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In the Daily News, three reporters team up to write:
“Meanwhile, Omar Minaya was discussing a trade for a pitcher with a GM but said he would first have to see how Sabathia’s free agency was
progressing, a baseball executive said. A Mets official subsequently wouldn’t deny interest in Sabathia.”
…look, i don’t mean to throw cold water on this, because i see people getting all giddy, but i do not read the executive’s statement to mean the Mets are interested in sabathia, which is how it is being interpreted in other corners of the Internet…
…instead, i read it to mean Omar Minaya intends to wait and see where sabathia ends up, before making a trade, or a push for Derek Lowe or A.J. Burnett, etc.…
Nevertheless, the Daily News article leads by saying, “The latest Subway Series tussle could be over none other than CC Sabathia…A high-placed Yankee source Thursday reacted to the development by saying: ‘The Mets are in it? Great. Bring it on.’”
…this just doesn’t make sense…i mean, all indications are that the Mets have roughly $25 million to spend in off-season dollars…the buzz around new york, all of baseball, and probably saturn at this point, is that the Yankees intend to offer around $25 million per season to sabathia over six years…so, a) the Mets would have to blow all of their off-season cash on one guy, b) beat out the Yankees, who are desperate for pitching and a big-name signing, and c) then figure out how to fill every other hole on the team by making trades, and not increasing payroll…and then i woke up…
…anyway, if the Mets want to worry, they should worry about this:
According to Jon Heyman at his blog for SI.com, “The Yankees are focused on Sabathia, Derek Lowe and A.J. Burnett.”
…in other words, once the Angels or Yankees sign sabathia, the Mets will have to compete with Brian Cashman for lowe or burnett, and that’s when the true conflict begins…
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Can you imagine if the Mets did decide to try and get CC, then the Yanks outbid them for him. Then the Mets tried to get Lowe, and again the Yanks outbid them? What a horrific scenario!
If they are not going to go for Sabathia, why wait to sign Lowe or Burnett? If those are the guys they are targeting, it makes no sense to wait and let the Yanks or Angels get a chance to jump in later. By waiting, they could miss out on all of them and drive the price up.
Yeah but you can bet that Lowe and Burnett will wait till after CC is picked up. Just as it makes no sense for teams to wait, it also makes no sense for free agents to sign too quickly when in about a month THEY will be the sole top pitchers in a hungry market.
Absolutely. Especially Boras being Lowe’s agent. Boras will wait until CC signs his ridiculous deal, and then all the teams that lost out on CC will be desperately running to Lowe. If the Mets go after Lowe now, Boras would laugh and tell them to wait.
I agree with this. Matt posts two things here that are seemingly at odds: 1) They’ll wait to see where CC winds up (silly on its face because why wait for there to be fewer options? Simple supply and demand dictates that is foolish) and 2) They’ll be bidding against either the Angels or Yankees depending on which one gets CC. (This supports my parenthetical above.)
I think it’s true that other agents will wait to see where CC signs and for how much because CC’s contract will set the market and “losers” of the CC sweepstakes will be that much more desperate.
But it makes no sense for Minaya to wait it out.
Its not Minaya’s choice.
It is his choice whether he starts the pursuit or not, but I agree on whether somebody sign and when is out of his hands. You’ll notice I said as much.
Matt suggests, however, that it is Minaya’s choice to hold off on the pursuit: “…instead, i read it to mean Omar Minaya intends to wait and see where sabathia ends up,”
I think it is highly unlikely that the Mets will outbid the Yankees for Sabbathia — or anyone else for that matter. Yankee “pride” simply won’t permit it. That and Fred’s frugality.
However, I do not think it is totally beyond the realm of possibility that the Mets could land Sabbathia. From everything I hear, he really, really wants to play in the National League because he wants to bat. In my opinion, money is always the deciding factor, but in this case, if the numbers are close, I think he will chose an NL team. That being said, maybe the Dodgers have a leg up on the Mets in that aspect because he’s from California.
So while I don’t think it will happen, it wouldn’t totally surprise me if it did. I think he has a comfort level pitching in the NL now and you cannot underestimate the hitting factor. That is definitely one thing that helped steer Santana to the Mets. He loves to hit.
I agree and personally I dont want him for that type of money. The Mets have way to many other holes that need to be filled and to give one guy who I do not think is worth it all that money makes no sense. Go let the Yankees over pay for him only to blow out his knees with all that weight. We have the best pitcher in baseball!!
The Mets will get Derek Lowe. I have heard from a reliable source that this is where he will be.
Francesa? Is that you?
HA…
Spend money on hitters. Big hitters.
Pitchers are too unpredictable.
Jerry Koosman was predictable…if it was a big game, he would be sure to win!!
Can we sign him? He can’t be a day over 65.
Where are you getting that low amount of money to spend? By my counts with the same salary increase percentage as the last few years and with the luxury tax threshold going up we had somewhere between 42-48 million to spend. We have already spent 12 of that on Delgado. That leaves us with 30-38 million. More than enough to sign CC at 25 and have room for some bullpen upgrades not to mention the trade market as a guy like Niese might become more expendable.
I am not saying CC is the best option, but we have to look into which ever one of the Tex/CC that the Yankee’s don’t get and see what happens.
Can’t see the Mets going after another $25 M per year pitcher now that Santana was given his deal last year.
Those 2 pitchers would be 35 - 40% of projected payroll alone. Plus long term big money.
I think Matts take is right. They want to see who is left in it for Lowe and Burnett types before pulling the trigger on their own deal for Vasquez.
Oooh. I can’t wait for that big Vasquez deal. Then would it be too much to ask if we could pick up another Kaz Matsui type?
Are you taking into the account the ten million dollars worth of raises? We have about 33 million coming off the books. And then 10 million dollars worth of raises on current contracts which would bring us down to 23 million. AndI wouldn’t expect them to increase the payroll by more tha 10 maybe 15 million.
Yes I did. I also took into account the Delgado pay decrease of 4 million.
Also based on your count that’s still 23+12 from Delgado+10 in new spending = 45 million.
No the 33 is with Delgado. It would be 43 or so coming off the books without picking up his option.
Factor in the $20M that Citigroup is paying
True, I expect the Mets to be right under the luxury threshold.
How many potential free agent aquisitions are we using that $20 mil on? Wasn’t that money what we were using for Santana? Then someone else, now on CC.. Thats the biggest $20 mil I’ve ever seen.
Don’t you realize the fact that we are even talking about whether we have 20 or 30 or 40 million to spend only indicates that we WILL be outspent by the Yankees for EVERY good player available. They may say they have a budget and they may say they have a limit, but just watch this offseason — THEY HAVE NO LIMIT!
Because Fred has decided that we can only spend xx amount of dollars, we will be out of the picture for any of the big time free agents.
Jacking up the price for the Yankees would be a wonderful scenario.
Especially for a 36 year old end-of-the-rotation starter.
Guys, even if Omar is not interested don’t you think we wants to drive up the price for everyone else? Especially the Yankee’s and the NL teams involved?
Driving up the price for the Yankees doesn’t work. They’ll spend whatever they want just because they can. In fact, it’s a point of pride with them to outspend everyone.
Don’t really see CC in Queens, but who knows. Stranger things have happened.
And Lowe would be OK, but the age factor is scary, and while he had a respectable year, he certainlyisn’t dominant. As a type A, for 3-4 years and big money at age 36, red flags go up.
AJ is interesting, but will he stay on the mound?
Frankly, it wouldn’t upset me if the Mets didn’t get any of these guys, as long as they add a couple of other SPs (could be a return of Ollie, Vazquez would be good, or some other name we aren’t thinking of).
And of course, Heilmann to compete for the 5th spot!
AH actually could be the next Lowe. Reliever for a while, goes back to starting at around age 29/30. Could happen. Maybe not here, but I will go out on a limb and predict he will have a solid year someplace as a back end starter. And for 1/5 the price of Lowe (or less)
Not only that, almost every year in the last 5 years 1 big name pitcher has been left out to dry because other big market teams were no longer involved. A guy like Sheets could be this year’s guy. I expect it will be Garland or Sheets. Omar could play his cards right, trade for Vasquez now and be in the driver’s seat for one of those guys later.
sounds good to me, but Garland and Sheets are no way equivilant. Sheets is an ace if he can stay healthy and pitch, and Garland is mediocre but consistant at it (the old 200 inning grinder).
Getting Vazquez for minor parts, if possible (Castillo is just too much to hpe for!) would be an excellent move to start the off season (along with reupping Tatis)
No they are nowhere near the same. However, for seperate reasons they could be left out. Sheets because of the injury history and Garland because of his crappyness.
I prefer to call it crappitude, but we are on the same page here.
the high risk/high reward guys like sheets are a better idea on a short deal. 5 years of big money has Pavano written all over it.
although there is a guy that on a 1 year incentive laden deal you might get lucky….. and wouldn’t that steam the clams of the yankee fans!
I was just thinking about him. Nice one. Bring in a guy like Palvano and Garcia to compete for the #5 spot.
I like the idea of Pavano coming in on a 1-yr deal. Maybe a player option for a 2nd year and club option for a 3rd year. He was a mess for the most part with the Yanks, but was at times effective when he came back. He is still young enough where he can find himself again and be a good pitcher, especially at the back end of an NL rotation.
I’d take Pavano over Garcia.
Why not Sheets?
It’s like they’re trying NOT to get a FA SP pitcher.
Not good, when you hear they’re going to make Pedblow an offer…
That had to be blowing smoke. I would be shocked to see pedro back. But who knows, maybe a 1 year deal and theres your #5? Just no idea what you will get another year removed from surgery. better? worse? same?
I don’t see a problem with bringing in Pedro on a 1
Whoops, tricky fingers.
On a 1 year contract to be the #5 and let Niese mature a little more. Niese would then be ready for the Midsummer Pedro break down.
More than likely out of respect to Pedro, Omar will offer a token offer that he would never take.
depends on who/what he replaces. There are only so many roster spots to go around.
But, if they add vazquez in a minor trade, and reup pedro, it is a cheap ($ and prospect) way of plugging up the rotation.
Santana, maine, Pelfrey, Vazquez, Pedro. With the poo poo platter of Neise/Parnell/Heilmann (yeah, I know..) and some reclamation projects to serve as the 6/7/8 guys (and in case one of the top 5 don’t make it out of ST).
Could be worse, and it leaves lots of money for other holes. K Rod, and be radical and get Teix. Trade Delgado for other help. Murhpy at 2B with Teix to cover the hole for him! And spend the rest of the money on set up guys (cruz, reyes, etc.)
I still like Dye too.
Reyes
Murphy
Wright
Teix
Beltran
Dye (F mart in the wings)
Church
Catcher (try to upgrade here too)
Not too shabby. And young and locked in for years.
In my opinion, Pedro is shot — he’s done. I wouldn’t even sign him as a long man in the bullpen. He’s got nothing left.
Vasquez? the second coming of Victor Zambrano? If we make a deal for this guy, I will be a Mets fan, but a very disgusted one. If this is the best we can do, then we need someone who can do better. Who’s next? Jermaine Dye? Two guys on the plus side of 30 making more money than they’re worth. Take a page from the White Sox playbook and get younger.
If you are going to get a guy plus 30, make sure he’s still performing close to peak. I know Manny is 36, but at least he’s productive.
Funny how trades for younger players are being made while Omar picks his nose.
Vasquez is 32 and making only 10.5 million for 2 more years. That in this market is a bargain considering he throws 200 innings 200 K’s and a low WHIP.
He’s a losing pitcher on a good team!
That kills me, go back and look at his game logs and you will figure out why. Any idiot can look at his stats and know that W-L’s don’t tell the story. See, Johan.
Dye is still very productive.
What should I compare? Santana & Vasquez ERA? They were really close, you’re right.
We were 2nd in runs scored. Dye is a very low priority.
Yes, Dye is a very low priority i agree, but if the right package for prospects is there, why not make the trade? It will never hurt to score more runs.
No, I would think that you could make the comparison that a silly stat like W-L’s cost Santana the Cy Young this season. That’s just me, if you want to focus on W-L’s and ERA fine by me. When you join the modern world let me know. I am surprised you even have internet.
“I don’t see a problem with bringing in Pedro on a 1″
I do, he’s injury-prone, washed-up, and he stinks.
Sign Kerry Woods and K-rod then focus on SP
LOL, so we are going to spend 35 million on closer next season.
Well yea, then we trade for street and have the best 7-8-9 crew in all of baseball. No money, prospects or fans by that point but hey, you gotta love big names
I Know I am Free Agent Crazy this morning!!!!!!!!
Pedro? That would be insane. Then Omar would have to go.
Vasquez was 12-16 on a team that won 89 games. Why would we want him? If i’m gonna shell out 12 million on a guy with one good season under his belt, I’d rather resign Ollie. I do not want to resign Ollie.
We don’t need to score more runs. We were second in the league. If you swap CC in for Pedro, We win 10 more games.
If it cost 26-27 for CC, do it.
Whose going to save all those games that CC pitches????
Joe Smith
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA, i Needed that laugh this morning!!!
When his slider is on, he’s good. I think he has the ability. But it is a bit funny.
I like SMith, your right, when he is on he is very good, i just think he is not closer material.. Better 7th inning guy!! Hes the only guy i think should stay in that pen!!
By that nature then he is awesome because in 2007 he went 15-8 on a losing team.
Do you guys even look at stats?
One good year? In Vasquez off year he still pitches more innings, has more SO and has a better WHIP than Perez.
The guy has had 198+ innings for 9 years in a row. Perez has never even had 198 innings in a season.
He’s an older Carlos Silva
Carlos Silva never had the SO/W ratio that Vasquez does or the WHIP that he does so no not really.
ERA over 4.42, 4 of the past 5 years. if he’s gonna throw 200 IP and have an ERA of 3.75, I’ll take him, but i dopubt he’d be on the market
That’s what he did in 2007. So I guess you would not take Oliver Perez either as his ERA on the Mets was over 4.00.
I’ll be more reasonable. If I have to take Vasquez back, the lesser of two evils between he and Dye, then it has to be in a deal that also involves Jenks & Castillo.
Jenks & Vasquez for Castillo, Neise & ____________
I would rather have Dye, Vazquez, and sign KROD!!!
Murphy & parnell, if your really being serious about what the white sox would want
Murphy and Parnell, plus Castillo and Neise? or by themselves
All 4, Neise hasn’t proven anything, Castillo is a cancer and don’t think other teams are blind to that, they know they would be dling us a favor by taking castillo, so if it was a deal including Castillo and Neise than yes, all 4
doing*
For a closer and a starting pitcher, I would do it.
why do we only get to spend 25 million, that’s ridiculous
My sentiments exactly.
Hey Fred — you can’t take it with you!
The yanks picked up swisher yesterday…they have now swisher and posada that can play first..do you guys think the yanks are out of the texeria talks?
those guys can play LF and C or DH, theres plenty of room for teixeira
Just the thought of Santana and Sabathia is amazing. Could you imagine a starting rotation of Santana, Pelfrey, Sabathia and Maine. Those 4 guys could easily win you 70 games. This won’t happen though. The Yankees won’t be outspent two years in a row by the Mets (in either $$$ or prospects). The Mets need a closer and possibly an outfield bat for starters. The only way they get away with this is if they trade for Jenks and are forced to take Jermane Dye. Then they will have $$$ to spend on a FA pitcher.
If only to raise the price for Yankees I don’t see the Mets really in the mix. And if the Yanks want to reciprocate, they can bid on KROD to screw the Mets. I hope Omar knows what he is doing.
They wont bid on Kros, cause every1 will know it ownt mean anything, since they have mariano, and niether mariano nor krod will be a setup man. We cant bluff when the opposition knows your bluffing
For got to add that I think it would be best for the Mets to get their closer (KROD or Jenks) and then see if they could get Wood as the setup man. That would push everyone back meaning Ayala (if they bring him back) Feliciano, Smith, Schoenweis and God forbid Heilman would be around for the 6th and 7th.
I just don’t get this. Why would
A) Wood come to be a setup man when other teams will ofer him a closer’s role
B) The Mets spend 25 million on 2 guys for the pen that do the same thing?
Why cant we be like the yankees? Why cant we go all out and sign as many people as we want. We play in the same market. We could afford the same payroll they can. We both movong into new stadiums, have our own channels, I know they havent won a world series in 8 seasons, but at least they make the playoffs every year. (almost).
The question is, why would you want to be like the Yankees?
therealsince86
Nice WHIP for Vasquez, I’ll admit, but what that’s telling me is that he must be getting hit hard in a few innings to have a 1.32 WHIP and a 4.67 ERA. Sounds a bit inconsistent to me. And I still do not know how a a pitcher on a winning team can have a losing record and still be good.
And why shouldn’t ERA be considered? I know wins and losses are also a product of how many runs your team scores, but 12-16? I can’t believe you netioned Santana and Vasquez in ther same blog post
The Sox defense was absolutely TERRIBLE this season. Much worse than 2007 even.
burnett will cost a lot, if he asks for 3 years i’d get him, when healthy he’s a horse, along side santana and pelfrey we could have 3 very good starters who can go deep in games.. but i’m sure he’ll wait on the yankees to offer. i’d try to invest like penny, prior to one year deal to see what can they do.. they can revive their career again.
Not comparing the two at all. Just that wins and loses are often out of a pitchers control just like ERA often is. I chose to focus on things that are, like WHIP, Walks, SO, Innings etc.
To finish up this comment, not only was the WSox Defense terrible but Vasquez lost 8 quality starts. If he wins half of those then he is 16-12.
To go a step further he lost
8 inning game that he gave up 1 run.
7.2 inning game that he gave up 1 run
7 inning game that he gave up 2 runs
Complete game that he gave up 3 runs
Just those alone would have made him 16-12.
You can’t go by wins and loses guys to determine a good pitcher.
the real, the only thing i’d be afraid of vasquez is that fact that he pitched in ny already and we all saw how he did, secondly he’s not that young anymore either, if we can get him and appoint him to be #4 i’m sure it will do wonders for us, but not for a package that will include our top prospects, he can be good, but we’ve all seen the bad side of him.. and is not good. also, he is a very good home pitcher.. he for some reason pitches good at homw wherever he plays
He’s 32, not old by any means and only on a 2 year contract. That’s much better than Lowe or Burnett on a 4 year deal. His season in NY was not as bad as people think and if that is his worst year then he should be proud. He still produced 198 innings and a 1.28 WHIP. He just did not have a good 2nd half. The 1st half he was an Allstar. Again if going 14-10 with an ERA under 5.00 is your worst season in 11 years then take it and run with it.
Agee, you’re apparently getting the right story from the stats (not to say defense and ballpark didn’t matter).
I specifically brought up this issue with a White Sox friend. It seems fans are frustrated by how incosistent his stuff is, despite his consistent line every year. Like Oliver Perez, when he’s on, he’s unhittable. He’s capable of going deep into games and pitching well but the rest of the time he’s mediocre.
As he is an older pitcher, you know that he’ll never change his ways but, by the same token, you know exactly what kind of season he will have, even if you don’t know what kind of game he’ll have.
I have yet to look at his gamelog to find out if this is true or not, this is just what I was told. If you check out the videos of him on mlb.com, he’s impressive.
I posted much of his gamelog here. In some starts he was bad, especially this September.
There is one thing, however that he does that Perez does not even sniff. Perez’s top inning performance was 7.2 innings.
Perez pitched 7 innings or more only 7 times all season while Vasquez did it 14 times. That is a huge difference. Also possibly why his ERA is higher as he goes deeper in the game and is more likely to give up a run in innings 7-9 while Perez is already out of the game at the begining of the 7th.
I am getting even more intrigued by Vasquez’s 2nd half numbers. They make no sense.
In the 1st half he went 7-7
In the 2nd half he went 5-9 and his ERA went up, Yet his WHIP, BAA, OBP, SLG, OPS, all went down. Seems clear that defense and other factors had to come into play.
They brought in that guy who played for the Mariners and then played for the Red and who’s name is for some reason banned from this blog, and moved Swisher from the outfield to first base. I imagine that downgraded their outfield defense quite a bit. They also lost Carlos Quentin for significant parts of the second half I believe.
This is so stupid and I am not saying that I am an expert on any of this but I do think I am an intelligent person that understands the economics of sports so I’ll break it down (diregard the recession the country is currently in, doesnt matter the games will be packed next yr) The mets have a new stadium next yr, with that a lot of things have increased in price for fans, also the mets are receiving $20 million from citi for naming rights, with this all being said the mets are able to spend between 40 and 50 million this offseason and still be in position the double their revenue from last yr, example is season ticket prices that I know of on the lower level nearly doubled in price. With this all being said the mets can afford CC, they can afford K-rod, and they should be looking to get that deal done for Dye, which would be an unbelievable offseason with additional moves as well and would make fans believe that this isnt a team that could collapse and disappoint them like the past two yrs. If the mets spend 25 million this offseason its a slap in the face to the fans, they raise prices in every place possible yet cheap out on players, it would be foolish by the front office. Their problem was pitching, can get 2 dominant guys this offseason, it should be something thought about, it needs to be something that gets done this offseason.
I’ll be very happy with a trade for Vasquez and bringing in one of CC/Burnett/Sheets. Our rotation would be very solid.
sheets and burnett only for 3 years.. that’s it.. i’d be very weary of either one based on their injury history.. but when on, this two are dominant.
I didn’t know we were a small market team! 25 million to spend! That 20 million from Citi is per year for 10 years I believe.
Is your monicker what you paid for a brick at Fan Walk? I thought it was $150.
No what they are charging for those oufiled wall bricks from Big Shea
BULL PEN
BULL PEN
BULL PEN
AMENNNNNNNNNNNNNNN
I agree bullpen but there is a large need for an innings eater such as lowe
Agreed. But, $25m for one guy when we already have Santana is nuts.
Omar has surprised us in the past by making trades that hadn’t been mentioned in the rumor mill. Any thoughts on what similar moves could happen this year?
Luis castillo for chase utley..
better yet Jore Toca for Howard
Ian Snell
for who?
Don’t know that part. I am just saying that we were once intereted in him and the Pirates demands were silly. Maybe they are less now.
after last year I would hope so!
He was terrible. Not a bad guy if you could get him for Heilman and a lower prospect. Let him compete for #5 and if he can’t get it throw him in the pen or spin him again.
Anyone from the Nats?
Nope, not even a reclamation project there.
What annoys me most is that the Yankees are building a more expensive new stadium and although they have more money off their books they still are out saying they are looking to possibly sign CC, Tex, Burnett, and Lowe. I know realistically thats prob not going to happen but at least they are making their fans extremely excited for next yr and the possiblities, hell they have already made a trade and got their offseason underway. I would love to hear some concrete stuff on the mets offseason and not stuff said by legendary met hater Francesa would is the biggest jerk alive when it comes to the mets, never have a I heard a man despise a team so much then that guy and he’s the one gives the offseason plan. Come Omar make some things happen this offseason and at least get a team that we can say is def going to be playing in october next yr.
It annoys you that the Mets don’t stupidly throw money around like the Yankees?
Subway Series over Sabathia? So how is it that the Yankees let us have Santana. But everyone is writing that there’s a competition between the Mets and Yankees over Sabathia? Oh right, b/c the Yankees will win that which makes for better writing.
That aside, we got the better pitcher last year. He’s signed to a cheaper deal and isn’t 400 lbs.
I totally agree with you bkfitz. As much as i would love CC for the next 2-3 years, i don’t think i’ll love him for the last 2-3 of this contract he’s going to get. He has Bartolo Colon written all over him. CC will be in the Cy young running for the next few years, but if he doesn’t control his weight he will loose his stuff.
I still want K-Rod(13 mil), Teix(18 Mil), Cruz (4mil), Beimel(3 mil) and another Reliever. Trade Delgado(-12 Mil) for more Relief arms, and castillo(-4) for a new pair of cleats. Heilman and others can net the 4th starter (sonny or Jackson), and possibly sign Garland(11 mil) as 5th guy.
We are then looking at an estimated 35 million more there, and Matt stated they are looking at 15-30 million in the off season budget. I think Omar would be allowed to go 5 mil over if it rebuilt the team like this.
Reyes (SS)
Murphy (2nd)
Wright (3rd)
Teix (1b)
Beltran (CF)
Church (RF)
Evans/Tatis (LF)
That’s what i want. If we had more money fix LF with someone and I’d be very very happy.
Schneider/Castro (c)
not possible
wow!!! so you’re gonna spend 50 millions and try to unload 16..? ok.. but remember we most likely will have to eat castillo’s contract, plus whatever relieve we get on the trade will add up also.. i don’t think the mets will want to go over 150 millions.. good to know you want teixeira also!!!!!
Javier Vasquez is a good pitcher but he doesn’t pitch well in big spots. I would have no problem with him being a #5 starter but if our only change in the rotation is Vasquez replacing Perez then we are in no better shape then we were at the end of the season.
We have to replace Perez with a better and more reliable player and Derek Lowe is the best available (after CC)
We might not be able to get Lowe but he should be our primary SP target and if we get outbid well there is nothing we can do about that.
How are we in no better shape with Vasquez over Perez? Perez kills the pen and has never pitched 200 innings. Vasquez has pitched 198 innings+ 9 years in a row. He pitched 7 innings or more 14 times last season compared to 7 for Perez. Not even in the same league.
what happens when Vasquez has to pitch a playoff game???
Come on. We have to get to the playoffs 1st after that it’s all a crap shoot.
Just stop it, there is no way that Vasquez is a #5 pitcher on ANY staff in the MLB. I can’t even think of one currently where he would be the #4.
The Rays. Possibly the Red Sox. Hell he might be a 5 on the Rays depending on how Price does next year.
I would think that Vasquez is clearly better than Sonnanstine or Jackson right now.
As for the Sox
He is better than Wakefield for sure.
Sonnastine/Jackson are barely even in the Rays to 5.
Shields/Kazmir/Garza, plus Price next year and they’re supposed to have another awesome pitching prospect but I can’t think of his name.
And as for the sox, Lester, Dice-K, Beckett, and then probably Vazquez.
i rather get sheets or burnett that start a bidding war for a guy that will last 3 years due to his body and wanna have a 6 to 7 year contract
Sheets and Burnett are both too injury prone.
And their has to be a change in the rotation as there are 2 holes. IF you are saying that Vasquez and Pedro are not any better than Perez and Pedro considering Pedro is even a year older you may be right. I still don’t see the Mets bringing back Pedro right now.
Javier Vasquez has a 10.34 ERA is the post season (18 ER in 15.2 innings)
He eats up innings sure but he cannot be relied on once we get into a pennant race. If you don’t want to see a collapse then don’t trade for a guy who doesn’t pitch well in big games.
LOL, We still have to get to the playoffs first. Adding a consistant 200+ innings is a good way of getting there. If he does not pitch well then you can always go with a 3 man rotation in the playoffs.
This clutch and big game stuff is just insane.
I know, it’s ridiculous TRS86. These guys calling Vasquez out on being not “clutch” in big games are the same people advocating getting CC Sabathia, who the last time I checked had the same perception as well.
woah i dont want CC either, way overrated
Oleosmirf, I wasn’t pointing that at you, personally, but there are a group of people on this site with that sentiment.
why trade for a guy who can’t get the job done in september and beyond when Lowe is available and is much better in the regular season and post-season.
Javier Vasquez in his final 3 starts of the season in the thick of the playoff race for Chicago
Sept 18 @ NYY 3.2 IP 6 ER
Sept 23 @ MIN 4.0 IP 5 ER
Sept 27 CLE 4.1 IP 7 ER
No Thanks
We need two starting pitchers, Vasquez + Free agent signing.
yes but Vasquez needs to be the lesser of the 2
TRS86, I agree with you on Vasquez. I feel Omar probably has something lined up with Kenny Williams already, just holding out to judge the way the pitching market opens up. Vasquez would be a great addition to the rotation. It is essentially the perfect time to buy low on him. Couple him with a free agent signing like Lowe, and watch out everybody!
yes but you have to bring him in with Lowe or somebody of that caliber or else come playoff time our rotation will be Santana-Pelfrey-Maine-????
We have to make the play-offs before we start thinking about our play-off roster.
We have to get to the playoffs first to even think of our rotation set-up, but our pitching staff additions this winter are not going to stop with acquiring Vasquez. Buying low on Vasquez is a no brainer. Omar then goes out and signs one of the top tier starters, you’ll have the best rotation in the league hands down.
that i agree with you 100% but i would only get Vasquez as a #4-5 starter if Lowe or someone of his status is our #2
BUT WHO WAS THE PITCHER MINAYA WAS INTERESTED IN TRADING FOR?!?!
I might be alone here, but I could see Ollie declining arbitration and then signing back with the Mets. Add Vasquez or someone similar and we have some good stuff.
I know Sheets is an ace when healthy but do we really want to invest that kind of money in another “when he’s healthy”guy. I feel like we’ve filled our quota on “when he’s healthy” guys for the next five years at least.
I completely agree…Sheets has not gone through a complete year healthy in 5 years!
Javier Vasquez in his final 3 starts of the season in the thick of the playoff race for Chicago and his lone playoff start
Sept 18 @ NYY 3.2 IP 6 ER
Sept 23 @ MIN 4.0 IP 5 ER
Sept 27 CLE 4.1 IP 7 ER
Oct. ?? TBR 4.1 IP 6 ER
There are much better guys available than Javier Vasquez
I’d rather have a when he’s healthy guy like Sheets, than a not very good at all guy like Vazquez. Sheets doesn’t miss THAT many starts anyway.
Gotta get TWO SP’s whatever happens.
Just gotta.
As a fan of the back to back NL East Champions and World Series Champion Philadelphia Phillies, Beasts of the Easts and best ball club…..
I implore the Mets…..please PLEASE get more free agents….yes, get Sabbathia, and K-Rod……..PLEASE…..
Alot of good your free agent signings and trades have done you under the Minaya regime…..please….BACK UP THE TRUCK….
LMAO……
Choke Much Mutts Fans?
Well at least the Eagles have lifted the Lomardi trophy once in their sorry history.
I Phillies WS victory might actually get more Phillies fans than Mets fans at CBP.
Mets = 48 years …2 Rings…4 NL pennants…5 Division Titles…
Phillies = 125 years…2 Rings…6 NL pennants…8 Division Titles…
Mets average a ring every 24 years…a pennant every 10 years…a division title every 10 years…
Phillies average a ring every 60 years…a pennant every 20 years…a division title every 15 years…
Do you really want to have this argument?
I give this year’s squad their just due…they earned a title…the mets did not and thats that…but please dont develop amnesia and forget all about the past..hehehehehehe
As usual, the Yankees shop at Nordstrom and the Mets shop at the thrift shop. Who came up with this ridiculous 25 million dollar number? Did the Mets pay you to say that, Cerrone, to keep the hopes down?
That is a joke- with a new stadium, a cash cow of a tv network, skyrocketting ticket prices, and big money from Citiband- well, there is no reason this team can’t have a payroll in the upper 100 millions. Yet we are CUTTING payroll, compared to the last few years? Unacceptable.
Business as usual- in Flushing, winning is secondary.
You would think our (cheap) ownership would be motivated by collaps*ng 2 straight years and by the Phillies winning it all. But they don’t care, more than anything, they want to make a buck- winning is secondary….while its quite the opposite in Yankee land.
I want new owners. Worst thing that ever happened to this team was Nelson Doubleday being bought out. The wrong owner remained, unfortunately- and we’re stuck with him.
Loved the Luis Alicea hire, by the way- yet another charity case doled out to an incompetent latino