In Newsday, Ken Davidoff explains why the Mets essentially have their choice of free-agent closers, flatly writing:
“They will sign either Francisco Rodriguez or Brian Fuentes to be their closer. Whom they sign will depend on the contract terms.”
…if this is the case, and i believe that it is, then i see no reason for the Mets to cave on a fourth year, which is obviously going to be the big issue in negotiations…the fourth-year issue will likely be less of an issue with Brian Fuentes, who i believe is the team’s second choice – despite what some reporters have written…
According to Davidoff, “The Mets expressed some interest in free agent Kerry Wood, and they asked in trade discussions about Bobby Jenks, J.J. Putz and Huston Street.”
…as i wrote yesterday, in the previous post, “From what I can gather, the Mets are likely to make a trade for a relief pitcher, who has experience as a closer, before they move to sign either Rodriguez, Fuentes or Wood.”…
…so, if things go the way the Mets are planning, they could end up with a free-agent closer and a set-up man from another organization…of course, a lot has to happen between now and then…so, stay tuned…
{ 76 comments }
Yes, I believe the Mets should get him. And if his asking price is too high get the other guy. And, honestly even that other other guy is probably okay. If they trade for that one fella, that would be okay too, as long as they then sign that kid to set up.
This is only my opinion, of course.
I couldn’t have said it better myself…what?
You’ve gotta love Matt and his “From what I can gathers” – the madness of the hot stove. Regarding last night’s post about how the Mets could sign K-Rod and trade for Street to set up – and EVERYONE was hopping on board – how do we know Street wants to set up? I don’t think he handled that move well in Oakland late last season when they moved him to a setup role. Furthermore, his perceived value is highger than his actual value, he’s always hurt and will cost too much. If people actually, seriously think the Mets can get Street with Heilman being the centerpiece of the deal, they are either using some extremely potent mind altering substance that i am not or they’re just getting the ol’ hot stove day dreams. (And please PLEASE don’t tell me “oh they’ll throw in Evans” because that’s just a joke)
My only approach to the offseason as a fan is this: read rumors, get excited, but know the bottom line: we have no idea what’s actually going on and we will be surprised several times over the next few months. And the Yankees will spend a lot more than they even need to. That is all.
Well done, Boscov.
If you read Matt’s post about Street from yesterday, he offers zero evidence that the Rockies are looking to unload street and that they like Heilman.
Come to think of it, that post is 100% speculation, with no supporting evidence whatsoever. This is borderline irresponsible, and no better than a WFAN caller giving one of those “hows about we trade (blank) for Jake Peavy” proposals.
The Padres would never do that deal. (blank) is another one of those prospects that Met fans fall in love with, but nobody around baseball covets. It will take much more than (blank) to get Peavy.
“Borderline irresponsible?” Let us not forget, this is a blog, not a newspaper, magazine, radio or television news program, or the website for any of those things. Blogs like this primarily exist to examine and parse rumors, and they don’t have the same restraints and standards given to (most) journalistic properties.
One of the main reasons I come here is to get a feel for the rumors and grumblings going on. This may not give me facts, but it does give me an indication of the perception of the populace as to what may happen. If I want the cold, hard, facts, I’ll go to Mets.com as they’ll surely report anything that actually does happen.
Matt’s just letting us know what he’s heard, and when something actually happens, I’m sure he’ll post.
I still see your point though, and I guess one way to alleviate frustration would be to flag posts like this as “Rumor.” and then allow filtering for those who want only the straight dope.
My post ran away.
Here is what I don’t get.
Why would the Mets offer Fuentes 3 years but not offer Krod 4?
Why would Krod not take a 3 year deal with options from the Mets if he thought there was any chance they might sign Fuentes? He knows that besides the Mets there is not a team out there that will give him 4 years. In fact if he does not sign with the Mets he may take a huge pay cut.
I think this deal gets done soon. 3 years 42 million with 2 option years. 1st with a large buyout and 2nd just a team option.
Our bullpen would improve dramatically, if we sign either one and then trade for street. This is just what the doctor ordered and I need one after the last 2 years of this bullpen. Whats the status of randy Johnson? He could be our 5 starter for a year till niese is ready or fill in this year. If we lose ollie, we could use another lefty or 2 against the phils.
I agree the Big Unit could be a good 5th starter. I just can’t see him coming back to NY (albeit the other side of town) after the disaster he was with the Yanks. He is a shell of his former self right now. He is one awkward landing away from needing back surgery again. I’d rather not get him, but I can understand why he is intriguing. I would see if Kerry Wood has any desire to return to a rotation. I wouldn’t mind him at 5th starter price.
You know … that’s a really good point about Kerry Wood. I have not heard much about him this off season … does he view himself as a closer only now or is it just the teams that look at him that way?
Thanks mikey. I’m just saying, most pitchers want to start, unless they are an all time great/dominant closer. Most pitchers that are in the bullpen are there because they either couldn’t stay healthy as a starter (think Wood, Harden when in Oakland) or weren’t good enough to start.
I think he would have to seriously consider it. He will probably get $10MM as a closer, or in that range. I would see if he would come here on a 2 yr deal, with the understanding that he can start, but if it doesn’t work out, then he’s our setup guy.
The Cubs tried to use him as starter for years and he just kept getting injured…
I know they tried to use him for years. Same with the A’s and Rich Harden. So what did they do? They put him in the bullpen to work on his arm strength again. Wood has a full season of pretty much injury free baseball behind him.
Trying to think out of the box here for a starter that isn’t going to cost an arm and a leg.
Wasn’t trying to bash you or anything dude, don’t get your panties all binded up. It just doesnt look like he has the durability to be a starter. As a reliever though I may take my chances with him.
I didn’t take it as bashing….but I wasn’t biting back either. I’m just saying…I know the guy is injury prone, but if he’s throwing pitches for your team, it doesn’t matter if he’s a starter or reliever – if his arm is ready to go, it’s ready to go. I just wonder how he feels about going back to starting.
Yeah, I hear ya. I just wouldnt want to try him as a starter, he gets injured, then jumps back and forth between the DL for 2 years. Based on evidence from the prior few years, I would just rather keep him in the pen where he can seem to stay healthy.
Disaster with the Yanks? Yes he had a high ERA his last year but in the 2 years he spent there he won 34 games, pitched 435 innings and had 383 SO all while having a WHIP under 1.25 both seasons. I would hardly call that a disaster and would welcome those stats from a #5 starter.
I will take Petey as my 5th starter over the big waste.
I think the disaster was in the perception.
thereal,
with that offense, i could have won 34 games in two seasons. he was a disaster with the media from day one and never pitched a big game for them, aside from his first start in fenway on sunday night baseball.
You would welcome those stats from a #5 starter, but the Yanks got him to be their ace or at least one of the top 2 in the rotation.
Look at last year’s numbers and explain that even a little.
We were talking about his time in New York, not Arizona. He may have put up decent numbers in Arizona this year, but he was also home. I would say to let him stay and finish his career on the west coast.
Last year reference was to the guy saying that he woudl take Pedro over Johnson. And no he was not an ace in NY but he still put up good numbers except for ERA one year.
You want a lefty 5th starter to replace Ollie…..Randy Wolf. I have no problem with him as our 4th or 5th starter. I think he might also like to stick it to Philly a little more when he pitches against them.
I like Wolf too. Depends on what he wants and how much we like Niese. Johnson would come on a 1 year deal and Niese would be the starter in 2010. If you sign Wolf it’s gonna be at least 2 years.
Wolf….yuck.
I’ve seen his numbers and can’t believe his K/9IP is as high as it is, but I’d rather stay away. Much rather let Niese go to work.
I don’t want to head into the season with Neise as the #5 starter. There is one flat out and simple reason. No rotation goes through an entire year without losing someone for a period of time. Every rotation has a guy that goes on the DL at some point in the year. I’d rather have Neise waiting in the wings in AAA working on his off speed stuff and just getting work in. Then when said starter goes on the DL you have a Quality Prospect to call up like Neise. This way you don’t have to call up Nelson Figeroa for 6 starts, Claudio Vargas for 4, or Brandon Knight or Tony Armas.
This is why you hopefully sign one Very good Veteran (Lowe/Burnett) type to fill a top rotation spot, pushing Pelfrey to a #3 guy. And you sign either a SP coming off injury (Penny/Sheets) to be your #5 guy. This provides you with depth in AAA to call someone up if someone gets a blister and has to go on the 15 day DL.
Always 09, you are killing me. You want to go with a rookie who did not show he was ready as our #5 starter instead of bringing in an established guy on a short term contract while Niese gets ready? That’s silly. Bring these guys in and when the injury happens Niese takes the spot. If you do not then who takes the ball when Maine gets injured and Niese is ineffective? Vargas and Armas?
I would give him a 3 year deal with two team option years..so if he’s good through three we have the oppurtunity to keep him through 5….
that way he can get the “5 year deal” he was looking for and we look like heroes….
If you want two option years, I think it would have to be a mutual option for the 5th year.
I am really intriqued by what SP will be left out to dry this season. Will anyone actually give Sheets more than 2 years? What if we offered 2/32? Would he take it? Then trade for an innings guy like Vasquez?
Johan, Sheets, Pelfrey, Vasquez, Maine? That would be a really deep rotation. If Sheets or Maine get injured you still have Niese.
As I said yesterday, I am also intriqued by Randy Johnson for 5-8 million on a 1 year deal. Same would apply about trading for Vasquez.
I know Randy is 106 years old but as a 5th starter he could be skipped often and he still put up good numbers last season.
184 innings, 173 SO, under 4.00 ERA, WHIP under 1.25. Those are excelent numbers from a #5.
I agree on liking Sheets and johnson. Sheets could be huge if (of course!) he stays healthy.
As always, for either guy, having viable 6/7/8 starters is key to taking the risk.
Wolf is OK to, on a shorter deal. I do like the idea of a 2nd lefty in the rotation, but I can overlook that for sheets (but not Garland, etc.)
Sheets and Vasquez would be amazing. They both have K/9 ratios. And as you said, we have Niese ready to fill in in case of an injury to Maine, etc. Actually, I’d also try sign Pedro or someone like that to be a fill in starter (hopefully he wants to retire a Met).
I’ll take K-Rod and hopefully trade for another releiver.
Mark my words Kerry Wood will have the best year out of any of these guys next year. I know I know if he’s stays healthy, but considering all of them are healthy.
I would love to see the Mets get Kerry Wood. Get K-Rod, you kinda of have to, thats fine. We all know its not just the ninth we are trying to fill.
Kerry Wood’s stuff is dirty, GET EM OMAR.
GET EVERYONE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
We’ll sign either Fuentes ot KRod? Are we first in line at the buffet? I think other teams will be in the same hunt .
Not many.
I see this
Texas: Wood or someone cheap like Cruz
Cleveland: Hoffman or someone cheap
Detroit: Fuentes or someone cheap like Cruz
Mets: Krod
St. Louis: Hoffman or someone cheap.
Really who is even in the market for Krod besides the Mets?
yonr right i cant see any other team putting up the $$$ we will for Krod but will we put up the years? Krod might take a pay cut for that guaranteed year where someone will pay him now for being a dominant closer and later for either being a dominant closer or an injured closer.
But who will give him the extra year? Tigers already have enough contract problems. Texas has already said they would have to move Blaylock just to afford Wood, St. Louis would never give 4 years and there is no way that Cleveland will either.
If you were Krod would you rather have 3/42 from the Mets with option years or 4/44 from the mystery team like Texas?
is there anything new here?
I am tired of seeing slider and change up out of the bullpen, some guy has a good over the top curve, sign him up!!!!
it boggles the mind how many people here advocating signing injury risks like ben sheets and the best idea is turning kerry wood back into a starter. the cubs tried that and then he went and got hurt again. have we learned nothing here? if that’s the case then let’s resign pedro to an incentive-laden one year deal and be done with it.
the idea of trading for street to set up is an interesting one. if that doesn’t work, sign cordero to an incentive-laden one or two year deal and let’s go.
If the dude is going to blow his arm out, he’s going to blow it out. Doesn’t matter if he he throwing 15-20 pitches with an average of 1-2 days rest inbetween, or throwing 100 pitches with 4 days rest inbetween. So, if Wood is an option, I don’t see why makign him a starter isn’t an option. He has a healthy year under his belt.
so you want to give wood 13mil a yr to start why not just give sheets 13mil a yr to start…and i think itll come down to fuentes for 3 yrs or krod for 4 and id much rather do krod for 4…fuentes is good but has been inconsistent…krod has been consistently a top 5 closer in the league since hes been closing and at only 26 i dont know if hell take less than 4 years…so how ab 4 years no option
and why do we have to trade for a set up man when we can just sign juan cruz…does no one know who this guy is…Houston Street is not that good people…very overrated in my opinion and hes def gonna cost more than he’s worth…save the guys and go and get dye…the n try and sign lowe and after all that your only adding ab 10 mil per year
I think Juan Cruz is a type A though, that’s the thing. If you’re talking about K-Rod and Lowe … that’s 2 type A’s already. Not sure if they’d sign 3 type A’s.
Depends on if you value the prospects being sent for Street over the 1 prospect you lose for signing Street.
“and why do we have to trade for a set up man when we can just sign juan cruz…does no one know who this guy is…Houston Street is not that good people”
exactly fsmetfan, Cruz numbers are much better than Streets and we dont have to give up prospects. Street is very mediocre.
I think the guy was just raising a question about Kerry Wood. He was a.s.s.uming we sign a guy like Lowe and then the idea that Wood could be a #5 starter.
I don’t think anyone was just advocating to go turn him into a starter and expect him to be a #2 in the rotation and do nothing else.
Context.
Beltran The Warrior, we should actually do both. Trade for Huston Street and sign Chad Cordero. There is no single answer when it comes to the bullpen. We should not go into camp banking that Cordero will be healthy. He should be ready, but after having a similar situations with Duaner Sanchez, we should not put all our eggs in one basket. We just have to go out there and get an arsenal of arms. The more guys brought into camp, the better… and with that comes the better likelihood that some happen to indeed pan out.
i can dig it.
If you get an innings eater like Vasquez through trade there is nothing wrong with risking it with a short term contract for one of the injury risk guys.
Get k-rod, trade delgado for somebody new in the bullpen, get betancour from the indians, put heilman as a 5th starter, signed ben sheets if your keeping delgado, if my wish happen and delgado gets trade then we have to get either MANNY or TEIXEIRA!! omar, please come trough for us..
Stop smoking that stuff!
Wow a little crazy there. No way is Heilman going to be the 5th starter. I do not see the Mets doing this. Simply because he’s been here for so long and the mets have needed starters and they have refused to put him there.
Now I want Delgado and his awful attitude gone. He’s not a leader and hasn’t seemed to help the younger players do anything but sulk.
I want Sheets. I know he’s an injury risk, but when he’s healthy he’s a very very good pitcher. He will make about 25 starts a year. And he will come cheaper then the top guys because of the injury past.
So if the mets are looking at say Lowe and Wolf, I’d much rather get Sheets and Lowe. Sheets at least can Dominate. Also he did make 31 starts last year, before going on the DL.
I hope the Mets don’t get just 1 or 2 pitchers. they need a full bullpen makeover. Sign ANYONE (okay, not anyone…) but yeah.
Why not sign Kerry Wood to the pen as the setup man? He has experience closing, has multiple pitch types, and still has some gas on the fastball. If the Mets can get him and K-Rod, I see that as lights out after the seventh inning.
Because Kerry would will get 8 million a year on the Closers market even if it’s for 2 years. Would you pay a setup man 16 million for 2 years. And would he accept a set-up role. He is looking to get a short term Closers contract, hope he stays healthy and pitches great for 2 years and then land a 3-4 year deal at 15-16 mil per. He will never see that as a set-up man.
That is why he won’t be signed as a Set-up guy.
Personally I’d want Wood over Fuentes. You can have him at a 2 year deal, and he has the make-up and stuff to be GREAT. Not just effective, GREAT. Like come out of the bullpen, throw 15 pitches and get 3k, day in and day out GREAT!
Between Wood and Fuentes, easily Wood. However, there is a chance that Wood if left out to dry would sign a short term setup contract. Not much of one but a small chance. I still see him going to Texas 2/20.
for all those ppl who want juan cruz how quickly we forget this guy 3 years ago had a 7.30 ERA while pitching for the A’s.. then he went to atlanta and didn’t make the playoff roster, he got to arizona and last year was his best year on a contract year, and even though he struck out 71 in 51 innings, he also gave up 32 WALKS!! ppl, this guy is not worth the risk, i rather have huston street.. guys, juan cruz will be murder here in ny once he feels the presure like he did in chicago when he was garbage, that goes to show that from year to year relief pitching is more of a scrapped shoot, u never know about relievers.. DO NOT SIGNED CRUZ because no set up man should be consider type A free agent, i rather pay woods more money than juan cruz..
Yeah you know who also was like this. J.C. Romero. Except Romero is older, and bounced around to 4 teams in 3 years. Cruz has better stuff. A better FastBall and for the last 3 years has had his numbers get better and better.
So yeah i want him.
Street’s SO have went down and walks went up. However, is he better than Cruz? Maybe. Problem still is what price will Street cost us in prospects? If it’s Heilman, Sanchez and Evans? Sure. If it cost Niese, Fmart, Murphy or even Parnell? No.
I don’t think Omar would give them (neise, Fmart, Murphy, or Parnell)up for a rental set-up man. But it is Omar, and he Whiffed in the past so it’s possible.
If the Mets could Move Heilman, Sanchez and Evans for Street that would be awesome. I actually would like to hold Sanchez. He pitched for a full year, came out healthy and will hopefully have full confidence heading into this year. Maybe after a year and a half of surgeries and setbacks he can return to a very effective bullpen arm.
I’d rather give them Heilman, Show, Feliciano and Evans. Completely rebuild the Rockies bullpen with this move..(Sarcasm) At least they can get lefties out…. Hopefully the Rockies would never face a right handed bat.
But that’s not going to happen. They would want Sanchez because he is cheap and under control. Actually I could see them taking Heilman, Kunz and Evans. That’s a decent deal. Kunz and his sinker could do well in Coors and Evans could take Helton’s spot when he gets injured on day 2. Heilman, I have no idea why the Rockies think he can be a starter in the Homerdome.
but cruz is a type A free agent, wouldn’t you rather have k-rod and let’s say: woods, sheets, cc, manny, teixeira than juan cruz?
Really, you are going to judge Cruz on what he did a couple years ago?? You could say the same about Pelf or Maine and many relievers with that reasoning. Fact is that Cruz has 2 solid seasons since then. Its not like he will cost 10 million or more a year and he isnt injury prone like Wood. You pay Cruz as a setup man that he is. 4 or 5 million/yr Signing a type A is irrelevant as we can sign 3 type A this year.
We can actually sign 5 or more based on MLBtraderumors. Not that we would.
Plus we need some velocity guys in the bullpen for a change. We had too many 88-91 mph relievers last year and it killed us. Look at it this way, with Cruz setting up, he would be a totally different look before KRod comes in. Krod relies on his changeup now, as opposed to hitters seeing a fastball from Cruz the inning before. We need some power guys in the bullpen!!
doesn’t heilmann throw at like 95? parnell 96? what happened to those guys then..
If you are K-Rod, why not take a one year deal and go back in the market next year when there isn’t a surplus of closers and you can demand more money?
they’re trying to get paid now.. i doubt he will go for that amount of year when he can get 40 to 50 millions guarantee..
The issue here is not how many years we give a guy, it is that no one on this planet or any other knows which of these pitchers will be the most effective and most healthy. A team like the NY Mets can just absorb that 4th year like they are doing with Wagner if they have to. The most important thing is to get a REAL closer who won’t choke and will give the opposition a true wall that they will hit at the end of the game – shorten the game for us and give our entire team more confidence and a better opportunity to win. I will say one thing – I think, since nobody knows weather Jenks, Putz, K-ROD or Fuentes will be the best over the next several years, the key to me is to get Beimel. No guarantees that he will be fine either, but I have a good feeling about him – better yet get Beimel, Juan Cruz and one of the above, so that if Mr. One of the Above fails miserably, maybe one of those other two guys can step in, hopefully at more of a bargain price, and be our closer.
Sign K-Rod to a 4 year 44 million deal
Sign Mark Teixeira to a 7 year 150 million deal
Trade Delgado, Evans and Heilman to TB for Andy Sonnanstine or Edwin Jackson
Resign Ollie for 4 years 40mil.
Sign Juan Cruz or Joe Beimel to a 3 year 15mil deal
Trade minor leaguers and maybe a RP like Sanchez or Show for Bengie Molina
Lineup
1. Reyes
2. Murphy (LF)
3. Wright
4. Teixeira
5. Beltran
6. Church
7. Molina
8. Castillo
Starting Pitchers
1. Santana
2. Pelf
3. Maine
4. Perez
5. Sonnanstine/ Jackson
Relief
Closer- K-Rod
SU- Cruz or Beimel
K-Rod= +11 mil
Teixeira= +21 mil
Delgado & Heilman for Jackson/Sonnanstine= – 13 mil
Perez= 10 mil
Minor players and Shoenweiss for Molina= + 3 mil
Thats adding 32 million to the payroll. Not including losing Alou’s, el duque and pedro’s contract. Thats not adding that much salary. But it is making the team so much better.
the thing is is that they dont want to add 32 mil to the payroll…they want to keep it low.
This from Ed Coleman on the WFAN website (I hope it’s ok to copy and paste this):
“I would lean toward Kerry Wood. I know you can’t – not after the myriad of injuries and arm woes that he has suffered throughout his career. But no one was throwing the ball better at the end of the year than Wood (well, maybe Brad Lidge). He seemed to keep getting stronger. Yes, he did blow 6 saves – K-Rod blew 7. Wood gave up just 54 hits in 66 innings – and actually K-Rod was better – the same amount of hits in 68 innings pitched. But the strikeout-to-walk ratio was an eye-opener – Wood had 84 K’s and just 18 walks – Rodriguez, using his changeup more, registered 77 strikeouts with 34 walks. Look, 62 saves in a season is nothing to sneeze at – neither is an average of 48 1/2 saves over the last 4 seasons.
The Mets have fundamental reservations on both these guys – as they do with Brian Fuentes as well – but maybe Fuentes provides a solid middle ground to walk on. He made half of what K-Rod made in salary in 2008, so he fits more economically in the three year window that the Mets would prefer to deal in. Fuentes is 33 – 7 years older than Rodriguez – but he had a very solid season, pitching to a 2.73 ERA in 67 games. He yielded just 47 hits in 63 innings – converted 30 of 34 save opportunities – and had a very impressive strikeout-to-walk ratio, almost 4-1 (82-22). His walks have decreased in each of the last four seasons, and over those 4 years, he’s averaged only 50 hits allowed in 66 innings. Pretty good.”
Closer is first up on the list, but what the Mets should be concentrating on after that is what the Cubs have already done – bring in some closer-types as 8th inning guys to shorten the game. Kevin Gregg was a great pickup for the Cubbies, albeit at the high price of Jose Ceda which really helps the Marlins as well. Gregg blew 9 saves, had knee problems, is really not a closer, but I think will flourish in a primary setup role for Carlos Marmol now that Wood is gone. Huston Street – now with Colorado after the Matt Holliday trade to Oakland – would be a great addition for the Mets in a similiar setup role. The Mets have to try and shorten the game while also changing the makeup and the style of their bullpen arms to avoid another repeat of 08 and 07 as well. Arizona free-agent reliever Juan Cruz is another arm the Mets should keep an eye on.”
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