Davidoff cites an AL executive who agrees with the approach, essentially saying the Mets would be better trading a high-level prospect for Jenks, ‘than throwing big dollars at K-Rod.’
The AL executive continues on to give a scouting report of Jenks, and explain why his decrease in strike outs could be a good thing, as compared to Rodriguez.
Meanwhile, in the New York Post, citing an ‘AL official regularly in touch with the Mets executives,’ “The Mets will wait to see if supply-and-demand take holds and the price falls.”
According to Sherman, as he has written previously on his blog, Hardball, Minaya’s main targets are Fuentes and Derek Lowe.
Nevertheless, if the Mets do go for Jenks, he will almost certainly cost OF Fernando Martinez, writes Sherman, who quotes a Mets official as saying, “Unless something changes, I would say the chances of us getting Jenks are close to zero. The price is too high and he isn’t close to the top of our list.”
Sherman also writes of how the M’s intend to handle J.J. Putz, and whether the Astros will trade Jose Valverde, and whether the Mets would have interest.
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Fernando Martinez is hitting .370 in Fall Ball…if we held off this long in trading him we might as well give him once more chance to see what he can do this spring
i agree about not trading f-mart and also – i just see this as posturing to get k-rods price down – nothing more nothing less
F Mart is the next Ricky Lede … ship him out
Agreed. He can’t even dominate AA ball.
How ridiculous. Martinez has been the youngest player in AA for two years running, and he showed significant improvement this year. Imagine if we said “Mike Pelfrey isn’t even pitching well in the minors anymore, let’s dump him for whatever we can get” a year ago? Patience people, patience.
Give me a break, the kid is 19 playing a difficult offensive environment against competition where the average age is more than two years older than him. Nick Evans is two years older. Daniel Murphy three. He’s still the top prospect in the system, still a top 50 prospect, and still has tons of potential. Why should we sell low? Lets see how he fares in Buffalo unless we’re really getting something huge in return.
agree’d everybody wants the quick fix thats why strawberry never grew into his talent – yes he was above average but he coulda been hall of fame caliber
strawberry was a just a tad better than “above average”. his fallen star had nothing to do with this talent and everything to do with his affinity for the white stuff. there is a huge difference.
look if i remember right his rookie year he batted 257 with 20 or more hrs i believe in his career he was a 270 hitter with what 250 homers? i could be wrong on those numbers warrior – and he was a true threat but he coulda been so much more
plus even he and cashen admited he shoulda stayed in the minors longer – but it was the pressure of a losing team that brought him up when he was still immature
you’re wrong on your numbers. he had about 270 homeruns when he left the mets.
Why cant the mets trade for jenks and include castillo and a top minor leaguer and they give back Vasquez or dye as a second player….and why cant the mets trade hielman for street.. street becomes our 8th inning guy and we still sign a closer….
after the Rocks just traded their best player for Street do you really think they would turn around and flip him for Aaron Heilman??
absurd
The Rocks traded their best player for Carlos Gonzalez and got Huston Street as a toss-in.
Of course, why they’d trade a 25 year old reliever with a 2.88 career ERA in the AL straight up for a 30 year old reliever with a 4.24 career ERA in the NL is another question. I guess maybe they feel bad for us? I’ll take their pity.
lmfao
the only way thats happening is if you become the White Sox GM
I would be extremely leery of Jenks. Kenny Williams only moves pitchers when they are about to decline or are damaged goods. Jenks is overweight and his peripherals are declining. Fernando Martinez should not be traded for any closer in MLB.
Especially when you’ve got 5+ closers on the market.
Exactly!! Lets see how the market plays out a bit more before we make any rash moves that weaken another part of the organization. Its actually shaping up to be a decent market for closers. We miss out on a K-Rod for five years, boo-hoo, oh well, sign Wood for three and probably get much better value. Even if we miss out on Wood, and then miss out on Fuentes too, then you can consider trading talent for a closer, or you can give Trevor Hoffman a shot. Its not like there isn’t any additional relief depth to be had for depth. Give Hoffman one year, then give a Scott Schoeneweis type contract to Jeremy Affeldt and all of a sudden you have plenty of depth at closer. And even if that didn’t work out, by the time you figure that out in June, you have Parnell and his big league fastball getting used to warming up in the bullpen, you give Kunz some time to get his confidence back, and you even have a better sense of what you have in Holt, and if he might be a good Joba Chamberlain type candidate for the second half. These guys aren’t Carlos Muniz. They all have legitimate big league fastballs and could be quality MLB relievers in short order.
No way do I trade F-Mart for Jenks.
Frankly, I think we HAVE to sign either K-Rod or Fuentes (preferrably K-Rod as I trust him more than Fuentes in a big spot). It will eat up a sizable chunk of our offseason budget…but the trade alternatives are either too expensive (Jenks, Soria) or too risky (Putz, Valverde).
Have of our budget would be toast. But Beimel and Affeldt wouldn’t(shouldn’t) cost much. Plus Cruz should be about a moderate price, and if we go cheap on the rotation, then that’s just a little bump in the payroll. We can handle that seeing as we’re getting an extra 20 mil a season.
That should be half…
i agree, sign Cruz, Affeldt, and Beimel! it is much cheaper than blowing huge money on a 1 inning pitcher.
Why do you trust K-rod more in big spots? Have you seen his play-off line?
I have and his ALCS and World Series numbers are STELLAR.
It’s his ALDS numbers you’re referring to, Gina. But don’t you think the deeper the playoffs the more crucial?
Look up the numbers..
Umm I think you have to make it deeper into the play-offs before you start worrying about them. And his numbers are stellar because the Angels used a loop-hole in 2002 to add him to their play-off roster and no team had any kind of scouting report on him. If you look at his number since then he’s been hit hard and often and has basically been terrible.
Do you see who he’s pitching against?
i dunno, gina. i’ll take k-rod over fuentes any day of the week. we signed billy wagner who has a worse playoff record than k-rod has.also didn’t brad lidge have a horrible playoff record too? this is a no-brainer. i believe k-rod is coming here. everything else is just posturing.
yeah fuentes lost the closers role twice i think his psyche is fragile to say the least
I’d actually prefer Wood to Fuentes. Maybe even to K-Rod. I understand the health risk, but he offers better command than K-Rod, he won’t cost an arm and a leg, and he seems like the best candidate on the market to be a shut-down dominant closer over the next three seasons. THEN you sign a high end setup man like Affeldt for depth. I also think the Mets farm is better suited to sustain a big bullpen injury this year, just in case. Parnell will have some time to get used to warming up in the pen. Kunz will have some time to get his confidence back and likely won’t be as intimidated coming up again, having experienced it once already. And if Holt does get fast-tracked, it might be a good idea to give him some time in the big league pen late in the season anyway.
trade for Street and sign Cruz, and let them battle for closer role in spring training. Less money, and would allow Mets to fill other gaps. You get a Closer and setup man for less then either K-rod or Fuentes. And Street would not cost as much as Jenks.
Trade who for street? Street is a terrible closer…only if we give up very little for him which aint gonna happen
cosign. I don’t know if I’d say he’s terrible but definitely not worth what the rockies are going to want back and I don’t think I’d feel totally comfortable with him in the 9th inning.
i say he is terrible too!! declining velocity and a top save blower, stay away from him. Beane wouldnt have dealt him so quickly if he was legit.
Those who like the idea of Street need to take a look at Street’s numbers as a closer…look at his save percentage every year of his career…it is VERY mediocre, and consistent across the board, every year of his career.
Check it out.
Putz or Jenks would be MUCH better than Street if we go the trade route.
kingman, would i ever love to pry Putz away from the M’s!! If healthy, i would put him in the top 5 closers in the AL with Mo,Papelbon,and Nathan. Have you heard if they might shop him???
street’s horrible. next.
Wright–I have not specifically heard that…but I used to live in Seattle (absolutely amazing area by the way) and follow the M’s a bit….they had been going with the free agent/high profile trade route, and after Sexson, Beltre, Silva, Washburn, Batista, and Bedard have all been steaming piles of disappointment, my guess is that they may be very willing to listen to a package of young, cheap players they can develop and control for a few years if they cna be rid of Putz’s salary.
Ichiro is different, as he is the face of the franchise and the key to their marketing and he loves the Asian population in Seattle and proximity to Japan, but what do you need a great closer for on a mediocre, young team? Soria was Mariano-like last year, and it helped them finish one game out of last.
If Omar is truly not going to sign KRod, I would very highly hope he is willing to trade just about anything among the youngsters (other than Murphy and FMart) for Putz.
And Beltran, you are so right, and I never realized HOW right until looking at Street’s rotten save pct. every year of his career.
hey kingman ever hear of a band from that area called forced entry?? or may be the accused?? the put the blues bros to shame lol
I know of them both, and I knew guys in The Accused a bit….two of their members later joined Tad and Gruntruck, and bands I played in opened for both of them in the good old Seattle 90s…I knew Ben McMillan from Gruntruck (and Skin Yard) really well, and he sadly died last January….
I lived there the whole decade of the 1990s and was in a couple of bands that had a little success, but moved back east in 2001 when all of the rich rock star jobs had been taken!
And I was sick of never seeing Mets and Nets games after a decade of it and it being impossible to find good Italian food!
I see Brad Holt as being a closer down the line. For that reason, we need to have someone who can fill the gap for 2 to 3 years. Fuentes fits that role best.
or we can get krod for 4 years and have holt set him up untill his contract is over in which holt would then take over…krod is better than fuentes..do ppl not understand this..also, he is coming from the AL and wheneer pitchers come the from the AL to the NL they do much better
Exactly.
That’s what you’re supposed to do and I agree. K-Rod on a 4-yr contract will be perfect timing for Holt to step in for year 3 and all of year 4.
I agree and disagree. I think eventually, Holt becomes a starter. He maintains his velocity deep into games as well as anyone in the minors, a sign that has successful starter written all over it. He had an outing right before the draft for UNC in which he reportedly threw 139 pitches and was clocked at 94 in the 9th inning. That sounds like a quality SP arm to me. Yes, he needs to develop his other pitches, but his curve has steadily improved since he went pro, and is already leaps and bounds past anything Mike Pelfrey has to offer.
However, if Holt does get fast-tracked due to his own success or a lack of organizational depth, sticking him in the pen at the end of this year with the intention of stretching him back out next year, a la Joba Chamberlain, might be a good idea. It would give him a chance to test out his curve against MLB hitters and really focus on making it a true second out-pitch, but without having to worry about showing the same hitters the same things in multiple times through the lineup.
i agree but jobba could be the exeception to the rule plus he already has shoulder issues
I know, Joba’s a unique player. Holt could be too, but he’s not the same pitcher Joba is. His command needs work, he needs to keep working on his curve, and his changeup is a long way away. But I still could see a short term RP solution and then a longterm quality SP in what he’s doing.
i agree i just dont wanna see him end up like pulisher or wilson
Fair enough, I don’t think anyone wants to see that. My point was just that I think he has a starters arm. All we ever see are guys who can maintain velocity deep into games, at least those are the only guys we notice, because they’re the only ones who are successful. The fact that Holt has that ability is a huge plus as a prospect, and its a whole dimension of his game that would get wasted in the pen. But at the same time, lots of successful starters got tested in the pen early in their careers, and given Holt’s situation I think that might be a good path to take with him.
definitely thats why i think there is creedence in putting maine in the pen if u obtained a front line starter
I liked that idea at the end of the year, but I don’t think its a good idea now. Maine is another guy who’s velocity really stays level throughout his outings. His velocity is a little inconsistent sometimes. It seems like some games he’s regularly 94-95 and some he’s more 91-92 and can dial back a bit more. But I never really notice spikes or dips within outings.
I actually think Maine is in good shape for a solid, bounceback year. Its not too long ago that we thought we had a really solid #2 starter in Maine. He made some really outstanding improvements as the league adjusted to him in 2006-2007. He had an injury, it was not serious, but made it more difficult to pitch, and the procedure wasn’t a huge risk, but it would have meant missing time during a pennant race. Now we’re not as high on as we were a year ago. Smells like a huge sleeper for a monster season to me.
And you could just tell, all year he wasn’t quite the same pitcher we were used to seeing. His fastball was erratic in movement and command, he lost sharpness on his slider and deception on his change. They both often reverted to below average pitches. If he’s healthy next season and gets anything back I could see a solid 190 IP, 175 K, 65 BB, WHIP < 1.20, ERA < 3.75.
yeah but he is always truly on in the first 5 innings – then he gets shakey
Holt’s next stop is single A St. Lucie. It is very highly unlikely that he’ll see the big club next year and almost as unlikely to see it the next. Which is as it should be.
That’s not necessarily true about Holt, perhaps likely, and its probably what SHOULD happen, but if he dominates A+ I could see him in AA by the all-star break, and perhaps the pen a few months later. A first round, flamethrowing, former college pitcher making his debut a bit before his 23rd birthday? Its certainly within the realm of possibility.
As for Maine, that’s really true, he averaged just under 6.0 IP/GS before 2008. He does have a history of losing his focus in the middle innings, but he has shown the ability to bounce back and finish strong. It seems to be more about focus with Maine than stuff when he’s right. His fastball stays pretty lively, its all about whether or not he can get swings and misses or if he’s just getting foul ball after foul ball. In 2008, he couldn’t command his fastball well, and it led to a lot of bad walks and foul balls. It was lively enough that it was tough to square up, but he has to locate it better if he wants to get swinging or called Ks with it.
Just to enhance my point about Maine, in 2006-2007 Maine made 47 starts. In 30 he completed at least six innings. He failed to complete six in 17 starts, and completed at least seven in 14 starts. Maybe those aren’t quite “innings-eater” numbers, but its not a five inning pitcher either.
By contrast, in 2008 Maine made 25 starts and in only 13 did he complete 6 innings. That’s 12 times he failed to do so, and he complete seven innings just once. Once!!! That’s a five inning pitcher. He dropped off from 6+ in nearly 2/3 of his starts to just over half of his starts.
I dont believe they’ll rush Holt. Where its true if he totally dominates at St. Lucie he can be moved up to AA, I dont think he’d end up being that dominant there that the Mets would call him up under any circumstances. College pitchers dont put in the kind of innings that a professional does and this upcoming year will be his first as one. He’s a starting pitcher. Dont you think for his first year they’re going to limit the amount of innings he will throw? They did already at Brooklyn. They were hoping to limit Pelfrey’s innings and he’s been pitching as a pro for how long? So no, dont expect to see Holt up anytime soon.
I don’t like the approach this team is taking at all. The Mets play in the biggest market in the world – there is no reason for them to continue to clean out their farm system when there are better players available that can be had without having to give anything up. I’m not saying I want them to spend like the Yankees, but I’ll take K-Rod over Jenks anyday, especially if it means keeping all our prospects.
Agreed. This smells a little too much like Vladimir’s ‘back’..
That’s easy to say in the moment, but big contracts are the only ones that can become bad contracts. Look at Luis Castillo. I bet Omar wishes he’d taken a different approach to 2B last year now. Its a thin line between “its only money” and an unmovable contract contract that you’re locked into for the next half-decade.
alous contract was not big but it turned bad also see hernandez- el dookie
Yeah but we’re not still paying for Alou’s contract. What I meant was, big long contracts are what you really wind up regretting later on. Yeah, Alou wasn’t a good idea, but that’s over and done with. Castillo we’re still paying for now, and he’ll be virtually impossible to move if we expect to get anything in return or if we expect someone to take on all of his salary. Castillo’s contract actually hampers Omar’s ability to do his job.
i understand it’s like bonillas contract – which i believe we are still paying
Okay, I know this may not be popular idea, but what about Pelfrey and Heilman for Peavy?
Peavy is only 27 and we would have him long term. I think it would be worth Pelfrey (and, a-s-s-u-m-i-n-g SD is one of those teams that believes in Heilmnann, it give SD two possible starters for the price of one).
ur right its not a popular idea because it is not a good idea…pelfrey is not going anywhere
Peavy is not that much of an upgrade over Pelfrey. Pelfrey may actually be better than Peavy… but what about trading Maine and Heilman for Peavy???
whoa whoa whoa lets not get ahead of ourselves…Peavy is a top 5 pitcher in MLB…Pelfrey is not nearly as good however has a ton of upside
and Maine and Heilman are NOT gonna come close to getting it done for Peavy…wowwwwwwww
itll probably take maine heilman murphy and neise
yeah and Murphy if the mets had any brains isnt going anywhere
Given what the padres have turned down from the braves there is no way that would get it done
The Padres would laugh at us if we offerd that.
lol trading martinez for bobby freakin jenks would be the worst idea ive ever heard. Sign krod and be over with it. I think we should be making a big run at Texeria, and im not sure why were not. That would give us Delgado to trade in a package for a closer or starting pitcher.
I would love to unload Delgado for relief help or starting pitching help and start Murphy at 1b. sign Hudson or even make a run at Manny Ramirez….
Can you name a team that is in a position to trade a good closer who would trade him for Delgado? Who else would you include in the package? I prefer to keep building the farm system….and use money deal with the pitching staff.
we cant trade Delgado for a closer….obviously. Thats why i said relief help remember we have the worst MIDDLE RELEIF in MLB
if u sign teixeira u wont get anything for delgado because any team u would try to trade him to would have leverage because having Tex means you HAVE TO get rid of Delgado and they will use that against us
Just sign K-Rod. 4/56. Geterdone.
I’m not sold on F-Mart being the second coming, but I would not trade him for Jenks. I think Fuentes is the way to go – 82 K’s in 62 innings pitched. That’s what you want out of a closer. If we held F-Mart for this long, we may as well see what we get out of him. I want to see him in Spring Training.
I would not be averse to signing K-Rod, but I’d rather go a bit cheaper on Fuentes and spend some extra dollars on getting Lowe or a good starter, maybe even Ollie.
agreed- Jenks’ declining strikeout numbers are alarming, as is KRod’s loss of velocity. Fuentes looks the most attractive for the price, but I wonder why no one even mentions Kerry Wood. I guess that he is just too big of an injury risk, but if some team rolls the dice with him and he gives them 2-3 good years, he will be a bargain. He has the stuff and the stones to pitch in NY, and the fans would love him. If none of these options work, perhaps we could look up Desi Relaford.
the team has been getting us fans exited about Fmart since he was 16… if they get rid of him, i promise it will be a scott kazmir all over again.. it will come back to bite us.
just get krod. simple as that
Wonder why the Sox want to trade a player with three years or arb left?? Bobby Jenks numbers have declined drastically. What do they know?
Lay off Jenks. Go with the sure think in K Rod.. It only takes $$$ and not prospects..
Forget Jenks. He is a nightmare waiting to happen
Agreed.
Actually, I thought Jenks’ numbers had declined drastically until someone (sorry, forgot who) on here pointed out that it is utterly untrue. And I looked up the stats.
Yes, his Ks have declined a lot the last 3 years, but so have his far more important and relevant stats, like runs and walks….and his hits the last two years were lower than his big K year of 2006…..apparently he is learning to pitch rather than just throw. Why use 5 or 6 pitches to K someone when you can use 2 or 3 to get a flyout/groundout?
Jenks’s runs and BB have gone down 40% in the last 3 years…his ERA was a career low this year, almots a RUN AND A HALF lower than when he was striking everyone out in 2006.
I know it is easy to listen to the ESPN/radio blowhards who do not do 5 seconds worth of research (like the sainted Heyman I think it was recently talking about Burrell’s homers being due to CBP when he hits over half on the road) but the numbers for Jenks do not show—at all—that he is losing effectiveness. Just that he is learning that you don’t have to blow everyone away to be a big success.
The Mets should go out and make a big statement to the league and to the entire fan base on the relief front this winter. I do not want to ever go through another year of this dreadful production from our relief pitching. I know Cruz is a Type A free agent and it’s hard to swallow a draft pick on a set-up man, but listen, if that’s what it takes for me to see a formidable bullpen and one that I can count on nearly every day, then let’s just go ahead and do it.
Sign K-Rod.
Sign Juan Cruz.
Trade for Huston Street.
Sign Chad Cordero.
do you realize that you just asked to sign 3 closers?? i guarantee that once the mets sign a closer, they will fix the rotation then go back to the relievers. there are 8+ teams looking for a closer right now, and if what you said were to happen, that would basically mean having the weakest minor league system in baseball, losing a ton of money, and not fixing any problems besides the bullpen. it would be impossible anyway because other teams do want a closer also, not just the mets. i guess you forgot that though.
K-Rod is the only true closer there in that group, Metsrule. Juan Cruz, Huston Street, and Chad Cordero are all essentially set-up men in my opinion.
chad cordero and huston streeet, if traded somewhere will be a closer. there are too many teams to let a possible closer go to another team as a setup man. i never said juan cruz was a closer, and ido think the mets should pursue him, but your “plan” will not leave any money to fix the rotation, left field, second base, catcher, and all of the other problems that must be adressed. why would the mets even want cordero? he is one of the most injury prone players in all of baseball. if these trades do happen, you will see the mets with no money, a very unbalanced team, and the worst farm system in baseball.
What trades? I olny see Street’s name up there. And that does not mean we didn’t fix the rotation. We’ll still have money left over. Those guys won’t cost 26 mil and trading for Street would mean money coming off the books.
Yes but to get cordero and street and krod, we are losing money for other problems losing minor leagues in the trades, losing draft picks, etc. etc. what we need right now is not an unstoppable bullpen with a shaky rotation and an old roster, but a reliable bullpen, a solid rotation, and a young roster. we are giving up too much to get an injury prone cordero and a huston street that was god-awful last season. why do it? it makes no sense. get krod, get some consistent relievers, fix the rotation, replace Luis, maybe a new catcher, and all will be fine in new york. say hello to the playoffs in 2009.
Metsrule, if we’re going to be signing K-Rod and a Type A free agent starting pitcher, that’s the net loss of our first round draft pick at #25. At that stage, is it really even worth it to holding onto our next pick if it means we can put a stamp on solidifying the bullpen? I’d say probably not and use it to sign Cruz.
K-Rod + Type A Starting Pitcher + Cruz = 2 Draft Picks.
If we were to go after Street as well at that point, which probably would not happen if we were to sign Cruz, but for the sake of imagination, let’s just say we did. It’d most likely cost Heilman coupled with one prospect.
And, Chad Cordero is an absolute no-brainer signing. It costs us nothing in terms of draft picks, only money to sign him. And, we could very well even get him on an incentive laden contract. 26 year old relievers with past success do not come around very often, coming off surgery or not.
i never said not to get cruz. i dont like the idea of cordero, and whose to say he wil fall im our laps? there are many teams out there. if we’re lucky, we get him, adn we get him cheap, bu the world isnt perfect, and it probably wont happpen
agreed…
I like your idea. It’s pretty good.
I don’t understand why so many folks are down on F-Mart. The kid is, well, a kid. Let’s give him a real chance to see what he can do. I know that he’s battled some injuries, but so did a certain Mets shortstop that I can name. Give him some time. F-Mart isn’t the one who put the “Second Coming” label on his back.
agree!
I second that.
fmart is the future to our sucess. absolutelt 100% agreed
do people forget that f-mart is just 20 years old? we could give him 3 more years and he will only be 23 years old. I saw him played in the DWL, this guy is going to be good and I saw him hit a breaking ball for a HR. how old is murphy? 23 right? be patient!!
can we PLEASE sell high on Delgado…if there was ever a perfect time to sell high on a player now would be hte time with delgado…and everyone keeps saying we need to get younger so why not unload an old relatively high priced aging player
Who wants him? Delgado’s value likely isn’t a high as we think.
agreed. we brought up lastings milledge too early, and i think the same with argenis reyes and nick evans. we cannot make the same mistake with fmart. be patient, let him grow, and he will be our left fielder in 09. JUST DONT GET RID OF HIM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Argenis Reyes? Lol what? He’s not a prospect. He’s like a 26 year old journey man.
still a prospect, and possibly an option next year at second, but we gave him too much to handle too early obviously. a prospect is a player, young or old, who can help the teaem in the near or distant future. the way i see it, he migh tbe able to help us out.
He’s a prospect in name only. He’s an AAAA player and maybe a defensive replacement on a team with a deep bench.
that helps the team, does it not? same with endy. would you be open to him starting? i wouldn’t. but he sure has helped us in the last 3 seasons as the position that you just described.
The problem with comparing Endy to Reyes is that Endy is a much much much much better defender. Reyes is above average, but his bat is so pathetic it outweighs his defense. Endy is possibly the best defensive outfielder in baseball, so good that he actually would be a serviceable starter on a team cause he’ll save way more runs in the outfield than he’ll cost with his bat. You can find guys like Argenis Reyes in scrap heaps anywhere, teams are full of them. Guys like Endy are a lot rarer.
In fact we had another guy like Reyes in Anderson Hernandez, and likely another one in Greg Volez. Guys like Argenis Reyes are basically worthless because any time can find one.
I’m glad you brought up Anderson Hernandez. Have you seen his numbers in Washington? Not bad for a guy on a scrap heap. If you haven’t, look them up and then tell me your response.
My response is 81 at bats, not to mention he slugged under 400 which is horrible. Look at Damion Easleys June/July numbers, he looked pretty awesome in an insanely small sample size too, and then he regressed back to his mean pretty rapidly. Not to mention his BABIP with the Nationals was .370 which is completely and utterly unsustainable.
sorry i meant to say 2010, i think the mets should get ibanez for one year, although im not sure what his contract is right now. does anybody know?
He’s an FA, but he’s a type A. But his defense is horrible. I think we’d be better off saving the draft pick and using a super platoon or guys we have. Or hell if we can upgrade another position offensively, ie putting Murphy at second or somehow upgrading catcher I’d be able to live with Endy in left field.
what about tatis?
and endy on a platoon also?
Well yeah Tatis would be part of a platoon. Really I’d be as comfortable having Tatis out there everyday as I would Ibanez.
your an idiot metsrule. argenis reyes is garbage.The mets didnt bring him up to early.he is just a defensive replacement.thats not gonna change regardess if hes in the minors or not.anderson hernandez is exactly the same type of player.
Argenis Reyes is 26…maybe he will be ready after a decade in the minors…but I seriously doubt it….calling him garbage is indeed a compliment.
I agree that Ibanez, if willing to sign for 2 years, would be perfect. The fact that he is lefty is virtually meaningless, and Gina must watch a highlight reel of his errrors 24/7, becuase he just is NOT as bad as she says 7 days a week.
well he’s 19 but your point is on. the mets are being smart with him. keep him in the minors so he LEARNS the game. i’d rather have fmart as a rookie of the year at 22 than being yet another met burned out waster prospect at 20. leave the kid alone.
now we are making some sense
If we keep signing Type As year after year, we’re never going to be able to build a decent farm system. Another long-term big money contract for a closer is going to be a crippling mistake for this team, mark my words. These long-term contracts for pitchers never work out for the full duration and should only be used in cases where the player in question is an undeniable contract. K-Rod still blew 6 saves last year, his peripherals were declining. I think it’s a bigger risk to sign him for 5+ years than to trade one of your blue chippers for a closer. In the past two years, we’ve heard of three prospects that were supposed to be our corner OFers of the future (Milledge, Gomez and Martinez) and the one who ended up looking like he had the most polish at the plate in the minors was Murphy, who wasn’t even on our radar. Martinez can and will be replaced, even if he goes on to have success wherever he’s traded to.
finally somebody thinks the same as me, except for your views on fmart. we need to have a strong farm system, so that ew are not the worst team in 5+ years.
I agree, but unfortunately I’m pretty sure we’re in the minority. Most Mets fans are permanently in a win now mindset, and unfortunately it seems like the front office is too. Nevermind that “win-now” is one of the stupidest strategies any sports team can have.
How is my mindset win-now? We’re trading an unproven prospect who doesn’t play a premium position and can either be replaced externally, or by some combination of players we already have in our system (Murphy, Evans — and is Flores really going to be a middle IF for this team?). Meanwhile, by not spending freely for type A’s we hold on to picks to draft replacements for F-Mart, while adding to where our system has truly wronged us the past three seasons in high ceiling pitching.
constanza, there’s a difference between blowing six games when you saved almost seventy and blowing six games and saving, let’s say, 27. i understand your concerns but at the same time, this year with our holes as glaring as they are in the bullpen, the mets are in a position where they have to send a message to the fans and the sport in general.
can you imagine the outcry if omar skips out on k-rod, goes for fuentes and we see the brian fuentes who got bumped from the closer’s role in favour of manny corpas?
Signing type A’s is bad for the farm system but trading prospects that are already somewhat highly regarded is okay?
Missing my point entirely. In the past two years, we’ve had 3 potential corner OFers come up through our system that were highly regarded one way or another. Think about that for a minute. Where this team has let us down for 3 seasons running is with pitching. Corner OF prospects are infinitely more replaceable and if one get net us a young, already proven, inexpensive, under contract closer for the next 2-3 years, I would rather trade F-Mart for Jenks, keep our draft picks and focus on pitching, pitching and more pitching so 3-4 years from now, we don’t have to worry about 3/5ths of our rotation leaving and having to replace it by forfeiting more draft picks and paying $15 million a year for mediocrity. If people think that’s stupid, sue me.
The problem with that if that you’re as-suming our front office is going to go out and draft high ceiling pitching talent. Which is the exact opposite of what they’ve done since this regime took over. Why do you think the best pitching prospect we have has two pitches and profiles as a back end of the rotation guy. Because we spend our packs on low upside quick turn around middle relief type pitchers, and for the most part the same thing with hitters, in the draft.
gina is right there costanza – omar hasn’t changed that front office mentality especially when it comes to paying above slot
so, who are you getting for f-mart? jenks?. I rather sign fuentes or wood for 3 years? just because milledge didnt work out, doesnt mean f-mart wont be good.
Not to mention it’s too early to say Milledge didn’t work out.
exactly, gina. it’s funny how people want to still god milledge but he looked pretty good this past year and showed some improvements. milledge is going to be fine.
You’re stupid.
And you’re insightful. Spend, spend, spend and let’s treat a corner OF prospect like the weight of our organization depends on it.
although i do agree with u gina this guy coulda been another walking timebomb ala carl (i don’t believe dinosaurs existed) everett
Why would you say we shouldnt lose our draft picks when the highest potential blue-chipper we’ve had in years and years, your ready to get rid of? My question is how good does a prospect have to be then before we consider holding on to him? Drafting pitcher after pitcher after pitcher is not that good of a strategy either. To be able to see those pitcher’s real potential, to have them go through the minors without the little problems that derail so many careers (drinking, drugs, homesickness, loss of patience), to avoid injuries, and of course the right coaching, are all things that makes the draft a crapshoot whether you pay over slot or not. By the way constnza, you just said to use the draft to get pitching but up earlier you said it can be used to get replacements for F-Mart, so which is it?
Kerry Wood’s name hasn’t come up very often, which is somewhat surprising. I know that he’s battled injuries over and over again, but he was willing to accept another one year deal from the Cubbies. I wonder what they were thinking. Or what they know.
Although I really do not understand why Omar would rather trade away young talent for a closer than invest money in one. What’s really the difference? We’re going to have to spend money eventually to fill the holes the young talent would have filled, and, at least you would think but this year makes me wonder, we’re going to have to spend money on the draft and IFA to refill the holes left in the farm system. It feel like overall the cost would be lesser in going after K-rod. Especially if he signs for 4 years, 50 million or less.
I would doubt that he will cost less than 15 a year. Maybe we get lucky with a 4 yr deal.
FMart for Bobby Jenks isn’t a bad idea, though I wonder how much more they want. The way I read it is that Dye is a salary dump. Put the two together and I think Neise or Parnell + Fmart is reasonable.
Paul Kinzer’s interview said otherwise. You apparently didn’t listen to it.
MLBTradeRumors says the Tigers are contemplating a trade that would send them Julio Lugo from the Red Soxs in exchange for Dontrelle Willis or Nate Robertson. Omar should try and see if the Tigers would be willing to do a salary dump with us on Castillo if that’s the case. Preferably, though, I hope there is truth to the rumor about swapping Castillo in a package for Javier Vasquez.
2009 bullpen should be this
closer – krod R
8th – affeldt L
biemel L
smith R
parnell R
feliciano L (specialist only)
Stokes R (long man)
this is a solid pen and is very reasonable…krod would be expensive but affeldt and biemel are both type Bs and shouldnt be tooo much.
But this leaves us little room for a starter or corner OF. I think that no matter how good the bullpen looks on paper, overworking them will make them look bad
What corner outfielder do you expect them to go after that they wouldn’t be able to afford after signing this bullpen and a starter.
Manny, Dunn, Ibanez would be out
Juan Rivera might be within range
The only guy on that list I think they were even considering is Ibanez, who I think is a waste anyway.
I still don’t understand why you want Beimel. Even with all his struggles Sanchez was better than him for the most part last year. It would make more sense just to keep Sanchez.
Also if anything being type B’s might mean more teams are going to be going after them because they won’t cost draft picks. Especially Affeldt who’s coming off an awesome year.
look at biemels stats!!!!! There is no way sanchez was even close to him last year…
Beimel – 2.02 ERA
Sanchez – 4.32 ERA
and u can look at the rest of the stats and see that these two players differ drastically
I have no clue where u get that sanchez was better than beimel last year.
Umm you know other stats exist than ERA right? And you know ERA is kind of a crappy way to judge pitchers right? Sanchez had a better k/9, bb/9 k/bb, BAA and WHIP. And Beimel had an unsustainable HR/9 number
He also has an unsustainable LOB%. His ERA is likely going to come crashing back down to earth next year.
Gina i really disagree with you here. You say that ERA is a crappy way to judge a relief pitcher and then you bring up a stat like K/9 IP. Just ridiculous, just admit you made a mistake by saying Sanchez is as good as Beimol.
and GINA i forgot to say that ERA is by far the best way to judge a relief pitcher. What other stat are u going to use Wins and Losses??? outrageous post on your point
Umm how is K/9 ridiculous? K/9 is actually in a pitchers control, ERA isn’t always. Not to mention the small sample sizes for relief pitchers make ERA basically worthless.
true and don’t forget about inherited runners or unearned runs
how is K/9 helpful for a ground ball pitcher someone like Pelfrey. ERA actually measures the runs given up on average per 9 innings if you werent aware. Obviously relievers are responsible for players left on base but its still the best way to measure a relief pitcher rather than K/pIP. PLus you want your pitchers rolling double plays in big spots often. and also, Dauner Sanchez was nother more than horrible last year and deserves no credit. And anyone remember his quote about how the pen shouldnt be getting criticized when the mets were winning games back at that brewers series around the start of september. Dispicable…..
and Rusty…..unearned runs dont effect your ERA smarty pants, and inherited runners dont effect your ERA either
true airfeet that was dispicable but the point i am making is when you are a reliever with inherited runners and u melt down ala our bp it affects the previous pitchers stas rather than the dolt thats pitching at that moment it’s kinda superflous imoho
hey air cut the sarcasm here man so i have a differing opinion than you doesn’t mean my point is any less relevant than yours
right but the previous pitcher who left runners on base pitched poorly obvious because he left runners all over the basepaths…
whatever Rusty all im saying is taht Gina saying ERA is a crappy way to judge a relief pitcher is a lil outrageous…K/9 is no way more relevant than ERA…i mean Heilman struck out a lot of guys this year….
very true the only point im making is that it is not full proff valid stat thats all a guy can give up 4 runs and strike out the side in an inning but his k/9 will still look good – his era may be astronomical but his k/9 will look good
ERA IS BY FAR THE BEST WAY TO JUDGE A PITCHER……SOMEONE MAY HAVE A k/9 of 10000000000 and STILL HAVE AN ERA OVER 5…WHO CARES ABOUT THOSE STATS…ERA MEANS EARNED RUN AVERGAGE WHICH BASICALLY MEANS THE NUMBER OF RUNS GIVEN UP PER NINE INNINGS!!!! SO GINA ERA IS NOT A CRAPPY WAY TO JUDGE A PITCHER…IT IS THE BEST WAY… AND IF U THINK SANCHEZ WAS BETTER THAN BEIMEL LAST YEAR THAN U ARE ONE OF THE STUPEDIST PPL ALIVE!!!
so air u telling me that you would rather have lets sayyy – mota as yer closer with a era over 4 or lidge who’s era was under 3?
me or airfeet phuck?
shes a girl phukthephills…gotta give her some what of a break i guess about being a knowledgeable baseball fan
I WOULD HAVE THE GUY WITH THE ERA OBVIOUSLY….LIKE IVE BEEN SAYING ALL ALONG IN HTE FIRST PLACE
hey i find gina alot more knowledgable about this crap than me – i just disagree with her about era vs k/9
thats what ive been saying !! sheesh – but and its a big but sometimes era is misleading – like i said errors and inherited runners etc
its rediculous…i never agree with her at all!!! especially when she said that duaner sanchez in 08 was bettr than beimel in 08
phuck opinions are like a-holes everybodys got one – 2 if u have fistulas lol
ERA is less useful because there are too many things that factor into that are out of a pitchers control. Like the park he’s in and the defense behind him.Johan Santana in Arlington isn’t going to have the same ERA as Johan Santana in Petco because of what the two parks do to offenses. And Johan Santana with a bunch of random guys off the straight playing the defensive positions behind him inst going to have the same ERA as Johan Santana with a bunch of gold glovers behind him.
If every pop up a pitcher gave up landed as a hit don’t you think his ERA would be different than if every pop up was caught and turned into an out? Do you think if we switched out Carlos Beltran and Ryan Church with two guys from this group their ERA would be the same? What if we put Manny in CF and Big Papi in right do you think our pitchers ERA’s would be the same? What if every pop out he gave out went out of the park vs being caught as outs? Obviously those are extremes but it shows you how easily ERA can be affected by things that have nothing to do with the pitchers. It’s really not rocket science to see how misleading ERA can be.
yeah but Manny would never play CF and Papi would never play Right….every team has a solid defensive player in CF and respetable players in LF and RF…yeah they may be a little different but you cant comapare 2.02 ERA to Sanchez….thats a little outrageous Gina…outrageous…
and your point was also that Sanchez was better than Beimol…and the mets played in a pitcher’s park with a better defensive team…so therefore shouldnt Sanchez have a better ERA…idk what you’re smoking Gina but wanna share some?
No my point was that ERA is a crappy way to judge pitchers. And everyone team has respectable defensive outfields? Have you looked at the Yankees, or White Sox outfields? And Shea didn’t play like a pitchers park this year. The construction of Citi field, it changed the wind patterns. Shea was actually pretty close to neutral but regardless, Dodgers stadium is the second worst pitchers park in the league, the only one worse is Petco. Shea didn’t come anywhere near what Dodger’s stadium did to offense.
but thats how the game unfolds gina – if everyteam’s stadium had the same dimensions or were domed or had the astro turf – what im trying to say is thats what seperates the great pitchers from the good pitchers and the good pitchers from the victor zambrano’s of the world
Also the dodgers defense was better than ours last years by a pretty wide margin. Which shouldn’t be surprising when you consider we had a rotating outfield outside of citi field and basically a defensive black hole on the right side of the infield.
rusty where did I say that wasn’t how the game unfolded? I said that’s why ERA is a poor way to judge pitchers. Why would that being the way the game unfolds make it not a poor way to judge pitchers?
yeah but there are also unmitigating factors gina that tends to skew era
Gina you are just wrong…idk what you’re babbling about. BY basically using your point I could say that u cant use K/9 as a valid stat because everyone faces different hitters…one pitcher might face the pirates 7-9 in hte order while another may face the Phillies 2-5…its just absurd..
Why wouldn’t facing different hitters make ERA just as unvalid? Is a pitcher in the Nl West facing the same caliber of hitters as a pitcher in the NL East?
so then why would u say K/9 is in a pitcher’s control…thats what you just said…and then how is it more valid than ERA?? but apparently thats NOT true now..make up your mind
do we really need to fight lets just all hope omar does the right thing and rebuilds the bullpen and gets rid of luis castillio – cuz ifrom what ive heard jerry manuel and luis never got along so idk if luis will play hard for him
girls dont play baseball
because k/9 i more under his control than ERA? Because the same arguments you can make against k/9 you can make against any metric or stat, but you can make more arguments against ERA. ERA and K/9 can both be affected by your competition level. But k/9 can’t be affected by your defense and your park. ERA can.
lets not get chauvenistic here now
okay but my last point im gonna make on this and the most important….being a strike out pitcher doesnt make you better than a pitcher that gets people out…striking out more guys but giving up tons of HRs and having a terrible ERA is not better than a guy with a low ERA that doesnt get K’s
When did I say it did? Was k/9 the only stat I mentioned? It sounds like you’re the one confused and babbling Airfeet.
yeah see nolan ryan
hey Gina…do you know what tagging up means?
Lol good job. You have no argument/idea what you’re talking about so you’re going to attack me personally. I’m sure that makes people think you’re less of an idiot.
come on guys can’t we all just get along!!?? we are not phillie fans – we are human!!
the fact of the matter is you think K/9 is a more effective stat than ERA for a MIDDLE RELIEVER…that was one of hte stupidest comments ive ever heard almost as dumb as thinking Sanchez was better than Beimol last season
air she is entitled to her opinion like u r to yours
The fact that you still don’t understand is funny to me. Especially since I never said k/9 by itself was a more effective stat.
hey airfeet you lost all credibility with your “girls don’t play baseball” comment. because you can’t understand something as simple as k/9, there is no need for that here.
agreed u just put yourself on flight fiya minaya and fmm level
Lefty middle reliever comes in with a man on first, one out. Gets a groundball but due to a bobble, the infield can only get one out. A righty comes up to hit and the manager replaces the lefty. The hitter knocks it out of the park. The lefty gets a run charged to him because the runner on first was the one he faced, despite the fact that he got an out. The ideal example of how era isnt the big stat. The pitchers defense didnt turn the double play, so that wasnt his fault. He also was not the one to give up the homer, yet his era increased despite him doing his job. Now if he had struck his hitter out…
K/BB gives a better indications of a pitcher’s true skills than does ERA. The idea is that a pitcher’s ERA is not as controllable as is his K/BB. After the ball makes contact with the bat, the pitcher has no control over the ball, and the ball could find a hole. In other words, the pitcher’s BABIP is subject to luck. And if runners were in scoring position, a pitcher’s ERA may inflate undeservedly. This is especially the case with relievers since they don’t get many innings in.
Pitchers have more control over Ks and BBs.
I really don’t think Parnell should be in the BP. Yet. Let him toy around in AAA for at least half a year.
Doesn’t F-Mart remind you of Benjamin Franklin Rodriguez from the movie Sandlot? haha
More like Alex Escobar. I’d say trade while his value is high.
Murphy almost came out of nowhere. He had a good HWB campaign in 2007 (yes, i keep tabs on this stuff) and obviously played well in 2008.
You never know where the next great player will come from. FMart may be it, he may not. I’m comfortable moving him because Wilmer Flores will be a much better player.
Mike Vail played great for half a season too (23 game hitting streak to boot). And then what happened to him?
he went to the cubs where he had a couple of decent years then scrubbed out and agee f-mart could turn into kevin mitchell with even more power and talent
omar needs to sign pitchers like krod,cruz,beimel, or even take a chance on cordero at least….i say id sign cruz in a heartbeat…his numbers are legit and he throws heat for a skinny man haha and trade away our bullpen from last year haha
we dont need position players….the bullpen blew ummm what was it? correct if im wrong i think 29 games that we were leading…its clearly the bullpen…the offense is fine even in left field with tatis,murphy, or evans. we dont need the ” big players names ” like ramirez or ibanez which both players are like 90 and not even worth giving up our draft picks
although i agree gotham we got verry little production fromleft field for about 2/3 of the year and second base was a black hole when it came to run production
A clutch bat would be nice…you know someone who can hit a sac fly w a runner on 3rd with 0 outs
This is so stupid. Let’s trade for a guy who throws 100 mph but can’t strike anyone out instead of signing a guy who throws less but can.
Jenks is actually OLDER than K-Rod and has had more injury problems than K-Rod who has pitched for twice as long.
They would be better off signing Trevor Hoffman than trading for Jenks if they don’t want a long term commitment.
What do you guys think of trying to get D-Train? What would it cost?
a couple of baseball bats???
a bucket of popeyes chicken and taking on the rest of his 20 mill contract lol
…. so he can pitch for Port St. Lucie?
I’m sure last year was a fluke.
Actually, when taking a good look at his career, it is just as likely that 2005 was the fluke….his 2006 was pretty mediocre, and 2007 was almost off the charts bad….
OMG, you’re right. But do you see how many innnings he can throw? Damn. Eh, I’d still give him a shot. 5th starter.
yeah i think d-train has arrived in the carl pavano zone
Neither were flukes. The problem is he can’t pitch the way he used to, with the high leg kick, because of his current body size and lack of flexibility. That and Florida way overused him.
Well I should say I don’t think neither were flukes. Obviously there’s no way to say definitively.
do we blame giradi for this like we blame him for olsen gina?
*girardi
i’ll take d-train in a second. buy low… start him as the #5 and let him work his way back.
pretty expensive #5 – not to say hes not worth the risk
i like the idea of signing Cruz and Affeldt and maybe Guardado( he seemed to find himself last year). Spend the bulk of the money on starters. If you have some starters that can go deep into games, the bullpen has to pitch much less anyways.
Guardado makes Wagner look like Rivera.
guardado makes rich rodrigez and mel rojas look like mo
Actually, Guardado pitched very well for Texas before he was traded back to the Twins. I think he would come pretty cheap and is a lefty.
This “anonymous AL executive” works for the White Sox, right?
I wouldn’t doubt it. Since when is having all those things decrease helping?
jeff torborg???
Oh yeah…
damn talk about a managing career that had so much promise then he became a met lol and he hasn’t been the same since – kinda like art howe
hey i just realized matt took down the fans confidence corner
i guess we would be at a all time low if it was still up there
Just to reply to the D-Train idea from above…
I have always loved Dontrelle Willis and have always envisioned him pitching in Queens. He would easily become a fan favorite here. He has that New York moxie. Granted, I am not sure if he is the pitcher he once was, I would love to see Omar take a shot on him. But would Detroit really want to deal him with his value so low. It cannot get any lower than it is right now, so what is the harm in trying him out again next year? He is an interesting case.
Also, I have never been a huge fan of Jenks. Would I give up our best prospects for him? No chance. K-Rod is overrated, but he is still one of the best closers in baseball. The bottom line is that the market value for big-time closers is in the 12-15 million dollar range. Personally, I envision K-Rod wearing a Mets uniform next season. Just my gut feeling.
he could also become the next roger craig anthony young who lost 20 straight in 93
giants baby! 30-10 4th quarter!
yeah!!
How bout our NY Red Bulls in the MLS Cup finals!!!! I wish they would get some coverage in ny sports media. After all they were considered the worst playoff team this season and are now facing the best team in the finals.
meh – soccer is like antartica herer in the u.s.a – everyone knows its there but who gives a flying fruck
LOL!
Thanks for the reminder, as I actually had no idea they were playing right now, let alone in the playoffs….
Rooting for the “Red Bulls”….wow, I am glad that in baseball, football and basketball I do not have to root for the “Pepsis” or “Walmarts”….
hey kingman what ever happened to toasty joe? did he go by way of pizzia the hutt and eat himself?? lol
Ha! Good question…
By the way, on the threads that got edited and closed yesterday due to that U R JERYR idiot, your comment that Reggie bars were “nutty goodness”, like Reggie himself, was a HOF quality line!
whty thankyou and did u read my rusty staub story?
No! I missed it and I just saw your comment about it being removed after the thread had been closed due to that idiot….
Rusty sure made good ribs….
im still wonderin why they took it down along with my cleon jones scandal comments that were tied to m donald grant
well heres the story when i was 3 or 4 ( it was 75,76 my dad took me to a game and scored field box seats he was trying to get me a autograph rusty was going into the dugout my dad yelled ” rusty howz about a autograph for your son over here ( i was pudgy and have red hair) rusty looked at me and laughed and signed a ball ( where it is today i have no clue lol) so to this day i caLL MYSELF RUSTY STAUBS ILLEGITIMATE SON LOL
If it was in a group of comments with something by that U R JERYR guy, it probably got taken down just because it seems like when they take down bad comments, they take the whole group of responses down too, so that is probably why….also, some of the Cleon Jones comments were left while some were deleted, also probably because some were in their own independent comment thread free of U R JERYR…
Gotta run, but would love to hear the Rusty story, as he was one of my very favorite Mets in the 70s, along with Seaver, Milner, and some mediocre guy who hit a lot of long home runs…
And I also answered you above about The Accused—I played music in Seattle in the 90s and opened for a couple of The Accused when they were later in Tad and Gruntruck!
Later!
cya i interviewed grunt truck back in college
That’s GREAT!!!
Glad I got to see that story before taking off…I can so imagine Rusty doing that, as he seemed to be such a good guy and a real person, unlike so many rich athletes…..
Did you ever get to his restaurant? I went in the 80s a few times and man, he cooked mean ribs….
Wow, my guess is that Ben was probably really, really nice, and really, really drunk….
He was a great guy though; about the nicest of the Seattle stars of the day…he always would brag about how he got drunk and threw up during the commercial breaks when he was hosting Headbanger’s Ball on MTV!
Hey cc. I’m on board go red bulls. Football is the most viewed sport in the world. I’m not saying to watch the games, but at least respect other peoples opinion. That being said this is a mets board and will not talk about it any further.
Trading F-Mart is a no-go. He’s far more valuable than a 275-lb. closer, especially when K-rod is available.
I was originally on the trade Delgado bandwagon, but I doubt anyone will pony up a closer for him. I say we sign K-rod, Lowe and Juan Rivera, and look to trade all of Heilman, Kunz, Castillo, Evans, Carp, Rustich, Gee, Antonini, and Carr to acquire a second baseman, and two starters that we can make into relievers.
agreed til mets look i have to have faith in omar he’s pulled off some good below the radar moves ie dirty sanchez ollie perez maine and nady to name a few
omar is gonna milk this as much as possible…i love it
hopefully K-Rods agent takes the bait
“people in the loop” –>
Are these the same people that are “familiar with the Mets thinking?”
put me in the camp of a couple of top prospects being worth ore than the $$ difference between a FA closer and trading for one. Jenks is good (certianly better than Ayala!) but the Mets IMO will be better off with someone else and retaining Fmart, etc.
I go for beef up the middle core (the real problem area anyway). Cruz, Affeldt, etc. (mix match, take your pick). For closer, if Omar insists on a big name brand, Fuentes or K rod, whichever looks like the best deal.
Is Woods a type A? Might be even a better idea if the deal is shroter/cheaper.
But, in any case, the only way to really build a pen and still have the prospect and financial flexibility to fill the other holes is to DEVELOP YOUR OWN CLOSER! Look at the good teams recently like the angels, Red Sox, White sox. All with young, home grown closers. Do the mets have this guy? WHo knows! parnell? Somwone else? worth a look.
2nd best idea is snagging a strong middle guy someplace and converting him (like a Cruz).
Or just spend the big $$s.
Putz for a decent cost would be sine too.
good point above about Sanchez. Perfect time for another trade like this (Delgado could be involved!) for a young, strong armed guy to groom.
I personally have no problem stocking the ST pen with a bunch of power arms, and letting them sort out who gets to close. Last man standing earns the job!
i think we are ovevaluing delgado
why give up prospects or our best power hitter when one of top 5 closers in the MLB is a FA and wants to play for us???
excellent point
i just hate waiting i just want the ice to finally break and know who will be on our roster for 09
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