|
|
|
Update, 6:27 am:
According to the Associated Press, the meeting between Boras and team executives will take place on Wednesday.
Original Post:
Andrew Marchand of 1050 ESPN Radio reports that 
Scott Boras will soon hold a face-to-face meeting with Mets executives to discuss free-agent pitchers Derek Lowe and Oliver Perez.
Boras is in New York City today as the Yankees introduce the signing of his client, first baseman Mark Teixeira.
Speaking of starting pitchers…
The Indians have signed free-agent starter Carl Pavano to a one-year deal, according to the Associated Press.
 |
 |
 |
RSS 2.0 Both comments and pings are currently closed.
get it done omar
Don’t forget to ask about Manny!!
Can we ask him to take Castillo as well? Maybe give him to Boras as a tip?
Tell him that we will give Lowe his $16 mill if he finds an outlet to dump Castillo….
Natasha will be there too, right?
Here comes the Omar “final offer” Take it or leave it Bora$$
Manny: 4 years $22.5 million per. Guaranteed. That offer would make him a Met. Then do everything in your power to make him happy. Put a personal bathroom out in left field for him. Whatever it takes.
LOL. Good one.
all indications are that the wilpons don’t want manny. period. forget 4 years (which as a manny proponent even i think is stupid). i don’t think ownership wants him for any years
Why not knock out a few birds with one stone?
Ask about every Boras client. Is Cora represented by Boras also?
If there were so many suitors for Lowe who were outbidding the Mets, why hasn’t he signed yet? This an old-fashioned game of chicken and Boras’ world is clearly being turned on its head because of this economy and what it’s doing to spending. If he doesn’t have the Yankees and Hank-enstein involved, Boras and his clients are not going to get the money they want – bottom line.
Boras clients never sign early. His not signing yet doesn’t there aren’t any other suitors. If Boras gets an offer, he’ll shop it around for a long time before having his client sign.
He’s difficult to read because his bluffs are the same as his non-bluffs.
The thing to do with him is to not get caught up in his frenzy and hype. He wins when he convinces a GM that they MUST have his client.
Sign moose and squirrel!
Moose would shore up the pen. Ever see that guy throw? He’s got this pitch called the “Split Antler Fastball”. It’s like Koufax’s curve and Ryan’s fastball in one pitch.
Don’t bother with squirrel. He’s always on the DL and his voice is too disruptive to a clubhouse.
He would make a good fielder though, with his ability to fly.
Plus I don’t know if Moose would sign without Squirrel, they are a package deal (like Dennis Rodman and Jack Haley).
Let’s go Omar! 3/42 with an attainable option will land him. Then we can move on to Abreu, another LOOGY, a bench infielder, and a 5th starter. I’d go to war after signing Lowe, Abreu, Shouse, Cora, and Redding.
I don’t understand why anyone wants either of Cora or Redding. Neither of them are any better than a AAAA player.
its mostly in name I think.
Hairston Jr and Cintron would be better options imo.
That wouldn’t be bad at all.
Look, I’m not going to knock Omar or the Mets if in fact Lowe is seeking for way more money than the market is bearing.
That said, I’d up the 3 year offer to $13M pe year with an easy to obtain 4th year. There.
Then I go to Boras and I say, “Manny. 2 years $48M. That our only offer. You have until Thursday to accept or we’re out and don’t call us unless it’s to say he’s accepting because we won’t counter this offer.”
im pretty sure are bullpen is set
ours you sures? :)
Why would anyone give lowe more money or more years when our offer has yet to be beat. Dare him to find another offer, then let him sign with that basement team going nowhere.
maybe so we can move on to other areas of need
i say for te love of all mets fans just land lowe but dont go overboard make it 14 mil with a attainable 4th year we got him then get a nice lefty reliever cheap and with all the money left over go for manny i kno we have money a solid 2 year deal for 38 to 40 million and he will definelty want to be in a championship club and the quicker it is done the harder it will be for scott to play his games
dude, you realize the dodgers’ initial offer was higher than that, right? why would he accept lower than that one, when he is obviously going to get higher???
Dodgers initial offer was 2/45
i know, and metswillwinitall said to offer him 2/38 or 2/40….my point exactly, if he is going to wind up getting more than the dodgers’ initial offer (which i’m guessing he will, whether it be years, or per year) why he would think its smart to offer less….
Sorry, I thought I read his other offer as 2/48. my bad
He said no to 12 per year. Why would we go to 14? What happened to 12.5 or 13? What happened to, show me a better offer and we’ll talk. Don’t go from 12 to 14 when there’s no evidence that he has any other offers. That’s bidding against yourself and exactly what Boras counts on. If another team offers Lowe 14, I promise you Boras will be at Omar’s door asking him to beat it.
the only way the mets get manny is if they miss on both perez/lowe which is very unlikely
or if we sign lowe and manny and go cheap on 5th starter, our payroll right now is around 120mil.
i think abreu is a real possibility after getting lowe/perez.
if we can get abreu on a 1 year 12 mil offer id probably do it
does anybody know what are payroll is at its maximum and hows it rank among other teams?
are =! our
Does anyone understand why Boras is such a C**k Su**er???
Why don’t you ask him yourself?
Um greed?
(See Bernard Madoff)
I don’t know why I’m laughing so hard.
What a great question :)
Boras at one time was a no field, no hit middle infielder in the Cardinals organization and obviously didn’t last long in organized ball. The amateur psychologist in me says he’s paying back the game of baseball for his failure to be recognized as the next major league superstar.
All I know is we are being cheap and worrying way too much about our payroll. We have a new stadium with many sold out luxury boxes and restaurants that will rake in cash bigtime. Not to mention the ticket prices will be double and we’re getting $20 mil a year from CITI. WTF? Cheap, cheap, cheap. We can easily afford to up payroll to $160 or so and still rake in a ton of cash.
shut up about the 20 million from citi, that will basically be the money to pay for the stadium and nothing more
how can you say that we can just up our payroll to 160?? where are you getting your info from? do you work for the organization, or are you related to the wilpons or something? We can all just speculate that payroll will be “around” last year, and as we dream on here, we can maybe add a little padding for our wish lists, but to just say, “hey they’re not upping payroll to 160, they’re cheap” is pretty ridiculous.
Sorry but I see a problem doubling/tripling ticket prices and keeping payroll level with last year, and I don’t care how bad the economy is (and it is horrible, the US will declare insolvency before Santana’s contract runs out and stop payment of p&i on treasuries)
Everyone is seriously overvaluing Lowe. I have always been a Lowe fan but to say we “need” him is a complete overstatement.
He posts a good ERA but remember that the guy has been pitching in the NL West. He pitched over 70 games against the Rockies, Padres, Giants, and Diamondbacks.
I bet a lot of the people who are desperate for this 36 year old were also some of the same people who were calling for Omar’s head for putting together such an old team. I get it: he’s durable. At that age a pitcher can break down at any moment without warning (see Pedro Martinez).
If “he’s pitching with a torn labrum” isn’t enough of a warning for you, I don’t know what is…
That was a warning that he would tear his rotator cuff 2 years later?
Watch Pavano have a real good yr for the Tribe
just give Lowe 14.5..meet in the middle and sign the freaking guy
let Ollie walk……just go with Niese as the 5th
Abreau will not get a big deal……….who needs a OF still?
but you’re saying to “just give him” more than OUR own offer, which until someone else makes one, does not make sense…if you were buying a house, and offered $400k for it, and no one else made an offer, but you got impatient, would you just for no reason, out bid yourself, and offer $425k?? No, you wouldnt, you would wait until another offer came in, then if you still wanted to you would counter, and meet on middle ground
anyone hear jc romero got banned 50 games for an illegal substance? hahah too damn bad
Hey Rocket, how do you know what the money goes for? Now you’re an authority on the inner financial workings of the Mets. With a username like that you must be a Jankee fan.
phillies should be stripped of their title!
Unless he’s willing to sign for like 5 million less please don’t pick Perez over Lowe.
Omar, don’t forget to bring your extra BS meter to the meeting …. you’re really going to need it.
Stand pat, Omar.
L.I.Mets, how is it ridiculous? If payroll was $143 last year and we have a new stadium now with way more luxury boxes and way higher ticket and concession prices it’s only logical that we can afford more. We can get Manny if we want him and we can afford it, but we’re being cheap as far as that goes.
The fans deserve a WS team after the past 3 seasons.
I’m sayig that for you to say it is ridiculous without knowing all of the details from inside the team as a company….Yes the tickets are more $$, but there’s also less of them, have you sat down, and actually figured out the #’s?? You’re saying that the concession prices are going to be higher, do you know how much a hot dog is going to cost at citi? have you done the math on how many less hot dogs are going to be sold due to their being less seats, and compared the 2 #’s??? That is all I am saying, unless you have access to all of that info, it is somewhat ridiculous for you to just a*s*s*ume that they can up the payroll by $20 MILLION…
Just because the Mets are lucky enough to be in a big market and have money doesn’t mean they should be irresponsible with it. With thousands of jobs being lost in NYC, and fan’s discretionary income going down, it doesn’t matter that the stadium’s new – any business person worth their salt wouldn’t lock themselves in to spending as if ticket sale revenue going up. I’m sure there are businesses that will choose to get rid of their luxury box, rather than lay a bunch of people off (though there are plenty that won’t).
Sure Citi Field will have fancier concessions, but I’d have to guess the Mets are giving a larger cut of the Shake Shack sales to Danny Meyer than they were giving to Aramark for those nasty chicken fingers. At the end of the day, this is a business. I’m sure the Wilpons want to win, but I’m also sure they want things under their control to turn profit – especially now.
Dude you must be listening to the fat man to much on the radio. How many times do you have to hear it? Getting Manny has nothing to do with money. THE WILPONS DO NOT WANT HIM HERE BECASUE OF HIS ATTITUDE. I am not saying I agree with them but that is why Manny is not coming to the Mets.
The Mets have used plenty of excuses in their time to hide the real reason – which of course is them not wanting to spend money.
This “Manny’s attitude” nonsense is just another one.
Because the Mets built a new stadium, that has luxery boxes and everything new….. They can just all of a sudden spend more money. How can you as$ume that. The mets like all businesses have an operating budget (this included minor leagues, spring training, coaches, players, trainers, stadium expenses, etc etc.). Some like the yankees like to pretend they don’t, those companies usually fold, or ask NYC for a 300 million dollar bail-out like the yankees did.
You can’t yell at the Mets for not spending money when they have been top 5 in payroll for the last 5 seasons.
Last season they were #1 in the NL, and #3 behind the Yankees and the Tigers (all that money spent worked out for them 3). Only 5of the teams in the top 12 made the playoffs.
So just go spend even more money, who cares if it’s not on the right things, just spend it because you got it. Don’t worry, you built a new stadium and added luxury boxes.
If you want to root for that and not root for a team and GM to make the right moves and sign guys at or below market value and not just go out and outspend people go root for the yankees. When they spent the money correctly and added the right players they won world series. When they just went out and over paid everyone they have won nothing.
I love how far off base we get in here…..Back to the original post, which is that boras plans on meeting with us face to face is quite interesting….with all of these other “teams” that are ahead of us on lowe, maybe a nice sit down will straighten some things out, like lowe, and maybe some other pieces to our puzzle…(i DOUBT manny, though)
haha I love the photo
I’m not saying we should just throw stupid money around like the Yankees do, but I think we can get Manny if we want to. I wouldn’t say to overbid by $20 mil for Lowe either, but maybe a liitle bit more and we can close the deal and move on to our other areas of need?
Boras on WFAN right now.
Rich Hill is out of minor league options for the Cubs. He’s most likely going to hit waivers. He’s 28 years old and a left-hander too. I never understood why Pinella just abandoned him, he looked like he had a promising future. Anyways, I’d gladly pick him up and work some Ollie Perez magic to get him back on track.
His hatred of Hill was he walked too many batters. But he was an up and comming star in 2007, started the year off stong as the #3 starter, then Lou threw him away after less then 20 innings
I’d pick him up. He can’t hurt. he has top end stuff. He was 11-7 in only his 2nd big league season in 2007. Under 4 ERA. 1.19 Whip .235 BAA in 195 innings. Then last year he got off to a slow start with a Whip of 1.58 and 18 walks in 20 innings and all of a sudden he’s on the scrap heap.
I mean in 2007 he had a 3-1 k/BB ratio. Almost a k per 9. He had real potential. Then Poof Lou hated him..
I say scoop him up, at least for competition for the 5th spot.
Agreed, Mark.
I think that we are currently still 20 below last years #…On that note, if lowe costs us 13 of it, that leaves us 7, for what, we still need a #5, and some kind of utility if, which will put us about even, or a hair over….do we still have the money to add, and make a manny run? maybe, I don’t know…are we keeping quiet on him and then jump on it at the end? perhaps, but I dont know…I find it VERY strange that we were very serious about ibanez, (even though omar says we are going with tatis/murphy in lf) but since then, we have heard not one word about us and another left fielder…(outside of speculation, of course) I just find that wierd, not sure if its a good wierd, or a bad wierd…
I find it strange that manny would want to come to NY. I know he will follow the money, because he always has, but he did say in boston he hated the scrutiny that every game was under. Does he think NY is much better. Wait until if somehow he is in NY he hits the homer, does his typical manny celebration what everyone will be saying. SHEESH jose reyes does some high 5’s and he gets destroyed for it. Joba celebrates like he won game 7 of the WS every time out and he gets killed.
they better discuss manny
Anyone hear what Boras just said? Something along the lines of: “What we hear as offers are different than what are reported to you guys” (I could be wrong and that was paraphrased) … doesn’t that sound like “I make up offers to gain leverage in negotiating”?
lol I doubt he would come out and say I make up offers if that is waht he does.
…I’m not saying that. I think he basically said that there’s a discrepancy between his internal talks with teams and what is reported, i.e. he provided a justification as to why (at times) there could be higher bidder without anyone really hearing about it. That does make sense, and I’m trying not to be cynical when it comes to Boras, but I heard that and thought “you’re bs’ing to gain leverage…”
I could be completely wrong, and I probably am, but I just don’t like him.
J.C. Romero, out with a 50 game suspension.
Woopee. Thats great news for the Mets
BREAKING NEWS:
METS OFFER MANNY A 3 YEAR 63 MILLIONS!!!!!!
huh?
Oh, wait.. i was dreaming.. sorry guys..
And then you woke up.
Alex, no laptop for you.
Why would you even do that?
lol, i’m sorry guys…
we all have to get over the manny idea…i have wanted manny since last year at the trade deadline..its not gonna happen…i wish it would but its not…because they are gay..and as for lowe…again like matt said..ill believe mets will get him when he puts on the uniform..
what does gay have to do with anything?
you werent here for my explanation of gay..to me gay means stupid..so in terms of the wilpons and having manny be on the open market…yes they are very gay(stupid)
Do I need to school you again on your comments? Huh, “enterkrod”!
lol..no of course not…
yeah i thought you were serious, I was checking mlbrumors and stuff….
BREAKING NEWS: Alex242 IS A HOMO!!!!
Why would any decent non latin player want to play for the Mets?
Because perhaps they’re not racist tools like you???
The Mets are the racists. Omar, the Carlos’s, Reyes, Castro, Castillo, Johan, K-Rod, and on and on. When is the last time we really went after a non latin player?
Denham can’t possibly be THAT dumb, could he?
J.J. Putz you imbecile
not to mention we are currently working on derek lowe….
Yea that was a sweet low ball offensive offer.
Why don’t you enlighten us?
So Ignorant.
yeah what is that supposed to mean?
Good point. We should totally ask Wright, Maine, Pelfrey, Stokes, Schneider, Church, Murphy,Evans, Niese and Parnell.
Moron.
Okay then let me put it this way, when is the last time we signed a free agent non latin player that was worth a crap?
Billy Wagner.
Why does the ethnicity matter to you?? As long as the players we get are the best available, their ethnicity shouldn’t matter…
good point….hey, if we were making a run at manny (the best hitter available, no questions asked, agreed?) that would be a problem for you??
You got me. I never much liked him though.
one more time….we are currently working on signing derek lowe….he doesnt look latino
Oh you mean like hall of famers, Mike Piazza and Tom Glavine just a few recent ones that come to mind.
But only latin players like the mets, and omar only likes latin players. even though he traded for church, putz, schneider, reed just to name a few.
yeah really, thats some pretty stupid stuff right there….
Wow people this days if u don’t like the fact that the mets bring in spainsh players then don’t be a fan of them
it was just such an out of left field (no pun intended) and stupid comment it was ridiculous….some people can be very dumb.
Denham,
You think the Mets offer was race related? How old are you?
I’m 32. I wasn’t trying to offend anyone. I didn’t use any words that I found to be offensive. I called the players “latin.” Frankly, I just feel like there is a perception around the league that we are really latin oriented and I don’t think other players want to sign here. I guess I am just frustrated.
Rockies acquired Jason Marquis for Vizcaino.
so we gave lowe a lowball offer because he is not latino is what you’re saying??? It has nothing to do with the fact that hes looking for 16, and we will probably meet him in the middle at like 14, right? Nothing to do with the proper way to handle a negotiation? You are a genius.
No. I’m saying that if there is a perception around the league that we favor latin players then it does not help our cause to give him an offensive first offer. If he was already questioning the Mets then this certainly can’t help.
Rich Hill should be a guy we target for the 5th spot in the rotation. He is out of minor league options and most likely headed to hit the waiver wire. He’s 28 years old and a left-hander too. He looked like had a promising future in place, and out of nowhere it all derailed for him. Louie Pinella just didn’t have the patience for him. If we can scoop him up and work some Ollie Perez magic, he might be good as new. No guarantees of course, but how does a Hill/Niese lefty tag team sound for the fifth slot? To me, it sounds like an outstanding idea.
He’s intriguing… but who are you pitching the Cubs? According to the rumored Heilman-Marquis buzz from earlier in the off-season, their interest was all in major-league ready talent (Heilman and Smith, e.g.) or untouchables (F-Mart, Niese); there’s been no interest from them in our midlevel guys (Kunz, Evans), and If I’m cashing in Murphy for someone, I’m sure as hell doing it for a higher-ceilinged bet than ol’ crazy-arms.
What exactly is Oliver Perez magic? He gave up nearly 5 runs per 9 innings in his Met career.
Game 7 NLCS…….halo effect……same as Endy.
That’s a stretch. I’m with cactus, no more “Ollie Perez Magic” please. Just get us a guy who will give us a consistent performance, day in and day out.
Perez is only 28 & coming into his own..I know he can be frustrating as hell but his talent is there & lefties come into there own later in there careers….I have no problem bringing Oliver back but lets move already!!
Oliver Perez was had value in a mets uniform because of his low salary, but now he will command a bigger piece of the pie. Best of luck to him.
I never even thought of Hill as an option, but it sounds like it could be a project with upside. How do we get em? Who said Niese was untouchable? Lets face it, he’s simply not as gd as some say and if Hill is healthy, pull the triger omar.
Scott Boras: No Leverage… Or ABSOLUTELY No Leverage?
(In a way, it’s admirable– there’s little to no market, and he’s still managed to create the illusion of one thanks to media contacts who owe him favors– hi, Jon Heyman!– and the simple act of waiting/leaking. I can see– to an extent, since he seems in years like this to also be a bit overextended– why he’s so well-employed.)
Let’s just get back to talking baseball.
Who is with me?
good idea….mlbrumors is saying that all of the giants/manny talk is bs….might still get interesting….I’m pretty sold on the idea that we wont get manny, but if it is just the dodgers, how can we not at least test the waters a little bit….
For every person who says Manny won’t be a Met…The Giants reported interest was false. Especially at what his current demands are. Every team will be out of the Manny race if he is asking for a 4 year 100 million dollar offer. Once it seems possible that Manny would sign for a two year deal, believe me, teams will be coming out of the wood work.
This is not to say Manny will be a Met, but we really don’t know anything at this point.
The thing we do sort of know is that the Wilpons don’t like the idea of Manny on their team.
I’ve heard that too, but do we actually know that for a fact?
Most people also swore that the Giants were interested as well. Look at what is happening now. I don’t think we will know until we wrap up our No.2 starter.
They just don’t want to pay Manny. It has nothing to do with his attitude.
I think its both financial & his attitude that worries the Wilpons….Its a shame because he makes us a virtual lock in the NL East…
Espn’s jayson stark, claims that MLB executives feel that any real interest for manny’s services is “baloney”.
Sorry for causing a stir.
Denham, I’m hispanic. I don’t take any offense. Life is too long to worry about one comment. as long as you don’t interfere with me getting a job or impeding from my given social rights we cool.
Nice to hear.
I want to avoid a scenario where the Mets consistently lowball Lowe and then some team swoops up out of nowhere and shows him his money 3 years for $48M with a mutual option for a 4th year, and Lowe takes it and shoves it in our faces.
We can afford to pay retail for Lowe. We cannot afford not to have him. To risk contention in 2009 for $1.5M per year is stupid to the utmost. To risk contention and lose draft picks by signing Perez instead of Lowe, to save perhaps $4M/yr. or less is also dumb. Those picks in themselves will be worth the $4M, let alone the Ollie/Lowe differential of perhaps $8M.
This is an excellent point. While I am nervous that we may not get Lowe, I am WAY more nervous that the Phillies will some how swoop in and grab him. We can afford to not get Lowe, but I don’t think we can afford for him to go to Philly. That would be disasterous on many levels. And we all know that he would torture the Mets if Philly got him.
On a different note, I think the Mets should act quickly and sign Wolf to a contract. When contending with the Phillies, we r going to need more that just one left-handed starter (even if he is the best in baseball) on our staff. I say sign Wolf immediately and wait out the rest of the starters….to either sign Lowe, Perez, Sheets or Smoltz. Smoltz is a very intriging option, no?
Smoltz is very intriguing, but I don’t believe he’s going anywhere. I would have to think that if he can’t work something out with the Braves, he’s just going to retire and join his buddy at the Hall in 5 years.
whatevered happened to ben sheets i mean he has great stuff and if he does get hurt we will have neise to back him up its just a decent suggestion i woder how much he looking for
No thanks. I’m not being sarcastic, but I’d rather sign Wolf and/or Perez than Sheets. I can deal with the inconsistency a lot better than I can deal with a guy simply being on the shelf. All the time.
I’m with you on Been Sheets. Sheets is one of the better pitcher out there, when he is pitching. Remember how many pitchers went down the last two years for the Mets and the Mets just miss the playoffs by one game. When he is pitching, he will give the Mets the best chance of winning out any of the Mets current pitchers, out side of Santana. Plus, its not a sure thing that he will miss a long period of time, if any. I realy believe he will be the jewel of the off-season for what ever team he goes to.
Question to all you “Omar stand your ground people”
Do you realize what 2 million dollars a year means to the Mets?
Its about 7 innings of one home game. Thats not even taking into account the network revenues.
Why increase 2mil when you already have the top offer? You really think Lowe will go elsewhere before checking in with the Mets? All you people who want to overpay won’t be very happy if this were to be the last move we make.
And don’t forget that he’s 35 years old— I like him alot but what 35 year-old pitcher deserves north of $15m per year on a new contract (Johan and others have it on the backside of their deals, but that’s different….)
One of those two pitchers that Boras has will wind up a Met. Could he swing a package deal? Probably not, but he might use the two as leverage against another to drive up one’s price. That guy is crazy sick— he’s good at what he does, even if we don’t like him as fans.
Guys why do you CARE?
They jacked up prices for the last two years at shea! The are doubling the cost of how much money it takes to bring a family to the ballpark.
We just had the two most heartbreaking years a Mets fan has ever experienced. and WE HAVE 2 GIANT HOLES in our rotation.
Do you really think that no other team is going to offer Lowe 36 million? The Nats just offered TEX 160..
Lowe is a proven big game pitcher.. And I mean big game.. Not game 164 vs the Marlins..
Did you not read what I said. You even say we have more holes than 1 SP, but if you overpay you will not have as good of a chance to fill your other holes.
Btw, let some basement team outbid us. I’m sure Lowe will really goto a team like the Nationals. I’d rather get 2 competent starters rather than Lowe and a scrub anyways.
I mean really.. Really guys? you are going to risk insulting the only Big Game pitcher on the market and probably the only hope we have of making a run this year over 2 million a season?
So if we low ball Lowe and he get insulted, and another team offers him a similar contract, don’t you think he will want to stick it to the Mets and sign with another team? I would, especially if I were as good as him.. the kid is as Clutch as it gets.
Get it done Omar… We don’t have any other options..
Wolf–meh
Redding-pfffffffft
Its funny you mention Redding since that is what our #5 will most likely be if we are forced to bid against overselves on Lowe.
If Lowe gets insulted by a contract offer and refuses to negotiate with the Mets because of it, then he is a bitch and we don’t want him anyway.
Because we cannot afford the risk. After we sign Lowe, we should get a backup 2B who will project to start and be done with it. Either that, or sign Adam Dunn and put Murphy at 2nd or trade him for a 2nd baseman.
Lowe is priority #1. 2nd Base is #2; Manny is #10. Murphy will give us adequate production at least. Castillo will not. Murphy is free. Manny isn’t nor is Castillo. When we have adequate production in LF free of charge, LF is not a priority. When we have no backup infielder and a black-hole at 2nd, that’s a priority.
If we sign Lowe and a #5, there is no way there will be any money for a 2B-potential starter or another OFer. Thats just unrealistic.
Depending on who it is you want for the OF and at 2B.
We aren’t getting Orlando Hudson. It just isn’t happening. There is nobody who is going to allow us to just dump Castillo on them, and if we had to eat the money we owe him it would essentially be like giving Hudson a stupid huge contract, which the Mets will not do.
We evidently aren’t after Manny, which just blows my mind.
So what is left? If we are going to start the season with stalwarts like Dan Murphy and Fernando Tatis,(both converted third basemen), in LF and Castillo at second, then we may as well sign Lowe and solidify the rest of the rotation the best we can. It will never hurt to have 5 above average SP’s.
Niese and Knight for #5 and #6 pitchers. We need the help at 2b.
Wait a second… do not use Murphy as the reason not to get Manny. Manny is possibly the second best RH hitter in baseball behind Pujols. Murphy will give us adequate production? Please.
Any replacement for Castillo will not give anywhere near (and i mean anywhere near) the production of Manny. If you do not want Manny, then fine. But Daniel Murphy cannot be the reason.
Thank you Darth. And I’m fine with Sheets. Just not Ollie/Wolfe/other riffraff.
romero got 50 games suspended
haha
Yesterday’s news.
Lowe is a MUST for this team. He is the only strong starter who stays healthy that’s on the market. We could get by with Ollie, but Lowe makes us way better.
which is better…
Lowe/Redding
(Perez or Wolf)/Garland/plus the ability to address positional issues.
This is a valid question, but I think I’d go with Lowe/Redding. I just love a guy in the rotation that we are confident in in a big game. I understand your point though.
Maine and Lowe were pretty much the same pitcher in 2007, and that is with Lowe pitching in an easier division in a bigger pitcher park. On top of that, Pelfrey had a 19game stretch last season where he was 11-3 with a 2.96era. It’s not so farfetched to think Pelfrey could be an excellent #2. I would like Lowe, but Maine or Pelfrey could very realistically be better this upcoming season.
My thoughts on Maine, Pelfrey, and Lowe are thus: I believe Maine will bounce back and have a solid year. I think Pelfrey will regress slightly, but still be a solid 3 or 4. Lowe I think will put up solid numbers again and solidify what has been a somewhat shaky rotation for us over the past 3 years. Looking closely at Lowe’s numbers, he’s a very solid #2. More so than I anticipate Pelfrey, Maine, or Ollie being next year.
Nobody on the Mets, not even Johan Santana has pitched in more big games than Derek Lowe. and in those games Derek Lowe has come through EVERY TIME…
He’s got guts and a sinker that will be the owner of faces for years to come in the NL east.
Boy darth, what a short memory you have. Don’t you remember the 2006 NLDS game against the Mets?
That’s not the only poor appearance he’s had in the postseason. Has he pitched well in October? Definitely. But his record is mixed and he’s no Beckett.
i agree with you but with lowe that seems 10x more possible…without him all of a sudden the thought of pelf regressing and maines injuries become a huge factor entering the season
I’m curious why you call Lowe a big game pitcher. He’s been generally good in the postseason but has also had some poor games. He’s no Josh Beckett.
He didn’t pitch that well against the Mets in the 2006 NLDS.
You say he is the only starter on the market who stays healthy, but he is also the oldest among the top starters left and so therefore his risk for injury and age-related decline in performance also is the highest.
Because of the risk due to age and the money he’s asking for I almost see Lowe as a wash with Garland, Sheets, Wolf and Ollie.
I said I would have confidence in him in a big game. Does he have a great history in big games? No, but all we have to judge him by is a small sample size. You can’t point to a collection of 10 games to make your point. I didn’t say Lowe was the only healthy starter remaining, I said he was the only solid AND healthy pitcher remaining. He’s far superior to Ollie, Garland, and Wolf. He’s far healthier than Sheets. Will he be superior to Ollie in 3 years? Maybe not, but this is a team built to win now, and we need to address a serious concern.
I’m confused. If you say the sample size is too small to make a judgment about his ability in big games, then why can you make that judgment? LOL.
For the record, I disagree. I think the postseason experience of Lowe is enough to make valid judgments about his performance in big games.
Regardless of your point about his health and solidity, he is still also the oldest of the bunch by far. If he starts falling off the cliff in ‘09 and continues downward thereafter, I can see where his value relative to Sheets and Ollie is vastly lower by year 2.
There’s a lot I like about Lowe but I don’t think he’s the slam-dunk choice that some are making him out to be and he’s asking for way too much relative to what he’s worth.
The reason you can be CONFIDENT in a player in big games is based on his record overall. A player will tend to perform in the postseason the way he does overall. That’s a fact. To say that you can judge Lowe based on 10 starts is absolutely ludicrous. He is by far better than any other pitcher out there, when factoring in everything. That’s indisputable. He is NOT being offered enough relative to his value. If you want to offer him spot on what he is projected to be worth you need to offer him 3/$42 with a fourth year vesting option that is 85% likely to be reached worth $18 mil.
Sorry but you’re being very contradictory. It doesn’t make sense for you to say there is a big enough sample size (postseason or not) for you to conclude he is a good big game pitcher …. but I can’t use that same set of games to say he is a mixed bag when it comes to big games.
A player will tend to perform in the postseason the way he does overall. That’s a fact.
No, not always. Beckett is actually better in the postseason than he is in the regular season …. and guys like Benitez have been worse in the postseason than in the regular season. Sometimes there is little correlation.
Wow, you just don’t get it do you? You’re trying to compare overall stats to a small sample size. Beckett has a small sample size, Benitez, etc, etc. I’m not being contradictory at all. I’m saying use his overall stats for your arguments. You haven’t done that at all. I’m open to the discussion, but you haven’t presented a case.
OK, we’ll use your skewered questionable logic …
Derek Lowe has a career ERA of 3.95 as a starter. You call that big game, LOL.
Further, career performance becomes more and more irrelevant in terms of future performance as the player gets older.
He is by far better than any other pitcher out there, when factoring in everything. That’s indisputable.
No, it’s certainly disputable. Better? Yes. But by far? Very debatable … especially factoring risk due to age.
He is NOT being offered enough relative to his value.
That’s certainly debatable. And entirely dependent on whether you view the marketplace through Boras’ eyes or through the eyes of the more sane GMs in the business.
I’m not going to discuss things when you don’t throw anything but your opinions out there. It’s pointless. You could argue that nothing that happens in the world is real, it’s all a metaphysical fantasy, but that’s not concrete. Not objective. I’ve given objective facts…you’ve given opinions.
Hey, you don’t have to get snotty. Your saying that Lowe is the better pitcher ” by far” is just your opinion. That is NOT a fact.
Your saying he is worth that amount of money is just your opinion too..
His value can be calculated based on his age, health, statistics. And it has been. I gave you that value. It’s very objective.
Source? I want to see a value vs. the value of Ollie, Sheets, Wolf, etc. Otherwise it’s just your opinion.
Go to CHONE. Discount using 12/31/08 bond portfolio discount rates (6.75%). You will match the values exactly. Gotta run, let’s pick it up later.
Sorry, be more precise with your source. I have no idea what CHONE is. Give a link.
Also, unless the values/projections are for the 2009 season and beyond, then they are worthless.
There is not enough evidence to conclude that Lowe is a big game pitcher (or Benitez, or Beckett). I said that from the start. I would be much more confident in a guy with a track record of pitching well overall than with a guy that puts up mediocre numbers overall. Players tend to perform like their history. It’s called regression to the mean. It’s a PROVEN fact. Statisticians and mathematicians have relied on that proof for ages.
Now there’s a fact 3.95 ERA…it’s not the end of the story however. But it’s quite respectable over a career.
VCarver – I’ve got to run. But I want to pick this discussion up later.
Players tend to perform like their history. It’s called regression to the mean. It’s a PROVEN fact.
Sure, for the regular season.
But the postseason. is different. It represents “big game” or clutch situations.
Now, as I can tell from your previous posts, you are one of those who believe clutchness doesn’t exist.
I know many in the sabermetric community have long held that belief — and still do.
However, some, like Bill James, have changed their mind on this and believe it in fact does exist.
I also believe it exists. So I think your belief that postseason or “big game” performance can be predicted from regular season performance is not valid.
I personally stopped attending Met games after Los Mets decided that I needed to learn to speakie panish. Why in the world do I need to watch and listen to Jose Reyes, on the jumbotron, attempt to teach me spanish? Am I not in America. That is why the latin perception on the Mets is of import. They lost a partial season ticket holder because I was offended by that.
They celebrate other cultures as well during the season…Thanks I needed those seats!!!
gg315 -
LOL so, let me get this right.
Mets in an attempt to expand fans cultural awareness add a little clip from time to time on Jumbotron showing the Spanish translation & pronunciation of words like “Welcome” for example.
With the idea that maybe, just maybe, fans would want to know more of many of their favorite players cultures considering a large portion of the team share the same primary languages English & Spanish.
This in turn is so offensive!, so appalling! you turn your back on the team by refusing to go to any further games.
Wow!!! can you imagine if Mets trade for Ichiro Suzuki and develop 4 or 5 Asian All-Stars and start a Sushi night. You’d probably leave the tri-state area.
There’s a word for you but I can only say it in Spanish and I don’t wish to offend your delicate state of being.
we really do need a left handed reliever to compensate for the loss of schoenwise and the addition of ibanez to the phillies
not necessarily. If Putz is in the 8th, and Howard comes up, you are not pulling Putz to use a left specialist. Same goes for Frod. So you would really only need that lefty specialist for the 6th or 7th in which case 1 could very well be enough.
what happens if the mets have a 1 run lead in the 7th inning with utly howard and ibanez coming up…felicano comes in and locks it down…lets say the phillies find a way to tie the game later and it goes into extras…who is going to shut those 3 down again?
* I was attempting to reply to a post from 1 hour ago. Didn’t work LOL
i dont understand how ollie is a guy we fall back to if we miss out on lowe….isnt ollie asking for the same amount of money/years as lowe?? plus ollie is nowhere close to being as good as lowe
I agree that Ollie is no where near the pitcher Lowe is. That’s indisputable. Ollie was originally looking for 5/$70. Lowe was looking for 5/$90. Ollie will not get as much as Lowe.
well it just seems like there are teams out there for ollie but really not many for lowe
Ollie may very likely wind up a Yankee. With Andy turning them down they might be looking to add another lefty.
Who says Derek Lowe isn’t a big game pitcher? cause he lost 1 post season start against the Mets in 06? I suggest some of you check his post season statistics.. He is the definition of big game pitcher
I deff overstated that.. I just checked his stats.. He good but not great…
He did have two very very big wins in 04 for the sox..
well i dont know who was saying that cuz he is a big game pitcher…also last year he was awesome down the stretch…pitched on 3 day rest a bunch of times…they said his stats on 3 day rest are very very good too
Omar everyone sellin like Hot Cakes hurry up before were stuck with SPAM
Our starting rotation is SPAM:
Santana
Pelfrey
and
Maine
Omar, 2 more starter’s please
For all the Lowe fans, you have to ask yourself why the Red Sox didn’t even pursue him. They know him better than anyone, and given that he’s expressed a desire to go back to Boston, I would think he’d give them a discount.
Yet it appears, they’ve never even tried to bring him back. Why?
Makes me wonder.
because he would be a number four starter for them asking for number two+ money it just doesnt finacially make sense for them.
How would he be a #4? I see him as a #3 in Boston.
And being a big market spender, the Red Sox have never let something like that get in the way of pursuit of a WS. And they emphasize pitching. They even signed a closer one year when Foulke was already signed and making closer money. He wasn’t hurt and on the DL either.
dice k
beckett
lester
would be the first three…all three of them are better than lowe
Well he’s certainly better than Wakefield and Penny. And paying $12 million for a middle of rotation starter isn’t something they’d be adverse to considering Lester doesn’t make a lot of money.er
You really have to wonder why they have NO interest at all.
Lowe was a drunk when he was in Boston and burned many bridges there within the organization. I doubt they really wanted anything to do with him.
Interesting. I did not know that. That would explain their lack of interest.
Well I certainly hope he’s sobered up since then.
I also wonder why LA hasn’t tried to keep him. I know he said he wanted to go back to the east coast, but still, it’s like they didn’t even try. Maybe he still gets smashed?
His drinking problems were well established in Boston. Who cares why the Dodgers aren’t interested. You must hate the K-Rod signing too. The Angels showed absolutely zero interest in him.
I’ll gladly take Lowe thank you. He’s rarely shaken or stirred.
That was damn funny Hazmet
LOL, no, wrong again. I love the K-Rod signing and even argued with other fans here who weren’t for it.
I care why a team doesn’t show interest in a player anymore. They usually know things about a player that other teams don’t.
ha
thats a good way to put it
I did not realize either that Lowe had a drinking problem, we don’t need that here. As far as talent and big-game potential, i am all for him being a Met, as long as he’s sobered up and will not be a negative influence on the youngsters in the clubhouse.
Kerry Collins had a very public drinking problem, and look what he’s been able to accomplish…
If Lowe will pitch for us in the big games the way he has pitched in past big games, I’d personally get him a drink if that is what he needed.
make mine a double…
Drunks and druggies did us just fine in 86!
Most of these guy’s aren’t choirboys and there grown men who are going to do what they do. If we’re systematically going to eliminate player by player for their off the field behavior we’ll have a team of Doug Flynn’s. It takes a mix and results are what matter so long as they’re not breaking the law. The heralded ‘86 Mets were the hardest partiers in the world but they had Gary Carter drinking milk on the team. It takes talent and mix, or chemistry, whatever.
The Wilpon’s love this stuff, first they pay Manny no attention because of his Manny being Manny attitude and now we’re going to discount Lowe because of past drinking. If they really believed what they preached then why is Ramon Castro on the team after he pleaded no contest on reduced charges from a rape charge in Pittsburgh. Why, because he’s cost effective even though he’s hurt all the time. How that’s cost effective is beyond me. Rooting for this team is an affliction at times the way they think things out.
I didn’t mean to dump on Lowe per se. It’s just that in addition to being older and asking for too much money, I find it ludicrous for some to attach the label “big game pitcher” to him. His postseason record as a starter is very mixed. And his career record as a starter is just a little above average.
Is he good? Yes. But “big game” is going way overboard. Santana is big game. And Beckett is big game. Lowe is not. .
As far as I know only Darth Manuel called him big game, something he later retracted.
Is that an endorsemant for Big Game Ollie? because with the other company of big game pitchers you just mentioned then teams must be lining up at his door.
NEWS FLASH “BIG GAME PITCHER” MEANS NOTHING UNLESS YOU CAN BEAT THE “LESSER TEAMS”
MLB is full of players that signed with new teams after former teams decided to part ways only to have that player find success somewhere else. Is this really that big of a deal?
How many championship teams are made up of some players that were no longer wanted by former teams due to Lord knows how many number of reasons?
The myth of Derek Lowe is starting to take on a life of it’s own. You would think he is a 28 YO stud that just won back to back cy young awards!
He is a decent pitcher, but not some ace. ANd he is about to be 36 (and I don’t care that he only became a starter at 29). age is age.
He also benefitted from being on the Dodgers, in the NL west.
Yes, he is a solid pitcher, and would be nice in the mets rotation. No, he does not guarantee a pennant, and yes they can certainly win without him. 12 mill. is not insulting by any means. 5/80 was ludicrous to ask for IMO.
So give him 3/40 if Omar wants him that bad. maybe stretch to 42 if desperate. Otherwise move on and get some other arms.
And replaying to an earlier comment, as a pticher, Ben Sheets is way better (discounting the injury potential, which is really an unknown gong forward).
Sheets pitched about the same number of innings this year. ANd put up better numbers.
Thank you!
He should be giddy to take 12M….
Matt, Love the ‘Boras Badenov’ graphic!
I know a over the past few years, Roy Oswalt name has been tossed around. Any word on his availability? Maybe the Astros are looking to unload some payroll
For those who think that Lowe should not get more than 3/$36:
Derek Lowe was originally thought to be looking for 5 years $90 million. After seeing a slowing market the Mets made an initial offer of 3/$36. Two very disparate numbers. Scott Boras and Derek Lowe countered by saying Lowe is looking to other suitors for $16 mil per.
Let’s use CHONE’s projections to formulate the present value of Lowe’s worth to a team. We will use a present value formulated from a discount rate based on current bond models. Using a combination of Citigroup’s Discount Rate Curve, Moody’s Discount Rate, and a portfolio of high rated corporate bonds, a reasonable discount rate is 6.75%. Furthermore, let’s as sume a middle of year payment for each year of Lowe’s valued worth. CHONE projects Lowe’s worth at:
2009: $15.5 mil
2010: $14.8
2011: $14.2
2012: $13.4
That gives us a present value of $51.14 mil.
Now, it is important to note that these discount rates do factor in current economic conditions. While we may be tempted to adjust the discount rate going forward, it is really unreasonable to do so given the current economic turbulence.
So now any team wanting to match the value of Lowe’s worth, but not wanting to give Lowe 4 years guaranteed could backload some of the dollars of both the guaranteed portion of the contract as well as a fourth year vesting option.
Based on the Mets’ three year offer a fourth year vesting option seems highly likely. To make the contract more appealing to Derek Lowe you need to make the vesting condition fairly easy to attain. Something that he has an 85%+ chance of attaining. Perhaps that would be pitching something like 170+ innings in 2011.
Suppose that a team offers Derek Lowe 3/$40, with a payment schedule of 2009 – $12 mil, 2010 – $13, 2011 – $15. In order to match the present value of Lowe’s worth, the 85% likely vesting option would have to be $22.18 million; a pretty hefty vesting option.
Now if instead a team makes a more reasonable offer of 3/$42 without backloading; the vesting option would only need to be $19.23 mil. This seems like the type of offer Lowe would be happy with. Either way, he’s probably looking for a bit too much in $16 mil per and the Mets started off too low at 3/$36, even given the current economic situation.
If you don’t know what CHONE is go to baseballprojection dot com.
CHONE is one of the most respected forecasting systems in the game. Only PECOTA exceeds it in accuracy. Of course those numbers aren’t available yet, or we could be all over that.
here are two Very Respected Forecasting Systems:
OLDAGE
and
WASHEDUP.
Omar; save ya money.
Youth, baby!
Tell Boris to take a long walk off a short pier!
LOL, nice one, eddie.
CHONE…
CHONE…CHONE…
CHONE…CHONE…CHONE…
Fan-Gebra 101 People
Simple Does X + Y = Z ?
(X = LOWE)
(Y = $$$’s)
(Z = W.S. Ring)
Dude, even with Lowe, one could make the argument that both Philadelphia and Florida are better than the Mets. NOTHING is guaranteed until it happens. With this team, no amount of Fan-gebra can save you…
That said, I think Lowe, Redding, Abreu, a LOOGY and a bench bat is a realisitic wish list.
Ahhh, nymgb44 –
Don’t you know?
Fan-gebra is all about plausible theories.
Fan-gebra is the mathematics
that is used in the science that studies
“The Theory Of Believability”
In short it’s all about
Fan-gebra.
“Scott Boras and Derek Lowe countered by saying Lowe is looking to other suitors for $16 mil per.”
saber, are you saying what I think you are saying? That you are basing your entire argument about Lowe’s worth on the dollar amount that came from Boras?????? Hold on….
.
.
.
.
.
.
…. Ok, now that I’ve picked myself up off the floor after collapsing in hysterical laughter, let me ask you — are you nuts?
That is NOT fact. That is NOT objective. Geez. $16 million is an opinion. I can’t believe you are even trying to pa-ss it off as “fact.”
Now if I read your explanation incorrectly, then let me know.
Wow. You didn’t even read the posts. Your first few posts had some intelligence in them. If you prefer a scouting approach to a sabermetrics approach that’s fine, but at least try to formulate a strong argument based on the posts.
Look kid, you’re a pretty smart kid. Go to college, think these things through. You could really start to get some good thoughts going. But I’m not going to argue with you when you just want to try to be funny and not really look at what’s out there.
Sure I read your posts …. and apparently you are not reading mine …
Because I actually addressed the most important point in your posts — the starting point from which you jumped to your conclusion about Lowe’s worth.
Your whole starting point is BOGUS. it’s not based on anything but Boras’ number.
And I suspect you know I’m right, which iSors why you’re obfuscating and ignoring the issue now.
Sorry, but unless you address that fallacy in your argument then your whole argument goes out the window.
Let me say this again —
Shame on you for trying to pa-ss off as factual and objective a valuation of worth based on a number Boras pulls out of his a-s-s.
If you left off the pontification about your ideas being factual and objective, I’d have no issue with your opinion.
But your valuation is not objective or factual and calling it such when it clearly is not is an insult to the intelligence of the readers of this blog.
saber, a few more thoughts –
I am familiar with projections systems (zips, pecota) but I’ve never heard of chones. At any rate, projections are not facts either. And you’d be hard-pressed to call them objective since they rely so much on speculation.
As for “value,” this is hardly an objective or factual thing either. In the context of baseball, value is in the eye of the observer. Value can be determined only relative to another player but not independent of anything factual (and Boras’ $16 million valuation is just his opinion). Unless of course you define “value” as market cost, in which case Lowe’s value has yet to be determined.
Enough with the esoteric strat-o-matic number crunching – sign a damn pitcher already!
Vcarver –
I see your appetite of discussing player vs dollar value ratio is still healthy.
=)
jersey, are you referring to anything specific in the past? I don’t recall anything specific.
MLBTR says the Mets have made an offer to Tim Redding!!!!
they also say a offer to Randy wolf will follow?
Are you kidding me OMAR!!!
BTW –
“In the context of baseball, value is in the eye of the observer.”
My God, save it for the book.
j/k
I just saw on mlbtr that the mets have made a offer to redding.
LOL, cleo and jersey.
btw, the latest from mlbtr is that the Mets made an offer to redding and are readying one for Wolf.
I think Omar’s idea is to sign just one of these two which is OK for the back end of the rotation. I prefer Wolf over Redding.
Tim Redding????? What a joke!
Is it me or is everyone on same rss feed?
Calm down guys. I think Omar plans to sign only one of them. Which I’m perfectly fine with. Why not?
This does not mean he will not purse Garland, Lowe, Ollie and Sheets.
pursue
Purse sounds right to me
Fail
Redding is not even a AAA pitcher!!
Wolf I can live w/ as my 5th starter, not the 4th
Redding had a 4.95 era last year and has a bad foot that was just operated on last month.
Typical Mets, sounds like El Duque all over again
HEY!!!
this is how a major market team gets it done! too bad the mets arent in NY *eyes rolling*
mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20090105&content_id=3733675&vkey=hotstove2008&fext=.jsp
p.s. SIGN MANNY before it is too late….AGAIN!
for the wilpons t hey dont consider it being late its called getting ready for next year lol
Redding 2008
W 10
L 11
ERA 4.95
IP 182.0
H 195
R 110
ER 100
HR 27
BB 65
K 120
OK tell me what am I not seeing here?
Is Minaya doing the SNY equivalent of
“Punk’d Fan Edition”
GOOD ONE!!! Minaya hehehe,hehehe you got me. Wheres Ashton???
Mr. NJ – what you are not seeing is that Redding had a 3-1 record against the Phillies in 2008; however I don’t know if he would do the same w/ the Mets against the Phillies in 2009. So, I agree w/ you Mr. NJ there is nothing special here. Lets get Lowe and the O-Dog NOW!!!! Omar you don’t have to get rid of L.C. in order to sign the O-Dog. You can sign Hudson now and trade Luis later. You HEARD!! O!
Santana
Pelfrey
Maine
Wolf
Redding
EQUALS
Another 2nd !!place finish
Now… Now… Let’s just wait and see now.
Fan-gebra 101
to da rescue
Redding x Pennant Race ÷ CitiFields + New Money =
- Mets Magic Baby!!!
Finally, some action. This definitely means that they are looking to sign one of Redding or Wolf, for the 5th spot. I am sure it will be the first man to take the offer.
Lowe and Wolf would be wonderful. I wouldn’t be too upset if we got Lowe and Redding either. I just prefer to add another lefty, if we sign Lowe.
Wolf 2008
W 12
L 12
ERA 4.30
IP 190.1
H 191
R 100
ER 91
HR 21
BB 71
K 162
Ummm?
If I have to choose between Redding & Wolf I choose…
Da Wolf-Man think of the headlines
“Wolf-Man Ravages Phils with his SouthPaw” OOwwwwwwwww!!!!!
As opposed to
“Mets are more than Redding for Phils”
This is actually a very good sign… Being proactive and grabbing chips that are actually on the table. but this should be followed by addressing LF/2nd. Right?
From your keyboard to God’s email.
I would do a backflip and im 240 pounds
Reyes
Hudson
Wright
Delgado
Beltran
F-Mart/Church
Tatis/Murphy
Schneider/Castro
If we could get rid of Casillo
Santana
Lowe
Pelf
Maine
Perez
K-rod
Putz
Green
Chad Cordero
Robertson
Parnell
Sanchez
Feliciano
Getting O-Dogg, Lowe and Perez would make anyone do backflips but I don’t see how the Mets are going to spend on Lowe and Perez and still be willing to take on Orlando Hudson while Luis Castillo is still on the team. I mean, if the team isn’t willing to spend that much more.
I guess we will find out soon enough what’s going to happen.
mets are going to have lowe tomorrow after talking with boras..thats usually how things go…lol
thought you didnt think the mets were going to land lowe…and sorry i asked u a question on another post and i cant find it so i dont know if u answered…enterkrod – u say the mets wont get lowe, who do u think will?
I hope if not tomorrow Mets get Lowe soon. The uncertainty of Maine concerns me a bit. Maine hasn’t been healthy ever since becoming a Met, seems like he’s always had injury woe’s. I think that’s why having two guys like Santana and Lowe at the top of the rotation that are inning guys is a must.
Then the Mets could spend cheaply with perhaps a Wolf, Redding or someone else to fill out their starting rotation. It’s not a must but it’s close to a need that I think the Mets should go after an outfield bat like Adam Dunn. I don’t think Tatis will hold up as an everyday outfield … I could be wrong but I’d rather have Tatis as a bench player that can fill in, give guys a day off, start if someone goes down but I just don’t think he’ll be able to hold up for an entire season.
We’ll see though.
stevie it would be nice if we got lowe today but i feel that boras will draw this out as long as possible so he can scare the front office into upping their offer – i am also ashamed to say that i agreed with that rotund jerk fatcessa about signing manny and how the mets are penny wise and dollar foolish – the other thing that annoyed me was me agreeing with hal steingrabber about putting money back into the team to ensure the fans a great ballpark experience and to try to ensure a world championship – (HEY FRED & JEFF – U LISTENING???!!!???!!) sorry had to vent
guys – the fellas at hot foot makes a good case on signing dunn – check it out
also happy 27 b-day krod
at this point, can we get all of Boras’ clients on wholesale prices??
well nwl is going outta buisness but at least at bj’s and costco u can buy at bulk – so lets see manny ollie and lowe – put em in my shopping cart lol
I had to chuckle at this for a moment because…
what happens if Ollie doesn’t get a contract? Are we going to see him at the Vernon Boulevard Costco in L.I.C.?
“Yes, yes. I used to pitch for the Mets. Would you like to sign up for a Costco Amex card?’
This reminds me of a clearance sale when I see the sign, I must go in and shop around for things I might not look at if they were at full price. Omar is doing the same thing, he is going in this thinking he’ll get a bargain except one problem, the owner of the place is charging him full price.
btw hairston jr is off the market
Now I can sleep at night knowing Harriston won’t be in the outfield.
The Mets currently have 4-5 reliable bats and 1-3 reliable starters.
Its going to take more than that to make the playoffs…
At least something might happen soon. That way the up tight posters can go ballistic on real moves instead of imaginary ones!
I prefer Wolf over Redding, but if they do sign Redding at 2-3 million (hey, coulda had Pavano!), that gives them another arm to compete for the 5th spot in ST. Could also hit the pen, or be traded, if something better comes along.
I thought the desire for the 5 ole was a semi-reliable, innings eater? And if that is what you are getting, it shouldn’t cost too much. And be better than the Limas of the world.
get wolfie and/or redding/garland. save $ and spend it on manny!!!!!
So you want a rotation of Santana, Pelfrey, Maine, Wolf, Garland? Wow, not even Manny would put us over the top at that point. Ugh.
Hairston would have been a nice utility guy.
And SHeets, unless the med reports are a screaming red flag (meaning a current ticking time bomb, not his previous history), would be the best signing of all.
Also heard Joel Sherman on XM this morning. He made a great point about Tex (that TRS and I also harped on): next years FA pool stinks. Holliday is about the only decent, younger slugger potentially available.
So, if you are going to have a major hole next year (like 1B for the Mets), Tex this year made a ton of sense. Or even Dunn.
Or maybe Murphy really is the 1B of the future. Who knows, but F mart really might be needed next year!
Oh, and related to this point, it might just make sense to stretch this year to add manny, especially if they can Flip Delgado for other help (maybe the angels).
or keep CD and hope for one last good year out of him.
I still dont understand this whole Redding thing. There is not much reasoning behind letting him be our 5th starter. If the real reaosn is his record against the Phils then that is sad. You dont sign a 5th starter because of his record in 4 games. Foolish, way too small of a sample size and something like that can easily change form year to year. Ide rather sign a Pavano to compete for 5th spot.
It isn’t just the Phils, but actually, that is the logic many people are using for why the Mets should bring back Ollie!
Redding is reasonably priced fodder to compete for the 5th spot. not spectacular, but his contract doesn’t kill you either (not like a silva).
he’s cheap enough to stick in the pen, demote, or trade if you don’t need him.
Unless of course hes always on theDL
w/foot probs which lead to arm trouble.
The more ppl talk about it the more i kinda sit back and look at the manny situation, he’s the greatest hitter of his era, he’s a beast and all that and i want him, but i think we are doing the right thing here, we just need to surround the mets with good role players to compliment reyes and wright, after this year when delgado is gone it will be wright’s team with jose as his lieutenant, look guys, manny may be a winner and all, and again i want him, but i think is time we go young and stayed that way, we will be competitive for years to come either way.
So do want to be “competitve” or compete
for a championship? How do you know what
will happen a couple yrs from now w/wright
reyes and/or johan?
Ok, so this is far off most likely but…
Who would be ok with us signing Redding and Wolf and then getting into the Manny market with the extra cash.
Wolf and Redding combined most likely would cost about what Lowe would cost.
Mute point. Not gonna happen.
i want ollie or lowe and then redding, cuz ollie and lowe is gonna be a lot of money and you can’t have one as a backend starter cuz they are not that at all, they are atleast a #3 in my opinion.
It’s Lowe and a cheap starter for the backend of the rotation for me.