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Question:
Do you think the mets are trying to go “cheap” on pitching in order to have some powder (cash) left in its keg to make a big move on offense (read: Manny)?
I just think its interesting that Manny is still out there. Perhaps this could be the reason. If the mets can fill the rotation but not overpay, they could be in a position to make one more BIG splash.
Does anyone think this is possible?
to be hoest that was my as-sumption but i just don’t see it.. he’s going cheap coz we now have a budget.. i guess choking the last 2 years has hurt them financially and the wilpons are being caution with how much the will spend.. but i’ll do 3 years 75 for manny anytime.. i’ll even sign pedro if it means bringin this guy here..
Yes it is possible.
Like a 0.00009% chance.
is omar crazy? First of all you make some good moves with the bullpen. which was good. Now you turn around and dont sign lowe to improve the starting line-up. You knew ollie was going to asked for more money even though rick peterson basicly gave him a second chance to be a good picher. And now you mean to tell me we tryin to sign the same starting line up as last year minus pedro. ……….WOW
Dont let me get started on the left feild and that line up
100% agree.. but be ready coz here comes the bashin time for u..
There is no Bashing. Just Lowe got way over paid. And if the Same thing happens to Ollie and he signs else where. So be it. You shouldn’t have to Over-Pay to compete…. See Yankee’s.
So if the Mets miss Ollie, and they Sign Sheets to a 1 year incentive laden contract and Jon Garland to a 3-4 year deal at a reasonable 6-9 mil per. How is that not being smart.
Manny will be way way way out of the price range. As it’s adding up the Mets are set to already be in top 5 in payroll without adding a single player from here on out.
Cerrone has it right, if ollie doesn’t come to the Mets at their Price… 15 million would make me laugh out loud very hard…. you sign the “Picnic basket” of guys minus wolf and pedro…. And Adam dunn’s 4 years with the team would come at less then 2 years of Manny.
Yes perfect world Manny, Lowe, and Ollie would be mets. But unlike the Yankee’s 31 other teams actually have a operating budget. 138 million was the mets budget last year, and they are targeting about the same this year. Which would easily put them only behind the yankee’s and maybe the Red Sox. With Manny, and Lowe the mets would right now be at about, 170 million or so for the season… 139 last year- 30 that came off the books + 12 for k-rod 4.5 for puts 2 for cora 2 for redding + 15 for Lowe + 25 for manny = 169 million give or take. That’s close to pushing them over the luxury tax threshold as well.
sign Ricky Henderson!
Omar: Hello?
Ricky: Hello, this is Ricky …
Omar: What’s up?
Ricky: Ricky wants Ricky to sign with the Mets to hit.
Omar: Are you kidding?
Ricky: Ricky is a hall of famer and Ricky wants to play again. Ricky hits homeruns and Ricky wants million dollars so that Ricky hits leadoff.
*click; omar hangs up*
Ricky: Hello? Is Ricky a Met? Ricky better than Manny Rameriz!
LOL. Now we’re talkin’!!!!!!!!
Let’s give Rickey and Bonds (now that he’s in the ‘clear’) minor league deals, and let them platoon in left!!!
Rickey and Barry<<<<<<<<Tatis and Murphy.
OK……where’s my coffee!! :-)
Am I the only one who things without another steady bat – and preferably one that can play the outfield – our bench is really, really weak? I mean who do we have if our LF platoon is gonna be Murphy and Tatis?
Castro, Reed, Cora, maybe Pagan, maybe Anderson, maybe Evans?
*thinks
darryl ward might do wonders in that lineup.. we need someone with pop in the bench..
Tatis would be excellent on the bench but NOOOOoooooooo … the Mets don’t want Manny.
maybe a cheaper solution is what they looking for.. dunn or abreu..
haha … don’t say the “c” word too loud.
As currently contructed, the bench includes:
Murphy/Tatis (OF), Cora(IF), Castro(C), Reed (OF).
I think you are right about needing a bat, but I think it should be for an infielder.
our bench stinks… if is tatis and murohy in the bench yes.. but we can’t afford to go into the season with only of them as our bench player..
Let’s get Wiggy!!!
Dump Castillo (I know, easier said than done).
Let Wiggy play 2B for the most part, and use Murphy to platoon in LF and 2B??
Just thinking out loud.
The Mets can afford both Perez and Sheets. I’ve done the numbers, check it out by clicking on my name. Let me know if I missed anything.
Nice work, and good ideas as usual. And Sheets might even be cheaper. I agree that Johan, Sheets, Pelf, Maine, and Ollie with our revamped pen is a fantastic staff.
JJ likes it too, and Raul is also impressed.
I’m glad to hear the Seattle ex-pat community approves!
Good points. If the Mets got Sheets and Perez, I wouldn’t even mind if they didn’t upgrade the offense until they saw what they had in Murphy, Evans, Tatis, F-Mart, etc.
If Matt Holiday proves he can hit as well in Oakland as he did in Colorado, he would be a great pickup at the trade deadline.
Of course, I would much rather the Mets sign Manny, Sheets, and Ollie now, but we know that isn’t happening.
Probably would have to dump Delgado to make room for Manny’s salary.
I don’t think Sheets will cost $15 million. I think maybe $13 mill max but he may settle for less on an incentive laden deal.
So I also think the Mets can afford both and perhaps exceed the LT threshold by only just a little.
But, as opposed to getting Manny, it would be worth it in this case. Because it’s true that pitching wins.
It would definitely be one of the better rotations if not the best.
Good work Case!!
Just so you know though, only the 25 man roster counts toward the payroll (not the entire 40).
If guys get get brought up, the they get figured in based on their salary, and time they spend in the bigs.
But again, it’s just the 25 major league guys that we need to be concerned with now.
Thanks, definitely makes my CASE stronger :)
No doubt. Very good job man.
I am surprise that manny is still a free agent, maybe omar told boras to wait for him after he is done with the starting rotation. we can only hope…
we don’t need manny ramirez. i don’t think guys like david and 2 carloses would like him in the clubhouse. bad clubhouse chemistry=bad team
For your information, many teammates actually like Manny Rameriz. Are you in the Mets locker room to know what Wright, Beltran and Delgado think?
He wishes
yeah, right. and you heard that directly from them ‘many teammates.’ at least i’m the team mascot.
I actually have heard directly from a player who was with the sox (never made it past AAA) but played in spring training with manny who said manny is the easiest guy to get along with and everybody loves him. he said the guy who is the cancer was kevin youkilis
so.. what chemistry did we have the past 2 years?? bad.. or super bad..?? due to those 2 chokes i guess it was horrendous!!
We have three players that we can bank on having good years. Jose Reyes, David Wright and Carlos Beltran. We have three players who we are keeping our fingers crossed with. Delgado, Church, Castillo. We have three more players who will either give us nothing or we just don’t know what to expect. Schneider and the pitcher will give us nothing offensively and the jury is still out on our LF platoon. Even if we were to look at our lineup as eight hitters (every NL team will have an automatic out hitting ninth virtually every night) that is still only 38% of our lineup that we can go into the season feeling 100% confident in. With Manny, not only can we pencil in productive years from four of our eight hitters, but the production from the remaining four will improve as well. So ‘yes’, we do need Manny. I am tired of the phillies phucking us and with Manny we will annihilate them. Without him…it’ll probably come down to holding another slim lead in September.
Sign Manny, sign Oliver, steamroll the phillies, go to the World Series, with Johan and Ollie taking two turns a piece maybe/probably beat the Yankees in 7.
and good clubhouse chemistry = no playoffs
well said Deaner, well said indeed
That was a good one Deaner lol
who would not want a manny on they team
the Wilpons
Hey, I posted this in the last thread, but it seems to be a dead thread now. I really wanted to get everyone’s opinion on this.
I don’t get a chance to check every post or post that often, so I’m sure I missed the discussion, but am I alone in thinking the Mets have SO many holes that signing ollie is little better than a stop-gap?
The way I see it, here are the problems facing the Mets in ‘09
1. ollie’s inconsistency/sheets’ health
2. maine not going far enough into games
3. total lack of production at 2nd base
4. total lack of offensive/defensive ability at catcher
5. duaner and pedro in the bullpen
6. delgado coming down to earth
7. will pelfrey be as good as last year?
8. johan coming off surgury
9. concussed church
10. murphy’s slump to end last season
Again, I’m sure this has been covered ad nauseum, but I’m so annoyed this morning I had to vent. I normally don’t rush to judgement but I wish Omar would do something. Playoff teams do not normally have this many problems.
I think your list from 5 down isn’t necessary. Delgado will can still put up pretty good numbers. His Numbers have kind of plateaued with the Mets… So you can expect about .265 30-35 HR, 115 RBI. The Bullpen isn’t a concern to anyone unless guys start getting injured.. there is way to much talent Sanchez and Feliciano… et el, will only be asked to pitch 1-2 innings combined which is what they need. If 2 pitchers are signed from here out and Redding is the long man, that cleans up any worries about pitchers not going deep (Maine, Ollie if he’s here, and whoever they bring in).
I can’t see why Pelfrey cant be AS good if not better for the full season as last year. He did have a horrific start to the year. 13 wins again is easily attainable he did go 11-5 in his last 20 starts. Murphy did slump towards the end. Could be a multitude of reason, from his longest season ever, to being slightly over-matched when scouting reports came out on him. I wouldn’t be too worried… If he struggles out of the gate then you can get concerned.
And on the catchers. Schneider remarkably threw out the league average of base runners i believe (seemed like he never caught anyone when i watched) and his fielding percentage was high for catchers… And Castro can hit. Platooned and healthy i think they will be as good as whatever alternatives are realistically out there. Great nooooo Good noooo… but adequate yeah.
The only real position that scares me to death is 2nd. Castillo is a mess. Church again i’m not that worried about, unless he is busy getting concussions during the off season. Johan’s Knee injury was minor and he wants to pitch in the WBC, but thinks the mets won’t let him… Proves to me he is healthy.
ill try to address your concerns with the way i see them
1. ollie’s inconsistency/sheets’ health
- very valid here, although the saying is lefties take longer to “get going” than righties so ollie could take off.
- we have redding and neise as insurance for sheets’ health
2. maine not going far enough into games
-hopefully with the bonespur removed, and peterson removed maine could bring back his curve as an out pitch and get further into games
3. total lack of production at 2nd base
-agree, however castillo knows his career is on the line here. im willing to give him this year to come back healthy and prove what he can do. 2b didnt sink us last year and he will be better than anything else we could put there
4. total lack of offensive/defensive ability at catcher
-schnieder was league avg offensively and defensively. yes we’d like better, but do we have the pieces to trade for a better C?
5. duaner and pedro in the bullpen
-duaner was coming off of surgery, first year back. he ran out of gas. his first half ERA was in the 3’s and his second half was in the 6’s. i think a full year removed from surgery and with conditioning he can be great in the 7th again.
-pedro had an off year last year. i am still a little leery about him, but everyone knows middle relief is a c-shoot, so him rebounding isnt out of the question.
6. delgado coming down to earth
-delgado also was finally healthy in the second half after a broken rist and hand surgery. he will produce next year, maybe not at his torrid pace of the 2nd half last year, but will still produce.
7. will pelfrey be as good as last year?
-will improve, dont forget he was a first round pick and really started to excel.
8. johan coming off surgury
-so far reports suggest he is on his current offseason routine, i wouldnt worry about him
9. concussed church
-fully healthy now, will be fine next season
10. murphy’s slump to end last season
-didnt have time to adjust before the season ended. he had a slump in the middle of sept, made adustments and rebounded. id be more concerned about his leg injury (and any nagging effects) and everyone questioning his D.
that said, LETS GO METS!
I’m just gonna touch on your concerns about the pitching because my opinions about our offense start and end w/ ManRam.
I am one of the few that believes Oliver Perez will become a stud. An absolute monster who is a threat to strike out 10+ and/or hold the opposition to three or fewer runs each time out. The kid is only 27. Hopefully we’ll sign him and 2-3 years from today we will be penciling him in at the top of our rotation.
I like Maine a lot despite his inconsistencies. At 28 (in May) he is another one with good stuff who I can envision turning the corner and heading our rotation. The funny thing is there has been all this talk about Perez not going deep into games (probably because he is under scrutiny as a possible FA signing) when, in fact, Maine had more starts of less than 6 IP than Perez in fewer games started. Perhaps the fact that eight of those 12 starts were from June 30 and on suggests that his shoulder was the reason for his struggles. Look for him to improve overall this season.
I’m excited about Pelfrey. He’s gonna have his struggles but he is established (in the sense that he won’t be a deer in headlights) and he has upside. At worst he’ll be our 4th starter, in a perfect world we’d plug him into the 5th slot. Either way he can continue to develop without too much pressure on him. To address your concern better, I think that the net gain we get from Pelfrey will be about the same as last year whether he improves or regresses a tad. I can’t say which it will be but other than improving his K/BB after the AS break I don’t see any signs that suggest a huge leap and obviously I’m hoping against a significant regression.
As far as our bullpen is concerned we can say that we’ll be playing seven inning games this season (knock on wood). What this means to me is that we need to find a “7th inning closer or closer-by-committee”. Getting six innings from our starters isn’t a given, but it’s certainly something that we can reasonably expect. This would create the need to cross a 3-out bridge which should be easy with the combined efforts of Feliciano, Green, Parnell, Sanchez, etc. Basically, the middle relief should feel less pressure and will perform better with less responsibility placed upon them. My biggest concern is striking the right balance so that our starters and bullpen are strong and have enough gas in the tank for a deep postseason run.
Johan will be fine. Just keep your fingers crossed that the Mets prohibit him from pitching in the WBC.
One thing that helps keep the entire pitching staff fresh and productive is an offense that scores a lot of runs (cough cough)…..
all team have slump
He’s a blogger, not Walter Cronkite. Man, people love to nitpick…
Matt, you did fine…
guys if we had billy wagner for the whole season last year we in the playoff
not neccesarily.. but at least our 9th inning problems would’ve not been as bad.. remmeber he had 7 blown saves by july!! he’s armando benitez lefty version..
METS will be good this year remember wright and reyes will be better this year and so will beltran
my prediction is :
THE 2009 NL MVP: JOSE REYES!!
WHAT? It is not going to be Manny as first ever Met MVP?!?!
kingman:
hear me on this one.. of manny is a met, then either wright or beltran will be the MVP..
beltran aka ELESTAQUI = ‘09 MVP
no way he is not that bad
you right every team has slumps but what is omar dong to prevent it?
not enough
alot of those 7 bown saves was because of bad fielding as i can recall and most of those game all he had was 1 run to play with
Yeah wagner was not as bad as the 7 blown saves indicated. I remember his first blown save of the year was a Matt Holiday home run to tie a 1-run game on a ball by his ankles.
This is also a guy that pitched what 10 HITLESS innings to start the year. If he never hurt his arm, this couldve been a great year.
I agree with adding Dunn’s bat. As good as Delgado was last year, I also remember the two months that he was really bad. Plus a power hitter is only as good as the bat behind him. If you have Dunn in the lineup behind Delgado, they can pitch around him to get to Dunn. Dunn may come with 200 K’s a year but he also walks a lot and brings 40+ HR’s to the table which is great protection for Delgado and a lot more run production.
Supposed to say the Can’t pitch around Delgado not that they can pitch around him.
omar did a good job with the bullpen now but it dont stop there……….we had 2 collapses
u canot prevent slump u can only minmize it….the good team does not slump for half the season……anyway u look at it all teams have slumps
you right in every way but paying for the same starting line up thats not minmizing anything
well you count dunn out because omar wanted Raul Ibanez and did nothing about that.
Maybe not—Dunn is 7 years younger than Ibanez….
I agree about the slumps. We lost 29 games last year after the 8th inning. With K-Rod, Putz and possibly Wagner in August that # should come way down.
we did not collapses last year…….do you know the definition of collapses IRONMAN…..2007 season is wat i call collapses
o yes it is. we was up 7 games. only thing we had to do is win.
lack of bullpen help
lack of hitting
lack of good starting picthing
santana was good down the wire. the last game he pitch was hella good
Personally I don’t see Omar adding a big bat. I do see him trying to get Matt Holliday at the trade deadline.
that’s right in ‘08 the mets feel short
WEREN’T WE AHEAD WITH 17 GAMES TO PLAY ONLY AGAISNT THE CUBS WITH A WINNING RECORD??? HOW DO YOU CALL THAT!!
i think all we need right now is OLI and SHEETS go into season and see where we at and take it from there
I actually wrote an extensive piece on Dunn yesterday and just psoted it. I’m all for getting him on this team, and I have some surprising info on Murphy and Tatis for those who are concerned about Dunn’s K’s and defense..
Fine piece and points….Dunn has 40 HR and 100 BB five years in a row.
But, as others have pointed out, maybe he would be better in the 2 hole here…true, batting 6th he would get pitched around and walk a lot, but in the 2 hole, he would see a zillion fastballs, and be batting with Jose distracting the pitchers a lot, so maybe he would really bash there.
I do think that Dunn is the best guy out there for us.
Funny thing that either Dunn or Abreu if signed would seem best suited here for
the 2 hole for the reasons noted above and
also b/c they both see alot of pitches.
This would certainly give some length to
the lineup
Can you post the Dunn and murphy/tatis piece here? id like to read it
can’t blame it all on omar for last year…….some player just did not step it up
im not blaming it on him last year. im blaming him for some of these stupid off session moves. like instead of upgrading your starting line up. you buy the same one
What u can blame omar for last yr though
was signing both Alou & castillo thus having
2 big spots in the lineup #2&5/6 manned by
guys whos health couldn’t be trusted to hold
up.Truth be told,Omar avoided acomplete
disaster in the OF last yr b/c of lucking out
w/Tatis(for a while anyway). Again though,
we’re stuck w/castillo and yet omar still
hasn’t addressed the need for a reliable
corner OF run producer.Even in this depressed market.NOW THAT is unforgivable
Why do so many of you have to say the same stupid and tired comments on every video blog about his demeanor?
I’d like to see all the critics get in front of a camera and do the same thing…
Can’t we just debate the topic like we used to…
Geez, enough already…
Omar have built a good team here am sorry but before omar got here we was not playing for a playoff spot we was playing for 4th place
We weren’t up 7 games last year. That was 2007. Last year the best we did was go up 3 games.
I agree with the lack of bullpen and losing Wagner didn’t help.
I agree with lack of SP and losing Maine didn’t help.
I agree with lack of hitting and losing Church, Tatis and both of our catchers during the season didn’t help. I would mention losing Castillo but I think that one is addition by subtraction.
Last year wasn’t a collapse. We just weren’t deep enough as a team to overcome all the injuries.
Yup. That’s the way I see it too. Considering all the injuries not the least of which was Wagner and Maine and parading 7 different LFs. out there, it’s a wonder we even were close going down the wire.
how can you say something like that before we enter last session we sign old alou. then you knew we need a LF and nady was there for the taken and you didnt bite. he help up get to the playoff in 2006 remember. he brought balance to our line up. so you stick wit a rookie and a has been to help the hitting in the line up and now you blame it on injuries. come on now
Nice job Mr.Cerrone BUT Delgado “Checked-
-Out” for two months? A little harsh given the
fact that he was still recovering f/a ton of injuries and was trying to get his timing back
back.But no doubt,for the 3rd off season in a row the single most obvious need is a RH,
corner OF,Proven RBI bat(outside of pitching–
-ofcourse).And please dont tell me he signed
and resigned Alou b/c the 1st time was a bad
enough error which Omar then compounded
by doing it again. Manny is the Obvious
choice BUT Mr.Wilpons not gonna let that
happen. So, where do we go? Abreu?Dunn?
I know neither is a perfect fit(And not rightys)
But they are proven,productive MLBers Who
from all accts we could now get on the cheap.
This is a MUST.Especially if the answer behind Johan,pelf&maine is gonna be Wolf
and not Ollie.But you certainly seem more
at ease i/f/o the camera than when you first
started.Good Job!
That’s what i said too…..even if we had wagner for an extra month we win the division we was the best team in the division all year we took care of philly only when our bullpen fell apart thats where it all started
METS will win the NL East this year please believe me……
i believe.. if our offense is the same as last year we’d have the division wrapped up by sept 16th with only 18 games to play.
(note i use 18 coz 17 is our unlucky number)
you cant say that im a die heart mets fan. our line up hasnt been the same since 2006. im not sayin get nady again i like him though but get a consisteint bat in there than you can say that
look at the CUBS they was the best team all year but they just slump at the wrong time
i think we all know that the best team from NL did not make it to the WS last year
and who was that fresh?? can u elaborate??
the last piece to this club=bobby valentine
OR Ellis Valentine!
jerry manuel is a good manager and handle the media and the players better than we expected.. dan w is a good pitching coach, the only issue is hojo.. he is not a good of a coach.. it shows by our inconsistant troughou the whole year..
with all the bown save and how poor the pitching is the mets was 6th in the NL in ERA and 2nd in runs scored……Pelfrey going to be better than last year he just learning how to pitch
blown*
the philly scored the same amoutn of runs as we did….we had a better batting average than them…….they pitching ERA was 0.19 better than us and they won it all…….now we have Putz n Krod i don’t see why we can’t win
amount
the phillys had 47SV and no blown SV…..the mets on the other hand had 43SV and a MIllion Blown save and we lost the division by 3 games tell how we not better than the philly
the only thing we did not have is the HR ball but look where they play the next best thing to coors field
LOL