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MetsBlog reader Bobby K points out in an e-mail, the Mets are 0-5 in the final game of a series this season, during which they could sweep, be swept, or win the best of three.
So, given the end of the last two seasons, do this group of players have a problem with finishing strong? Are they capable of ending with a win? Or, like so many people ask me in emails, “Where is their killer instinct?”
Personally, I believe emphasizing heart, passion, killer instincts, etc., among baseball fans is over blown.
However, there is certainly something to the idea of ‘finishing strong,’ since coaches in every sport, including Jerry Manuel, speak about it constantly.
In the end, the Mets are a just not playing good baseball right now, and when they do, the wins will come – regardless of the size of their hearts.
The question is, when they do start playing better, and winning, will thos specific group of players be able to close the deal?
Because they don’t have one.
Their killer instinct died with the Beltran curveball in 2006.
The sad part is that it will take management 3 + years to realize that, and they will only see it when Citi Field is EMPTY.
“sure the seats are empty but the fans are all admiring our rotunda – have you heard of jackie robinson? – and enjoying world class amenities!”
LOL
i’ll be here all year folks! try the pulled pork!
stink fish taco for u
speaking of killer instinct, we really need a c-c-c-c-c-combo breaker!
alternatively, they are not a very good team
it’s my fault. everytime i pull the trigger and buy the mlb cable tv package the mets tank. i usually wait till the end of the season as it’s a bit cheaper and i really don’t need to watch six games a week but this year i decided to do it early.
btw, $225.00 and 20 games a night i don’t care about just sucks. not to mention no pregame/postgame and dubious quality.
Well, it clearly your fault. We now have the reason. Please cancel ASAP.
i would but you can’ t just cancel with the cable company. they send a guy around.
No.
Now playing the New York Mets of 1993 with Gary Sheffield playing the part of Bobby Bo.
i have a poll idea:
would you prefer the mets suck wire-to-wire with little to no rational playoff hope, or put together a nice run in the summer only to crush your soul in september?
suck wire to wire…..at least that may force the issue
I tried to believe these guys would come out swinging with something to prove; as men!
That being said, I struggled with it; having watched this basically, same group go through the motions waiting for payday for a while now. I am stunned we did not improve our starting 5. I am stunned we did not seek a “hammer”. I wish I could say I’m surprised by their play, it is uninspired, frustrating and infuriating. I don’t want to be the “new” Cubs fans. I want a ream that plays neat, hard, and smart. I ain’t got that or anything like it!
Same guys. Same results. Too bad for us!
I meant “team”
not “ream”
Fraudian slip!
The bottom line is, the Mets DO lack a killer instinct. Some of these guys see the game through the lens of a 162 game season, which is all well and good for a GM, and even for a manager, but players? They need a sense of urgency everyday, to go out there and win THAT day, and not have what seems to be our current line of thinking, which is, oh, well we have a bunch of talent, so over the course of the year, we’ll be fine.
its clear this is a weak team. from guys not planting Yadier Molina into the dirt, to our starters showing absolutely no guts whatsoever, to not stepping up and being the guy who gets the big hit. everyone seems scared to fail. and that may be why they are failing.
and i obviously DON’T include Johan as weak. Dude’s the best pitcher in the game bar-none.
SIGN PEDRO NOW, put livan as the long man and drop fossum….its worth a shot.
The 2+ seasons from “swing Beltran swing!” to “slide Beltran slide!,” it’s been a heartless ride for the Mets. They’ve had the overall talent to get things done (or at least win one of those wussy wild card spots), but they’re a gutless group who’ve shown again and again, they play not to lose, instead of grabbing victory by the throat. There are individual exceptions, of course. Johan’s an undisputed warrior. I won’t label any of the other new(er) guys either. But at the core we have a group of fantasy league stat studs who play scared when true winners are supposed to grab victory by the throat.
word
You nailed it. Outside of johan i think whenever a met is in a big spot they think “why me!” instead of “yes,its my time to shine.” If johan can pitch a complete game shutout injured, the rest of these losers should be able to get a single with two men on and two out, or a homerun to put the game away.if you keep allowing teams to come back and beat you, they will.
to answer your question matt, no
Bottomline is the mets will always be losers, and the yankees will allways be winners. I don’t think you can find a bigger yankee hater in this world or mets fan, i watch every single game that i can since i can remember and as much as it pains me to say it, its true. No matter who this team brings in no matter who the develop, they will always be losers. This is the last year i will ever buy tickets until the mets make the world series. you want to call me a front runner go ahead, i’m still going to watch every game,and convince myself every season that this really is the year, but i refuse to spend my money going to these games anymore,and paying 5 bucks for a shit hot dog, 20 to park and 23 to sit in the nosebleeds.
the hot dogs are MUCH better this year
while its ok that your opinion is that the Mets are losers, i fail to see how that correlates to this line of thinking. For me, going to a game is about the experience of being at the game, being with friends, watching baseball live, win or lose. The Mets have assembled talent, you can’t deny that, and they have a beautiful new ballpark, and i’ll always have fun going to games.
it’s even better, since the crap economy and crap team will drive street value way down. bad year to have a season plan.
First off, i’;ve been to 1 game and citi and purchased a hot dog for 5 dollars that was the size of my finger and tasted horrible.
I hear you man, some of my best memories are going to ball games.i love baseball, and i love the mets. The bottomline is i’m not old enough to have enjoyed ‘86, so all i know is losing baseball and i can’t take it anymore. i’m a huge sports fan, i grew up on the mets and jets and all i ever see is potential gone down the drain and it sucks. if u were had a friend that always let u down, would u still be his friend?
go to catch of the day, it’s to the RF side of taste of the city. they have an ale steamed hot dog. it has a funny sign with a lobster wearing a baseball glove. which, at citi field, is how you tell the difference between a lobster and daniel murphy.
haha!!
People can look at numbers all they want but this team looks and plays exactly like they have for the past two years. Manuel is not the baseball man that they need either and by mid season will be the new Willie…
As many other fans have pointed out already, this team is just grossly overpaid to create the illusion of being winners.
SIGN PEDRO
I don’t think you blame the Mets for assembling the talent that they did. I blame the players. You can’t know if a player is a “winner” until they win, and most players haven’t done that, or if they have, they’re locked on a team forever. You assemble talent and hope the players learn how to get it done. Thus far, these players haven’t learned how to do that.
The team reflects the ownership. Meaningful games in September is enough. Nice without killer instinct.
The pitchers don’t knock down batters on the plate.
The players don’t take out the second baseman on a double play.
The other teams hate the Mets and the Mets are friends with the other players on the field. And it’s not reciprocal.
Manny Ramirez.
How is nobody at least asking Minaya if he has interest in Pedro??? Cmon its so obvious!!! SIGN PEDRO NOW!!!
How can you not? You can give Redding and Cora 2 mill but you can give Pedro 3 or 4?? At the very least I would rather see Pedro give up 6 runs a game then Ollie.
Pedro is done. Love the guy, but enough with the being hurt every other start. At least the staff is healthy now. Granted they’re terrible at the moment.
At this point, why not give him a shot? If he gets hurt, u lose 3 mill….big deal. Can he be any worse? Not to mention, hes great in the clubhouse. I think its a no brainer.
Why waste 5 mil you could spend on a younger pitcher that is actually good on a washed up pitcher. Remember the mets are penny pinchers, no way thy spend 5mil on ‘dro
Well zen, I agree with you 100% on this issue!
ok…say what you will about pedro but HE CANT BE ANY WORSE. Bring in Pedro, get pelfrey back and make a trade at the deadline…
What does a killer instinct have to do with pitching? I don’t get it. If Livan showed more passion that would boast his fastball up to 93 MPH with pinpoint location? Pitching, bullpen & starting, has to be your #1 strong point and the Mets simply don’t have that beyond Santana. How do you expect this team to win? With passion and killer instinct because they’ll need to win 9-7 every time out?
the problem is twofold…if the hitters could score more than two runs (off a flyout and a wild pitch) with the bases jacked and no one out,pitchers wouldn’t have to feel that if they’re not perfect they can’t win, and if pitchers could stop giving the lead back every chance they get, maybe hitters wouldn’t feel that they need 10 runs to win.
can we do something as fans to get out message heard to the front office??????? please. omar drops the ball every time it is put in his hands. i can throw money at beltran, pedro and the myriad of players he has. roster moves are a joke. letting go of o’day, letting murphy start in left. bringing in 8 starting number 5 pitchers who all SUCK. instead of saying “hey, lets over pay a little for lowe… have him as our number 2, pelfrey as 3, maine 4 and ollie 5, but no, we let him go to the BRAVES. i cant stand it. nothing is done the right way with this franchise. nothing. we cant open a stadium right, we cant close one right, we can start a season well, we cant end one well. i am so sick of spending time watching my favorite team be the butt of jokes and be made to look like fools. i stopped watching this game at 4-1 because it was over. this series in st. louis was an atrocity.
i wish we could pick a day and all boycott going to game. i understand everyone wanting to see the new ballpark but our voice needs to be heard. yankee fans flip out they miss the playoffs ONE YEAR and they go get apple jacks burnett, cheeseburger cheeseburger sabathia and big Tex. they love their fans. Mets fans are the stepchildren of Mets ownership, they dont care about us, they just dont want to treat us so horribly that we never show up.
rant over.
it was a solid rant
GET PEDRO
It is a really bad idea, which is why no team has even come close to doing it, and posting it over and over and over again in caps is really just not going to make it new or novel or smart…….
WRONG-no team has done it because he is demanding too much money. Was signing Freddy Garcia, Tim Redding, Livan Hernandez smart? No, but they took a bunch of mud threw it against the wall and hoped some would stick…..lets add Pedro to that pile of mudd. Again, what is the negative? Dont just say “he stinks now”, say how signing him to relatively little money is a bad move when 4/5 of our rotation is embarrassingly bad.
Well, of course money has been the main issue….and from what I have heard and read, he wants 5 or 6 mil, which is a LOT for a guy who has not been consistently good or healthy since late in 2006, and it is now 2009.
To me, signing ePedro is turning the clock back, not forwards. He is Alou, Duque, Vaughn, Alomar, etc etc etc, older vets whose day has come and gone.
We still have more 2009 Limas to go through, and after Livan and The Chief and Redding and Niese and Parnell have all bombed out as starters, if it is August and Pedro is ready to come in for one mil, let’s re-visit the issue then, when it will likely be too late anyway.
When was the last time Pedro had a good year? Didn’t we just conclude we don’t want another year, and that he can’t help this club?
How can you field a team with a new stadium playing in the biggest baseball market, promising a world series contending tam, and mike pelfrey is your # 2 pitcher?
Because your last name is Wilpon that is how.
At times towards the end of the season Pelfrey really did look like he could be a legit #2. It was a huge risk to expect him to continute to dominate in the fashion that a #2 starter should. I always thought this team should of done everything they could to get Lowe and not Ollie. Forget about him. I have no problem with having a stinky 5th starter but we needed to at least have a good 1-2 punch with Santana and Lowe while Pelfrey & Maine locked up the 3rd & 4th spots.
Exactly. Minaya and Co. bet it all on young, developing arms (Pelfry, Ollie, and Maine). The no. 2 spot was Minaya’s 08 offseason task (as well as fixing the Bullpen which he should have done a year earlier, but, it bounced off Minaya’s glove, he forgot to slide, grounded into a double play with bases loaded, walked in the winning run, couldn’t get through 5…
You know, I hate to say it and I do really like Pelf, but that really is a pretty good question.
I like him to, but get real, he’s pitched one good half of a season.
That is absolutely true, and this is a big disappointment so far; maybe the key. I think a lot of us were counting on Pelf, even if we got the worst-case with Ollie and Maine, which we have been close to so far.
If none of them can be counted on, we have a long, long season ahead.
Sure, more runs and late-inning hits would be great, but as the pen was our death last year, starting pitching it is so far this year.
And the pen is already starting to get overworked, except for KRod.
The thought of having to watch Ollie for almost 3 more seasons make me shutter.
I understand that Bernie, but the thought of watching Pedro give up 2 or 3 homers to the Marlins his first start out makes me feel the same way!
killer instinct? we need a C-C-C-C-COMBO BREAKER
I just heard a clip of Jerry Manuel saying he is “somewhat concerned” about the starting pitching…………
WHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAT ???????????
he’s also “a little disheartened” about his 401k
hahahah nice.
Somewhat concerned? Was Jerry fiddling while the Titanic sunk? That’s like saying the economy is having a “rough patch.” Yikes.
I don’t think the Mets lack “passion”. I think they lack “grit”. Like Gary Cohen said on the broadcast today, I don’t want to bring up the past, but they don’t have one player on this team that approaches the game like Lenny Dykstra or Wally Backman. Every team needs those kind of players to be successful. The kind of players who will run through a wall, will slide hard into 2nd base to break up a double play. The Phillies have Shane Victorino and Chase Utley. The Marlins have Cody Ross. These are star players necessarily. They are called “glue” guys or “gritty” ballplayers. Sure Pujols is an enormous talent, but he also plays with that kind of passion. Those players are your leaders. I don’t see anyone on this team who fits that bill (maybe Ryan Church?).
Oh and after my criticism of Daniel Murphy the other day.. it’s only fair to give him props for Wednesdays game. He played better in the field and drove in our only run. Way to go!
The one player they had was Jose Reyes but they declawed him like a cat.
Gritless moments in this 3 game series:
1-The Beltran nonslide-You MUST take out the catchers leg when it blocks the plate
2-The Murphy non slide-if Molina wants to lay all over the plate step on his face.
3-getting pummeled and not throwing at anybody.-Pujols should have been hit.
4-Castro not blocking the plate last night WITH THE PITCHER RUNNING!-He should have been taken out immediately after this. I cant believe nobody is talking about what a LAME move it was by Castro.
5-Sheffield not running over Pujols on the close play at first. I know Pujols is a monster but what is Sheff? A good fist fight at first is something that could have lit a fire under this team.
Look, im not a big advocate of bench clearing brawels most of the time but after over 2 years of passionless baseball I think its something this team might unfortunately need.
jeez guys relax
Jerry Manuel’s favorite song is on my stereo right now…..
” I ain’t got nobody that I can depend on”
By Johan ……er…..Carlos Santana
fx i like you man but don’t feed into their negativity man
Not giving the extra 5 million for Lowe is going to go down as the biggest mistake of the season.
Yes. Minaya is a year late on every fix, and as a result there’s always something that crushes the team. Last year was the bullpen. Lets hope the rotation can get it’s royal shizzy together.
guys can we all just freekin relax!!!
Haha! Good luck buddy!
damn i wish i had a doobie kong lol sometimes going to this site is like paddling upstream in a river made entirely of human waste lol
That is exactly what it is like! At least the doob will somewhat improve the scent of the area….now get out your machete and keep hacking through this wilderness!!
to quote bruce cambells “ash” in army of darkness “THIS IS MY BOOM STICK”!!! LOL
If this team doesn’t take care of business against the Nats it will be downright embarrassing and we’ll soon be looking at last place lol. I don’t care what time of the season it is, you should never, ever be behind the Nationals in the standings lol
i agree with u there vegas – btw i liked vince neils tattoo parlor there lol
uh matt time to get the banned guys off here again airfeet and the boyz are infiltrating us again
Wait whoever think this team is bad is not a real fan ???? Thats the message some of these blind fools are saying WAKE UP they been playing like this for a yr now same team same results THEY STINK
Every year it’s a different reason. I truely believe they were bad last year because of an awful bullpen. This year I believe they stink because of the starting rotation pitching awful. It’s not to say Maine and Pelfrey won’t turn it around at some point but Ollie I’m certain is going to implode more starts than not.
I don’t have so much of an issue with Pelfrey or Maine as I have with Ollie, whom in the bigger picture is the “X” factor in all of this. I honestly believe the Mets paid out 12 mil per for 3 years for a .500 pitcher with issues, or the typical million dollar arm with a 12 cent head type of player.
not saying that freak u r entitled to your own opinion – im saying don’t give up when u are only half a month into a 6 month season – if and when the team turns it around u might look foolish – if and when we sweep the nats and have a strong showing against the marlins then im sure all this rhetoric will die down
I understand your point but others are saying that some are not real fans because we are down on them , I am sorry they give me no reason to think positive about them they been playing like this for a yr now
all i can do is speak for myself and i know u are a real fan – but when you get the hacks that were banned such ans firemetsmanagement and airfeet etc flooding this section with asinine comments and negativity it kinda grates on yer nerves – look at the philths are they in better shape than us right now?
to be honest… i blame us for a lot of this.
booing players right off the bat… booing OP on opening day?!?!?! do we not know the guy is fragile? How is that going to help anything?
Instantly turning on our team… hating castillo, calling for murphs head after we were all so high on him, acting holier then thou at all times. Like we expect players just to explode because we want them to.
the attitude at the stadium stinks. Mets trailing? Here come the boos and the apathy. What happened to you gotta believe? Its like we are pushing them to fail.
Seriously, have you guys been to a game where we are trailing? its like a funeral! how bout some love from the fans, and maybe the players would care how we feel. Of course they all say they love us and we are the best fans, because if they even hint a critisizm, front page of the papers, boos, radio call ins screaming and yelling… they have no choice!
I wouldnt want to win for us. Why should they care?
you are right gbaked but these guys have internal filters that can block that out also – except for ollie lol he has no concentration
because they are paid MILLIONS OF DOLLARS to be good at baseball?
man, i hate pollyanna posts like yours. YAY METSIES THANKS FOR SUCKING! it ain’t 1962 anymore.
dykstraw i like ya man im on caryns site alot – im just saying is its too early to pack it up and be apathetic
its not yeah for sucking…
its yeah, i love the mets and i am gonna stand behind my team and try to will them through this.
its not booing our rookie LFer who never played there and is gonna make mistakes. its not booing our headcase pitcher because of past transgressions.
its enjoying the game and realizing that even the best players fail 3 times out of 10 in this game.
seriously, its like so many of you have never watched this game before.
Saying that they block it out is a joke. Yes, they do to an extent… but they are humans like the rest of us. there is no way they dont hear it when 20,000 people boo them. or go from very loud to very quiet.
well if that was the case man how did bonds reach his hr record – especially after the steroid allegations came out – that coulda distracted almost anyone
steroids helped alot
Your right because its the fans that choked the last 2 yrs I wished I saw this before and can you tell me what you are smoking
its not 100% on us, but we sure aint helping the situation.
the fans were there the past 2 years as well… we sure didnt help the situation.
yeah like instead of booing delgado – im sure cheering him coulda broke him out of his slump quicker (no sarcasm)
Was DWright hearing those New York boos today when he was busy getting out with risp?
did he get a rbi today?
Rusty, i wish i could have your positive outlook on this team, i really wish i could. David Wright has been miserable this year..don’t give me stats, just use your eyes,my point is that this team isn’t failing with risp because of boo’s. thats just flat out rediculous.
truist me murph im sick to my stomach about this – but i know its wayyy to early to wave the white flag
good evening guys its time for the “im depressed as hell” edition of “this day in mets infamy with rusty” so lets put away our cyanide / suicide tablets and have a little fun
first off b-day wishes go out to – one of the best left handed pitchers of all time (unfortunately not for us) pitcher/ coach (yes he did both for us in ‘65 – don’t be so surprised so did yogi) Warren Spahn (1921)
Duke “mmmm” Carmel (1937)
Jason ” i just was traded to the tigers yesterday for noone” Tyner (1977)
Henry “fireballer” Owens (1979) – although i am extremely happy with frankie and putz – i wish we bever traded owens away – coulda been the second coming of jeff reardon
Died on this date:
Deron “wish i remembered him” Johnson (1992)
Transactions:
New York Mets traded Chico “bail bonds” Fernandez and Bobby Catton to the Chicago White Sox for Charley Smith on April 23, 1964.
New York Mets claimed Jeff “chiefs” Kaiser on waivers from the Cincinnati Reds on April 23, 1993.
New York Mets signed free agent Gerald “i’m a ex brave and yakee so ill suck for the mets”Williams on April 23, 2004
so i hope u guys are smiling just a lil right now
In ‘06 this team stole every base they coulde, they pretty much said “we don’t care if u know it, we’re going to try to take this base so throw us out if you can”, and it worked, and on top of that, they hit the longball. Right now they have 5 stolen bags, and haven’t hit a hr since #500…so its clear what direction this team is going in.
different manager different philosphy – also remember we had kaz – then valentin in the 2 hole that was patient enuff to let jose steal
You clealy have never watched a Daniel Murphy at-bat, the guy is 3-2 almost every time he gets up.
yes he does and i love the guy but alot of the time that jose takes off he fouls the ball away
So…steal on the next pitch..steal next batter, send beltran and wright more often, have murph and church try to swipe on occasionally,keep pitchers on their toes.
then u catch him leaning the other way and he is picked off – u can’t always be predictable
Great, so lets not steal, becuase they might get picked off, lets move station to station and rely on people to get hits with risp..thats been working out so far.
i didnt say that – man are you just yankin my chain over here or are u just in such a foul mood cuz of the loss?
They have 5 stolen bases! push the envelope! Reyes is so fast he could tell the catcher and pitcher “i’m going to steal here”..and he will still very likely steal the base.
remember sat’s game beltran was running church lined out and carlos was picked off – remember the dp last nite/? cuz he was stealing – i want to see em steal but u can’t be reckless about it either
so are we gonna get on murphs case now cuz he grounded into a fielders choice???
No, we’re going to get on murphs case because he can’t field for shit, and his glove has already cost a team that has consecutively come 1 game short 2 games, and its still april.
you sir are an insult to your handle
Rusty, i am huge murphy fan, he is one hell of a hitter, but you cannot deny he is a defensive liability, i am begging to think you spend so long on your day in mets history that you don’t have time to watch the games.
i watch the games man and yes he is a liability but does that mean u turn tale and boo him?? did u boo when they made mazz a 1b who couldnt field ? or putting todd zeile at 1st when he had no prior experience there? what about hojo in the outfield when his days as a 3b were over?
I was simply responding to your fielders choice comment which i felt was kind of stupid.
i was being sarcastic murph – i want the kid to succeed but u have mental midgits that will critique every little flaw
Yeah, not being able to catch ruitine fly balls..tiny flaw.
what about when the david wright ball hit damon on his head and ruled a homer – was that a tiny flaw?
what does that even mean!?
u are so quick to berate a guy who has played less that 60 games in the outfield because he botched 2 playes in one week but – you know what nevermind we will argue til we are blue in the face and neither one of us will change each others minds man – i just want this team to win and i don’t think being negative will solve the problems that we are seeing
Fixing the bullpen was 07’s homework Minaya did a year late in 08, costing the Mets 29 saves and a confidence crushing collapse. Adding a 2nd Ace, King or a Jack to the hand was 08’s homework, and Minaya added a Joker (Ollie).
This years story is the rotation and whether Pelfry, Ollie, and Maine can take this team anywhere.
whats lowe’s record right now? garlands?? while we are at it maybe we shoulda signed suppan 2 years ago and loshe last year – (sarcasm)
good analogies but i think you should change your handle to Minaya’s Errors lol
lol
You have seen this team unable to finish the season the last three years with pretty much the same core of players, yet you question whether they can close the deal? What more evidence do you need to see Matt?
you are buying into fatcessas b.s
This has absolutely nothing to do with Fatcessa. I could care less what he says. This is evidence in front of the eyes of fans that can lift the blinders a bit. One time is an occurence, twice is a coincidence, three times is a pattern. I am not advocating breaking up the core, but something will eventuallly give. Better yet, if they make it four choke jobs in a row after this season is over, Omar will be looking for work.
after 15 games u wanna break up the core – damn how short sighted some of us are
“after 15 games u wanna break up the core – damn how short sighted some of us are”
Where did I say that I wanted to break up the core? Or are you just twisting things to suit your argument.
This year, this team has not much,…I repeat, NOT MUCH room for error. Not after 2007 and 2008 where they wet their pants down the stretch to our hated rivals. They have lost any benefit of the doubt from the majority of fans, and any street cred from those that know better. They are in “earning” mode in the fans eyes this year and so far they are working on a negative balance sheet.
Yeah it’s 15 games and I have never given up on them this early in the 40+ year I have been a fan. But that doesn’t mean we are blind to the continual story they have established in recent history.
you are right u didnt say this but you got the “core” – alex airfeet flight from huston that do
hey guys this should make you guys chuckle
as per mlbtr
The Newark Bears of the Atlantic League have signed former major leaguer Armando Benitez. He spent part of last year with the Blue Jays, but is best remembered for his time as a closer for the Mets, Marlins and Giants.
That’s great! He should be closing for someone by August….hopefully the Marlins or Braves….
and he will shut us out for a 3 inning save lol
kong i need someback up – were on a mission from dog
No offense, but you guys do realize that you’re overreacting about 15 games? While nothing can absolve Minaya and the Front Office for not ponying up an extra $4M for Lowe, you all must take time to realize that this is a small sample size (except for Livan — he’s been atrocious for a while now, he simply allows too many hard hit balls in play). If the starting rotation is this abysmal in mid-May, then it would be time to panic.
Also, how about some objective analysis people? Don’t let Mike Francesa, WFAN callers and the team’s broadcasters shape your view of the team and their players. Murphy’s made some crucial gaffes in the OF, but he’s been an above average left fielder with a 2.2 UZR (the best fielding metric available, which measures range, arm and errors).
Also, all that stuff about “passion” and “grit” is a bunch of bunk assigned to teams that win (and found lacking on teams that lose).
thankyou shook !!
“No offense, but you guys do realize that you’re overreacting about 15 games? ”
Uh no. We have every reason to react this way considering they are playing the same pattern of baseball they have played the last two seasons. If they had come off a 2008 where they made the post-season, or even advanced far in the playoffs, then you would have a valid argument. But that is far from the case. We have every reason to be indignant at this team’s play, the front office, and how this franchise is generally run.
Overreacting? Hardly, given the circumstances.
almar did the 69 team have a slow start? did the 73 team suffer from a slow start? did the 2000 team suffer from a slow start?? remember the 07 team was in first place almost wire to wire before they imploded
“almar did the 69 team have a slow start? did the 73 team suffer from a slow start? did the 2000 team suffer from a slow start?? remember the 07 team was in first place almost wire to wire before they imploded”
I think you are missing the overall point here Rusty. This isn’t about whether we are giving up on the team, or whether they can or cannot make the postseason. This is about witnessing the same, typical kind of play that was their undoing the past two seasons. Don’t you think that we as fans should hold them more accountable this season due to the last two?
So basically bringing up 69, 73, or 2000 comparitively would be like me saying how the Mets of the late 70s started off slow like this year as well. Irrelevant to the core of the argument I am making.
This is more of the same old same. Win 2 loose 4 type of play that we have seen the last two years. Look good and then look awful. All I want is to feel that no matter what the score or how late it is, that I will stay up and watch because I fell they can win. The last two years and now once we get behind turn off the tv and go to bed its over. That is the feeling that makes us fans upset. Look at the results of the poll. We dont havt confidence in this team, why is that? They have not shown us that they can come back or hit w RISP on a consistant basis. If and when they do things will change. Until then it will more of the same.
Even though some of the faces are the same, the 2009 Mets are not the same as the teams in 2008 and 2007. One season does not beget another.
I wouldn’t charcterize any of the play I’ve seen thus far as “listless”, “unclutch” or devoid of “killer instinct”. Yes, some physical and mental errors were made. And some of them in high leverage situations. And yes, the starting pitching has been abysmal, but only a snapshot of the season has passed.
What many of you fail to realize is that “batted ball luck” is predominant between the lines. Joel Piniero threw strikes and induced many a grounder at his defenders. He gave up 2 ER over 8 innings without striking anyone out. If you played the same game over a 100 times, with “0 K for Piniero” as a control, the Mets would beat him like a pinanta about 75% of the time.
Sometimes you have to realize that there are things the players can’t control out there. I mean, geez, it’s not like Delgado can go out there and tackle Rick Ankiel to keep him from catching Sheffield’s liner. If the Mets weren’t drawing walks and hitting for power, I’d be more worried. Clutch hitting can be illusory, because you can’t “will” a ball between 3rd and SS — it just has to happen!
Yeah, it’s early. And the whole division except for the Marlins is struggling. It’s more of an attitude problem. The hitting will come around sooner or later. The pitching might even work itself out. And Omar might make a trade to fill a hole in the rotation that will fix everything. But the Mets just don’t appear to be “tough.” And “tough” teams are the ones that win close games and don’t collapse in September.
and the fish just got swept by the pirates – the bottom feeders of the nl central
I have a question and be honest when yo answer it. Are the METS more likely to sweep a team or be sweept? I say get sweept, what about you? It seems that even when they score early they dont add on runs and allow the other team to pick its way back in and win. They also have bases loaded with less than 2 outs and will score only one run instead of blowing the game out.
Matt I disagree with you. This team is soft and has been for over 2 years now. It’s insane that some of us still expect this team to be anything other than what they have been these last 2 years. They will not knock over catchers blocking homeplate. They are too laid back in personality. Problem is who can be brought in to add a fighting personality to the Mets? Aaron Rowand? Somebody else?
so then you would cry about us having a lfder with no pwer – wait we got murph (sarcasm)
I agree somewhat. I think it’s important to focus on what’s important — which happens to be focus itself, and intensity. Not every player who is intense and plays with the attitude necessary to win also jumps up and down or throws his bat. Look at two of our nemeses — Chase Utley and vintage Jeter. These guys are/were winners, and they’re not bat throwers or helmet smashers. They’re in control, but a guy like Utley plays with a swagger, a confidence, a focus and an intelligence that you just don’t see from the Mets, who seem to get by solely on “talent.” So, they’re soft in the sense that they wilt late — similar to what Matt is talking about. To the extent they’re not testosterone-addled Paul O’Neill idiots, I don’t think that matters at all.
You do know that Aaron Rowand isn’t really that good and would only present a marginal improvement (at best) over Daniel Murphy? Oh and he’s overpriced too!
ok guys im outta here for the nite – cya tomorrow after johan wins and ill be at sats game when pelfry pitches (fingers crossed)
Enjoy!
And Johan BETTER frigin win!
to quote paul perdon
I GAAAARUNNNTEEEE!! – nite my friend
Oh no. Figgy refuses minors. We lose a good pitcher and keep all the losers.
good for him. he doesnt deserve the treatment he gets from omar.
You do know that there are hundred of pitchers that can be had for free that are very much like Nelson Figueroa — or better? Brandon Knight is almost the same guy from the age to the right-handedness to the journeyman travails right down to the love of the curveball.
The Mets have treated Figueroa well, in my opinion. They gave him a job! Odalis Perez doesn’t have one and he’s better than Figgy.
I am a Yankee Fan with a lot of friends who are met fans. Something confuses me about them, they are all so in love with the mets roster and dont want it to change, yet all this roster does is put up miserable loss after miserable loss. WHY? Get rid of these players already and shake things up. I just dont understand them. And OMAR has to go, my team and its fans would not put up with this, why do you ?
This team will never win the division. I am NOT affraid of any team in the NL East, but, I am affraid that the METS are going to hang around until the end waiting for another team, the Phillies, Braves or Marlins to stumble so they can walk in. They are a good team, not great. We are the Red Sox of the NL. Find a way to loose and make excuses and what if’s about it later. I love this team and hope they will find a way to win and I have faith that they will, but, in reality they will break our hearts again.
10 Mets THINGS TO CHEER YOU UP
1.)While we are 5 games out only 1 games seperate us from Philly & Atl.
2.)In 2007 Wright in April hit .244 0Hr 6Rbi 16BB 23SO
he went on to finish the season .325 30Hr 107Rbi 94BB 115SO
3.)Murphy’s 6 rbi’s is tied with Wright not bad company
4.)Castillo & Church are hitting a respective .381 & .383
5.)If Schneider falters Josh Thole in AA & Robinson Cancel in AAA are leading their teams in hitting.
6.)Mets pen era of 2.85 is 3rd in MLB only Mariners & Red Sox are better.
7.)Johan Santana’s era of 0.46 is 2nd best in all of mlb for starters with at least 3 starts.
Only Zack Greinke’s era of 0.00 is better.
8.)Mets pitching staff has 109 K’s tied for 8th best in MLB with Mariners.
9.)We have Johan Santana to JJ Putz to KRod every 5 days!!!
10.)Did I say we have Johan Santana to JJ Putz to KRod every 5 days!!! Go Mets!!!
Now Cheer Up!!!!
10 Mets THINGS TO CHEER YOU UP is brought to you by The Notorious Mr North Jersey
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