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In the Daily News, three reporters team up to write:
“Meanwhile, Omar Minaya was discussing a trade for a pitcher with a GM but said he would first have to see how Sabathia’s free agency was
progressing, a baseball executive said. A Mets official subsequently wouldn’t deny interest in Sabathia.”
…look, i don’t mean to throw cold water on this, because i see people getting all giddy, but i do not read the executive’s statement to mean the Mets are interested in sabathia, which is how it is being interpreted in other corners of the Internet…
…instead, i read it to mean Omar Minaya intends to wait and see where sabathia ends up, before making a trade, or a push for Derek Lowe or A.J. Burnett, etc.…
Nevertheless, the Daily News article leads by saying, “The latest Subway Series tussle could be over none other than CC Sabathia…A high-placed Yankee source Thursday reacted to the development by saying: ‘The Mets are in it? Great. Bring it on.’”
…this just doesn’t make sense…i mean, all indications are that the Mets have roughly $25 million to spend in off-season dollars…the buzz around new york, all of baseball, and probably saturn at this point, is that the Yankees intend to offer around $25 million per season to sabathia over six years…so, a) the Mets would have to blow all of their off-season cash on one guy, b) beat out the Yankees, who are desperate for pitching and a big-name signing, and c) then figure out how to fill every other hole on the team by making trades, and not increasing payroll…and then i woke up…
…anyway, if the Mets want to worry, they should worry about this:
According to Jon Heyman at his blog for SI.com, “The Yankees are focused on Sabathia, Derek Lowe and A.J. Burnett.”
…in other words, once the Angels or Yankees sign sabathia, the Mets will have to compete with Brian Cashman for lowe or burnett, and that’s when the true conflict begins…
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Can you imagine if the Mets did decide to try and get CC, then the Yanks outbid them for him. Then the Mets tried to get Lowe, and again the Yanks outbid them? What a horrific scenario!
If they are not going to go for Sabathia, why wait to sign Lowe or Burnett? If those are the guys they are targeting, it makes no sense to wait and let the Yanks or Angels get a chance to jump in later. By waiting, they could miss out on all of them and drive the price up.
Yeah but you can bet that Lowe and Burnett will wait till after CC is picked up. Just as it makes no sense for teams to wait, it also makes no sense for free agents to sign too quickly when in about a month THEY will be the sole top pitchers in a hungry market.
Absolutely. Especially Boras being Lowe’s agent. Boras will wait until CC signs his ridiculous deal, and then all the teams that lost out on CC will be desperately running to Lowe. If the Mets go after Lowe now, Boras would laugh and tell them to wait.
I agree with this. Matt posts two things here that are seemingly at odds: 1) They’ll wait to see where CC winds up (silly on its face because why wait for there to be fewer options? Simple supply and demand dictates that is foolish) and 2) They’ll be bidding against either the Angels or Yankees depending on which one gets CC. (This supports my parenthetical above.)
I think it’s true that other agents will wait to see where CC signs and for how much because CC’s contract will set the market and “losers” of the CC sweepstakes will be that much more desperate.
But it makes no sense for Minaya to wait it out.
Its not Minaya’s choice.
It is his choice whether he starts the pursuit or not, but I agree on whether somebody sign and when is out of his hands. You’ll notice I said as much.
Matt suggests, however, that it is Minaya’s choice to hold off on the pursuit: “…instead, i read it to mean Omar Minaya intends to wait and see where sabathia ends up,”
I think it is highly unlikely that the Mets will outbid the Yankees for Sabbathia — or anyone else for that matter. Yankee “pride” simply won’t permit it. That and Fred’s frugality.
However, I do not think it is totally beyond the realm of possibility that the Mets could land Sabbathia. From everything I hear, he really, really wants to play in the National League because he wants to bat. In my opinion, money is always the deciding factor, but in this case, if the numbers are close, I think he will chose an NL team. That being said, maybe the Dodgers have a leg up on the Mets in that aspect because he’s from California.
So while I don’t think it will happen, it wouldn’t totally surprise me if it did. I think he has a comfort level pitching in the NL now and you cannot underestimate the hitting factor. That is definitely one thing that helped steer Santana to the Mets. He loves to hit.
I agree and personally I dont want him for that type of money. The Mets have way to many other holes that need to be filled and to give one guy who I do not think is worth it all that money makes no sense. Go let the Yankees over pay for him only to blow out his knees with all that weight. We have the best pitcher in baseball!!
The Mets will get Derek Lowe. I have heard from a reliable source that this is where he will be.
Francesa? Is that you?
HA…
Spend money on hitters. Big hitters.
Pitchers are too unpredictable.
Jerry Koosman was predictable…if it was a big game, he would be sure to win!!
Can we sign him? He can’t be a day over 65.
Where are you getting that low amount of money to spend? By my counts with the same salary increase percentage as the last few years and with the luxury tax threshold going up we had somewhere between 42-48 million to spend. We have already spent 12 of that on Delgado. That leaves us with 30-38 million. More than enough to sign CC at 25 and have room for some bullpen upgrades not to mention the trade market as a guy like Niese might become more expendable.
I am not saying CC is the best option, but we have to look into which ever one of the Tex/CC that the Yankee’s don’t get and see what happens.
Can’t see the Mets going after another $25 M per year pitcher now that Santana was given his deal last year.
Those 2 pitchers would be 35 - 40% of projected payroll alone. Plus long term big money.
I think Matts take is right. They want to see who is left in it for Lowe and Burnett types before pulling the trigger on their own deal for Vasquez.
Oooh. I can’t wait for that big Vasquez deal. Then would it be too much to ask if we could pick up another Kaz Matsui type?
Are you taking into the account the ten million dollars worth of raises? We have about 33 million coming off the books. And then 10 million dollars worth of raises on current contracts which would bring us down to 23 million. AndI wouldn’t expect them to increase the payroll by more tha 10 maybe 15 million.
Yes I did. I also took into account the Delgado pay decrease of 4 million.
Also based on your count that’s still 23+12 from Delgado+10 in new spending = 45 million.
No the 33 is with Delgado. It would be 43 or so coming off the books without picking up his option.
Factor in the $20M that Citigroup is paying
True, I expect the Mets to be right under the luxury threshold.
How many potential free agent aquisitions are we using that $20 mil on? Wasn’t that money what we were using for Santana? Then someone else, now on CC.. Thats the biggest $20 mil I’ve ever seen.
Don’t you realize the fact that we are even talking about whether we have 20 or 30 or 40 million to spend only indicates that we WILL be outspent by the Yankees for EVERY good player available. They may say they have a budget and they may say they have a limit, but just watch this offseason — THEY HAVE NO LIMIT!
Because Fred has decided that we can only spend xx amount of dollars, we will be out of the picture for any of the big time free agents.
Jacking up the price for the Yankees would be a wonderful scenario.
Especially for a 36 year old end-of-the-rotation starter.
Guys, even if Omar is not interested don’t you think we wants to drive up the price for everyone else? Especially the Yankee’s and the NL teams involved?
Driving up the price for the Yankees doesn’t work. They’ll spend whatever they want just because they can. In fact, it’s a point of pride with them to outspend everyone.
Don’t really see CC in Queens, but who knows. Stranger things have happened.
And Lowe would be OK, but the age factor is scary, and while he had a respectable year, he certainlyisn’t dominant. As a type A, for 3-4 years and big money at age 36, red flags go up.
AJ is interesting, but will he stay on the mound?
Frankly, it wouldn’t upset me if the Mets didn’t get any of these guys, as long as they add a couple of other SPs (could be a return of Ollie, Vazquez would be good, or some other name we aren’t thinking of).
And of course, Heilmann to compete for the 5th spot!
AH actually could be the next Lowe. Reliever for a while, goes back to starting at around age 29/30. Could happen. Maybe not here, but I will go out on a limb and predict he will have a solid year someplace as a back end starter. And for 1/5 the price of Lowe (or less)
Not only that, almost every year in the last 5 years 1 big name pitcher has been left out to dry because other big market teams were no longer involved. A guy like Sheets could be this year’s guy. I expect it will be Garland or Sheets. Omar could play his cards right, trade for Vasquez now and be in the driver’s seat for one of those guys later.
sounds good to me, but Garland and Sheets are no way equivilant. Sheets is an ace if he can stay healthy and pitch, and Garland is mediocre but consistant at it (the old 200 inning grinder).
Getting Vazquez for minor parts, if possible (Castillo is just too much to hpe for!) would be an excellent move to start the off season (along with reupping Tatis)
No they are nowhere near the same. However, for seperate reasons they could be left out. Sheets because of the injury history and Garland because of his crappyness.
I prefer to call it crappitude, but we are on the same page here.
the high risk/high reward guys like sheets are a better idea on a short deal. 5 years of big money has Pavano written all over it.
although there is a guy that on a 1 year incentive laden deal you might get lucky….. and wouldn’t that steam the clams of the yankee fans!
I was just thinking about him. Nice one. Bring in a guy like Palvano and Garcia to compete for the #5 spot.
I like the idea of Pavano coming in on a 1-yr deal. Maybe a player option for a 2nd year and club option for a 3rd year. He was a mess for the most part with the Yanks, but was at times effective when he came back. He is still young enough where he can find himself again and be a good pitcher, especially at the back end of an NL rotation.
I’d take Pavano over Garcia.
Why not Sheets?
It’s like they’re trying NOT to get a FA SP pitcher.
Not good, when you hear they’re going to make Pedblow an offer…
That had to be blowing smoke. I would be shocked to see pedro back. But who knows, maybe a 1 year deal and theres your #5? Just no idea what you will get another year removed from surgery. better? worse? same?
I don’t see a problem with bringing in Pedro on a 1
Whoops, tricky fingers.
On a 1 year contract to be the #5 and let Niese mature a little more. Niese would then be ready for the Midsummer Pedro break down.
More than likely out of respect to Pedro, Omar will offer a token offer that he would never take.
depends on who/what he replaces. There are only so many roster spots to go around.
But, if they add vazquez in a minor trade, and reup pedro, it is a cheap ($ and prospect) way of plugging up the rotation.
Santana, maine, Pelfrey, Vazquez, Pedro. With the poo poo platter of Neise/Parnell/Heilmann (yeah, I know..) and some reclamation projects to serve as the 6/7/8 guys (and in case one of the top 5 don’t make it out of ST).
Could be worse, and it leaves lots of money for other holes. K Rod, and be radical and get Teix. Trade Delgado for other help. Murhpy at 2B with Teix to cover the hole for him! And spend the rest of the money on set up guys (cruz, reyes, etc.)
I still like Dye too.
Reyes
Murphy
Wright
Teix
Beltran
Dye (F mart in the wings)
Church
Catcher (try to upgrade here too)
Not too shabby. And young and locked in for years.
In my opinion, Pedro is shot — he’s done. I wouldn’t even sign him as a long man in the bullpen. He’s got nothing left.
Vasquez? the second coming of Victor Zambrano? If we make a deal for this guy, I will be a Mets fan, but a very disgusted one. If this is the best we can do, then we need someone who can do better. Who’s next? Jermaine Dye? Two guys on the plus side of 30 making more money than they’re worth. Take a page from the White Sox playbook and get younger.
If you are going to get a guy plus 30, make sure he’s still performing close to peak. I know Manny is 36, but at least he’s productive.
Funny how trades for younger players are being made while Omar picks his nose.
Vasquez is 32 and making only 10.5 million for 2 more years. That in this market is a bargain considering he throws 200 innings 200 K’s and a low WHIP.
He’s a losing pitcher on a good team!
That kills me, go back and look at his game logs and you will figure out why. Any idiot can look at his stats and know that W-L’s don’t tell the story. See, Johan.
Dye is still very productive.
What should I compare? Santana & Vasquez ERA? They were really close, you’re right.
We were 2nd in runs scored. Dye is a very low priority.
Yes, Dye is a very low priority i agree, but if the right package for prospects is there, why not make the trade? It will never