murphy there. Which would be giving up wayyyy too much!!!!!
Trade for Dye and Vasquez.
Sign K-Rod.
How? I think we have enough to get Vasquez but not enough for Dye and Vazquez.
With that swinging strike rate in the mid-70’s, he just needs to keep throwing strikes. Once his WHIP returns to career norms, around 1, he’ll be great.
Now’s the time to buy low.
and by the way, have we mentioned he’s only 25 years old!! him and k-rod would anchor our bullpen for years to come..
I like Juan Cruz to set up KROD. Cruz is only 30 himself which is kinda young, so you figure he also can be in that pen for a few years to come.
yeah, him as well, but remember he’s type A free agent, and i don’t think the mets will be thrilled to go after..
Comapre Vasquez’s numbers in the AL in a pitchers park to Perez last season. Vasquez will be listed first in the following comparisions
Innings
208.3
194
Innings per start
6 1/3
5 2/3
WHIP
1.32
1.42
Walks
61
105
SO
200
180
ERA
4.62
4.22
So the only way you could say that Perez is anywhere near Vasquez is in their ERA’s but again looking at those stats whose ERA is more true?
Not to mention that Vasquez has thrown 198+ innings for 9 years in a row and Perez has yet to throw that many.
Anyone who thinks that he would not be at least the #3 starter here is insane.
But Vazquez can not pitch in NY!!!! He proved it while playing for the Junkees. Plus no way he is a number 3 starter, cause i put both pelfrey and maine ahead of him!!
And if the Mets can sign Lowe, he is a #5 at best.
Look at Maine’s numbers compared to Vasquez. Maine can’t get out of the 6th inning.
And the NY thing is a joke it was 1 year and he had a bad ERA. He was an allstar that year and fell apart in the 2nd half.
maine no.. he needs to prove himself.. vasquez will be a good addition.. inning eater.. plus wheteher he or maine is 4th we will have one of the best rotation in the ML..
I think Maine proved himself very well before he got hurt
IF he can control his pitch count and not waste so many pitches, he is will be dominant!!
AFTER peterson left he became marginal and we all saw that
I think it had to do more with the bone spurs in his shoulder.
Mikey, i totally agree.
so he had a bone spur since june??? he came out with that in august!! he was pitching terrible after peterson left, i read that i had something to do with his mechanics..
Nah … he had it the whole time. He was having shoulder issues as early as May … maybe earlier.
…and yeah, mechanics … that usually happens when a guy is injured. The mechanics change.
Vazquez is a flyball pitcher who with the Yankees in 2004 threw in front of the worst defensive outfield in the history of baseball (Matsui, Bernie, Sheffield). It has nothing to do with him “not being able to pitch in NY”.
Vasquez doesn’t pitch well under pressure. I wouldnt trust him in a big game
For the salary that Vazquez is making, he is a bargain!
He made 11.5 million last season. How is that a bargain for a #5 starter?
Wake up! he isnt a #5 starter, go look up his stats versus other AL #5 starters. In the NL, Vazquez is a #2 or #3 starter, depending on what teams rotation you are putting him in.
On the mets, he is a #5 Santana, Pelfrey, Lowe (if we can get him) Maine, and Vazquez. Look at his stats from the past 5 years. HE STINKS!!!!!!!!!!! An ERA of under 4.50 just ONCE!!!!
Stop spreading lies. He has done it 2 times. And During the last 5 years he has pitched over 200 innings EVERY YEAR.
If you can get him without giving up much it is well worth it. I sitll think Kunz, Evans, Hielman, Castillo and Gee/Stoner for Dye and Vasquez would work and be great for us.
As our rotation is currently constucted if we added Vasquez tommorow he would be OUR number 2.
Really #2?? Over both Pelfrey and Maine????
In his past 5 seasons, he has an ERA of under 4.50 just ONCE. And in his one year in the NL with Arizona he stunk it up!!!!!
metinDC23..
he does have the potential, but i wouldn’t pin him ahead of pelfrey.. slightly over maine.. not over pelfrey.. and if maine goes back to 2007 first half maine he will be our #2
Thats a big IF with Maine. I have hope but think a wait and see approach is best with him. I love Pelf but he can’t pitch to lefties and his stats make me think he might not have been as good as his era- I wouldn’t be suprised it goes up this year (unless the changeup comes around…)
He has had an ERA under 4.50 2 times in the last 5 years including a 3.84 in 2007 but why let facts get in the way.
And the year that he “stunk it up” in Arizona he pitched 215 innings with a 1.25 WHIP.
Besides, obviously you are one that values ERA over every other real stat so you win.
You guys are counting on what you hope Pelf and Maine will do. Vazquez or Lowe have proven to be durable workhorses that keep you in ballgames. Like “the Real ” or Gina said, Vazquez pitched in US Cellular field (true hitters park) in the AL. There is a big difference in Shea vs most AL parks(much smaller). Vazquez can easily give Perez numbers without the high walks and Jeckell/Hyde pitching performances game to game. And at a much more reasonable salary.
plus we get 2 picks for Perez!
PELFREY AND MAINE HAVE YET TO PITCH WELL FOR A FULL SEASON. THE METS WILL BE WATCHING THE PLAYOFFS AGAIN IF THEY ARE THE #2 AND #3 STARTERS
Some of you guys kill me. I even posted his stats on here. Vasquez is incredibly underrated. Look at his stats people. He would have been our #2 last season and easily our #3 next season.
I am looking at his stats, and i do not know what good you see in them??? Can you help me find any positives in his stats?
The fact that he was better than our last year’s #3 in every catagory but ERA?
The fact that he cost less than Carlos Silva and is on a short term contract?
K/9, BB/9, his innings pitched, his FIP(fielding independent ERA)
Wjat good is his K/9, BB/9 and innings pitched if his ERA has been sonsistently over 4.50 the past 5 seasons. except for one yr
Duh, what d’oes mean?
It’s 2 years you can’t read.
Again, if you are hung up on ERA you are insane. ERA has so much more to do with your park, your defense, your league….
Because things like K/9 and BB/9 are for the most part completely within a pitchers control. ERA isn’t. ERA can be affected by the parks you’re in the defense behind you and to an extent good/bad luck. A guy pitching in petco in 2007 probably isn’t going to have the same ERA in 2008 if he pitches in Arlington. And that’s not even taking into account defense. Do you think if we replaced our current outfield with an outfield of 3 random guys off the street our pitchers ERA’s would look the same as they do now?
Thanks Gina.
This is like the people who only look at BA instead of OPS. It’s very frustrating.
Vasquez is only on the block because he does not get along with Gullien and who could after calling him out in public like that.
Perez will probably be making 14/15 million/yr in ‘09 with more walks and inconsistency than Vazquez. Vazquez is a bargain.
i’d agree number wise he would’ve, but in the pedigree he folder like a possum when the sox needed him to step up!! we didn’t need that..
At least they’re not basing their arguments on pitchers wins and losses like people were yesterday. Maybe tomorrow they’ll consider WHIP?
who cares if he is the #3 or #4 or #5 starter?
the question is: will vazquez be better than whoever his replacement in the rotation will be without getting him?
if vazquez is better than any of the mets starters on opening day it’s worth getting him if the price is good.
Agreed, it all gets jumbled up anyway. But to me with the potiental of having a 5 inning pitcher in Maine and a posibility of a grab bag at #5 Vasquez makes too much sense.
thats’s the thing, how does the white sox view him? as a #5 or a #2..? that’s what we should be concern with,, but as i said before, omar will get him.. he’s latin and he was an expo.. done deal..
Yeah but if a price is good or not depends on how he’ll do in the Mets rotation.
why not sign perez and get vasquez?
I think everyone just a.s.s.u.m.e.s that Perez ain’t coming back because of Boras.
Well i think we’d be better off because we get draft picks for him. That way if we sign another type A (which I think is a forgone conclusion) we still have a 1st rounder and a supplemental round pick that we wouldn’t have had before.
Exactly metinDC23!
And I would rather take the picks and bring in someone to compete for #5. Maybe Niese works out for 2010 and you save a lot of money on the 5 inning man.
Exactly. The order of 3-5 does not matter in regular season. The only thing that matters is … is he an upgrade to what we had. Vasquez would be an upgrade in any one of those 3-5 spots.
Love all this talk about how Vasquez can’t pitch in
NY. Last I checked, he won 14 gms in the Bronx Zoo
when he was here.I’d sign for that from our 4th starter.
Wake up people! I can say that i’m in love with Street, he’s young, and fairly proven. NO JENKS! have you seen this guys K/9? it’s horrible. its one thing for a starter to have a bad K/9, but a closer? And it is not just this year, his K/9 has been decreasing for the last 2-3 years… so theres got to be a reason for the White sox to be wanting to get rid of this guy. probally losing his stuff. And no Putz, Off an injury and aging, if your going to get an aging closer, get Fuentes.
-Get Street or K-rod.
Trade Heilman, Evans and throw in Kunz if needed ( this guy is not going to be a Major league Closer anytime soon, and the way hes pitching now, or in the distant future.)