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According to the Boston Globe, the Phillies have made an offer to free-agent RHP Derek Lowe.
The report believes a second team also made an offer, and it is not the Red Sox or Yankees.
Last month, at SI.com, Jon Heyman listed the Mets, Red Sox, Yankees, Phillies, Braves, Giants, M’s and Dodgers have interest in Lowe.
In Newsday, Ken Davidoff actually characterizes the Mets and Yankees interest in Lowe as, ‘great.’
However, last week in the Daily News, John Harper said the Mets do not expect to out-bid the Sox and Yankees for Lowe, ‘and they think Scott Boras will price Oliver Perez too high as well.’
…as i wrote last week, the way i understand it, lowe is more concerned with the dollar amount than the years…he is far more likely to accept a four-year, $70 million deal, than he is to accept a five– or six-year deal worth less per season…the buzz around lowe suggests he would like to retire at or around his 40th birthday, and would prefer to sign with a team who has a spring training facility near his home in Florida…
Instead, Harper reports the Mets have interest in free-agent Jon Garland, and trading for a fifth starter to compete for Jon Niese in spring training.
Yesterday, the Daily News and Atlanta Journal-Constitution both reported Atlanta is preparing an offer for free-
agent RHP A.J. Burnett, worth roughly $80 million over five years.
The Blue Jays and Yankees are only willing to give an option on a fifth year for Burnett, reports Davidoff.
The Red Sox, Blue Jays, Yankees, Braves, Phillies and Orioles have all been linked in rumor to Burnett.
In a post to ESPN.com, Buster Olney believes the Braves may push hard, now, for Burnett, for fear that the Yankees will over-bid on him in the event do not sign CC Sabathia.
Speaking of Sabathia, the Giants are considering whether to offer him a contract worth more than $100 million, reports the Daily News, “but far less than the six years and $140 million the Yankees have offered.”
…Sabathia in San Francisco would give the Giants a rotation of Tim Lincecum, Barry Zito, Sabathia and Matt Cain, which is pretty nasty, to say the least…
…Update…1:10 pm…
According to the Atlanta Journal-Constitution, the Braves offer to Burnett is for four years, with a fifth-year option.
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Sabathia in San Francisco would give the Giants a rotation of Tim Lincecum, Barry Zito, Sabathia and Matt Cain, which is pretty nasty, to say the least…
Subtract Zito from that list and I agree…
Lincecum, Cain, and Sabathia would be an unbelievable front three. Too bad the Giants have absolutely nothing else.
If they sign sabathia, than Cain is on the trading block.
Really? I dunno, I think Cain’s pretty good, and still under control for a while too, if I’m not mistaken. He’s a hard luck pitcher if I ever saw one–seems to lose 2-1 games all the time.
Me too, buts thats according to the new york post, so i dont know how accurate that is. They can use Cail to seriously upgrade their offense.
Cain for Prince Fielder.
I imagine signing Sabathia would be why they’re trading Sanchez. Just having Lincecum and Sabathia would be nasty but it’s not going to make a big difference for a team with so many other holes.
Like i said below, if they can sign sabathia, and trade cain or sanchez for some offense, theres no reason they cant compete in the NL west. Especially if the dodgers lose manny.
I’d disagree. If the offense they get back for Cain is anything like the offense they’re expected to get back for Sanchez, Jorge Cantu. Then I think they’ll be lucky to come in third. Who else is filling out their rotation after number 1 and number 2?
The padres, are rebuilding as they trade away everyone. the rockies lost there team with the trade of holliday. and of the dodgers lose manny than Cantu would help the team compete.
Why would they be lucky to come in third?
what makes you think the rockies, padres, dodgers will finish ahead of them?
Besides, i think Cain would net them a better option that Sanchez will.
Because even without Manny the Dodgers are a better team top to bottom, especially if they can bring back Lowe, and their young talent continues to improve. And did I miss the D-backs moving out of the West? They’re also much younger, with a lot of upside, and already have a stable front end of the rotation.
If you look at the three teams, the dodgers, d-backs, and giants position by position, even if they add sabathia I just don’t see anyway you could see them being better than either team, especially since both teams are likely going to be making additions themselves. They just have too many problems, and as good as Cain is there’s no way they fill enough holes by moving him. Especially with the types of deals that have been rumored.
I dont know, i see the dbacks as over acheivers last year. They started the year red hot and finished only 2 games over .500. I cant really count on all those young guys having the same year this year.
Why would you expect young high upside players to decline?
Pitching wins games. They would have the best rotation in the division, and a really good bullpen. All im saying is anything is possible.
How would they have the best rotation? Who do they have after their front 2? Even if the Dodgers don’t manage to bring Lowe back they’d have a much better top 3, and young players they could expect to step into the rotation. Same with the D-backs. You’re saying pitching wins games but expecting them to trade away two awesome young pitchers and somehow get better.
No not 2, they would trade trade both sanchez and Cain, im saying one of the other.
Sabathia, Lincecum, Cain (Sanchez)
Then there’s no way they get enough offense. The dodgers and d-backs rotations would still be nearly as good and they’d have much better offenses, as-suming the dodgers front office doesn’t mess it up somehow by moving Martin to third or trading Kemp or Either to make room for Jones/Pierre.
I don’t understand the Giants at all. You would think they would be trying to get rid of the huge contracts they have and rebuild, not handing out more huge contracts.
and they signed Renteria for 2yrs at 18.5m
Boy and from the looks of it, it seems Giants fans think they are going to contend now that Renteria has signed. Even with CC, where is the offense coming from? Molina can’t be in there everyday and Rowand isn’t that type of hitter. They need a solid run producer. Even if Renteria has a breakout year for the Giants, who’s going to drive him in?
They play in a really bad division. Anyhting is possible in the NL West. If the dodgers lose manny, then you can;t really say they are better than the giants.
No but still, Giants have one of the worst offenses I have ever seen. They still need a bat or two unless they go after Adam Dunn and throw the rest of their money at Sabathia.
If they sign sabathia, they would use cain or sanchez and trade chips for offense.
Yeah but based on the deals they’ve mad in the past. I doubt they get nearly enough value, or offense, for either of them.
At least they are trying to put together a winning team. gotta give em credit.
Two words, Gina: Brian. Sabean.
Reports are that Atlanta has made an offer to Burnett but it is four years with a 5th year option….
From MLBTradeRumors.
Garland is not a #2 SP, maybe the Mets could get sheets, i havent really seen anything about him but he can pitch and on a 1-3 year deal he might be worth the risk
sheets is very interesting on a short term deal
He’s interesting but if we bring him in we’d need to bring in more decent starting arms because of the high injury risk. \
Isnt that what niese is for. Insurance as a 5th starter.?
He’s insurance. He’s just not very good insurance. Plus Sheets only fills one hole. In theory you’d be looking at something like Santana, Sheets, Pelfrey Maine, then maybe a Garland or a Wolf, preferably Wolf since he’s much better than Garland. Sheets goes down and now you’re looking at Santana, Pelfrey, Maine, Garland/Wolf and Niese. Not exactly a frightening rotation.
by the time sheets gets hurt… hopefully niese will be ready… I know Lowe seems solid, but something bout him worries me
Putrifying. Start acting like a big market team, Freddie, instead of scavaging for the Randy Wolfes and John Garlands of the world. No reason we can’t be in on Burnett or Sabathia. I’m done.
bye. we will miss you around here!
sabathia is not worth it and burnett is not that good.
it isnt how much you spend but who you spend it on.
I want the Mets to sign the big name guys but just giving out bad contracts doesnt do any good.
The Mets have to sign Manny, K-Rod and a #2 SP if they wish to compete with the phillies…
“The Mets have to sign Manny, K-Rod and a #2 SP if they wish to compete with the phillies…
are you serious??
haven’t you see what day the phillies clinch the last 2 years??…
Stop. This is silly. “Become the Yankees!!” “Buy us a title!!”
Not only does that rarely work, it’s becoming harder as teams lock up players.
Incidentally, if Moyer is a free agent, how about a one year deal as a flyer?
Moyer wants a multiyear deal.
SInce Burnett has expressed that he really doesn’t want to pitch for the Mets I think that makes it a little hard to sign him.
So far Gregg, Olsen, Hampton, Vazquez, Brocail, Miller, Howry, Affeldt, Nunez, and Ramirez have all been traded or signed. For a team in which pitching is their number one priority, are the Mets being aggressive enough. Sure some of those trades the Mets didn’t have the pieces for nor did they want some of the relievers signed. But just like Willie needed to get off to a fast start in 2008 doesn’t Omar this off-season. With at least 10 pitchers already on the move it’s hard to keep saying it’s early nothings really happening yet, the Giants pen certainly looks better. As the more pitchers are signed the higher the price goes because of the demand, Joe Biemel’s stock is already rumored to be going up as the other relievers of his quality are already gone
and im glad we didnt get any of them, maybe Gregg or Howry but thats it…
Its not the point, the point is the pitchers are going fast, the longer you wait the more your gonna have to pay.
If crap pitchers are getting top dollar, the top guys are going to sit and wait, and demand huge dollars. No reason for either side to rush.
You can throw offers at guys like Burnett and Lowe but unless it is a blow them away kind of deal most the starters like Perez, Lowe, and Burnett are going to sit and wait for CC to set the market. Things really pick up in the offseason during the December winter meetings at which Omar has already set up meetings with at least KRod’s agent.. KRod isn’t doing anything without the Mets at least being involved since the market for closers is tight and the Mets are one of if the not the only team that can pay him what he wants.
I have a feeling the Phillies will end up signing Lowe. And we will end up with Oliver ( gonna overpay) and prob Garland.
While I think we need to add a #2 SP, I kinda am with Omar on this one. I don’t think there is a need to force ourselves into a bad contract, which 5 years for Burnett or Lowe would bring us. I think we should push for a solid 4 year deal with Lowe, but even then, The guy will be 39 and 40 the last half of that deal. That kinda scares me.
2 years ago, Barry Zito and the Mets were inseparable in every news outlet. But, the Mets stood firm and were not going to dish out a bad (record-at the time) contract to a #3 pitcher. And I’d say that turned out to be a very good decision. With Zito, we may not have gone so hard for Johan, and thank the good lord we got Johan.
My point is, There are not that many attractive pitchers out there that warrant big contracts (CC obviously, but I’m leaving him out of this) . I don’t see a need to bog us down the next few years, essentially being forced to swallow a bad contract.
I don’t think Burnett for 5 years is a good idea…I wish the Braves luck with that. Burnett’s two previous 200+ IP seasons have been followed up by injury, and 2008 was his third 200+ IP season, not to mention a career high.
Mets need a strong bullpen more than a starting rotation at this point. Jon Garland and Perez would do if the bullpen was strong and had depth to it. Maybe strong is too big of a word, more like stable and at least good enough to take on a heavy workload if a starter like Perez can’t go deep into the game.
It works both ways doesn’t it?
the years are a problem for guys like Lowe and Manny but the money is not. If the Mets dont want to give out more than 3 year deals thats fine just they are going to have to pay more during those times.
the arguments about becoming the Yankees make no sense. Derek Jeter has more playoff appearences than the entire Mets franchise.
The Mets have only made the playoffs 7 times in their history. 7 times. i rest my case
I think I missed the part where you made a case.
that we shouldnt spend money like the Yankees. we need to get the best players not settle for guys like John Garland b/c we refused to spend an extra 2 mil a year
And where has spending all that money gotten the Yankees in the last 8 seasons.
When they won 4 in 5 years, they had partial home Grown talent (Jeter, Bernie, Pettitte, Mo). they had key guys that participated and were valuable guys ( Lfer, Catcher, O’Neil, Tino)
They didn’t have a team full of superstars. Their Starting Rotation wasn’t even spectacular:
Pettitte (21 wins)
Jimmy Key (12)
David Cone
Kenny Rodgers
Ramiro Mendoza
Scott Kamieniecki
Their Lineup was just filled with solid hitters top to bottom,
C Joe Girardi
1B *Tino Martinez
2B Mariano Duncan
3B *Wade Boggs
SS Derek Jeter
LF Gerald Williams
CF #Bernie Williams
RF *Paul O’Neill
DH #Ruben Sierra
Jim Leyritz
*Darryl Strawberry
#Tim Raines
Cecil Fielder
Luis Sojo
Please,don’t say BE LIKE THE YANKEES. When the Mets are trying to be like the YANKEES who actually won!
There is so much trash being thrown around, I simply do not know what to believe anymore. Whatever happens, happens.
I think the Phillies will sign Lowe and the Yankees will sign Sabathia and Oliver Perez…
bet my money that if the phillies sign lowe, we will sign MANUEL RAMIREZ #24….
Jon Garland is a 5th starter.
And probably a worse option than other 5th starters on the market who will cost the same or less. Wolf for example.
Gina why do you want Wolf so bad. he is always hurt and when he is healthy he isn’t good. The only thing he has going for him is he is a Lefty?
Jon Garland’s AL stats are almost Identical to the stats Lowe put up in the AL. Why wouldn’t Garlands numbers in the NL be similar to what Lowe did.
I don’t see anything that blows me away about Wolf. he pitched in the NL east with Philly and was terrible.
Basically their almost equal but Wolf misses way more bats. Garland’s numbers are going to fluctuate a lot depending on the defense behind him and and right now we have a lot of question marks in that sense, how does Church come back who’s in left, and we know the right side of the infield is likely to be terrible defensively. And since we have no idea how citi is going to play, the pictures definitely make it look like it’s going to be a hitters park, a pitcher that pitches to contact, like Garland does, is going to be a much bigger risk. The only thing that might be better about Garland and he induces more ground balls, but like I said right now we know almost for sure half of our infield is going to be a defensive black hole.
Yes but wouldn’t you want a pitcher you know won’t get injured like Wolf does every year. Go look at it. Every season he gets hurt dating back 2003.
That’s why i was wondering why people wanted him. Also if you look at Garland’s stats over the last 5 seasons, his numbers Mirror that of Derek Lowe in the AL. So why wouldn’t his numbers dip to a 3.8 ERA and a 1.2 whip like Lowe’s did when he goes to the NL?
My rational is if we are going to take a pitcher with an injury history, it better be sheets or burnett or someone with DOMINATE stuff. not a middle of the road, back of the rotation guy. I would rather those guys be able to get 32 starts and 190-200+ innings.
I am not interested in overpriced starters. No thanks for CC. No thanks for Lowe. No thanks for Burnett.
I’d like to see us touch base with Sheets. Maybe get him on a two year deal. Then try to get another young/cheap/upside #5 starter. Like I was mentioning in another thread, I’d like the Mets to take a shot at Edwin Jackson. Also, I really hope the Mets resign Perez. We need another LHP. And say what you want about the guy, he is young, he is talented, he is durable, and he is left handed. What else do you want out of a 26 year old #3? I’d be excited if we started the season with this rotation.
Santana
Sheets
Perez
Pelfrey
Maine
Jackson/Neise
Yes, that’s 6+ starting pitchers. But this way Neise can enjoy himself in the minors a little while longer, and Maine or Jackson could work out of the pen. Maine can’t seem to go an entire season healthy, and I could picture Jackson being filthy out of the pen. Besides, one of our starters is going to get hurt, it’s nice to have some insurance. Imagine those horses in the postseason too.
And for all those Manny Ramirez supporters and people looking for a new LF bat. I’ll tell you who we should want in left.
Barry Bonds, at the league minimum.
I am ignoring the last part.
However, I will tell you what I could expect out of a #3 starter. Someone who could make it past 6 innings now and then. The guy kills our pen. He’s no where near a #3 starter right now. And as for Maine “Who can’t seem to stay healthy” He pitched more innings than Perez did in 2007.
Perez is only 26. Give the guy a break. All Perez needs to work on is his control. You don’t think Perez is a #3? You’re crazy. Perez is one of the top ten lefties in baseball – argueably one of the top 5. In no particular order, and completely off the top of my head. The list reads as such”
Johan
CC
Hamels
Kazmir
Lester
Liriano
Perez
Danks
Bedard -who knows
Big Unit?
Perez is absolutely worth 4/60 – 5/70.
I think you’re crazy. Perez has a limited repertoire, walks way too many batters, and for some reason people think he throws for way more velocity than he does, the only saving grace for him is his arm angle gives him ridiculous splits against lefties. He is not worth 15 million dollars in any market.
LOL you go right on believing that. I just can’t see how a guy that averages 5.5 innings per start can be considered dominant.
I know you didn’t say any of these pitchers were dominant, I’m just throwing these numbers (from 2008) out for comparison:
perez–5.71 ips
wolf–5.76 ips
e. jackson–5.91 ips
sonnanstine–6.04 ips
garland–6.14 ips
lowe–6.21 ips
vazquez (for comparison)–6.31
sheets–6.40 ips
I’m no sabermatrician, nor am I really good at math (or most other things) so I (perhaps erroneously) converted thirds of an inning to .3 and .6 when I divded innings by starts (jackson was the only one who pitched in relief).
I think it is pretty amazing how much sheets pitched last year, but I guess its when you pitch as well–el duque ‘06. and I think it’s how you pitch too.
Somebody midseason posted this really interesting comparison between Maine and Perez. Ollie’s ips are probably lower b/c he implodes early sometimes, far earlier than probably these other guys. I wonder how his ips would compare with the others if you took out their 3 shortest starts of the season?
I have little to no doubt if you took out their three lowest starts Ollie’s IP would jump way ahead of Maine’s. The problem is Ollie, at least IMO, is never going to be a type of pitcher who doesn’t have those implosions. Just because of his focus issues, and the huge split against righties and lefties, pitching him against right handed heavy line-ups is just asking the bullpen to take on 4 or more innings. But I don’t think the IPs between him and Maine means Ollie is worth the money, I think it means we shouldn’t go into the season counting heavily on Maine to be a #3 guy.
I completely agree with you. If the find a 2 (or 3, depending how high you are on Pelf), then Maine slots at four and you have many more options at 5. What if they can’t get a true 2? Do you gamble on Ollie?
The thing with Ollie is are you willing to take on an average pitcher (ok, i know that’s debatable) whose range of starts is far wider than a comparable pitcher–say Wolf–whose going to give you more consistency start to start. Ollie will throw out complete game shutout against a lefthanded lineup, then pitch 2 and 2/3 with 3er (but 7 runs total b/c of the error he made out of fear/frustration) walking every righty he faced, whereas Wolf will give you 2 consecutive starts of 6 innings, 3 runs in one, 4 in the other.
I don’t know which I’d rather have over the course of the season– I guess whichever is cheaper. In the playoffs though, I can’t say I’d feel comfortable with a guy who you know is borderline for a quality start. Of course, he probably wouldn’t be pitching if you are a 1-3 of any worth.
Guys considering the market I am 100% on the idea of
Sign Tex +20
Trade Delgado for a #5 pitcher-12
Sign Wood +10
Sign Wolf +8
Trade for Putz or Street + 3/6 million
Sign Rivera +6?
Sign Guardado +2
That’s around the 42-45 million that we had available to spend at the begining of the offseason.
Reyes, Beltran, Wright, Tex, Church, Rivera/Murphy, Schnieder/Castro, Castillo.
Wood
Street/Putz
Guardado
Smith
Feliciano/Show
Stokes
Sanchez/Parnell
Johan, Pelfrey, Wolf, Maine, Delgado trade, Niese.
Which 5th starter from which team are you getting for Carlos Delgado… and what makes you believe they will pick up his $12M price tage.
Why are people so sure that a 37-year old 1B/DH making $12M can be dealt… and especially for a 5th starter!?!?!?
hsi numbers from last year, and his actually reasonable salary on a 1 year contract.
Why should Dye cost anything more than a 3rd tier prospect than? Same price tag, same age 9or so), 1 year contract. And Delgado put up bigger power numbers.
Mght not get you Peavy, but it can get some useful parts from the right team.
I like it all. Some tweaks: take street. I like Putz more as a pitcher, but street should come cheaper (talent wise).
not sure about Rivera, but for a low cost (prospect) worth a flyer. Good platoon partner for murphy?
I still want to see a change at 2nd base (but can live with Castillo), and really want to see a younger catcher come along too (maybe for Delgado) to at least share time.
But, I could live with that line up.
and the 5th starter may not come from Delgado. Could be a prospect trade, with Delgado bringing backt he prospects.
But, I like your team.
TRS, correct me if I’m wrong, but I don’t think you’re taking into account the salary of the #5 starter we get back for Delgado?
NO thanks on that rotation. it’s Worse off then last seasons. Wolf never mskes 30 starts, and in the last 5 years has made 20 starts TWO times. TWO.
I’d much rather have Garland and Perez.
I don’t know what this love affair with injury prone players who had one good year last is.
Milton bradley
Wolf
Furcal
And then when they get here we all cheer and cry when they are INJURED!!!
The linup is great. And i want the delgado trade to happen.
What about the Mets deal Heilman, Nick Evans, and Eddie Kunz for Ian Snell and John Grabow?
No offense, but the Pirates would laugh us off the phone.
But would they for just Snell?
How much value do you think those players have? For a guy that every Met fan wants to dump ASAP, there seems to be an significant overstatement of Heilman’s value in a trade. Eddie Kunz is a bullpen arm. There are about 10,000 of them in the minor leagues. And Nick Evans is a nice kid and may have a future, but he’s hardly a top prospect.
Snell didn’t have a great year last year, but he’s only 27 and one year removed from a 116 ERA+ and an almost 3-to-1 K-BB ratio.
The guy had a 6.00 ERA last year.
But the pirates new front office is pretty progressive thinking and aren’t likely to look at just ERA, or sell low on a guy like Snell.
Most likely right. But is Heilman, Evans, Parnell really selling low?
Yes. Heilman will be arbitration eligible soon so for the pirates they’d basically be getting a future middle reliever and a player that profiles as likely a fourth outfielder.
I like Snell because he has above average stuff and has some moderate success in the major leagues – as has Heilman, so many of you are overlooking his 2005-2007. The real guy the Mets would be dealing for would be John Grabow who is a Free Agent next off season. He had terrific numbers across the board and apparantly the Bucs are trying to work out an extension for him. However if they don’t and they realize they could deal him then perhaps the Mets could swing a deal for him.
Of course the market for middle relief is being ridiculous so the Mets would not be alone in their pursuit of someone like that.
So you pay a little of Delgado’s contract. Not to mention that the Reds were willing to send Homer to the Sox for Dye and the Sox wanted more. If Dye can next 2 starter prospects, then Delgado can net a #5.
I still think the Rays would be interested if the price is right. Send them Delgado and what we would have paid in his buyout (4 million) for one of their extra starters. They get a big bat for 8 million and we get a #5 starter for 4 million this year and practically nothing for a few more years.
There’s a HUGE difference between a couple of prospects (especially one like Bailey who’s had big problems at the ML level) and a #5 starter. Dye is also 2 years younger, plays the OF and is RH… which makes him a more valuable commodity than Delgado.
How is RH more of a commodity than LH? Teams need LH bats too.
And yes Dye is younger but in the AL with DH age and postion for guys like Dye and Delgado are not as big of a deal.
Think the Yankee’s would not want Delgado? The O’s? There are plenty of teams out there that would want Delgado.
Why would being right handed make him a more valuable comodity?
Because there are signifcantly more LH sluggers out there than RH sluggers. You find more LH sluggers because they have more success against RHP and there are more RHP than LHP. That’s just how baseball is.
I’m not saying every RH slugger is more valuable than a LH slugger. I’m just saying that being a RH slugger is a commodity. LH sluggers are a dime a dozen.
So because there are more RH pitchers there are more LH sluggers? But because there are fewer LH pitchers there are less RH sluggers?
Got it.
Is this actually true? They’re may be a higher percentage of left handed sluggers relative to the total number of left handers, but I’d imagine overall it’s even since there’s so many more right handed batters. Plus I’m pretty sure there’s like a 3:1 ratio, not exactly but around that area, of right handed pitchers to left handed pitchers in the bigs so wouldn’t that still make being left handed more valuable. When over 70% of the pitchers you’ll face are going to be right handed?
I think the Rays would be interested if they can’t get better, but I’d be shocked if no team offered them something better than just Delgado. Not to mention for basically the same cost they could bring in Dunn to be a longer term answer at DH. I just don’t see it being very likely that they couldn’t find a better solution than trading one of the starters to us for Delgado.
Also the Reds are crazy. This is a team that started Corey Patterson for most of the year. I’m not sure they’re the best example of an average front office’s thought process.
Maybe if the Mets picked up at least $8M in salary. But that kinda defeats the purpose of trading Delgado since it’s all about salary relief.
The Rays didn’t even bring back Cliff Floyd at $2.75M. They’re certainly not spending more than $4M on Delgado.
I disagree but what does that matter? They are not reuping Floyd because he can’t really produce anymore.
And Gina they would not want Dunn because he would be locked in for multiple years at that price where Delgado would be one and done, possibly with picks after next year.
Well, I won’t hold my breath waiting for the first legitimate trade rumor involving Carlos Delgado.
If the Mets were serious about replacing him, they would have just declined his option.
No they wouldn’t have, his contract is valuable.
Why? You don’t think his value in trade is worth at least the 4 million buyout?
Declining his option would have been dumb. If they simply declined it, they would have had no choice but to get a first baseman or power hitting outfielder on top of the pitching they already need to get. Teams would have known this and would have had leverage. By picking up the option, they can trade him if an enticing offer comes up. If not, they keep him for 2009.
nope. They would have picked it up and traded him. Either way, they are rid of the salary, but doing it this way, they get some players back for him.
I like Garland but he does not replace Perez in terms of wins and such. Sign him as a No.4, fine but then they still a better pitcher like Lowe in order to upgrade the rotation.
Not if Lowe is going to cost 4/70. Stay far away.
matt, i like the picture of lowe in a ‘brooklyn’ jersey. thats a nice touch there haha
This is great.
The Yankees are going to spend all their money on pitching. I’m certain, the Mets will be on the Tex market, there’s no reason not to be. Their only real competition is the Angels who have to some holes to fill as well.
Money, Money, Money, Moneeey!
Sign Tex!
BTW, for those that have looked at the projected salaries I posted, do the projected salaries for Heilman, Sanchez and Feliciano seem way too high?
Have not made it over to look at your chart but I think there may be more to the Tex idea than we think. At least that’s my blind hope. I just don’t see the Yankee’s getting involved needing as much pitching as they do and the Sox are only Yankee protecting. Thus you are right, it looks like us and the Angles and if we would go 8 years 160 million it could get done. Best thing for us maybe if the Angles got CC and the Yankee’s then got Lowe and Burnett. That would free up Tex and keep Burnette and Lowe out of the NL East.
It’s over 13 million for those 3.
We don’t need top tier starters, just reliable starters. Then have options with Niese and another from a trade.
Team of closers, don’t care who, the price won’t be high.
Rivera for LF and Lopez for MI.
Most importantly, Tex.
True. A rotation of Santana (a #1) and 4 “#3s” is plenty good enough to win it all.
I don’t get real hung up on this pigeonholing stuff (whos a 1, 2 or 3). But I would guess that most posters feel that Santana is a 1, and would give Pelfrey and maine (as-suming his precudere gets him back in the groove) are at least 3s.
Well, if they could add 2 more guys roughly equivilant to pelf/maine (meaning 2 more #s), wouldn’t that make a nice rotation?
So say Sheets, giving him a 3 due to risk of missed starts. And even if you added a 5? maybe wolf? Is he a 3/4/5 on a 2 year deal?
Santana/maine/Pelf/Sheets and Wolf would be a kick A rotation IMO.
Just no Garland.
Best idea i’ve heard on here in a month and a half.
Sign 2 reliable starters who make 30 quality starts a year and 200 innings.
Trade and acquire a bullpen of Closer guys. Not specialists.
Sign Teixeria, trade Delgado. I’m even fine with a 85-15% Murphy/tatis LF
Tried to get mine in earlier. I want no part of Wolf.
Add him with Sheets you have 2 guys who will make 20 starts, and by mid september our rotation would look like
Johan,
Pelf,
Maine(if we are lucky his arm trouble was a one time thing)
Neise
Figgy
Yeah that’s what we want.
Garland is a perfect fit for this team. PERFECT!!! why not get him. So he doesn’t k a ton of guys. His numbers are pretty solid in the AL and he throws 32 starts 200 innings. What is wrong with him?
Oh yeah he’s 29. not 33 like an injury prone Wolf
If Omar lets the phillies swoop in and sign lowe without making it competitive he should be fired im sorry but when a team that just won the World Series is linked to more players than a big market team with alot of holes there is something very wrong.
So IF the Phillies offered 4/70 like Matt said, we should offer 5/85? 4/80? Come on. This is just silly. Just because someone else is going to make a stupid deal does not mean we need to keep them from doing it.
4/70 isnt that unreasonable. And Im sure if Philly signed Lowe to that deal your first reaction wouldn’t be “im happy they made a stupid deal and not us” it would probably be more like “i sure hope we can win the wild card next year”.
Why should the Mets do this. this killed the yankees over the last 8 years. Saying oooo the Sox are in on this guy and close lets throw an extra 10 million and get it done. HELLOOOOOO Pavano, Igawa, old atlanta pitcher, 10 other guys.
you dont have to throw 10 extra million but get in the mix, and igawa wasnt a target of the sox the yankees got him because the red sox got dice K. so basically if the phillies get lowe and we get freddy garcia that would be more on par with that analogy.
How do you know they are not in the mix? Just because it has not been reported? Just because the Phillies offered Lowe a contract that means nothing. What you think Lowe is going to sign tomorrow? You don’t think he is going to wait for offers from the Yanks and Sox’s? Lowe won’t be signing a contract any time so just relax. What is wrong with on some of these free agents the Mets wait and see what they are offered first and counter offer if they wish to? I mean I swear calm down.
Over/under for how many times this offseason Matt will use the phrases “From what I understand” or “From what I gather” in a blog entry? I’d say 100
it’s probably in direct relationship to the number of people who accuse him of making rediculous claims when he is simply relaying information from other sources.
c-y-a
I don’t really want Manny but IF the Dodgers are really no longer interested and the Phillies are after a SP then who can sign him? The Angles? Then Tex is more open. I think this is why Omar is being so patient. There are more big names than there are big market teams.
I really hope you’re right about omar just being patient. And I’ll be the first to say you were if we land some kind of big time player.
Not related but, I don’t think we’ll see Evans or Murphy on the 25 man roster unless we trade someone.
We currently have Castro, Tatis, Chavez, and Anderson signed for 09. None play middle infield. My choice would be Felipe Lopez. As you can see, though, there is no room for Evans or Tatis if we bring in a LF, which I hope will be Juan Rivera.
meant “Evans or Murphy”
I’m fine with that. I would love for Murphy to be able to spend the year in Buffalo at 2nd.
I expect the bench guys to shuffle Case. I think marlon will get cut along the way to make room.
Not sure what happens to Murphy if they get a FT LF guy, keep Delgado and can’t unload Luis. Tough choice between putting him in AAA to work on 1 position (hopefully 2B!) or keeping him up as a super sub.
More likely, if he isn’t moved, is he is platooning in LF with someone. COuld be Rivera. or tatis. Or evans I guess.
I wouldn’t mind Evans on the bench as a RH bat that will get time in the OF and at 1B. Unless they get Tex, then I don’t want to see him there!
As-suming they keep Delgado, I don’t expect comparable output to last year, and would be shocked if he plays close to 160 games again, so make sure to have a viable 1B available to fill in.
I do hope the bench gets rebuilt, but I don’t want young guys sitting on it would they could be playing every day in the minors.
Tatis, Anderson and Evans are redundant. I’d keep Tatis on the bench, trade or DFA Anderson and keep Evans in AAA.
depends on what they do with LF. Do they get a FT guy like Dye? Play Murphy everyday (not a bad idea)? Platoon him again?
If platoon, then Evans or Tatis (of the current options) will be playing regularly (sort of) and there is room for both.
I agree that Anderson needs to be sent bye bye. Also will be interesting to see how Endy fits in. Especially if Pagan comes back and looks like a worthwhile option. Could endy be traded for something worthwhile?
I really can’t think of a reason to keep Anderson.
Forgot about Pagan. He has options though.
If you are fielding a team of full time regulars that play every day (reyes, wright, beltran) and only need an occasional day off, then the young guys rot.
But if you have a couple of platoons or positions where they need more frequent rest (old farts) or want to play match up, then younger guys should get plenty of PT.
It also depneds on who the vets are. I would rather have Evans than Julio Franco!
I really had high hopes that omar was going to do some real moving and shaking this year, and really make over the look of this team.
Now, I can’t decide if he is laying back, waiting with the onslaught of changes, or if very little (other than a few new pen parts, and maybe a FA SP) is going to happen?
Yeah, the team should be good enough in 2009 to compete for the title with a few relatviley minor changes (OK, 4 new guys inthe pen!), but I really think he has a window this year to act boldly and stabalize the team for a sustained tun of success.
Signing tex for 7 years? Probably a good move, like when he got beltran. Work everything off of that.
1 signing and he could have a team with 4 all star core offenseive players for the next 3+ years locked up. All hitting or in their primes.
a couple of smart fillin moves with up and comers and role guys (like Church) and plenty of O and D to go around.
Even the rotation has 3 solid guys locked in. Get at least one more solid guy now, and look to break in a rookie as needed (when ready).
Then just work on the pen.
thats my plan. IMO, better than signing a closer and a 36 YO overpaid SP, and keeping all the old guys like Delgado and Castillo. Or signing dreck like Garland.
I’m not a big fan of Garland, but he would certainly benefit from a move to the NL, he is only 29 and can probably be had on a 3 year deal. His ERA would probably be below 4.00, pitch 200 innings and manage 15 wins….he doesn’t walk many, which is nice…..walks killed the Mets last year.
Santana
Garland
Pelfrey
Maine
Niese
Improvement, but another move would be necessary
He doesn’t walk many but he gives up a lot of hits.
Since he was facing a DH rather than a pitcher, that makes sense….like I said, I don’t love him, but considering his age, his injury free seasons, his playoff experience and bing a type B free agent, I’ll take him….
Hard to be a met fan,
I’m 100% with you. Jon Garland’s statistics are right on with what Derek Lowe did in Boston, Right up to their best seasons 2002 for lowe and 2005 for garland. Their Whips, K’s, ERA, starts, innings. All right on the same plane.
Why wouldn’t he become what Derek Lowe was 32 moving to the NL.
Nobody is saying Garland is the Answer. But he would be a great piece, and a great rotation addition….. Especially if Gimpy isn’t playing 2nd.
I’m also wondering if some of those hits he gives up would be vacuumed up by a pretty good Mets’ defense.
I like Garland as the FA Starter signed……….I really think they just need innings pitched and a work horse………..they have the stuff with Santana and Pelffrey then add Maine, Garland, Niese and this a pretty good and relatively young staff
Of course the pen is the most important thing………I could see alot of deals to revamp it……………..I think Heilman, Scho, Sanchez have some value and other teams would be willing to make moves for them……change of scenery
I would LOVE Lowe but I think the Mets are spending their cash on K-Rod and maybe a Biemel………………Hopefully the Rockies will take Heilman,Scho for Street to setup
Garland is serviceable, if the contract is cheap (and short) enough. But, I want him (if he arrives) to be the last man in the rotation.
That is, get someone better too, and let Neise season inthe minors for another year.
vazquez would have been a good ST option.
Sheets would be real nice.
Or even Wolf. Would he do 2 years plus an option?
Santana/pelfrey/maine/Garland/Wolf doesn’t look too shabby. it could give some innings too. Neise (then Holt) waiting in the wings for emergencies.
Now, plug in Sheets instead of Garland and it looks even better!
i would take that rotation if the Mets can bring in Manny, K-Rod and Street but i’d prefer Penny over Wolf.
Reyes
Beltran
Manny
Delgado
Wright
Church
Murphy (2B)
Schneider
Fatstro
Daryle Ward
Eckstein
Tatis
Chavez
Santana
Pelfrey
Garland
Penny
Maine
Figueroa/Stokes
Sanchez
Feliciano
Smith
Cordero
Street
Rodriguez
I know it would cost the Mets a bit more than they planned but after 2 years of not making the playoffs we gotta spend more that 40 mil especially with this talent available. I don’t know if both Penny and Garland can be had but if not Pedro as the 5th starter i can live with b/c Pedro is the man.
and most important…no top prospects would be traded which is so much more important than money
any gm that gives burnett 4 or 5 years needs to have their head examined
Just raise prices across the board and go after CC.