According to SNY’s Kevin Burkhardt, Freddy Garcia told reporters that his shoulder is doing well.
Garcia said he expects to be in the team’s starting rotation, adding, “Otherwise, I’ll pitch some place else.”
…frankly, i think it’s his job to lose at this point… i feel the team is comfortable with using Tim Redding as a long man, knowing he can step in to the rotation from the bullpen… also, i believe, though he can be ready if need be, the Mets would rather let Jon Niese get more work in Triple-A, before committing him to a rotation slot… of course, all of the above remains to be seen, as it will play out during March…
To hear more from Burkhardt, and see clips from the day’s action in St. Lucie, watch SportsNite on SNY every night at 10 pm.
{ 109 comments }
So much for being Alex’s “long man.”
Garcia said he expects to be in the team’s starting rotation, adding, “Otherwise, I’ll pitch some place else.”
Nice first impression withouth having thrown a single pitch.. nice,.. don’t let the door hit you on ur way out..
the guy wants it, wouldn’t you rather a guy be like that, wanting a job, then saying, well whatever, i don’t really care? he’s motivated and wants a job, yet you have to find negativity. Why don’t you go shove it you a hole.
So both Garcia and Redding expect to be in the starting rotation to begin the year?
Uh-oh.
Sounds like Garcia’s being a baby about it though, while Redding is showing a bit more maturity.
Well redding has said he is open to being in the pen….
”It’s my as.sumption, and I’ve been told that I’ve been brought in here to be a starting pitcher – bottom line,” -Redding, yesterday
(in the Post)
First Redding and Garcia have to make it through ST healthy. not as easy as it sounds.
Redding during his conference call after signing:
“Starter, reliever, it doesn’t matter to me,”
Chosen, You forgot the rest of his statement
“I’ll do whatever they need because I”m a
terrible Pitcher and am thankful for a job”.
LMAO… good one fongu
lo fukin l
I didn’t see that, Prismo.
I guess these gorwn up millionaires will have to s*ck it up. May the best man win.
Personally, I think that if Garcia is healthy (a huge IF, I know) that we are much better off with him in the rotation and Redding in the pen than vice versa (or someone other than Garcia in the pen).
I dobut that even if healthy Garcia can return to form at the front of the staff. But I don’t doubt that he can be much better than a 4.
Redding is a 5 and on a 4 on a good day.
Holycrap Wanny, on what good day is
Redding a #4?-Winter Ball in Puerto Rico,
on a bad team? He’s got nothing to say!
If the Big Chief is healthy and half of what
he was before injuries,he’s twice the Pitcher
Redding is!
Of course, I didn’t say Garcia was better than Redding by why let the point get in the way of your thoughts?
Redding was pretty good in April and May of last year, 6-3 with an ERA well under 4. So for at least two months he was better than a 5, which seems to comport with what I actually did say — that on a good day he can be a 4.
I should say that I didn;t say Redding was better than Garcia.
In any event, I know full well that Fongu wouldn’t let the facts affect his point of view.
Yeah, this is a quote straight from Redding (I’m surprised it hasn’t been its own post here):
“It’s my a*umption, and I’ve been told that I’ve been brought in here to be a starting pitcher, bottom line,” Redding said. “I went through this for four years in Houston, being told that I have to compete against a bunch of guys. They brought me in here, and I’ve got a guaranteed contract. I didn’t have to beg them for a job, so it’s got to make me feel like I have the upper hand.”
Some competition is good, but both guys are older and seem to feel entitled to that 5th spot. I don’t know that it could turn ugly, but …. maybe it can?
what are you looking for him to say he is a starter. I mean if he get send down to the minors he will move on if he is good enogh he will start thats the bottom line is not about being a baby. Im an architect and if i go to job as a project manager and i get told no you will be an intern I would look for work somewhere else.
with the state of the economy today, you might be better served just bucking up and taking some coffee orders
This is the best comment I have read in a long time.
I actually like the feistiness. The Mets like to create competition in situations like this, and if the competitors get a little charged up about it, so much the better.
I don’t know that Redding has any expectation and has already said that he will pitch in the pen.
Anyway, Redding has a guaranteed contract and will have to do what he is told.
If garcia doesn’t want to pitch in the pen, he can be cut and the Mets don’t have to worry about him.
right…if garcia makes it..redding to the long man and stokes stays in AAA. If garcia gets cut or doesnt make it, redding to SP, stokes to long man, niese back up….
Stokes is out of options. If he doesn’t make the pen out of ST, he will either have to be traded or released (since I doubt he makes it through waivers, unless he has a really dismal spring).
Of course, there is also the real possibility that someone else gets hurt freeing up a spot. So really, way too early to worry about it.
I woundn’t mind them moving Stokes and a lower level prospect for a guy like Wily Mo Pena, who doesn’t really have a spot in the Nats outfield, and they always need bullpen guys.
Any word on the status of Chad Cordero?
The same problem we have with Stokes is the same problem another team would have. He’s out of options. Best case is he is traded for another player who is out of options.
Less the prospect and its done ravi.
Good idea, Stokes for Wily Mo.
I’m wondering myself what the heck they’re doin’ there in D.C w/all the OFers,1B&2B
they have
What about Marlon Byrd? Texas has a crowded OF and always needs pitching. He would be another decent RH that can play all 3 OF positions. Not to mention he played for the Nats :)
Thereal:
Nats need the arms just as much…Also, I would rather Wily Mo Pena because he is a much bigger power threat, and has a fantastic upside…he is simply a guy that was rushed, and never saw enough playing time.
Here we go again. 2009, THERE WILL NEVER BE A BETTER TIME. Let’s Go Mets!!!
“Never a better time?” I dont know about that.
I hope this is a true position battle, don’t just give it to Garcia because he can’t handle alittle comp.
If Redding puts up a fuss, then he is nuts because he is clearly next in line if someone goes down. The odds of someone going down are pretty good.
he’s gunna start or he’ll go pitch someplace else? where? triple A?
I as sume the pen.
How’s he gonna put up a fuss?
If The Chief has a good&healthy spring–
He’s the #5.He’s been a top of the rotation
guy whos always Won while Redding is a
journeyman who has been unable to find
a spot most of the time.Even on bad teams.
Looking at stats, name 2 #5 starters in the NL that had better numbers than Redding last year.
do you realize maine’s number were as if he was a #5?? and oliver wasn’t no #3 either.. at best he’s our #4.. why u keep bringing this stupid fact??
What’s your point Alex? I already said I was not letting you bring me in, but I will try and provide a logic post that you can understand.
Yes we are missing a true #2. What does that have to do with Redding? He was brought in to compete for the #5 spot. Thus it is very relevant that he would make a very good number 5. Did I say in this post that our rotation is lights out? It’s solid and missing a #2 unless someone steps up.
But again, what does that have to do with one of the guys who is competing for our #5?
gracias alex. Yeah, I forgot how good redding
was last yr!—10-11 w/a 5era,allowing 260+
baserunners in 180innings and 27hrs in
his best/walk year,playing for money on a
bad team with absolutely no pressure on
him at all. Yeah, he’s REAL good!
And after actually figuring out what you were saying in the post you are really insane. Do you know what league average is for a #5? It for sure is not John Maine who had an ERA of 4.18 and a WHIP 1.35. Those are better than league average numbers and would put him in the middle of the league’s #3 pitchers, and that’s with him having a down year. Same thing for Perez. Truthfully we have
1 Santana
3 Pelfrey
3 Maine
3 Perez
5 Redding/Garcia
Pelf has potential to be #2.
I think all 3 of them have potential to be #2’s in a given season. Which is why I said unless one of them step up.
Based on pedigree,expectations and performance(after April)last year–Pelfrey
should be our #2, followed by Ollie&Maine.
Since Omar did the minimum in addressing
our #5 spot, A healthy Garcia should clearly
be given the opp to be that guy.
Redding is an afterthought on a good/contending team.His 4 previous teams
haven’t been wrong about this guy nor have
they failed to give him an honest chance.
I took TRS up on this challenge a few months ago and found he was right.
Go look at Kyle Kendrick and Adam Eaton’s stats.
If I remember correctly only Jason Marquis, among the good NL clubs, had better stats than Redding as far as #5s go.
I’m not sure what the exact numbers would be, but Pelf’s numbers in June, July, and August are outstanding. Def worth #2 and #1 for some teams.
Why put the pressure on Pelfrey to be the #2 is my thinking. Yeah he had a break out last year, but it’s really time for Ollie and/or Maine to as.sume that mantle. In doing so, they take the pressure off of Pelfrey although I agree with you if he pitches anything like he did last year he is on his way to that #2.
Wanny they will keep ignoring the question because it kills their arguement. I guess they expected the Mets to have another #3 be a #5. To say they did the minimum to address the #5 spot is just plain silly. What team did more for their #5 spot than the Mets? Redding would rank out as one of the best #5’s in the league and there is still a good chance that Garcia beats him out. To me that is the definition of addressing a need. Get one of the league’s best and then get a guy that has a great chance of beating him out.
Just admit it Fongu you are not going to answer the question because you can’t and keep your arguement.
Fong, just answer the question. Seriously. Answer the question.
Dude, your question makes no sense.
you want to know what the “Average”#5SP
is compared to Redding but your entire
premise is off base(no pun).To look at
the “average”#5 means we include the likes
of those on the staffs of Wash,Pitt,SD,Tex,Sea,Oak,KC,Balt AND a #
of other teams which are just plain BAD!
We should be comparing our staff to contending teams and others who actually
spend money in attempt to “Play meaningful
games in September”. Is Redding good enough to be a #5 or even a #4 on one of the
teams I mentioned above? Yeah, Most likely
BUT even thats no sure bet. Could he even
make the RedSox,Yankees,Rays,Indian,Angel,Phillie,
Cub,Giant,Dodger etc,etc,Staffs??
Not even close.
Does that answer your Question?
See below, Redding was better than the #5s on Milwaukee, Philly, LA, Arizona and St. Loo.
Good job, Fongu. Good job.
Nope, as Wanny pointed out even the contending teams had worse #5 starters. So again, I ask you who was better. How does my question not make sense. Either you are too dumb to understand it or you know the answer kills your arguement.
Not only could he have made the Phillies last season, he might have been their #3 because Kendrick was just as bad as Eaton.
By the way. I researched Redding’s numbers a couple of weeks ago. He would have been in the top 35 of qualified starters in ERA, WHIP, Innings. How is that not a solid #5?
Funny that he lumped the Yankees into that mix. Did he know the Yankees got 59 awful awful starts from Rasner, Ponson, Kennedy, Hughes and Pavano?
Could Redding have made that group? The LOWEST ERA among that group was 5.40.
Fongu – you’re embara$$ing yourself.
Micah Owings, 5.93 ERA in 104 IP (77 ERA+)
Jason Marquis, 4.53 ERA in 167 IP (99 ERA+)
Brad Penny, 6.27 ERA in 95 IP (68 ERA+)
Jeff Suppan, 4.96 ERA in 177 IP (87 ERA+)
Adam Eaton, 5.80 ERA in 108 IP (75 ERA+)
Joel Pineiro, 5.15 ERA in 148 IP (83 ERA+)
Tim Redding, 4.95 ERA in 192 IP (89 ERA+)
Only Marquis was better and Redding still saved his bullpen 25 more IP.
And everyone of the guys you named would
be preferrable to Redding based on their
respective prior histories and/or their
potential/stuff(not to mention,Ownings could
hit more then our second basemen).
Wow, what the heck!? is this guy related
to Redding? I mean, I know he’s from
New York and all BUT the guys just not
been a very good pitcher throughout his
career.
Exactly which of these re-treads are so desirable?
Suppan and Marquis are the closest but Marquis makes $10m and Suppan makes more than $13m. Both were expected to be more than 5s.
You want Adam Eaton? You want Brad Penny who can’t stay on the mound? Joel Pineiro???
Go ahead.
And your point was that Redding was not good enough make these staffs. He pitched better thanb all of these pitchers (and more) on those staffs. Prior performances have nothing to do with it. He proved he can pitch at the back end of a rotation.
Again, answer the question. NAME 2 #5 STARTING PITCHERS IN THE NL THAT HAD BETTER NUMBERS THAN REDDING LAST YEAR.
Until then you are a joke on this blog.
I am not saying he is an allstar, or even good over all pitcher. But based on numbers he is a VERY good #5.
As usualy, you’re missing the point. No one cares what Adam Eaton did ten years ago or what Joel Pineiro did as a reliever 6 years ago.
The fact of the matter is that Redding was a better pitcher than the back end of most of the good NL staffs, whether Owings can hit or not.
Wait a second wanny, we may be talkin’
about two diff things here. I’m saying
Redding isn’t a good # 5 based on his history
for THIS YEARS Mets(or other contenders)
And you’re throwin’ names and stats of guys
who were #5s on the yanks and other
contenders from last year and comparing
them. What I’ve been trying to say here is
Do you think Tim Redding is a better #5
coming into 2009 then the #5s on the other
12-15 or so teams that think/hope to win
the Series this year? My contention is:
HE DOESNT MAKE THE STAFFS OF THOSE
OTHER TEAMS! Thats all! Do you understand?
Because who is better? Who would keep him from making those staffs? Adam Eaton, Aaron Heilman?
Dude, your question about “name 2 #5Sps-
who were better then Redding last year”
Is Absurd!–HE WASNT THE #5 SP-on his
team last year! What the freak are you talkin’ about??
I don’t know how the other #5s are going to pitch this year. But I do know that they did not pitch as well last season as Tim Redding.
And generally speaking #5s don’t pitch well at all. That’s why they are #5s.
This year the Phillies have a rookie, Kendrick and Park battling it out for the 5th spot. Would you be so confident in that troika?
Fongu — it gets worse for you every time you type.
True, he wasn’t the 5 last year for Washington. He was probably their ace.
But he will be the Mets 5 and that’s why you compare him to other 5s. And since he will likely be pitching against other 5s, you may see his win pctg. increase even further.
First of all Adam Eaton isn’t the Phillies
#5 and wasn’t after they got Blanton Last
year. Second,as much as He broke our
hearts, if you think Tim Redding is a better
Pitcher then Aaron Heilman-You simply
don’[t know what you’re talking about.
You mean to tell me that, at the same contract
amount you would rather have Heilmann
in the #5 spot then Tim Redding-Who again
even with last season is a Well-below average MLB Pitcher?
All of the teams who are represented by the terrible pitchers listed above played well last season. Some even made the playoffs. Yet, only one of them achieved the success with a 5th starter as good as Redding.
THAT’s the point. The Mets are in better shape than all of those teams were last season — seasons in which they played well.
Joe Blanton is listed by the Phillies as 4th on their depth chart. That’s number one.
Number two, the Phillies had to trade for Blanton because the bottom of their rotation was so bad.
Number three, after Blanton was acquired that slotted Kendrick down to #5. And if you want to tell me that Kendrick was their three or four, then that will only prove that Redding was better than their 3 or 4.
Give up. Please.
The Mets evidently don’t believe Heilman can be an effective starting pitcher.
And if you want to compare career track records, Heilman doesn’t have one as a starter.
Why is it so difficult for you to realize that 5th starters are generally journeymen types and that Redding is as good as any?
I am stubborn as anyone. And I had to make that admission.
Ok!, So if you think Redding is a better #5
then Kendrick(whos still a kid) OR
Heilman then hey,God blessyou.
We have to agree to disagree.
Tim Redding is simply not a good MLB
pitcher and it doesn’t comfort me to have
him as our #5 nor obviously does it comfort
Omar,hence the reason he signed Garcia
hoping he has recovered from his arm
problems. I must take exception though
with your personal insults as there unwarranted but atleast I’m secured with
the knowledge that face to face you wouldnt
be so condescending.
Theres really no need for it. Especially since
I personally never treat any other poster
that way. But hey, it says alot about you.
No one personally insulted you any worse than your a$$ertions and characterizations that the question asked was “absurd” and the tone of your questions like “what the freak are you talking about?”
You were asked a question that you could not answer favorably to your point of view. Rather than admitting you might have been wrong you decided to try to change the character of the question.
Don’t be so sensitive.
Holycrap man, you’ve got some set calling
someone stubborn. And shame on me for
getting involved in this in the first place.
You move the argument back and forth b/t
what Redding did last year with the Nats
who really it didn’t matter how you label
their SPs 1,2,3,4or5 because they all werent
any good AND my contention that Redding
cant be counted on as a “Solid”#5 on a
contending team. NOW, you just did it again,
Yes, the Phillies are lookin’@ Kendrick as
their #5 THIS YEAR! -LASt YEAR,their #5
WAS EATON. But he wasn’t any good so they
went out and got Blanton who basically replaced the guy(eaton) who they saw as their #5 until that point. NOW, you can label
guys however you want but within a few weeks into the season because of scheduling and days off, your #5 can start
after your Ace or #2 etc.. So it becomes only
a matter of perception as to what “Number–
Starter” a guy is until very late in the season
of course.So, You can be happy with Redding
whos never given any indication of being even a “solid” much less “good” MLB Pitcher
And I’ll stick with my education and experienced thought and belief that either
A) Garcia,if healthy will take the job from him.
B)Niese,if he continues to develop will take
the job from him at some point. OR
C)Parnell,if not put in the pen,will take the job.
I’d like to add something if I may, Tim Redding is a very good #5 pitcher to have and every team with the exception of the Red Sox would gladly take him especially given his contract. and HReilman is a decent reliever and an awful starter… I’m not sure why so many people on here are high on him.
if garcia is finally healthy, he can be a beast. just saying
I’m curious to hear how his comment was said in person. I mean my instant reaction from seeing the print “Garcia said he expects to be in the team’s starting rotation, adding, “Otherwise, I’ll pitch some place else.”” makes me think that he’s basically demanding the spot and saying it’s starting or he wants out. But we’ll see….
Unless he means that I will pitch in the pen?
But, maybe there is a gentleman’s agreement to trade or release him if he does not make the #5 starter?
That’s what I was thinking – he was saying if I’m not going to be the #5 then they will give me my release and i will try and hook on with someone else. Agreed, reading that snipet is sounds a little off putting, but hey, the guy has been a good starter and still thinks he can do it. I’m from Mizzou (not really ) so Show Me.
“Garcia said he expects to be in the team’s starting rotation, adding, [If ya smelllllllllalalalalaaaa, what the FRED, is cookin]“
hahahhaha! Thats pretty good!
Redding and Garcia meeting for the first time:
Redding: ‘Hi, I’m T..’
Garcia (interrupting): ‘It doesn’t matter what you’re name is’
you’re or your?
I know. I know. I noticed it after I hit submit.
Hey……You caught my first spelling error.!!!!
Nice.!!
it’s too bad that we can’t edit what we have said.. i’ve had few of those oops posts..
I hear ya.
I was clicking on it trying to change it right when I hit submit. Oh well.
lol, i had a good laugh at that.. very nice,,
I am starting to feel a little better about Garcia. If he is really healthy he is just a year removed from a 17 win season for th chi sox and 15 the year before that. He also had over 200 innings in both of his prior years before last years injury. If he is back in health he should be more than adequate as the number 5 starter.
Get this team last, me first guy on the first bus out of St Lucie. Overpaid, underproducing player, making demands already. My new hate guy on this team. Get him oput of town.
Hey Matt,
How about something on Sanchez….I feel his might be the single most important person that could really make or break our season. I just want to know if he has gotten his velocity back up, if he’s in shape and how’s he feeling. The old pre-taxi accident version of Mr. Dirty would be an amazing 7-8-9 and put us over the top. Just was hoping that might be something you could look into for us Mets fans
Someone should tell Freddy to shut up and pitch.
Does he pitch? Or are you just being a blithering idiot in yet another topic?
The “Typical Mets Fan” is not this big of an idiot. Go cheer for the Dodgers.
The latter. You have to wonder how old someone has to be to act so immature…
You can disagree with my comment, but are insults necessary?
He’s probably Scott Boras.
agreed…i think we shoudl just ignore these types of posts because all they are looking for is attention..why give it to them you know…
LOL!!
fongu if ever engaged a ponint with TRS ur never gonna win, he’s alway right.. and wanny.. forget it, he’s another TRS’s as-s kisser.. they don’t seem to view this team past their bias for it..
You actually CAN win with those guys, you just have to make a reasonable case to back up your point.
alex, some observers might say that you don’t seem to view this team past your bias against it…
This is a stupid statement — even for you.
You must not recall my urging to sign Lowe instead of Perez or my displeasure with the signing of Cora.
But I guess if by biased you mean that I am willing to look at facts, address arguments directly and refusal to rush to criticize even the most minor and inconsequential of moves without any thought as to what the purpose or surrounding circumstances may be — then I guess you’re right.
The fact is you do all of these things without ever intellectually considering the factors leading to a decision or any of the relevant factual information easily available to you by the Internet.
how can you say against it grave? i see the point for what it is, reality, see the nest thread and u see 2 valid point i make about this team and davi wright.. i love the team but i don’t love the way the team has been run for the past 3 years..
addressed to alex, not hebner.
The team has been run so horribly the last three years?
Right, in 2006 they were a pitch away from the World Series and the following two seasons they were literally a game away from consecutive post seasons.
We have the highest payroll in the NL and have four of the league’s best players.
We’re practically the Pirates.
This is precisely the bias you have against the team. You can’t expect a championship every season.
But once in a while you could perhaps post something with clarity, thought and fact.
Alex —
since you’ve decided to be so personal, I don’t mind saying that your point about “Davi Wright” is stupid, thoughtless and completely ignorant of facts, history and past performance. Of course, you latch on to one small sub-sample (his RISP in 2008) because it promotes your depressing doom and gloom view of the world and justifies your depressing view of life.
Career avg/obp/slg in:
RISP
Close and Late
High leverage
Wright
300/394/501
307/407/483
315/397/531
And even though “Davi” hit poorly with RISP this season he still performed well in “pressure” situations.
High leverage: .324 .420 .477
Close and late: .286 .412 .464
In any event, I guess the 124 runs he drove in and the 115 runs he scored don’t count as much as the other runs you feel the team missed.
alex, I say that because in the past you admitted to me that you blast most of the Met decision making so that you can either be very happy when they do better than you expect, or you can say I told you so when they don’t. That’s why I say that. You view that as realistic, I view it as negative, and that is the fundamental difference between us. End of the day we both love this team, but in drastically different ways.
Yeah, wont waste my time again.
Seems some on this blog like to engage
in arguments and tell you how dopey you
are for having an opinion. Instead of just
disagreeing w/ the opinion. Unbelievable but
after 2hrs all I was trying to say is I dont think
Redding is a very good pitcher. #4 or #5
Whatever.He’s just not real good. If you’re
a .500 or worse team and want someone
to eat innings,OK maybe BUT if the goal is
to Win-you want Tim Redding in your rotation?
I don’t, Some do.So be it. Unlike some others
I’m not trying to change anyone’s mind nor
do I begrudge them their opinion. I’ll been involved with,employed by and a fan of this
game for 35years now. I think i know when i
see a journeyman,below average Pitcher
and thats what Redding is.I never said we
cantwin with him as our #5 and I hope we do
and he has a career best season. I just dont
feel its likely and dont feel safe with him in
that position. For that, I’m stubborn,dumb etc?
Yes Alex. I have many who kiss my as s and you have many that tell you to kiss their’s. Stinks to be you.
From Rock/Freddy Garcia quotes to David Wright’s apparent failure in the clutch.
Alex, you sir, are a troll.
I’ve been a Mets fan since 1966.
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