Comments on: Update: Wagner, Putz, Beltran and Jose http://www.metsblog.com/2009/08/03/update-wagner-putz-beltran-and-jose/ Latest Mets News, Links, Rumors and Opinion Fri, 04 Feb 2011 21:22:00 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Nate W. http://www.metsblog.com/2009/08/03/update-wagner-putz-beltran-and-jose/#comment-590273 Nate W. Mon, 03 Aug 2009 18:37:51 +0000 http://www.metsblog.com/2009/08/03/update-wagner-putz-beltran-and-jose/#comment-590273 Wagner pitched this afternoon for the GCL Mets. The St. Lucie Mets are off today, so pitching for them tonight would be kind of impossible. He had 1-2-3 inning with no K's. Wagner pitched this afternoon for the GCL Mets. The St. Lucie Mets are off today, so pitching for them tonight would be kind of impossible. He had 1-2-3 inning with no K’s.

]]> By: wlaadair http://www.metsblog.com/2009/08/03/update-wagner-putz-beltran-and-jose/#comment-590228 wlaadair Mon, 03 Aug 2009 16:52:42 +0000 http://www.metsblog.com/2009/08/03/update-wagner-putz-beltran-and-jose/#comment-590228 they won't do that because Minaya didn't make any moves based on them coming back and as long as they are out with small progress noted Jerry has the excuse of not playing the team that will win games. they won’t do that because Minaya didn’t make any moves based on them coming back and as long as they are out with small progress noted Jerry has the excuse of not playing the team that will win games.

]]> By: wlaadair http://www.metsblog.com/2009/08/03/update-wagner-putz-beltran-and-jose/#comment-590227 wlaadair Mon, 03 Aug 2009 16:51:01 +0000 http://www.metsblog.com/2009/08/03/update-wagner-putz-beltran-and-jose/#comment-590227 Can't say i disagree on it being a huge risk with low to no reward but he played for Puerto Rico for Team USA just fine and now the whole team is suffering the consequences of him doing more than he should have earlier in the year. Can’t say i disagree on it being a huge risk with low to no reward but he played for Puerto Rico for Team USA just fine and now the whole team is suffering the consequences of him doing more than he should have earlier in the year.

]]> By: ravi3 http://www.metsblog.com/2009/08/03/update-wagner-putz-beltran-and-jose/#comment-590224 ravi3 Mon, 03 Aug 2009 16:38:16 +0000 http://www.metsblog.com/2009/08/03/update-wagner-putz-beltran-and-jose/#comment-590224 Aka there hasn't been any meaningful progress whatsoever. Can't they just admit that these guys won't be back this year and end this nonsense? Aka there hasn’t been any meaningful progress whatsoever. Can’t they just admit that these guys won’t be back this year and end this nonsense?

]]> By: MetsLv31 http://www.metsblog.com/2009/08/03/update-wagner-putz-beltran-and-jose/#comment-590219 MetsLv31 Mon, 03 Aug 2009 16:10:08 +0000 http://www.metsblog.com/2009/08/03/update-wagner-putz-beltran-and-jose/#comment-590219 Sure, there is always risk whenever you play a sport, or even step outside your door. But the point is to minimize risk and maximize reward. Him coming back this season does neither. Sure, there is always risk whenever you play a sport, or even step outside your door. But the point is to minimize risk and maximize reward. Him coming back this season does neither.

]]> By: wlaadair http://www.metsblog.com/2009/08/03/update-wagner-putz-beltran-and-jose/#comment-590217 wlaadair Mon, 03 Aug 2009 15:59:48 +0000 http://www.metsblog.com/2009/08/03/update-wagner-putz-beltran-and-jose/#comment-590217 Agreed, it is a big risk, and we dont' want Beltran to be permanently shut down because he played when he shouldn't have, that's been debated ad nauseum, but as professional athletes, these things are a part of the game. They all play hurt and they all take chances, but who doesn't? Every time you get in your car, you are taking the risk of being in an accident, etc. Agreed, it is a big risk, and we dont’ want Beltran to be permanently shut down because he played when he shouldn’t have, that’s been debated ad nauseum, but as professional athletes, these things are a part of the game.

They all play hurt and they all take chances, but who doesn’t? Every time you get in your car, you are taking the risk of being in an accident, etc.

]]> By: Nate W. http://www.metsblog.com/2009/08/03/update-wagner-putz-beltran-and-jose/#comment-590216 Nate W. Mon, 03 Aug 2009 15:47:24 +0000 http://www.metsblog.com/2009/08/03/update-wagner-putz-beltran-and-jose/#comment-590216 I'd put it more like this... If playing this year has more than a 10% chance of ending forcing him to miss time next year then he shouldn't come back. It's sounding like a high risk, low reward situation. If they had managed to not give away games earlier in the year or if Omar had made another move or two and they were actually in it then its debatable. But they aren't even in it, so to risk next year is just awful awful chance taking. I’d put it more like this…

If playing this year has more than a 10% chance of ending forcing him to miss time next year then he shouldn’t come back.

It’s sounding like a high risk, low reward situation. If they had managed to not give away games earlier in the year or if Omar had made another move or two and they were actually in it then its debatable. But they aren’t even in it, so to risk next year is just awful awful chance taking.

]]> By: MetsLv31 http://www.metsblog.com/2009/08/03/update-wagner-putz-beltran-and-jose/#comment-590214 MetsLv31 Mon, 03 Aug 2009 15:41:32 +0000 http://www.metsblog.com/2009/08/03/update-wagner-putz-beltran-and-jose/#comment-590214 I haven't heard about "a great deal of progress." This is from a post 4 or so days ago. "According to Beltran, though his <b>recent MRI indicated the bone bruise in his knee has not improved</b>, he has been hitting with the brace for more than a week... " Here is an article from Baseball Prospectus, with some pieces pulled out. http://www.baseballprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=9316 "Beltran has decided to accelerate the pace of his rehab, hoping to come back towards mid-August...Beltran made the informed decision based on the near certainty that he will need microfracture surgery and could miss much, if not all, of the 2010 season. He'll do everything he can to avoid it, but that's the worst case scenario and he's willing to give it a go...It's a calculated risk that Beltran and the Mets are taking." This seems like a stupid risk to be taking, for a nearly dead season. What exactly is the upside to this gamble? Even if we do make the WC, who thinks we're going to go all the way? I haven’t heard about “a great deal of progress.” This is from a post 4 or so days ago.

“According to Beltran, though his recent MRI indicated the bone bruise in his knee has not improved, he has been hitting with the brace for more than a week… ”

Here is an article from Baseball Prospectus, with some pieces pulled out. http://www.baseballprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=9316

“Beltran has decided to accelerate the pace of his rehab, hoping to come back towards mid-August…Beltran made the informed decision based on the near certainty that he will need microfracture surgery and could miss much, if not all, of the 2010 season. He’ll do everything he can to avoid it, but that’s the worst case scenario and he’s willing to give it a go…It’s a calculated risk that Beltran and the Mets are taking.”

This seems like a stupid risk to be taking, for a nearly dead season. What exactly is the upside to this gamble? Even if we do make the WC, who thinks we’re going to go all the way?

]]> By: Nate W. http://www.metsblog.com/2009/08/03/update-wagner-putz-beltran-and-jose/#comment-590212 Nate W. Mon, 03 Aug 2009 15:40:34 +0000 http://www.metsblog.com/2009/08/03/update-wagner-putz-beltran-and-jose/#comment-590212 "Can someone else do better? Yes" This says it all really. And I'm not concerned with what he has done in the past, though the game threads here are filled with first guessing Jerry's illogical moves. There are numerous times Jerry pulled a dump move not because of roster limitations but simply because he is a terrible in game manager. I'm concerned if he will be the right man to manage the team they put together next year. And there is almost a zero change he is the best candidate. Tony LaRussa is a free agent, but no lets just keep Manuel because he does a couple things well. “Can someone else do better? Yes”

This says it all really.

And I’m not concerned with what he has done in the past, though the game threads here are filled with first guessing Jerry’s illogical moves. There are numerous times Jerry pulled a dump move not because of roster limitations but simply because he is a terrible in game manager.

I’m concerned if he will be the right man to manage the team they put together next year. And there is almost a zero change he is the best candidate.
Tony LaRussa is a free agent, but no lets just keep Manuel because he does a couple things well.

]]> By: Nate W. http://www.metsblog.com/2009/08/03/update-wagner-putz-beltran-and-jose/#comment-590210 Nate W. Mon, 03 Aug 2009 15:35:32 +0000 http://www.metsblog.com/2009/08/03/update-wagner-putz-beltran-and-jose/#comment-590210 First of all, putting Torre and Manuel in the same conversation is uncalled for and its completely illogical to make the leap that since Torre was good and had a foolproof roster makes Manuel good somehow. One situation has nothing to do with the other. Second, Torre's biggest trait in the early years he was there was his ability to shelter the players from an overbearing owner. That situation doesn't exist here at all. That kind of player and press friendly manager isn't what is called for. Someone who can do the things Jerry does, while not being a dunce at in game management shouldn't be that hard to find. Bringing Torre into this debate, wow... just wow. Any more silly ideas? First of all, putting Torre and Manuel in the same conversation is uncalled for and its completely illogical to make the leap that since Torre was good and had a foolproof roster makes Manuel good somehow. One situation has nothing to do with the other.

Second, Torre’s biggest trait in the early years he was there was his ability to shelter the players from an overbearing owner. That situation doesn’t exist here at all. That kind of player and press friendly manager isn’t what is called for. Someone who can do the things Jerry does, while not being a dunce at in game management shouldn’t be that hard to find.

Bringing Torre into this debate, wow… just wow. Any more silly ideas?

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